You have every right in the world to whoop ya kid's..PLZ start I am sick of all the punk's

Originally posted by undermind
Waaaay too many of the big daddy family tyrants are completely ignorant and incompetent and just copy their father from the fifties or sixties or whatever because they've never known the path of the heart in a family.

Those people should have refrained from reproduction or should have used other methods of discipline and reserve the swat for special cases. The swat doesn't solve everything just some things and should not be used as the sole form of discipline. However, I think that in many cases it is justified.

Originally posted by DaMod

Lol! I love when people twist the things I say to use the word ego.

I don't think you have the same definition for the word as I do, but that's off topic.

Spanking should only be used maybe 1% of the time.

Thanks for your opinion. I'm sure it will be no surprise if I don't take that as the truth or agree with it.

You're acting like I don't believe in time outs or other forms of discipline!

No, I'm not. That's your limited perception demonstrating itself again

If your kid steals your car and you do nothing about it then they will undoubtedly do it again!

Where did I suggest doing nothing about it?

My issue is that you and other 'pro-violence' parents believe that resorting to inflicting physical and emotional pain on a less powerful individual is the best course of action to take under certain circumstances.

I strongly disagree.

I'm also willing to bet that you can't get a consensus with co-posters on which circumstances always require violence and which do not.

If the punishment undercuts the crime then they would do it again.

You cannot stop another human from doing something, you can only make them wish they hadn't. Not my quote, but I think it has some truth to it.

Limited perceptions? No, not limited, you obviously tie spanking to the same bow as beating a child senseless. They are not one and the same.

No I don't.

Extreme physical abuse causes emotional trauma, discipline inspires 2nd thought to a wrongful action. People have used physical discipline for hundreds of years, and in my opinion those children turned out better than our current self righteous, entitled, disrespectful youth that has no regard to anyone but themselves.

Rather vague generalisations about character of different generations, combined with a conclusion that only one of a gazillion variables is the deciding factor.

That's why I don't take your opinion too seriously - it is based on severely limited perception, combined with rigorous defence of ego (my def. not yours).

Welcome to the new age of parenting I guess.

It is certainly necessary if humans are going to survive the next century or two without destroying themselves through our heightened abilities to inflict violence on each other.

You think I would like to spank my kids?

A part of you probably does, but deep in your consciousness, you are fully aware that you are violating yourself and 'life' itself each time you do it.... or not!

You must do what has to be done in order to insure a proper upbringing.

Just following orders? Whose orders? I know .... do you?

In fact the spanking method really only needs to be used once just to put the thought in there. They will know you are not kidding around when they step way out of line. They will be sure that it doesn't happen again.

Well, if you are scary and violent enough, that may be true. Otherwise, you'll have to repeat it multiple times or up the anti on the violence.

You are putting spankers in the same category as those who come home drunk every night and beat their children black and blue.

Well not in the sense that you interpret. However, in terms of unconscious behaviour it is the same insanity, just at a different level I suppose.

Do you put the same undertones on spanking as you do with say washing a child's mouth out with soap?

Look, you want what all loving and caring parents want, for you children to become conscious, well adjusted, loving and caring human beings that contribute to the world and find happiness and peace.

That outcome can only come about by the arising of self awareness and consciousness, and that cannot really be taught intentionally through unconscious acts.

Ironically, inflicting sufferring on another can force the ego to back down and allow consciousness/awareness to emerge, but this is nothing akin to your personal reasoning or justification for spanking. More likely, it causes a strengthening of ego identity, which only leads to more and extended suffering for the child, the parent and ultimately, humanity as a whole.

reply to post by RogerT


Anyone that knows me will tell you that I am anything but egotistical. I don't condone violence, however in some cases it is necessary. You're acting like my own ego is the reason for spanking and my intention is not for the betterment of the child's life and then you find it necessary to insult me! You blatantly said I enjoy it when there is nothing I hate to do more. You act like it is a daily occurrence when in fact it is a very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very rare occurrence. My argument is that it is a good form of discipline for some very rare occurrences.

You do not need to escalate the violence! They remember that one nice hard swat. You act like it never works, or creates people that do not properly function or that are prone to violence. You would be wrong on this assumption. Then you say well the historical argument doesn't work because of the other variables when it was a huge part of the parenting process back in the day.

You are not correct about me sir.

reply to post by DaMod


Never mind. I didn't have a lot of confidence that you would fully understand the post, but others may draw some value from it so I made the effort.

No personal attack was meant or intended, my sincere apologies for any offense/suffering I have caused you with my words.

Originally posted by DaMod
reply to post by RogerT

 

Anyone that knows me will tell you that I am anything but egotistical.

As I said before, we are operating on different interpretations of this word. If you could understand my use of the term you would see the humour in your comment above.

As a parting gift, I offer this question: If you are 'anything but' your ego, which in my definition is simply a colleciton of your mental thoughts, opinions and beliefs, who are you?

If you are willing to wrestle with that concept for a while, and can get even a tiny fleeting glimpse of who you really are, I promise you will reconsider your ideas on spanking children.

Best of luck.
R

[edit on 29/7/09 by RogerT]

Originally posted by [davinci]
One final thought to those who feel that talking is the best and only approach: If I see you are being ravaged by a dog, do you want me to yell at it, or beat it off of you?

That's a rather strange analogy to use.
Do you respond to your children in the same way you respond to ravaging dogs or are you advocating that for other people's kids?

reply to post by 6EQUJ5


Wow. thats pathetic, to only extract what you want and what makes your argument better from whatever anyone else said. None of that lies within what anyone has been talking about. You really should read through the post.

Peace!

[edit on 29-7-2009 by Armour For Victor]

Originally posted by RogerT
reply to post by DaMod

 

Never mind. I didn't have a lot of confidence that you would fully understand the post, but others may draw some value from it so I made the effort.

No personal attack was meant or intended, my sincere apologies for any offense/suffering I have caused you with my words.

Well don't take this hard, but DaMod, if he didn't fully understand your post, wasn't the only one.

Are you a parent? What is your age? Since you seem to be so full of parental wisdom, please endulge us with some firsthand accounts of your parenting experiences.

I dont believe in corporal punishment for my kids, i have never laid a hand on either of mine and theyre turning out to be great kids so far.
I know when my dad would spank me it caused a lot of resentment towards him and as i got older and the belt wasnt enough for him, he graduated to hitting me with his fist.
My mom never hit me but she also never stopped my dad from hitting me.
I dont hold any grudges though, I gave my dad a pass because he had a stressful job, Dallas Cop and hes an alcoholic and I gave my mom a pass because she was just afraid of him.
We all have a good relationship now but I always vowed that when i had kids, they would never know violence from me or anyone else.
There are other, more effective ways to discipline children, positive reinforcement is one of them.
Dont beat them when they do bad, reward them when they do good.

Originally posted by Bombeni

Originally posted by RogerT
reply to post by DaMod

 

Never mind. I didn't have a lot of confidence that you would fully understand the post, but others may draw some value from it so I made the effort.

No personal attack was meant or intended, my sincere apologies for any offense/suffering I have caused you with my words.

Well don't take this hard, but DaMod, if he didn't fully understand your post, wasn't the only one.

Are you a parent? What is your age? Since you seem to be so full of parental wisdom, please endulge us with some firsthand accounts of your parenting experiences.

I'm 25, i have a daughter that is 6 years old. Her name is Hannah. I've spanked her only once because I caught her beating the dog for barking. Really beating the dog (like stomping on him and kicking him). Was the only time I've used physical punishment. I hated it, but she's never done it since. I felt it was right although others may disagree. I really think it helped to discourage that kind of behavior.

I'm not claiming to be an expert on parenting. I just know how I was raised and how they did it other than that I'm still just guessing like every other parent trying to raise a future adult. I have my opinions and obviously others have theirs, but I always do best for her the only ways that I know how.

reply to post by DaMod


I wasn't asking you, I was asking RogerT. I did mention your name in the post but I think you misread it. Sorry.





[edit on 29-7-2009 by Bombeni]

reply to post by Amaterasu


I agree with this. Spanking = lazy parenting.


I find that spanking or "whooping" a child (at least my child) has no affect. When my daughter was suspended from kindergarten for behavior issues, her dad spanked her. The very day she returned to school she was placed in detention for behavior issues. So I took it into my own hands and I had her spend a day in "jail". I stripped her room bare and had her spend the entire day writing sentences about her behavior and pleading with her "parole officer" (me) for leniency. About 8 hours later I knew she understood that her behavior issues had consequences and I have never heard or witnessed any repeating offenses since.

That took a lot of work, and it tore at my heart... but no one ever claimed that being a responsible parent was easy.

Personally spanking my children makes me feel sick to my stomach. Why would I want my children to feel pain? Personally I would rather reason with my children. When my children are bad they lose things. My children are good kids, they don't talk back. I personally find that children that are disrespectful and steal are usually the ones who aren't getting attention at home. Seriously, getting attention for bad behaviour is better then getting no attention at all to a child. Try spending more time with your children. You don't need to hit your children, just give them some of your time. If they do something bad then they lose something that means something to them. That hurts more then a 2 sec smack.

reply to post by siouxm


That's a pretty nice method. I'll have to remember that one.

2nd line.

Actually, nevermind. People will probably just take what I posted the wrong way, so screw it I deleted it.

Peace

[edit on 29-7-2009 by jeasahtheseer]

I completely agree with spanking your child. But I dont agree with spanking your child a lot for any reason. Then that's when it turns into abuse.

reply to post by jeasahtheseer


Wow that is sad that you had a childhood like that.

I grew up in the 60's and it was pretty standard to get your butt spanked if you did some crappy thing. Certainly getting whipped/spanked was not a daily thing for most kids, only if they pulled a real nasty trick. Mostly, just knowing you could be whipped/spanked kept us in line. None of us was ever abused though, and looking back and I think wow how did my mom and dad do it, raise 4 kids, both of them work fulltime jobs, and everyone of us turned out to be self-reliant, never in jail, etc.

What you speak of is abuse. No one is advocating abuse.

Originally posted by Bombeni
reply to post by jeasahtheseer

 

Wow that is sad that you had a childhood like that.

I grew up in the 60's and it was pretty standard to get your butt spanked if you did some crappy thing. Certainly getting whipped/spanked was not a daily thing for most kids, only if they pulled a real nasty trick. Mostly, just knowing you could be whipped/spanked kept us in line. None of us was ever abused though, and looking back and I think wow how did my mom and dad do it, raise 4 kids, both of them work fulltime jobs, and everyone of us turned out to be self-reliant, never in jail, etc.

What you speak of is abuse. No one is advocating abuse.

I know that. I just keep seeing people saying stuff like "lots of sissy parents in here" and I think those comments are partly aimed at me because I said a few pages back I'll never lay a hand on my kid. So I made that last post to defend myself.

I was just saying in my own case it started off as just a little slap or whatever but it escalated into much, much worst. I know my case probably isn't typical at all though for most kids who get punished.

Also another reason I could never do any of that to my daughter is because I really don't trust myself because I was a abused person. Many people who are abused as children grow up to be abusers themselves and so far I don't have those types of tendencies and I don't to risk having them come out if I do have them deep down somewhere!

I wasn't really aiming my post at anyone I just wanted to say my feelings on this. I've deleted the whole post now because I don't want people thinking I was attacking them with it or telling them how to raise their kids or whatever. I know people hate being told how to raise their kids, I can't stand it either.

Peace


[edit on 29-7-2009 by jeasahtheseer]

[edit on 29-7-2009 by jeasahtheseer]

reply to post by RogerT


Mate, you really do have a very deluded opinion regarding the up-bringing of children.

When did I once mention violence?

Do you want the definition of violence?

an act of aggression (as one against a person who resists)

acting with or marked by or resulting from great force or energy or emotional intensity; "a violent attack"; "a violent person"; "violent feelings

Doesn't quite fit the bill pal about abusing kids does it?

If you want to be a do-gooder then fair play to you, I suppose you'll put your kids on the "naughty step" or give them a "cool off period"

Happy days pal, your the parent who am I to judge.

I would say though, open your eyes...

And again as I said before STOP likening discipline to physical violence, smacking a kid on its bum isn't the same as kicking the #e out of a child

Get off your high horse and accept what I'm saying

Oh yeah, forgot to mention Roger... violence is slapping your child on its wrist to prevent it touching an open fire?

Jesus mate, if you controlled the world we would all be in trouble...