Originally posted by GoodOlDave

Originally posted by evergreenvt
Let's take the facts as you allege and, for once, look at the practical aspects. How many people, working full time, for at least six months, were involved in the conspiracy to weaken and demolish the World Trade Center complex? 500? 1,000? 2,000?

I think you're confusing me with someone else, since I fully acknowledge how absurd the idea of "secretly planted controlled demolitions" are. The reason why is simple:

Taking an educated guess that it would take an hour to rig up a single column with demolitions AND prime them AND link them together AND hide them so noone would notice them, that works out to be one hour per column times 49 columns per floor times 110 floors times two towers works out to be over TEN THOUSAND man hours to complete. So, the number required to pull it off would be anywhere between over ten thousand people descended on the towers all at once, and one guy plodding along 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, for 14 months. If he did it only during the off-hours so that fewer people were around it would take OVER TWO YEARS.

I'm sorry, but there's just way too much disbelief we have to suspend in order to entertain the idea of controlled demolitions.

First of all, you have absolutely no idea what technology they may have to bring those towers down. If your guess was actually educated, and honest, the probability they possess technology far advanced what is public knowledge is hard to argue. Besides, there is evidence of workers having access to inner structure prior to 911.

None of that matters anyway. You're trying to claim this single event impossible by a government that has done equal deeds in the past? In fact, it's all they do and you can see it everywhere! You can bet that wherever you find one of these atrocities you will find a government carrying it out! I don't necessarily believe these events are the will of world leaders alone, but they are handling the dirty work. For whom do they do it, who knows? My money would be on those with the most money of all. Just know that they most definitely can pull it off no matter how extravagant it may be. Open your eyes to see it for yourself. The people you declare nuts can make these claims with conviction because their eyes are open, and have looked for the truth. It's shockingly easier to see than you might think, but be prepared to see much more than you wished for, because what you learn quick is that it's all lies! Everything you thought you knew is turned on its head.

They put fluoride in your water, and you pay a lot of money for it, yet you think they are concerned with your smile? They drug you, practically from birth, and you think you have a mental problem? They take your house and car away, then convince you to become a slave for the bank so you can still pay them in full? They gave you diseases to profit from vaccinations that infected you, you think it's cause you can't eat right? They used who knows how many of your $millions to purposefully create HIV/AIDS, and not long ago they declassified the proof of it. They continuously invade foreign nations to slaughter their people, create lucrative businesses and dictate their governments? They do it for one reason, create a sweat shop labor organization that takes your job and allows big business more profit, but you believe it's a caused by the "global market"?

Do you honestly think Oswald shot JFK in the throat and forehead from behind him? Do you really believe some guy from Hawaii flew to New York, right after John Lennon embarrassed Washington by winning his long immigration trial, to kill him? They created the Pearl Harbor tragedy, and completely made the whole Gulf of Tonkin thing up, yet those never really leaked out? They violently overthrew Iran's democratically elected government, installed their own dictator and ruled that country for 30 years? I'd say that constitutes as avoiding a leak! They dropped into Panama in the middle of the night and viciously gunned down every man, woman and child in site just to control the drugs down there. That stayed pretty quiet. They kidnapped Chavez and held him hostage to force him to resign. Though unsuccessful, they still got away with it.

And arguably one of the worst, most despicable atrocities in all of history, the ongoing economic, commercial, and financial embargo imposed by the US on Cuba since 1960! The deliberate destruction and retardation of an entire country and its people for nearly 50 years is an unforgivable crime that can never be repaid. Sadly, the US has done this to other nations as well, the first being the American Indians.

This is only a drop in a bucket of what the US has done and gotten away with. So, you think the US, with this extensive track record, could not possibly pull off 911? They have countless 911's and gotten away with every single one of them. Could you possibly be so naive as to think them innocent of all these things? How could you and expect to be taken seriously? And if they are guilty of even a fraction of them, that would give strong support to 911 being a possibility.

You said,

"I'm sorry, but there's just way too much disbelief we have to suspend in order to entertain the idea of controlled demolitions."

Can you not apply your theory to both sides of a debate, or is it used only at your convenience?


Peace.

Originally posted by Solomons

The media is in the back pocket of the real people that run your country.

Are referring to the Democrats? If you are, then I would have a hard time arguing with you on that one.

If you are not, who exactly are the "real people" that are running this country?

Your country kill their fellow citizens just like in my country and every other country on earth. What is so special?. NAM 3.000.000 people moraless were killed. So? what is the fuzz?

Herod Kill all new born babies when he was in charge? so....why is 9/11 shoul be different? Human tends to harm humans. man...it's boring. lets spread love not hate. This is boring too, maybe the end is indeed near.

I used to teach at a college. One of my students has a relative who worked in security at the World Trade Center. A week before 9/11, NONE of the security canines were on duty all day. NOT ONE!

This was just one of many things to come to get us to where we are currently headed . . . depopulation via TPTB.

So! We can talk about this until we are corpses. Many of us do. But I'm not just a talker. I'm tired of all the talk-no-action. I'm tired of the ones who intend to warn the masses get killed (Michael Jackson) by TPTB.

I want to know, what do we DO to get these people out of office? What do we DO to protect our rights? What do we DO to kick ass and take back OUR country and reinstate OUR original U.S. Constitution?

Thank you.

[edit on 23-7-2009 by Nivcharah]

Originally posted by Nivcharah
I used to teach at a college. One of my students has a relative who worked in security at the World Trade Center. A week before 9/11, NONE of the security canines were on duty all day. NOT ONE!

Well that's odd.

I have co-worker who has a relative that worked at the WTC, and he said that they had extra dogs there up until a few days before, and that a dog named Sirius died that day.

So someone just made it up.

I wonder who?

Originally posted by Nivcharah
I used to teach at a college. One of my students has a relative who worked in security at the World Trade Center. A week before 9/11, NONE of the security canines were on duty all day. NOT ONE!

I do not believe it!

Sorry, nothing personal; but after 8 years of paltry claims from the self proclaimed "truthers" I can not help but to be very skeptical of your above claim.

Sorry.

Originally posted by Nivcharah

I want to know, what do we DO to get these people out of office? What do we DO to protect our rights? What do we DO to kick ass and take back OUR country and reinstate OUR original U.S. Constitution?

Thank you.

1. Voting? Nope that will not work. Research how hard it is for a 3'rd party candidate to get on a state ballot is very sobering. The deck is stacked against us.

2. Know the constitution and purchase and learn how to use the best firearm that money can buy.

3. We probably can't, but our children can so teach them in the proper way, every day, and they will know what to do. Or simply do not vote for another Republican or Democrat ( I will make exception to about a dozen).

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999

What he fails to know, understand or realize (whichever one applies) is that a week or two prior to 9/11, they had had EXTRA dogs on duty at the complex. It was the extra dogs that were removed. The dogs normally assigned to the WTC were on duty as usual.

Yes. There had been a rash of calls into authroities anonymously warning about something going to happen at the WTC. Security was put on higher alert and extra dogs added. After a couple weeks they cut back to the standdard levels. So people saw dogs that might have been around suddenly gone.

This gets magnified into something suspicious for peole looking for it.

Had there been foreknowledge why would they want to create suspicion removing a few dogs when thousands were going to be killed?


Mike

I feel the need to make a few comments about the whole "conspiracy theory" thing.

1) - The 911 Commission report is first and foremost a "theory". A theory that 19 muslim extremists hijacked 4 commerical airliners and crashed them into buildings on 9/11/2001.

Furthermore, they presuppose that these 19 men were engaged in a "conspiracy" together to attack the United States.

Ergo; the 911 Commission Report is itself a "Conspiracy Theory"

2) - Those who attack people with a differing view than the official story are consistently labeled as "nutjobs" "whackos" etc etc. Why does it always devolve into personal attacks on those who disagree?
3) - There is also the implication that if you think that 911 was an inside job you automatically believe in bigfoot, aliens and peter pan?
4) - Personal attacks are for those who cannot base their arguments on logic or evidence.
5) The list of evidence WITHHELD OR DESTROYED is stunning:

FAA flight controller tapes were ordered destroyed.

Dozens of videotapes of the Pentagon attack are still being withheld with only partial clips from 2 released to the public NEITHER OF WHICH SHOW AN AIRPLANE. in fact one plainly shows some type of rocket exhaust.

Firefighters testimony from the WTC was excluded.

No explanation for why WTC 7 collapsed. It was simply left out.

Bush and Cheney REFUSED to testify until they got a)- a private hearing that b) wasn't recorded in any way and c) - took them a year and a half to agree to testify. Oh, and they had to testify together.

2.2 TERABYTES of information concerning Al Qaeda (see Able Danger) was destroyed under orders of the DOD the summer of 2001. Why?

Sen. Max Cleland resigned from the commission in disgust due to the way they mishandled the investigation.

I could go on and on but there is a clear pattern of evidence being destroyed, excluded or manipulated.

ALL EXPLANATIONS FOR THE 911 ATTACKS ARE THEORIES OF A CONSPIRATORIAL NATURE, INCLUDING THE 911 COMMISSION REPORT.

So can we please desist from name calling and lets keep the discussion civil. I'm sure we'd all appreciate that. thanks, Asktheanimals

Originally posted by Victoria 1
If 9/11 was a consperacy don't you know how many people would have had to cover everything up. There would be 100's and possibly 1,000's of people all keeping a secret. Don't you think that would have came out? Don't you think the media would jump on this, they hate Bush and would do anything to make him look bad.

My God, not this tired old and well beaten argument.

Simply put....NO! There would NOT have to be hundreds or thousands of people involved.

It's the way the chain of command is set up. You are told to do something and you know it is your job and your duty to obey those orders.

In most cases the orders will NOT be blatantly bad. It's the combination of multiple orders sent down to multiple people/offices that create the ill effect.

Only a FEW needed to actually know or plan it. Only a F.E.W. Not even dozens.

Originally posted by CUBD1
The premise of your entire argument requires the credulity of a conspiracy nut itself. 500? 1000? 2000?

Try 20. Try 30. At the most. Maybe even ten.

The rest of your argument is made laughable by the unbelieveable premise you've set forth.

Going by the presumption that a reasonable amount of time to deliver the explosives into the location they needed to be installed without being detected AND rig each column up with explosives AND wire them together AND conceal them so that noone would find them is at least two hours. Two hours times 49 columns per floor times 110 floors times two towers is almost TWENTY TWO THOUSAND man hours. Ten people working in the (presumably) 8 hour evening shift to evade detection would take almost TEN MONTHS to accomplish.

...And you're honestly telling me that ten guys wandering around the entire WTC complex for close to a year isn't going to look suspicious to any of the 30,000+ people in the buildings, and that noone would ever stumble across what they were doing...? Is that really what you're saying?

It is, to put it mildly, being unrealistic.