“Give me half a tanker of iron and I will give you an ice age.”- Russ George

Originally posted by Donkey_Dean
AGW taxation will keep America out of the red. What do you expect, no one said anything while Bush was cutting taxes on record levels and spending like hell. Bushes Medicare B has already broken the system and we can’t undo it. The funds have to come from some place.

Truth hurts, but Medicare B was legislation for big Pharma by big Pharma. Make no mistake friends everyone knew it would break the system AGW was already staged to bridge the gap and cover the cost.

America is for sale friends and it always has been. Money talks and bull# walks.

You ever heard about the Diamond mining company that wanted to mine the Arkansas public diamond mine? Legislation existed which protected the publically owned mine, and ensured that it could never be exploited or taken from public use “This was an open/working park mind you”. To make the story short this company lined a few pockets and had legislation past that gave them full and sole access to the mine.

The only reason we can still hunt for diamonds there is the fact that the company after some experimental digging found the mine to be not commercially viable. Not enough carets per ton.

It’s all for sale, big business rules the roost in America. Capitalism at its finest.


[edit on 23-7-2009 by Donkey_Dean]

REPLY: AGW, AKA as cap and Tax, would bankrupt America if BHO hadn't already done so. In Europe, every "Green" job caused the loss of two "regular" jobs. Medicare was already bankrupt before GW was in office, simply because government is running it.

The reduction in tax rates by GW resulted in more money going to the government coffers, more money in the pockets of those who earned it, and in 2006, alone, generated enough NEW wealth equal to the entire economy of China.

"Big Business" is........ YOU!!! A corporation is a legal fiction, and is nothing more than many people working for the same business. PEOPLE are the economy, not government. The top 15% of earners in America (those evil rich) pay over 85% of the taxes, and over 35% of people in America pay no taxes at all.

I didn't agree with many things Bush spent money on (like more social programs), but most of it went to keeping America safe, which he did for eight years. Medicare B was the only part of it that was actually coming in UNDER BUDGET, until the Dems stuck their wienie in the soup and removed the competition from the equation.

It's obvious that there are a lot of different opinions on this issue. Considering the fact that it involves the ecosystem concerns each way should be considered and not dismissed out of hand.

I think it really needs further study and research because it has the possibility of a lot of upsides with little relatively low cost. Other than the Planktos project has anyone found any other background on the subject? I'm limited in my internet acces for the next few weeks and will be doing more searching but I'm curious as to wether this has been in the public eye much at any other time.

I'm very interested in what seems to be an attempt by the Green Cabalto prevent the idea from being tested at all. It seems to me that if you reduced the free carbon levels, increased the ability of habitat to support life and even helped to increase depleted marine life and food supplies that it would be something that should be studied.

Why would they want to stop carbon sequestration, improvments in the habitat and increases in dwindling food supplies worldwide?

reply to post by badgerprints


I believe this will work.

See, we are not tampering things we do not understand. We are affecting the base of a structure that is basically an upside down pyrimid, and at that level, alteration swill not drastically affect the rest.


I say do it in the smalles ocean first, the indain ocean, then spread if it works.

Alot of Iron was deposited into the oceans during WW2 - Significantly more than half a tanker.

No ice age occurred...

Originally posted by zappafan1

Originally posted by Donkey_Dean
AGW taxation will keep America out of the red. What do you expect, no one said anything while Bush was cutting taxes on record levels and spending like hell. Bushes Medicare B has already broken the system and we can’t undo it. The funds have to come from some place.

Truth hurts, but Medicare B was legislation for big Pharma by big Pharma. Make no mistake friends everyone knew it would break the system AGW was already staged to bridge the gap and cover the cost.

America is for sale friends and it always has been. Money talks and bull# walks.

You ever heard about the Diamond mining company that wanted to mine the Arkansas public diamond mine? Legislation existed which protected the publically owned mine, and ensured that it could never be exploited or taken from public use “This was an open/working park mind you”. To make the story short this company lined a few pockets and had legislation past that gave them full and sole access to the mine.

The only reason we can still hunt for diamonds there is the fact that the company after some experimental digging found the mine to be not commercially viable. Not enough carets per ton.

It’s all for sale, big business rules the roost in America. Capitalism at its finest.


[edit on 23-7-2009 by Donkey_Dean]

REPLY: AGW, AKA as cap and Tax, would bankrupt America if BHO hadn't already done so. In Europe, every "Green" job caused the loss of two "regular" jobs. Medicare was already bankrupt before GW was in office, simply because government is running it.

The reduction in tax rates by GW resulted in more money going to the government coffers, more money in the pockets of those who earned it, and in 2006, alone, generated enough NEW wealth equal to the entire economy of China.

"Big Business" is........ YOU!!! A corporation is a legal fiction, and is nothing more than many people working for the same business. PEOPLE are the economy, not government. The top 15% of earners in America (those evil rich) pay over 85% of the taxes, and over 35% of people in America pay no taxes at all.

I didn't agree with many things Bush spent money on (like more social programs), but most of it went to keeping America safe, which he did for eight years. Medicare B was the only part of it that was actually coming in UNDER BUDGET, until the Dems stuck their wienie in the soup and removed the competition from the equation.

Your very confused friend!! AGW = the largest tax increases in history. New wealth from Bush? Maybe right before the bottom dropped out, and everyone said oh crap were royally screwed.

Do you even know what Medicare B is? Bush invented the damn thing. You need to do some research friend. Bush bankrupted this country, he was the first president to take office with a surplus in 30 years.

That crook robbed you, your children and your childrens children. America is on the verge of colapse. Medicair B will have us in the red from here on out. What happens when America defaults? Bye bye America as we know it, and you can thank Bush.

I know its a lot to ask, but frontline has a show called 10 trillion and counting. It goes a long way to showing the complete story. Please do have a look. It is not biased one way or the other just plain fact and truth.

I am very wealthy friend. No thanks to Bush times have been very hard. Bush is and was the freaking Devil!!!! He knew exactly what he was doing in fact many advised against it. BHO has done what had to be done, nothing more. He inherited this mess remember.

Your insane if you do not acknowledge how big business rules the roost in this country. I can point out many times when legislation has been passed which benefitted only some corporate interest. It’s America anyone with the resources can push legislation.

Had Bush stepped into your yard and shot your dog, would you still be kissing his ass? I would have rather lost my dog friend!

Oh and on the more secure note! We are no more secure than we were before 911. We can’t even touch on the influx of things like heroin and coc aine. Much less hardened determined terrorists. The fact that we have not been hit is beyond comprehension really. Shoot man, thousands of Mexicans cross illegally every day. So what’s stopping them? Its not Homeland Security.



[edit on 24-7-2009 by Donkey_Dean]

Originally posted by Exuberant1
Alot of Iron was deposited into the oceans during WW2 - Significantly more than half a tanker.

No ice age occurred...

it wasn't fine grain nor spread out

Originally posted by Gorman91

Originally posted by Exuberant1
Alot of Iron was deposited into the oceans during WW2 - Significantly more than half a tanker.

No ice age occurred...

it wasn't fine grain nor spread out

Spread out?

It was called 'World War' 2 - that is pretty spread out.

The hulls of of the various ships active in our oceans continuously deposit 'fine grain iron.' No ice age....

Originally posted by Exuberant1

Originally posted by Gorman91

Originally posted by Exuberant1
Alot of Iron was deposited into the oceans during WW2 - Significantly more than half a tanker.

No ice age occurred...

it wasn't fine grain nor spread out

Spread out?

It was called 'World War' 2 - that is pretty spread out.

The hulls of of the various ships active in our oceans continuously deposit 'fine grain iron.' No ice age....

Without any doubt we could fertilize the oceans and promote plankton growth. No point in arguing that. So what if it took more than just Iron.

I saw some studies that showed Plankton increases just because of increased CO2.

The ability to manipulate the temperature of the planet is an ability that a type 1 civilization has.

We are not a type 1 civilization. Not yet.


*Plankton growth has increased since we killed the whales who eat it.

Want more plankton, kill the rest of the whales.


[edit on 24-7-2009 by Exuberant1]

Originally posted by Exuberant1
Alot of Iron was deposited into the oceans during WW2 - Significantly more than half a tanker.

No ice age occurred...

The size needed to make the iron available to the phytoplankton is an extremely fine powder. It has to be small enough to suspend it in the upper layers of water where the phytoplankton live. They need sunlight as well as nutrients so sunken ships are in big unusable chunks that are too deep.

[edit on 24-7-2009 by badgerprints]

Originally posted by Exuberant1
The ability to manipulate the temperature of the planet is an ability that a type 1 civilization has.

We are not a type 1 civilization. Not yet.


*Plankton growth has increased since we killed the whales who eat it.

Want more plankton, kill the rest of the whales.


[edit on 24-7-2009 by Exuberant1]

Excellent post! Maybe by increasing the numbers of creatures that eat the sardines and other species that feed from the plankton we could shed more CO2. And yes 100% kill the whales. Maybe keep one or two, ya know just to shut up peta and green peace.

What else may be needed to clean up after the dyeing plankton blooms? Maybe mechanical harvesting, shoot we could turn the stuff into oil. Recycling on a global scale so to speak. Better yet we can kill off the sardine and other plankton feeding species predators and harvest the plankton feeders for oil as well.

Problem solved people! Remember this is survival, not a fairy princesses day dream.



[edit on 24-7-2009 by Donkey_Dean]

Originally posted by Exuberant1

*Plankton growth has increased since we killed the whales who eat it.

Want more plankton, kill the rest of the whales.


[edit on 24-7-2009 by Exuberant1]

Actually many many types of small marine life feed on phytoplankton. Mostly the whales feed on krill, shrimp and smaller fish. These all rely on smaller creatures that feed on phytoplankton which is at the bottom of the food chain.

Originally posted by badgerprints

Actually many many types of small marine life feed on phytoplankton.

I bet we could poison them somehow.

Maybe a virus could be created to attack those organisms whilst leaving the rest unharmed; A "Krill Flu" or something to that effect.

We could attach perforated drums of the stuff to the remaining whales, and let them disperse it into the feeding areas.

[edit on 24-7-2009 by Exuberant1]

Kill the predators of the plankton eating species, or at least keep their numbers low. Fertilize the oceans to increase plankton growth. Harvest both the plankton and plankton eating species for conversion to Oil. Problem solved, we just need to better manage things is all.

We have all the needed technology for this!!!

Remember this is survival, not a fairy princesses day dream. It’s not by the principals of humanity that mankind is able to maintain himself above the animal world. Our lives today are built around this type of mindset. It is a mindset of survival despite the odds, and is very beneficial to mankind.

Sometimes species must give way, and thats just how the cookie crumbles.

Wouldn’t it be neat if something like this led to a manageable climate?



[edit on 24-7-2009 by Donkey_Dean]

reply to post by badgerprints


That is a crazy idea. What fully don't understand how organisms interact with other, much less how they do it in a water environment. There are countless uknown forms of life in the ocean, from bacteria to whales..we have absolutely no idea what kind of affect doing something like would create. Bacteria can feed off iron..in combination with the excess oxygen created by the Phytoplankton it could get ugly.

Creating a boom will infuse the oceans oxygen, but could possibly cause a drastic increase in bacteria, not to mention other unknown microbes.

Bah, just seed the ocean with kelp and seaweed farms and call it a day!

Originally posted by Donkey_Dean

Wouldn’t it be neat if something like this led to a manageable climate?

By detonating a 20 megaton nuclear weapon over a sizable iron ore deposit in the ocean, the required amount of particulate might be generated.

Although, a series of twenty 1 megaton blasts over multiple ore locations would guarantee results. I mean, why take take any chances? not to mention doing it in multiple locations would save energy - energy that would have been used to disperse the iron by other means.


Edit: this would be an excellent show of force for the rest of the world to see. It is important that they be made to see that the USA still has 'the right stuff'. This would do just that.

The best part is we could do it completely unilaterally, which is a perfect demonstration of our global supremacy and the he United States will have assumed some of the properties of a Type 1 Civilization. After this display of American Beneficence the whole world will look at us with wide-eyed wonderment.

*This is too important a matter to be left to the rest of the world - who for the most part - are much less knowledgeable than we are about this sort of thing. Plus, we are the only ones with the Power, resources, technology and Brains to pull this off.


[edit on 24-7-2009 by Exuberant1]

reply to post by cenpuppie


Actually it happens every day. The saharan winds feed the atlantic a steady meal of iron (among other things) for 9 months out of the year. This is observed in nature it just doesn't happen as much as it could.

Originally posted by Exuberant1

Originally posted by Donkey_Dean

Wouldn’t it be neat if something like this led to a manageable climate?

By detonating a 20 megaton nuclear weapon over a sizable iron ore deposit in the ocean, the required amount of particulate might be generated.

Although, a series of twenty 1 megaton blasts over multiple ore locations would guarantee results. I mean, why take take any chances? not to mention doing it in multiple locations would save energy - energy that would have been used to disperse the iron by other means.

[edit on 24-7-2009 by Exuberant1]

Uh, dude
sarcasm?

Originally posted by badgerprints
reply to post by cenpuppie

 

The saharan winds feed the atlantic a steady meal of iron (among other things) for 9 months out of the year....it just doesn't happen as much as it could.....
(emph. mine)

I don't think America could get away with nuking the Sahara.

Besides, would it not be more efficient to hit sources of iron that are already under the ocean?


[edit on 24-7-2009 by Exuberant1]

I dont know about t this idea.

The planet naturally provides the iron with volcanic eruptions. Due to the atmophere weakening and decreasing due to the chemistry of the "air up there" volcanic activity may increase. Also Iron may or may not harm other biological processes, so if they do use it, they should quarantine an entire area to test it out. I've had dreams of Scientists messing around in the ocean and destroying the world... It doesn't surprise me.

Whoever said we cant destroy the earth is a fool... Has anyone ever seen real footage of nuclear bombs? It takes precious air... Superheats it and explodes it into the upper atmosphere which is really cool looking i must admit... but the upper atmosphere is really cold and b y doing this it increases the worlds temperature.

I blame global warming on Military Action by means of nuclear testing and bomb explosions. If the world wanted to create natural bombs as frequent as we do, it would do it to warm the earth, but it doesnt..