Crivitz flag issue update: pole stolen, cops do nothing

I know this may be a dead issue here on ATS, and I may be beating a dead horse... but understand that this is an important issue to those who do understand and enjoy their freedom of speech.

A quick summary so far:

1) A man from Crivitz Wisconsin, to protest having his liquor license refused, started flying the American flag upside down; the local village cops came onto his property and removed the flag without warrant, or for that matter, any legal rights or reason other than to prevent the owner from catching a bunch of * from the locals. That information can be found on this ATS thread. The flag was eventually returned.

2) A protest was held outside the man's home recently, as seen on this TV station's broadcast here, with further information here.

Now, we have yet another issue regarding the flag and the village police.

As reported by the Eagle Herald, a newspaper serving this area, the flag is no longer being flown upside down, as "the pole has been cut down and the flag taken from property owned by Vito Congine Jr as of Friday morning" (quoted from the Eagle Herald, Monday July 27 2009.

Furthermore, it seems that a neighbor reported the flag missing at roughly 10pm Thursday night... by 5:30 Friday morning, it was noted that the pole was also missing; a SECOND call was made to the Marinette Sheriff's office (remember, they gave the initial order to have the village police illegally seize the flag), with a unit arriving at about 8:00am Friday morn.

...

Not only do we have the area cops stealing without warrant, we have them ignoring an issue that they wanted to prevent in the first place (the protest), AND we have them ignoring the fact that property was stolen AGAIN.

Now, before anyone jumps on the "cops are busy", think again. Crivitz has a staggering population of 990, spread over miles and miles of wooded cabins and farmland. There are, at any given time, three cops within the village limits, with county cops and state troopers going through all the time. In the evenings, you can expect to see three squad cars at the Citgo station, another one over at the Piggly Wiggly, and one more at the Town Hall, which, incidently, is just a block or two away from Congine's house! What took so long in their responding to a theft?

Again, to quote from the Eagle Herald...

The Marinette County Sheriff's Department declined to comment Sunday, while a call to the Crivitz Police Department went unanswered.

...

So, why is this important for us? Just think of what will happen when we begin to hold our own protests against important issues, when our numbers grow and swell. What will happen when we begin to fly our Don't Tread flags or our American flag inverted? The village of Crivitz is a small community, sitting nicely within a square mile; imagine what will happen in larger areas.

That's messed up, but not too surprising, unfortunately.

I drive through Crivitz quite often, heading into Forest County to hunt, fish, and camp.

The last two deer seasons, both I and members of our hunting group have started having run-ins with the Sheriffs there, too.

We are not rowdy, or poorly behaved.

Last year, a new Sheriff was sitting in his cruiser, telling people they needed to cross the street at the crosswalks. This was at midnight, in late November, when it was -2 degrees, wind chill much lower. The motels and lodges are literally right across the street from the bar/restaurant.
One of the guys from our party said “You’re kidding me!”
The Sheriff exited his car and said, “You think I’m kidding?” then proceeded to cuff and frisk the guy who commented, and another guy who had said and done nothing, other than being next to the guy who commented.

They were both given drunk and disorderly conduct tickets.

My truck was towed later that night, by the same Sheriff.

And before anybody stereotypes us as a bunch of drunken hunters, I’ll say that I have been going to this same town for over twenty years, and the majority of our party has been going for forty plus years. We have always been welcomed, and have never once had any run-ins previously.

In speaking with another Sheriff, whom we’ve gotten to know over the years, he told us that a few older Sheriffs had retired, and the replacements were “kinda green, and real gung ho”.

I hope this isn’t the future of Small Town, U.S.A.

Well, the news crews are over there right now... sure is a big hoop-la for a flag raising; yep, Vito has gotten himself a new pole, and a new flag... and it remains inverted.

Be funny to see what happens now with this, and what the cops will say. There will probably be a youtube link added within the day about this.

Oaktree - so nice to hear someone else complain about our village idiots, err, village police! Do you recall what the cop looked like? Dark hair and mustache would be "Creepy Craig"... and if it was a scrawny little guy with receding reddish hair, he would be the one we lovingly call "Little Hitler".

Cool, we now have our chance to speak and be heard...

This Thursday at 9am, supports of Vito and his right to free speech will be meeting... along with ACLU reps.

Seems that the ACLU declined to press charges against the village, but now, after the flag and pole was stolen (and the flag was found buried in a dumpster), they are ready to fight. Seems things are now moving to the big leagues!

This all happened over in Wabeno, but the fact that you all have such enduring names for the officers says it all!

I was trying to imagine the response if this had happened to the flag/pole in front of the Sheriff's station.

I'm sure no expense would have been spared bringing those criminals to justice!

As an update to the update... a few hours ago, a major case of vandalism and arson occurred on the property in which this issue of an inverted flag has been waging since the first week of July.

However, you will have to wait until it is fully covered by an outside media source before further details can be given.

BREAKING(kinda)NEWS

www.wfrv.com...

The mainstream media posted this story at 8:12am this morning... but some read it here on ATS first at roughly 6:45pm last night.

Oops... forgot story snippet...

CRIVITZ (WFRV) -- Police say the conflict over a flag being flown upside down in Crivitz, has reached a dangerous level.

too bad things have gotten to this...

[edit from here down]

As I reported 14.5 hours before the official press release, limestone rocks were thrown into the windows, with the village police stating that anyone can buy the stones anywhere, so they are not focusing on anyone local...

Police Chief Mike Frievalt told Channel 5’s Jenna Sachs that vandals had broken the windows by throwing large rocks.

...police say the culprits may not be from the Crivitz community.

“This has obviously gone beyond the area news-wise,” said Frievalt. “Therefore suspects, it could be anybody at this time.”

Furthermore, the police went on to say that the event happened between Wednesday and Thursday.

Sometime between Wednesday night and Thursday afternoon

WRONG!

Look at one of my earlier posts, the one dealing with supporters gathering Thursday morning at 9am. The support gathering was rescheduled for August 6th at 3pm... I know, because I was there between 8:50am and 9:10am; there was no damage at that time.

What the cops aren't telling you is their level of incompetence... that the building is on the main street of Crivitz, before it merges into County Highway A, and that it is located a mere block away from the Town Hall (where the village police office is located).

In addition, some more information that they will not release to the media is that an other local paper, the Peshtigo Times, ran an editorial within the community section last week that stated:

If our country had more people like you we probably wouldn’t be where we are today, and by the way, it’s still upside down, if you want to go get it from him I will personally take up a collection for any fines your actions might incur.

Barbara Tobison

(taken from the Peshtigo Times, linked here

It says right in the quote that this Barb is telling someone to steal it.

Who would your first suspect be?

[edit on 2009/7/31 by The Soothsayer]

Now, instead of simply adding another edit to the above post, I thought it might be prudent to just add a new post.

Why?

Well... this one may be deleted. Oh, it adds some more information, alright, but at what cost? The truth needs to be known, and there is some more evidence which further involves the author of the Peshtigo Times editorial (see above for link, quote). Circumstantial evidence, but evidence none-the-less.

Couple weeks ago, there was an incident by the Crivitz ball diamond; someone set fire to the bathrooms located nearby, causing substantial damage. The cops had no idea who did it, and were not investigating further, until a third party came to them with the names of the culprits. Problem solved, case closed.

...

Couple weeks later, this incident with the flag and vandalism and attempted arson.

...

Seems that there is a connection between these two events, other than arson. A relation, if you will. But, because the "bathroom bandits" were minors, that information cannot be released.

...

Which leads me to this: as a parent, have you ever seen your child act upon one of your vices?

Now, as stated earlier, this post may be removed, as to the fact that it implicates a minor through association with a person who has written in a public medium that she will defend whoever acts against the inverted flag.

Coincidence? Maybe. Circumstantial? Perhaps...

But it would seem to me that the suspect list might be a tad shorter if the authorities involved would open their eyes.

...

Last side note as to why the evidence leaning towards the writer of the Peshtigo Times editorial: She's on the Rescue Squad, and works along side these same authorities.

Boy that's messed up.
Why would the paper have even printed that letter from Barbara Tobison?
It seems like she is thanking this other fellow for cutting it down the first time, doesn't it?

wow oaktree that was harsh! dead of night, -2 and using the crosswalk? Just goees to show, the police and fed are not on our side! that is one hell of a story.
I kinda miss the old days, relatively speaking. early 90's, cops arond me(southwest CT) wouold often simply walk away or just mess with yuo, OR give the opportunity to not go downtown. a guy i knida know, was telling me when he was 21, this was like 1974..city just north me, was out drinking with a friend one night. back of the car was ankle deep in beer cans. His frined chucked a beer can out on the road, wa late night. sure enough cop saw it and pulled him over. Cop knew the drivers father, so the cop says, i know yuor dad dont i..he answered yes, knoing the cop. so the cop took him and his car to the local high school, at like midnight, and dropped the beer cans all over the filed, via his car. cops says to them, you boys got a lot of work to do. They were expeccted to clean up the beer cans which they did.
In one sense, they were happy to have doen that , than go down town with a DUI. A friend of mine back in 94, bought a 74 chevy (forget teh model was a boat fo aar). HE had nNO liscense, insurance or resgistation. He and his friend were both high on weed, and working on their 3rd beer. cop pulls him over. Cop ciomes up to window, and asks who car is it. my friends frinds answers, im liscensed, and driving my friend home. cop asks how much he payed for it ...$400. So the cop asks other frined same questions..4 times back n forth, the cop shakes his head, wlks back to his car and drives away. My frined and his friend lookeda t eahother like WTF was that all about!
Another time, same frined and car, went ot see pantera in 95, woodstock. coming back at 3 am on I 95 highway, trooper pulls them over. comes up to window, and says damn! yuo boys are drunk arnt ya. they were,a nd HIGH>....my friend ansswered yes officer, we just got back form a metal concert, adnwe want to get home. Trooper tellshim, ok, heres what your gunna do....yuor gunan drive home NOW. IF, i har about you agian on my CB, Im coing for you myeslf.
I share theser storys, because cool and fun cops arnt aroun anymore. Understanding at that too. Its sad to see cosp can be mischevous, for no good reason. myabe we should start steeling form thier private propertys or pooice precincts!

That town needs a good slap in the face.

I'm not sure what their problem is, hopefully its simple ignorance and not malice.

As for the police department, I hope they get sued and the cops that refused service lose their jobs.

As horribly wrong as I think it is to fly the American flag upside down as a means of protest, ESPECIALLY a protest over a liquor license, and as much as it boils my blood to see the flag that I salute so proudly be used in this way, I do have to say that I have never heard of a law that prevents the flag being flow upside down.

It is his own flag. It is his own property. The police have already confirmed that there is no danger or distress on the property from the upside down flag.

Everything after that is just a freak show of civil rights abuse. I actually feel sorry for the poor guy. His property sounds like it is being destroyed over this. There is no need to smash his windows or cut his flagpole down. That is just vandalism.

At least he is actually displaying the flag. That is more than I can say for over half of the houses in my own neighborhood.

Well, just came back from the support rally; boy, is Crivitz screwed now.

The ACLU has officially taken the case. At first, they weren't going to, but now that his establishment has been vandalized and an incident of attempted arson, ontop of have the flag and pole stolen, the ACLU figured enough was enough already, that this goes beyond a simple amendment case. Goes before a judge on September 3rd.

...

Regarding Barb and the connections / what she wrote: apparently, the cops are considering looking into it, but are following different leads first.

Whatever.

[edit here done]

Here's coverage from FOX 11 news...

FOX

Did you all see my back? Heh... I'm the one in the black / gray / white striped shirt.

[edit on 2009/8/6 by The Soothsayer]

How dare you people on this site accuse me or my son of doing this crap, My son wasn't even in town when that brick crap happened. You people going to sit here on this website and hide behind your stupid screen names, tell me your real name and we'll discuss this in person. You can't do that though can you, your going to try and slander me and my family, have the balls to do it to my face. Just because I disagree with you does not give you the right to slander a child. Are your children perfect? Have they NEVER done nothing wrong, or stepped into the wrong crowd? Get your freakin facts straight, as for vito and his stupid flag, no one cares anymore....he's not even a resident of Wisconsin, he has no right for a license here. Again, get your facts staraight, and as for the editorial I wrote, I have just as much right to say what I want, I just have the balls to say it with my REAL name attached, you can't say the same though can you

why even care about a flag when noone even cares about the nation

..

I care about it, the flag, the nation, and my community. For example, that park, I spent 2 years of my time getting everything started, then another year getting committies, fundraisers and getting it built. I volunteer in this town, and have for well over 10 years. Yes, I work for the rescue squad, but I also volunteer for it. I have put in more hours helping this town out than you can possibly even count. I have organizied and worked many many events in this community to help others out. So when my son set off a bottle rocket in the bathrooms at the park that I started and was instrumental in building, was I hurt and disappointed? YES. He paid for it though and has not been in any trouble before that or since, so for people to say that he is responsible for throwing a lit brick through a window is just bashing him because you don't like what I said. It's stooping pretty low in my book, he's a kid for gods sake, leave him alone. You can say what you want about me, and you will, but when it comes to my children, theres not much you can say because they are good kids, and one of them made a mistake. I dare anyone of you to try and say you never have, or that your children are perfect. And before you even go there, none of us were in town that night, so I didn't do it either. I personally think someone did it because this thing was getting old an no one cared anymore, he needed something to get peoples attention, but that is MY opinion and I have a right to that without my son getting involved. Why don't you, instead of bashing the town you live in, step up like I have and volunteer to try to make it a better place!

True, this is old news... hell, the last actual post was from the beginning of August, and yes, I agree, it was all over and done with and in the past.

Until, that is, a couple days ago.

I should just ignore this, simply go on about my business... but man it's hard.

... (much pause) ...

I will say this, though. This, believe it or not, is a conspiracy site, where we take the information that is given and make conclusions as such. Some of us on ATS will do research and reveal the knowledge gained so that others may learn and evolve theories of their own. Perhaps instead of getting defensive, why not defend your side of things?

Don't get offensive, don't be defensive... just state your argument in an intelligent and respectful manner. Be ready for a debate, not an argument; I know, I know... having dealt with you in the past, that really isn't your strong suit, but welcome to ATS, where healthy debate leads to greater understanding.

Just be careful of how you say things: the mods might give you a warning, or direct you to a rules violation... unlike the real world, where it seems you can threaten to pay someone to do something illegal and have no repercussions.

I didn't accuse your son of anything. I took evidence exhibits "A" "B" and "C", and made a worthy connection. A theory which connected all the evidence (please see the above about "conspiracy site"). I even stated that it might all be coincidence and circumstantial. If what was presented was right or wrong, it was not for me to decide... that's up to Fival.

I am merely a soothsayer, someone who seeks the truth. So please, if there is anything you can add civilly to further this discussion, then by all means, do so.



On to other things. I don't bash Crivitz... just some of its people. Seems to be a common practice in these here parts, ehh?

"Don't get offensive, don't be defensive... just state your argument in an intelligent and respectful manner. Be ready for a debate, not an argument; I know, I know... having dealt with you in the past, that really isn't your strong suit"

Nice that you seem to think you know so very much about me, who are you, or are you just to much of a coward to admit that?

Thank you very much for this thread! please keep us updated on current events of the situation! i fopr one am a strong advocate of flying the flag upside down as a means of protest and do so myself (just not at this time because it could cause some trouble for my roomates and am being curteous to them). it really alarms me how much violence is aimed at other people that take this stance.

I do not know the specifics of this particular case and why this man has decided to fly the flag so butt i will look into it. As for anyone who says it is disgraceful, i can not speak for this man or any others who might be saying that this nation is a disgrace, but that is not what the act signifies in and of itself.

the national flag code indicates that flying the flag upside down is a signal of distress if "your life or property are in immediate jeopardy." well my property definitely is seing as how an illegal independent bank owns all of our currency and i am illegally forced to pay an income tax every year. aditionnally, if you look at many quotes from our founding fathers, many of them seem to say that our lives are no longer in our control when we have an independent bank controlling our wealth (that was one of the main reasons for the revolution, to get away from the central bank of london.)

so in esence when our government sold us out in 1913 they put all of our lives in immediate jeopardy.

therefore i will fly a an american flag upside down at any time i choose to!

and on an amusing note, Barbara Tobinson apparently forgot she created one ATS account and created a second!

no, I didn't forget, just had trouble with the first account, as to the why's and everything else about this, I'll leave it to someone else, because as I said earlier, no one cares anymore and especially not me, what I do care about here was the fact that some anonymous coward accused my son of something on here, that's what I wanted to set straight.