Crop Circle - New one is a beauty! 24th July 2009

Please for the love of sanity, please consider this:

Does anyone stand to gain money from this?

Who?

Does anyone reguarly make money due to new crop circles?

The answers are yes, crop circle tours, and yes.

It is that simple.

Not aliens, not military weapons that draw art, no indian messages here, it is a stunt pulled for money. Period.

reply to post by Lastone


So you are saying men cannot make motors? LOL!

reply to post by space cadet


Unless they can actually fly over, the experience seems kinda dull and boring to me. I suppose some might think there's some medical benefit to being inside the circle and if their equipment fails. I'd rather see the burial mounds, digs and archeological evidence in the museums. I guess that's also part of the vacation tour package? (woopee)

reply to post by TOSFORUS


Are you talking about the Mayans of WILTSHIRE???

reply to post by aleon1018


Jeez, I have said over and over , they get people to pay 3900.00 a piece to fly over these. 10 people at a time or more. Lots and lots of money to gullible folk who want to believe that there is something to it more than what it is.

www.sacredbritain.com...

cropcircletours.com...

www.travel-quest.co.uk...


It is a freaking industry. If you cannot figure that out by checking out the above links I feel you may need help with reality.

reply to post by space cadet


Sounds like fun!! I'd really like to go to Scottland anyway.

I can't help but wonder if all of these crop circles would still be there after a couple months. Are they also using balloon rides for this?

As far as a reality check, I've recalled having been part of a government training program in the 70's and possibly even an abductee. I don't recall having paid for that trip. I hope they don't send me a bill.

Thanks for the links though.

I'm wondering if a flight with the UFOs while making these circles is also part of the tour package?

reply to post by irishchic


I believe that UFO's created this. these might be codes to represent something that extraterrestrials are trying to tell us. now what worries me is that even though thislooks nice, if you actually look at the inner circles it almost looks as if there are shocked faces.than you move on to the outer circle and it looks like sad faces. could aliens be trying to tell us something?

[sarcasm mode]
Many of the recent crop circles relate to the sun and solar activity. This crop circle also represents the sun. The rays extending from the sun have what appears to be 12 peace symbols. Therefore I say that our space brothers believe that the sun will be at peace for the next 12 months... or to clarify further, a solar minimum until the end of that period. The fact that this design also appears as a snow flake would back this up metaphorically.

[/sarcasm mode]

IRM

It's not that a human couldn't figure it out, but even with 12 people, this is a time consuming undertaking. This is not a 30 minute job, as someone suggested.

If Aliens did it, fine. If man did it, fine.

Let's assume humans did this. I think you would be using more than just rope and planks on this one. Getting those straight lines coming from the center would seem to need an electronic device to make sure you are walking out straight from the center without disturbing the rest of the field. Actually, maybe a compass, now that I think about it. Unless you are carrying a very long pole with you for your straight edge.

I don't know what kind of field this is? Some of those impressions would require a human to walk through the field while trying to flatten as little as possible plant life. I do see a few disturbed areas, but I'm not sure why they are there. From a distance would you be able to tell a person was walking through an area of the field? I do see areas where maybe there could be some crossover points. A nice high resolution photo might shed more light.

Honestly, I don't know one way or the other with this one. You would have to study the crop circle at the ground level to see what the evidence shows. Does it suggest plank smashing or something else? How long did it take for this thing to appear?

Again, this isn't an "in and out" job someone(s) threw together in a half hour. It's quite precise.

I've watched some films on crop circles, and some of the evidence on some of the circles did seem to suggest something other than "stomping." I'm not ruling ET at all. I just need some more evidence on this circle.

Now, this one is amazing,
www.cropcircleconnector.com...

Troy

[edit on 26-7-2009 by cybertroy]

[edit on 26-7-2009 by cybertroy]

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It's pretty. Most crop circles are pretty though, but aside from their artistic aspect so what? Are there people out there that really think these things are NOT man made? I mean seriously...?

Originally posted by afoolbyanyothername
reply to post by jfj123

 

On the contrary, you are the one that is OVER simplifying what it actually may take to get a crop design off of a sheet of paper and onto a field of vision obscuring wheat.
A circle, square, triangle or other simple geometric design would probably be trivial to construct ... but we're not talking about trivial designs. We're seeing incredibly complex designs on a huge scale.

Yep but when you break it down, it's just a bunch of simple shapes. That's where you're getting confused. You're looking at the object as a whole but you should be looking at it as individual pieces.
It's like buildings a house. If you look at a skyscraper, it's seems impossible to build but that's not how it's looked at by the builders. It's look at in small chunks. Get one chunk done and move to the next. It's much more simple then you're making it out to be.

Lets start with basics ... a group of people walk into a field of mature chest high wheat in the middle of the night (ok, let them have flashlights) to start a design. Now, a question ... if you were in charge would you have everyone start work at a beginning point and work outwards ... or would you disperse your people and get them to start working on different segments of the design ?

First, they could also use night vision goggles which would speed things up.
I wouldn't have a whole team. I'd probably pick 4 people. 2 people to work on the design and 2 spotters. Everyone with walkie talkies.

If you have them initially disperse, how would you coordinate their work ... how would you make constant checks to see that EVERY one of them is adhering to the paper plan ?

The same way I would coordinate with people who were building a house for me.

How would you verify the accuracy and alignment of each individual segment so that they all met up perfectly ?

Same as with a house.

How would you even communicate with a group member who is working on a segment 100 metres away from you ?

Walkie Talkie headsets.

This is almost like 2 tunnel boring teams on opposite sides of a mountain drilling a hole towards each other, working independently and still managing to meet up together dead centre.

Which does happen. Down to the inch.

Further, with members working independently and away from each other, how do they do the complex calculations required to create partial circles, various angles such as say, 38 degrees, 67 degrees, 42 degrees, etc when these angles are required to be made at that point of construction ?

The same way I can have a dozen different guys building a house in different area's and have everything match up.

How do they coordinate with each other ? Every segment of the construction HAS to be perfect for it to eventually line up with and meet the other segments to complete the design.

We don't know that ANY crop circle is PERFECT. Nobody has posted scientific data regarding this.

I'm sure I could come up with many more logistical nightmares

They're not nightmares for people who've done it a few times and have a basic understanding of the math involved.

that they would have to contend with but the above points are more than sufficient to make it PERFECTLY clear to any logical and rational individual that a bunch of people working in a field from a design on a sheet of paper simply is NOT practical or feasible by any stretch of the imagination.

It happens every day in the building industry. It's both feasible and practical.

if they are not experts in ground surveying, don't have experience in night time construction, don't have some kind of efficient communication system, don't have continual and ongoing work reviews, etc, etc ... simply don't have a hope in hell of pulling it off.

They don't need to be experts in any of that but maybe they are experts?? Ever think of that?

And frankly, anyone that claims that a bunch of people using nothing more sophisticated than a rope and board can created these design monsters is purely and simply deluding themselves and needs to sit down and work out the logistics for themselves as if THEY were the group leader in charge of the design and anticipate EVERY potential problem and how YOU would overcome it.

And if everyone believed that, nothing would ever get built.
Keep in mind that houses are built with simple strings with dashes on them...they're called tape measures and they're used to exacting standards.

Bet you can't do it .....

Sure I could. You could to with just a little training and a bit of common sense.

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by jfj123

 

Nope. My logic is sound.

Then you should expect the next 2 words.
PROVE IT.

This is my method. No matter wat the black hole is or does, if it has an event horizon and an ergosphere, then what I want to do can work. This is the significant entity. Weather it puffes purple smoke or requires daily doses of ham is irrelevent. As long as it sucks up matter and light, affects time, and makes gravity valleys, then it's ok.

NOPE.
You got caught. That's the reality. I stated that Hawking's theory had radically changed and it did. End of argument. You are wrong, I am right. Spin it anyway you like but that's the reality of it. Be a man enough to admit it.

You have inspired me to make something.


Wish me luck.

[edit on 25-7-2009 by Gorman91]

The only thing you're going to be successful at making is chocolate chip cookies. Get the instant kind though.

You can't even post instructions on how you're going to make this which you must have to make it. So why haven't you posted said instructions to shut me up?

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by afoolbyanyothername
reply to post by jfj123

 

Yep but when you break it down, it's just a bunch of simple shapes. That's where you're getting confused. You're looking at the object as a whole but you should be looking at it as individual pieces.
It's like buildings a house. If you look at a skyscraper, it's seems impossible to build but that's not how it's looked at by the builders. It's look at in small chunks. Get one chunk done and move to the next. It's much more simple then you're making it out to be.

Yes, you can break down almost ANY complex pattern into smaller less detailed segments ... but where you've made a grave error in your assumption is that if you have multiple people working on different sections of the design e.g one is making a circle; another is marking out lines; another is making an angle ... the point is that EVERY part being worked on has to be laid out PERFECTLY in the wheat and in EXACTLY the position it needs to be so that when someone completes an adjacent section it joins your segment perfectly .. even the slightest error by you or him will magnify into a significant deviation by the time it comes to join your and his segments.

First, they could also use night vision goggles which would speed things up.
I wouldn't have a whole team. I'd probably pick 4 people. 2 people to work on the design and 2 spotters. Everyone with walkie talkies.

Night vision goggles aren't going to do you much good when you're standing in a field surrounded by chest high grass and your other team members are dispersed great distances throughout the field working on their part of the design AND also surrounded by chest high wheat.
A very impractical idea.

So you've mentioned gadgets such as every member has night vision goggles and walkie talkies ... so we're starting to see some significant out of personal pocket expense now being incurred by the group simply to tramp down some wheat in a pattern. Begins to seem like an expensive hobby to me !

The same way I would coordinate with people who were building a house for me.

So, tell me ... how many houses do you see being constructed at 3 in the morning and using NO electricity ? Must be a REALLY big house and covering 100's of square meters if it's comparable in size to some of these HUGE designs !

How would you verify the accuracy and alignment of each individual segment so that they all met up perfectly ?

Same as with a house.

Your house analogy is completely flawed and innapropriate.
A house is NOT constructed in the middle of the night in a field of wheat. The location where the house foundations are to be poured is usually cleared and levelled.

The same way I can have a dozen different guys building a house in different area's and have everything match up.

Again, you're arguing with a false analogy.

They're not nightmares for people who've done it a few times and have a basic understanding of the math involved.

Basic math knowledge is all that's required ? Really ??
So YOU would have NO trouble using a rope and some poles and create any EXACT desired angle ? 38 degrees ? 59 degrees ? how about 72 degrees ?
I know somewhat more than "basic" math and even I would have no end of difficulty determining the above angles in the daylight ... let alone in the dark of night ... but wait, I could always make use of my expensive night vision goggles !

that they would have to contend with but the above points are more than sufficient to make it PERFECTLY clear to any logical and rational individual that a bunch of people working in a field from a design on a sheet of paper simply is NOT practical or feasible by any stretch of the imagination.

It happens every day in the building industry. It's both feasible and practical.

You're right ... every DAY in the building industry.
If it's that easy, then why do we never see house construction going on in the middle of the night ?
Simple reason ... because it introduces too many extra variables that don't happen during the day.

Again ... flawed analogy.

Bet you can't do it .....

Sure I could. You could to with just a little training and a bit of common sense.

You're just deluding yourself.
Even constructing in a wheat field an extremely simple geometric shape such as a four sided object comprising 4 unequal length sides and 4 unequal interior angles would probably stump the vast majority of people ... and thats a VERY simple shape.

I'm enjoying this thread for many reasons...

I will only add,and you can take it as you'd like that it's obvious few actually have spent TIME in a corn or wheat field,LOL!

I live surrounded on all sides by them and can assure you that navigating through them day or night can be a daunting experience.

It would NOT be a "30 minute job" no matter what or who was dong the creating.

Originally posted by irishchic
I'm enjoying this thread for many reasons...

I will only add,and you can take it as you'd like that it's obvious few actually have spent TIME in a corn or wheat field,LOL!

I live surrounded on all sides by them and can assure you that navigating through them day or night can be a daunting experience.

It would NOT be a "30 minute job" no matter what or who was doing the creating.

Thank you VERY much !!!!
This has been my point of contention all along. Too many people see a pattern drawn in a wheat field and with NO previous experience OR knowledge immediately proclaim that to create such an intricate pattern is nothing more than childs play and that it can be "knocked together" in an hour or two and using nothing more sophisticated than rope and boards !

It's a delusional response on a massive scale. I'd love to see some of these "crop designing experts" get out there and give it a go and atch with delight as they give up in shear frustration !

[edit on 26-7-2009 by afoolbyanyothername]

I'd be interested in seeing the root formation patterns of crops affected by this phenomenon. If something were affecting the direction the crop grew (alien or otherwise), it would still have a regular root pattern. Given that the plants aren't broken above ground when flattened into a pattern, that would mean that the roots and the entire root ball of the plant/grass, would have to have been moved.
Since we never see these formations in fresh grasses/crops (ie. before they go to seed and dry out to become the hay we are all so familiar with), one would assume that the plants are being moved after the root system has formed. I would looooove to get out there and have a dig around the soil there to see how exactly the plants were formed into the crop circles. (or at least the effects of what happened to them)
The only two things that I can think of, would be if the plants' growth was accelerated overnight (from seed to hay) and a temporary greenhouse was set up that shaded the crop in certain areas so that the grass there would be forced to lean over to get sunlight (?), OR, that during crop formation, something added to the soil purposefully messed with the plants so that they didn't grow upwards... if the latter WERE the case, the crop would be intertwined with the grasses around each indentation...
Gah, I could have a field day out there on one of these things!

[edit on 26/7/2009 by nrky]

Originally posted by afoolbyanyothername

Yes, you can break down almost ANY complex pattern into smaller less detailed segments ... but where you've made a grave error in your assumption is that if you have multiple people working on different sections of the design e.g one is making a circle; another is marking out lines; another is making an angle ... the point is that EVERY part being worked on has to be laid out PERFECTLY

You keep using the word "perfectly" yet you've never proven the crop circles are PERFECT. Please do so or stop using the word.

Also, Once again, this is exactly what happens when building a house minus the wheat. A bunch of guys working on separate sections, bring all the sections together with precision.

in the wheat and in EXACTLY

Stop with the EXACTLY crap. You've never provided a single bit of evidence that these things were done EXACTLY in any way.

the position it needs to be so that when someone completes an adjacent section it joins your segment perfectly ..

Again with the perfect crap. You obviously didn't even read my post. How do you explain a house being built? By your standards, no building should exist.

even the slightest error by you or him will magnify into a significant deviation by the time it comes to join your and his segments.

Ever seen a house built?

Night vision goggles aren't going to do you much good when you're standing in a field surrounded by chest high grass and your other team members are dispersed great distances throughout the field working on their part of the design AND also surrounded by chest high wheat.
A very impractical idea.

Not at all. You've suggested that NIGHT TIME is a big factor as to why this can't be done. By using night vision goggles, we're taking your night factor out of the equation.

So you've mentioned gadgets such as every member has night vision goggles and walkie talkies ... so we're starting to see some significant out of personal pocket expense now being incurred by the group simply to tramp down some wheat in a pattern.

Not really. You can get a pair of 4th gen night vision goggles for about $250.00 and a set of walkie talkies for about $20.00

A lot of people spend money on hobbies so you can't use that as an excuse.

Begins to seem like an expensive hobby to me !

Not really but in any case, I said they COULD use night vision goggles or FLASHLIGHTS...flashlights are about $10.00 for a decent one.

In any case, so what they might spend a lot of money? One of my sisters friends customized his Harley for about $50,000 plus the original cost of the bike. Now that's an expensive hobby ! Does it mean he didn't do it? Of course not.

So, tell me ... how many houses do you see being constructed at 3 in the morning and using NO electricity ?

To be fair, I've only built a few houses at night to meet deadlines and as for electricity, that doesn't compare with a wheat field crop circle. But for the sake of argument, I bring portable generators. 1 guy can toss 1 generator in and out of the truck in less then a minute.

Must be a REALLY big house and covering 100's of square meters if it's comparable in size to some of these HUGE designs !

Yes a few have been and with very ornate designs.

Here's another analogy.
I recently tiled a house using ceramic tile in a front entry & hall, kitchen, utility room and seasonal room. The front entry had a circular ornate design that was cut with water jets. Since the floor plan was open, the tile had to match up at the entry points of each room.
After dry laying out the project, I had 1 guy working in each room laying down tile and it all matched up just fine. If what you're saying were even remotely true, I wouldn't be able to do that.

Your house analogy is completely flawed and innapropriate.

Not at all.

A house is NOT constructed in the middle of the night in a field of wheat. The location where the house foundations are to be poured is usually cleared and levelled.

HUH? are you serious?

The same way I can have a dozen different guys building a house in different area's and have everything match up.

again, you're arguing with a false analogy.

Your inability to understand the analogy doesn't make it false. Trust me, it's an appropriate analogy and it works just fine. Apparently you'll just need to trust me on this one.

they're not nightmares for people who've done it a few times and have a basic understanding of the math involved.

Basic math knowledge is all that's required ? Really ??

So YOU would have NO trouble using a rope and some poles and create any EXACT desired angle ? 38 degrees ? 59 degrees ? how about 72 degrees ?

After laying it out on paper, it wouldn't be that hard.

I know somewhat more than "basic" math and even I would have no end of difficulty determining the above angles in the daylight ... let alone in the dark of night ... but wait, I could always make use of my expensive night vision goggles !

If you would have a problem laying out a crop circle, you're just not trying.
Also, once again, night vision goggles are not expensive anymore.

It happens every day in the building industry. It's both feasible and practical.

You're right ... every DAY in the building industry.
If it's that easy, then why do we never see house construction going on in the middle of the night ?

1. It does happen but not often but I've done it myself.
2. You might be asleep when it's going on.
3. Most townships and cities have ordinances against construction activity after 7pm, before 7 am and some even have ordinances against construction on weekends. You need to get a special waiver from the township to perform construction during, "off hours". You can generally, only get those waivers if the construction is happening in an isolated area.

Simple reason ... because it introduces too many extra variables that don't happen during the day.

Again ... flawed analogy.

Again, not at all. The only additional variable is darkness which can be easily fixed using halogen lighting systems.

As a matter of fact, in Michigan, road crews do perform construction at night from time to time.

You're just deluding yourself.

Not at all. I just have a decent amount of confidence, intelligence and common sense.

Even constructing in a wheat field an extremely simple geometric shape such as a four sided object comprising 4 unequal length sides and 4 unequal interior angles would probably stump the vast majority of people ... and thats a VERY simple shape.

I doubt it. I'm sorry you seem to be having such a problem with it but I believe most people with a decent amount of intelligence and common sense could do it without too much effort. As a matter of fact, one of the other posters has shown this regarding the Firefox crop circle.

reply to post by jfj123

So YOU would have NO trouble using a rope and some poles and create any EXACT desired angle ? 38 degrees ? 59 degrees ? how about 72 degrees ?

After laying it out on paper, it wouldn't be that hard.

Ok, I'll bite ... I'm really intrigued how you would transfer the following from paper onto a wheat field. I'm not being cynical or having a go at you but rather would consider the lesson educational and interesting. So could you please give an explanation (doesn't have to be extensive) as to how you would create an EXACT (there's that word again) angle of 38 degrees between 2 lines utilizing poles and rope.
You're permitted to do this in daylight so leave your night vision goggles home.

Originally posted by afoolbyanyothername
reply to post by jfj123

 

So YOU would have NO trouble using a rope and some poles and create any EXACT desired angle ? 38 degrees ? 59 degrees ? how about 72 degrees ?

After laying it out on paper, it wouldn't be that hard.

Ok, I'll bite ... I'm really intrigued how you would transfer the following from paper onto a wheat field. I'm not being cynical or having a go at you but rather would consider the lesson educational and interesting. So could you please give an explanation (doesn't have to be extensive) as to how you would create an EXACT (there's that word again) angle of 38 degrees between 2 lines utilizing poles and rope.
You're permitted to do this in daylight so leave your night vision goggles home.

The same way you would use blue prints to build a full sized house. It all has to do with scale.
One way to make things a bit quicker would be to pre-mark the lengths of rope for the locations of the center points and color code them for each arc.
Basically what I'm talking about is making a blue print equivalent for a crop circle. It works for a house and it'll work for a crop circle.

By the way, you still haven't answered my question. How do you know that the crop circles were EXACT ???

[edit on 26-7-2009 by jfj123]