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Police union condemns Obama's comments

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posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 08:16 AM
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Originally posted by Ferris.Bueller.II

Originally posted by Sestias
Obama has acknowledged that he spoke in haste. IMO both sides acted stupidly.

It is inflammatory in this country to even suggest that we may have racial divisions.

Anything Obama said short of crawling on his knees and begging us white folks to forgive him for being mistaken in this instance would not be accepted by a lot of people here on ATS.



OK. Let's take a look at reality. Gates, who is black, is a tenured professor at one of the most revered universities in the world; his state Governor, Deval Patrick, is black; and the President of the United States is black.

Now, how long can someone play the race card that blacks are being kept down?

Exactly. Prof. Henry Louis Gates profession isn't historian; he is one of the pioneer "Professionally Black" people in the US, of which Rev. Dr. Jesse Jackson is the most famous. I fully understand that Gates is a tenured professor, but reviewing his scholarship, I wonder if he would be so exalted if he were white? I get the impression that this is too much of a live wire even for FTS...




posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 08:39 AM
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Originally posted by Office 4256
Exactly. Prof. Henry Louis Gates profession isn't historian; he is one of the pioneer "Professionally Black" people in the US, of which Rev. Dr. Jesse Jackson is the most famous. I fully understand that Gates is a tenured professor, but reviewing his scholarship, I wonder if he would be so exalted if he were white? I get the impression that this is too much of a live wire even for FTS...


Excellence in academia is sometimes hard to equate to other professions. We have/had a professor at a local university here that falsely claimed he was an American Indian to get a tenured position there, plagiarized other authors' work in his books, told his students to rebel through bombing and killing, and exalted the deaths of Americans during 9-11. It took the university years to finally succeed in firing him, and he is fighting for his seat back. And a lot of people love him, and are fighting for him to get his job back. What other profession would this assclown be able to succeed in with what he did? I can't think of any other than maybe a terrorist organization.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 08:54 AM
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Originally posted by Wildbob77
I think that it was a mistake for the POTUS to comment on a police arrest when he didn't have all the facts.

The courts are here to determine the right and wrong of a situation, not the President.



The courts are here to generally side with the police 95% of the time whether they are right or wrong. The citizen gets the short end of the stick up the yin yang almost every time.

Cops always admit it when they have erred right?



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 09:26 AM
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reply to post by John Matrix
 


So what I'm hearing from you is that it really doesn't matter what the actual facts are; a simple police presence means the police are at fault? God help us that we should live in your Utopia! In this case, I'm not sure we even need police testimony - that one photograph of Gates screaming like an unhinged maniac at the cops - black and white - gives me a window on his psyche. But of course we need the testimony of Gates, cops and neighbors (apparently plenty due to the screaming). If I had been the cop, I'd probably have backed off, even though I would have considered that somewhat of a dereliction. The only other alternative to "disorderly conduct" would have been referral to a state psychiatric hospital.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 10:01 AM
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Originally posted by Office 4256
reply to post by John Matrix
 


So what I'm hearing from you is that it really doesn't matter what the actual facts are; a simple police presence means the police are at fault? God help us that we should live in your Utopia! In this case, I'm not sure we even need police testimony - that one photograph of Gates screaming like an unhinged maniac at the cops - black and white - gives me a window on his psyche. But of course we need the testimony of Gates, cops and neighbors (apparently plenty due to the screaming). If I had been the cop, I'd probably have backed off, even though I would have considered that somewhat of a dereliction. The only other alternative to "disorderly conduct" would have been referral to a state psychiatric hospital.


A little 5'4" old man screaming at a cop after being confronted in his own home and provoked by a cop that had no ability to defuse the situation and obviously got offended and decided to provoke Gates further by asking him to step outside his own home. Nice touch...LOL. Step outside sir, so I can taser you, or so me and my 6' 1" buddies can lay a beating on your 5'4" scrawny old butt.....


This event tells me that the cops lack training in conflict avoidance and conflict resolution. This situation could easily have been defused if the cop had proper training. I use a technique that I call deflection. Deflection calms a person by getting them to change the direction of their thoughts away from what is bothering them. It works nearly every time, especially when you are not arrogant and you speak in a friendly, respectful, and civil manner.

I know a lot of cops, and with very few exceptions they develop an air of arrogance and wear it on their sleeves from early on in their careers. Many a friend has ostracized themselves from their childhood buddies because of their arrogance after becoming a cop. They are very good at provoking people with their arrogance, very good at bullying people by using threats and ultimatums when there is no need to.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 10:09 AM
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reply to post by John Matrix
 

It sounds like your interaction with law enforcement is more from a "professional" angle.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 10:25 AM
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reply to post by Oldnslo
 


If I treated cops with "the respect they deserve", I'd shoot them on sight. Most deserve a very long stretch in prison with mandatory mental treatment. I'll treat them with respect when they learn to treat citizens with respect. It goes both ways. I treat them with respect now, but it's the respect I give to wasps, black widows, and scorpions: that which you give unpredictably dangerous things that can kill you or radically change your life without warning. But I have zero respect for them as people because most don't deserve it.

This wasn't about racism, it was about an egotistical cop running into an egostitical professor. Cop has a gun, so cop wins the first round. Professor has a powerful friend, so he wins the second.

Obama was right the first time: the cops handled this stupidly, as they usually always do.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 10:42 AM
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Originally posted by apacheman
reply to post by Oldnslo
 


If I treated cops with "the respect they deserve", I'd shoot them on sight. Most deserve a very long stretch in prison with mandatory mental treatment. I'll treat them with respect when they learn to treat citizens with respect. It goes both ways. I treat them with respect now, but it's the respect I give to wasps, black widows, and scorpions: that which you give unpredictably dangerous things that can kill you or radically change your life without warning. But I have zero respect for them as people because most don't deserve it.

This wasn't about racism, it was about an egotistical cop running into an egostitical professor. Cop has a gun, so cop wins the first round. Professor has a powerful friend, so he wins the second.

Obama was right the first time: the cops handled this stupidly, as they usually always do.


I agree. I will add that I would respect Obama more if he did not back track from his first statement.

A very small black man who is vastly aware of how police brutalize and kill his fellow black people (as well as white people) should be given some room here, rather than being condemned for pulling the race card on a cop.

Empathy is the ability to step out of yourself and walk a mile in the other person's shoes. The only time I lack empathy is when it comes to cops. The arrogance they wear openly started way back when, and each subsequent generation is indoctrinated, vaccinated, initiated, and stamped with the same arrogant attitude.
They are the "authorit-ah".
They are the experts.
They have all the experience.
They have the power.
They are the only one's with level heads.
They are in control.
The civi's are just peeons that don't know anything.

Those civi's better kiss our butts or we'll show them who's boss.


Of course their are some good cops.
They are the one's that whistle blow on the illegal activity of other cops.
They are the one's that really try to be humble and treat people with courtesy and respect.
They are the one's that respect privacy and civil rights.
They are the one's that can actually speak with you instead of talk at you.
They are the one's that earn our admiration and respect.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 12:14 PM
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Long yawn.......

I stand by my comments.

I don't care if you are 5' or 6'10", you open your disrespectful flap at a police officer, homeless or Harvard professor, enjoy the ride to the station.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 12:27 PM
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reply to post by John Matrix
 


The police report states he had to step off the porch to better hear his radio. You're saying he was creating some kind of trap or something? Don't you realize most situations like this are so tense it doesn't give you time to think about that kind of stuff and only to react?

Listen, I'm a security guard, and I can tell you first hand that when you're dealing with either a loud, upset resident at an apartment complex or a loud TV, the acoustics can make it very difficult to hear a radio. Stepping off the porch was required of him to make a radio transmission that wasn't muddled with background yelling. He couldn't have heard dispatch without stepping away from the loudmouth.

It is NEVER acceptable to yell at a cop, under any circumstances, because cops are TRAINED to expect the worst right after emotional escalation. They are trained to expect violent retaliation, possibly a gun. Also, what if Gates had a baseball bat or a long rifle next to his door? The cop doesn't know what he's got in there or who may be waiting. Stepping off the porch is a safety precaution creating a buffer zone as well as a necessary step to make a radio transmission.

False charge or not, he has no right to think he's above the law, just as much as a cop doesn't have the right to taser somebody for no reason. But arresting a man for disorderly conduct in public and making a scene? Good call, Crowley.

Seems to me like you're playing devil's advocate more than anything.

This is all a distraction of course. We should be focusing on the real robbers, not the falsely accused robber. Making everything into a big town hall discussion about racism while behind our backs we're getting robbed by the big central banks.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 01:35 PM
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Originally posted by Oldnslo
reply to post by danj3ris
 


It's what we called in the old days, "RESPECT FOR LAW ENFORCEMENT".

Prof. Gates of Harvard forgot the basic rules in dealing with the police. Its show them your ID, answer questions honestly with a "Yes Sir/No Sir" and when driving, "where do I sign" and then keep your trap shut. Treat the officers with the respect they DESERVE!!!

You defend your rights in the court room, geez.... Bad mouth a police officer, stupid, stupid move.

The Cambridge PD were leaving Gate's home, when the Professor decided since he's BO's bud, he'd play the ole race card on the local PD. It did not work!! Greatly offended the local officers who handled the situation properly and law enforcement all across America, got a GOOD look at the real BO.

Prof. Gates got what he deserved, a trip to the station for having a fat mouth.

As far as BO's twin performances regarding Prof. Gates, I have come to the conclusion the he's not just TPTB's empty suit, he's nothing but a bully and a punk.

You'd think a Harvard educated President would have known better. But in his scheme of things, he'd rather play "Divide and Conquer" than be the President of all the American people.

Professor Gates has an excuse, he dropped out of Yale, where they teach real men how to play hardball. I've seen all I need to see. BO carries a bag of softballs.


As a final note, God bless Los Angeles' Ex-Chief of Police, Daryl Gates, the best Chief of Police this city has ever had.



I hope you are being sarcastic; if not, shame on you. While you are kowtowing and genuflecting and bowing to a COP, of all people, I will be standing toe to toe with them if they think they are above the law. Cops do NOT deserve ' respect' any more than anyone else.

You are obviously one of those timid cop groupies that fawn over any thug with a badge. Because in the OLD days people were even MORE afraid of cops going beserk and violating rights than today. With video to capture police abuses of the people we can catch more cops abusing us.

Gates was NOT guilty of anything. Here is a refresher course in how the LAW operates. disorderly conduct is a ' breach of the peace'. An ESSENTIAL ELEMENT of a breach of the peace is VIOLENCE, either actual or IMMANENT. It is supposed to be used to stop words from becoming violence. If a redneck is shouting racist words at a car load of LA gangbangers, the cops could charge the redneck with DC because if they did not remove him there would no doubt be a violent confrontation.

The INTENT to provoke a violent retaliation is an essential part of DC. since no one in their right mind would TRY to get a cop to beat him senseless, there can be NO intent on Gates part to provoker any violence. he was just expressing his OPINION ...and the cop didn't LIKE Gates opinion, so he used a false charge to show him who is ' boss'.

Well, black folks today are NOT going to be violated by any more ' boss' types if they can help it. Gates for sure is not going to stand by while some cop refuses to walk away and has his huge ego hurt by a man taking a stand in his OWN HOME.

Your entire post seems to reek of submissive groveling by us citizens when we happen to encounter one of our SERVANTS..one of the people we pay to show US respect...we pay them to act professionally, and a charge that gets thrown out as fast as this one did was phony all the way or it would have stuck and been taken to trial.

Can you imagine this typical white Irish Boston cop getting on the stand and tring to say that Gates was violent? Or that his neighbors were in fear of immanent violence/ no way!! It is ridiculous. What immnent violence was the cop preventing? None!! The cop just got fed up, and that means he is NOT a p[rofessional, he is typical.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 01:35 PM
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Originally posted by John Matrix
A little 5'4" old man screaming at a cop after being confronted in his own home and provoked by a cop that had no ability to defuse the situation and obviously got offended and decided to provoke Gates further by asking him to step outside his own home. Nice touch...LOL. Step outside sir, so I can taser you, or so me and my 6' 1" buddies can lay a beating on your 5'4" scrawny old butt.....


This event tells me that the cops lack training in conflict avoidance and conflict resolution. This situation could easily have been defused if the cop had proper training. I use a technique that I call deflection. Deflection calms a person by getting them to change the direction of their thoughts away from what is bothering them. It works nearly every time, especially when you are not arrogant and you speak in a friendly, respectful, and civil manner.

I know a lot of cops, and with very few exceptions they develop an air of arrogance and wear it on their sleeves from early on in their careers. Many a friend has ostracized themselves from their childhood buddies because of their arrogance after becoming a cop. They are very good at provoking people with their arrogance, very good at bullying people by using threats and ultimatums when there is no need to.


Do you, by chance, get "singled out" a lot for committing crimes? And then try to stake out your rights when police question you, and tend to be generally resistive towards police in general? Cause that's how you're making out to be. And, yes, I can guarantee you, that if you take that stance towards 90% of police officers, they will get irritated.

I have a few questions for you, if you don't mind answering them:

1) How were the police supposed to know he was "in his own home?" If a black person breaks into your house, police arrive, and he starts screaming about racism when asked for identification, should they just placate him and leave? The police were called because someone dialed 911 and reported a burglary taking place in the house, don't forget. It's not like the police saw a black man in a house and decided to go up and harass him.

2) How is asking the man to step out of his house "provoking him?" And do you not consider Gates screaming obscenities about the officer's mother, calling him a racist attempting to provoke the officer?

3) Do you think Gates was surprised when he stepped outside, and was not tasered, or beaten down as you claim he was sure to have been had he done so? Do you think that was not what he intended to happen, and that he was even more surprised when the police officer calmly and collectively explained that if he kept up the behavior, he would be arrested? And not once did he explain this, but twice, and all the while, Mr. Gates was still screaming about racism.

4) How would you have "defused" the situation, in which a resident had no interest in helping you out, kept calling you a racist, was attempting to create a scene, and pretty much ignored everything you say? I don't think "deflection" would have helped out much here, in a matter when a man was hellbent on either provoking a police officer or starting a small civil disturbance on his front lawn.

5) Lastly, what makes you think Sgt. Crowley was being arrogant about anything? Do you think he was being arrogant when he performed mouth-to-mouth resuscitation to attempt to save Reggie Lewis' life 16 years ago? Or that he all of a sudden became a racist pig?

I know my fair share of police officers, I've dealt with them both as a citizen, and as a suspect. In each time, I have been calm, collected, and presented my story, my side of the "argument," if you will, and have only had one bad encounter with a particularly ignorant (not arrogant) detective. As long as you treat the officers with respect, they will do the same to you. If you (collective "you," not singling you out) start screaming at officers when they ask for identification, expect to at least be detained, because YOU just escalated the situation, not the officers.

And on the note of arrogance, who in this case was the one shouting, "You don't know who I am!"

I believe it was Mr. Gates.

I pointed out earlier, how if this was truly a racially-motivated incident, if this was truly the case of an indigent police officer overstepping his bounds, if it was one of the incidents the anti-police preachers love to jump all over, wouldn't Mr. Gates have been tased, beaten, or otherwise physically harmed? They even cuffed him in the front because he needed his cane!

I honestly think this was a case of a predominant black person seeing the opportunity to make headlines by provoking a police officer, getting tased or beaten, and "proving" that all cops are racist pigs. However, his plan backfired and now he just looks like an idiot.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 01:39 PM
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Originally posted by northexpedition
reply to post by John Matrix
 


The police report states he had to step off the porch to better hear his radio. You're saying he was creating some kind of trap or something? Don't you realize most situations like this are so tense it doesn't give you time to think about that kind of stuff and only to react?

Listen, I'm a security guard, and I can tell you first hand that when you're dealing with either a loud, upset resident at an apartment complex or a loud TV, the acoustics can make it very difficult to hear a radio. Stepping off the porch was required of him to make a radio transmission that wasn't muddled with background yelling. He couldn't have heard dispatch without stepping away from the loudmouth.

It is NEVER acceptable to yell at a cop, under any circumstances, because cops are TRAINED to expect the worst right after emotional escalation. They are trained to expect violent retaliation, possibly a gun. Also, what if Gates had a baseball bat or a long rifle next to his door? The cop doesn't know what he's got in there or who may be waiting. Stepping off the porch is a safety precaution creating a buffer zone as well as a necessary step to make a radio transmission.

False charge or not, he has no right to think he's above the law, just as much as a cop doesn't have the right to taser somebody for no reason. But arresting a man for disorderly conduct in public and making a scene? Good call, Crowley.

Seems to me like you're playing devil's advocate more than anything.

This is all a distraction of course. We should be focusing on the real robbers, not the falsely accused robber. Making everything into a big town hall discussion about racism while behind our backs we're getting robbed by the big central banks.


Thanks for another voice of reason. I totally agree.

Crowley did the right thing and the black officer involved in the arrest backs Crowley actions 100%. Nuff said.

I predict that at every turn where Obama, or his minions, will play the race card at every opportunity, to get what they want. This is what was attempted in this situation, but most observant Americans saw it for what it was. It might actually give us a peek at who are the real "racists" in this country.

A lot of us have BO figured out and he's only been in office 6 months. It took most Americans 6 years to catch on to "I'm not a crook" Nixon. BO better put on his leather chaps for the long dowhill slide to the end of his one term Presidency.

He promised to unite the American people, when in truth he plays TPTB's "Divide and Conquer" with his race card antics. Hypocrite of the first order.

It won't take long for most Americans to figure this out.

[edit on 26-7-2009 by Oldnslo]



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 01:50 PM
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Originally posted by richierich
Gates was NOT guilty of anything. Here is a refresher course in how the LAW operates. disorderly conduct is a ' breach of the peace'. An ESSENTIAL ELEMENT of a breach of the peace is VIOLENCE, either actual or IMMANENT. It is supposed to be used to stop words from becoming violence. If a redneck is shouting racist words at a car load of LA gangbangers, the cops could charge the redneck with DC because if they did not remove him there would no doubt be a violent confrontation.

The INTENT to provoke a violent retaliation is an essential part of DC. since no one in their right mind would TRY to get a cop to beat him senseless, there can be NO intent on Gates part to provoker any violence. he was just expressing his OPINION ...and the cop didn't LIKE Gates opinion, so he used a false charge to show him who is ' boss'.


Chapter 272, Section 53. Common night walkers, common street walkers, both male and female, common railers and brawlers, persons who with offensive and disorderly acts or language accost or annoy persons of the opposite sex, lewd, wanton and lascivious persons in speech or behavior, idle and disorderly persons, disturbers of the peace, keepers of noisy and disorderly houses, and persons guilty of indecent exposure may be punished by imprisonment in a jail or house of correction for not more than six months, or by a fine of not more than two hundred dollars, or by both such fine and imprisonment.

I see nothing in the code that requires these "essential elements" you speak of. AND, how is Mr. Gates shouting racist rhetoric at a police officer, with many other onlookers (who may start a civil disturbance if Mr. Gates is not quelled), different from your "redneck" scenario? And are you implying that all rednecks are racist? Why even use the term "redneck" at all?



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 02:00 PM
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By the way, here is some LAW that says that even cursing the cops is legal. they are not supposed to get their itty bitty wittle feewings hurt!!

From this case:

www.firstamendmentcenter.org...

and this:
www.freedomforum.org...

from the above case:

"Every state has laws against foul language, but the courts, including the U.S. Supreme Court, have generally agreed that the words have to be used in a violent or sexually obscene context, said John Burkoff, associate dean and law professor at the University of Pittsburgh. Uttering something vulgar or profane is not, in itself, grounds for arrest, he said."

And, remember Timothy Bopomer, the guy in the canoe that swore while kids were there? even HE was eventually exonerated:

Case:www.freedomforum.org...

"In one case out of Michigan, Timothy Boomer, a canoeist who let loose a stream of curses after falling out of a canoe, was found guilty three years ago of violating a law against cursing in front of women and children. He was fined $75 and ordered to perform four days of community service. In April, though, an appeals court struck down the 105-year-old law and threw out the conviction."

And on and on:
" Analyzing this development, Meierhenry wrote that “the United States Supreme Court has made it clear that in order for speech to fall within the ‘fighting words’ exception, the words by their very utterance have ‘to tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace’ under the circumstances of the case.”

According to Meierhenry, Suhn’s profanity about the police did not “tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace,” as the other people standing on Main Street did not react with any type of violence.

“The crowd merely responded with facial expressions of disbelief,” he wrote. “Just because someone may have been offended, annoyed, or even angered by Suhn’s words does not make them fighting words.”

and:www.fac.org...

from this case: A man who cursed at police officers in Brookings, S.D., engaged in protected free speech, the state high court has ruled.

The court voted 4-1 to reverse a lower court decision that had found Marcus Suhn used unprotected fighting words — defined by the U.S. Supreme Court more than 60 years ago as words “which by their very utterance inflict injury or tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace.”


There has to be an IMMEDIATE breach of the peace....NOt potential..NOT to assuage the ego of some cop...NOT to pretend that some neighbors were suprised or ' alarmed'...NO!! it is NOT the intent of the law.

As long as you are not inciting an IMMEDIATE violent retaliation, there is NO disorderly conduct. the FACT of the matter is that cops use this law for their own purposes in enforcing a law that does not exist!1 There is no law saying that cops are special people that have to be addressed and bowed down to. If this society acts like a cop is a Nazi stormtrooper, the cops will ACT like Nazi stormtroopers, guaranteed. We should NEVER allow some cop to think that he is in any way, shape or form deserving of anything except our suspicious and wary caution in any venture that the cop undertakes.

" Yes Sir"...No Sir"...yassa massa!! Please don't whip me massa...please don't arrest me for nothing boss...is that the way you think/ God help save us from the worshippers of a common servant who should have absolutem limits on their authority, as they abuse same at evey chance, proven historically.

It sickens the independent mind to imagine being cowardly enough to give deference to a cop...unreal. They don't deserve until they prove they are not like 90% of all cops...willing to falsely charge to make a point. That is what happened with Gates.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 02:09 PM
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[

Chapter 272, Section 53. Common night walkers, common street walkers, both male and female, common railers and brawlers, persons who with offensive and disorderly acts or language accost or annoy persons of the opposite sex, lewd, wanton and lascivious persons in speech or behavior, idle and disorderly persons, disturbers of the peace, keepers of noisy and disorderly houses, and persons guilty of indecent exposure may be punished by imprisonment in a jail or house of correction for not more than six months, or by a fine of not more than two hundred dollars, or by both such fine and imprisonment.

I see nothing in the code that requires these "essential elements" you speak of. AND, how is Mr. Gates shouting racist rhetoric at a police officer, with many other onlookers (who may start a civil disturbance if Mr. Gates is not quelled), different from your "redneck" scenario? And are you implying that all rednecks are racist? Why even use the term "redneck" at all?

You totally miss the point: This old statute is NOT in force. Court cases since it's writing have narrowed it all down. For example, it is NOT illegal anymore to be ' idle' now is it? No. It is not illegal anymore to censor words because of the sex of the person offended:"or annoy persons of the opposite sex"..See? You can quote any old general law that has been made invalid in this day and age, but it is not a valid debating point. It is like me quoting an old supreme court decision that validated slaery and saying that is is still Ok today...it is not!

It is also not illegal to be a ' streetwalker', whatever that means...now the courts demand specific and not general applications. Prostitution is illegal, but walking down a street , whether or not some cop thinks you are a hooker, is LEGAL. Those old laws are gone, thank God..and you should find a real example or admit that I am right.

By the way, how would you define today the following: RAILER...AND BRAWLER ?? Invalid..AND INVALID MEANS not in effect.



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 02:17 PM
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reply to post by Oldnslo
 


Crowley abused his authority.

The altercation did NOT take place in public, so public disorderliness statutes do NOT apply.

The man was in his own home, a private residence.

Crowley exhibited an appalling lack of judgment in that he failed to use any reasoning ability at all that I can percieve.

Cops tend to put great store by their supposedly special grasp of people's intentions, behaviors, modes of dress, etc. etc. ad nauseum to justify stopping someone because their gut and experience tell them something illegal is going on.

A burglar and a homeowner present two entirely different demeanors when confronted by police. A burglar and a college professor exhibit two entirely different demeanors when interacting with police. If Crowley couldn't figure out which was which, why would anyone take his word for squat?

My bet is that he approached the issue with ignorance, arrogance and attitude, demanding obiesance, which cops commonly call "respect", an attitude and belief they share with other violence-prone outfits like gangs and criminal syndicates. When it wasn't offered, he escalated his attitude to provoke an angry response to justify arrest. Cops do this every minute of every hour of every day, somewhere in the "land of the free".

[edit on 26-7-2009 by apacheman]



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 02:17 PM
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reply to post by richierich
 


Listen, cops have a tough job, whether you'd like to admit it or not, and you never know what situation they just got back from. I am not referring to Crowley, but rather your assertion that common courtesy is not required at all times for a uniformed police officer. They could have just been at the scene of a murder, working a 12 hour shift, dealing with a domestic disturbance case, could have got socked in the nose trying to subdue a purse snatcher.... etc. Oftentimes they have a short fuse dealing with a lot of effed up stuff all day, and the last thing they want is another kid or uppity soccer mom yelling at them for pulling them over for no reason.

I don't care if I'm in the wrong, I'm going to say "yes sir, no sir" to a police officer because:

1. He has a gun and a tazer and I dont.
2. He has the ability to arrest me and stack charges or find violations he would have otherwise ignored (i.e. expired car registration).
3. It gets him off my case a LOT quicker and gives him less reason to waste my time.

What, do you think being rebellious to a police officer gets you more ATS cred or something? All it's gonna do is get you more tickets. Who are you trying to impress? Are you trying to make a point or something?

It's COMMON FREAKING DECENCY to be nice to a PERSON serving their community. When you show empathy for a human being working a rough job, it shows through, and they tend to go lightly on you, sometimes even dropping the ticket altogether because you were nice to them.

Sometimes it's a lot SMARTER to lick their boots and play by their rules. "Yes sir, no sir" tends to get you a LOT further than "What exactly did I do wrong? I didn't do anything wrong!" Being overly defensive to ANYONE gets you nowhere. It's a lot smarter and productive to be level-headed and cool about the situation, and calmly address your grievances to the officer.


Scenario A:

"Hi Officer, may I ask what I did wrong?"
"You were going 65 in a 40 zone."
"Ah, I'm sorry about that, yeah I messed up, well I'm late for a job interview. Isn't there some way you could let this one go?"
"Sorry, you'll have to leave earlier next time."

Then he writes you a ticket.


Scenario B:

"Can you tell me why you were going 65 in a 40?"
"Because I am LATE for WORK and if you keep holding me here, I'm going to sue you for lost wages if I lose my job! WHAT'S YOUR BADGE NUMBER? I'm going to get you fired!"
"Calm down sir. Next time act a bit nicer and I might have ignored the expired registration sticker and busted tail light."

He writes you 3 tickets instead of 1.


Being mean to a police officer gives them more leverage to mess with you and tilt things in their favor if it ever comes to trial. Disrespect for law enforcement makes them think you're the type who disobeys the law in general, to the point that you might be carrying around crack rocks in your pocket or something.

It's just smarter and makes more sense to be calm and collected, and it makes them treat you a lot less harshly, in my experience.

Right, we know about the Alex Jones-esque "police state" paranoia and social engineering going on, but since when has it ever been acceptable to cause anarchy in the face of an ambassador of the government?

It's like walking up to a beehive and hitting it with a baseball bat and not expecting to get stung.

"When in Rome, do as the Romans do."

[edit on 26-7-2009 by northexpedition]



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 02:21 PM
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reply to post by apacheman
 


It became a public incident and grounds for arrest when he was attracting a large crowd and making a scene. This is common knowledge to anyone with half a brain that if you are disorderly in public and saying to a cop "I'll speak with your momma outside" your ass is going to jail.


On Thursday July 16, 2009, Henry Gates, Jr. was placed under arrest after being observed exhibiting loud and tumultous behavior, in a public place, directed at a uniformed police officer who was present investigation a report of a crime in progress. These actions on behalf of Gates served no legitimate purpose and caused citizens passing by this location to stop and take notice while appearing surprised and alarmed.

-Officer James Crowley


Read the report(s) for yourself and see that its well documented and even backed up with Ofcr. Figueroa's police report.

www.thesmokinggun.com...

[edit on 26-7-2009 by northexpedition]



posted on Jul, 26 2009 @ 02:23 PM
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reply to post by northexpedition
 


It goes both ways: a cop has no idea what anyone else has just been through either, so what justifies them taking out their stress on citizens?

The key point you mentioned was that a cop can kill you and get away with it: they have weapons, you don't, and they're not afraid to use them on you. That's a valid reason to to keep your mouth shut, and save your criticisms for later, but it isn't a reason to kiss their ass.



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