Genesis’ Young Earth, Stars, Michael J. Fox and the DeLorean…“All Aboard!”, page 4

reply to post by ChemBreather

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CB, thanks for the laminin graphic...whew, that pretty cool!

OT

Originally posted by styleswahington
What about the dinosaurs?

I dunno? Good question...

see photo's here... www.bible.ca...

Here is a photo of the Paluxy River in Glen Rose Texas. This rapidly flowing river runs through the middle of Dinosaur Valley State Park, famous for its dinosaur tracks. Not as well known is the fact that human tracks have also been found, not only in the same formation, but on the same bedding plane and in some cases overlapping the dinosaur tracks.


Stan Taylor (pointing at track) began his excavation of the Taylor Trail in 1969 and continued working through 1972. Initially, only two tracks could be seen in the Paluxy River bed.



By following the trail back under the river bank, seven more very human like tracks were exposed. The process involved removing tons of limestone overburden, effectively eliminating the possibility that the tracks were carved.




The Taylor Trail, as it normally appears in the river under water. Subsequent excavation has extended the trail to a total of fourteen tracks in a consistent right-left pattern. The entire sequence can be seen through the water in this 1994 photograph, even though a thin layer of mud obscures the details. A trail of three-toed dinosaur tracks can be seen crossing at an angle of approximately 30 degrees.


The drought of 1999 revealed the entire trail in dramatic detail!

Originally posted by Welfhard
reply to post by OldThinker

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I'm pretty sure that by now everyone on ATS knows about the biggest known stars. This knowledge is hardly life changing. I've been into cosmology since I was a child and the unimaginable size of the cosmos and it's contents are something that helped me to the conclusion that we are absolutely meaningless. Anyone who doesn't realise that nature is completely indifferent to us is a pathetically near sighted.

Moreover, why do you even bother? Every time you come on here, you peddle stuff like this and no one listens, they just argue with you because you present opinions as facts and admittedly biased, one-sided arguments as proof. You consistently offer noting of value in these threads.

Don't even get ne started about the so-called "logic" of the old testament.

Friend, your attend a secular university and are influenced more than you know by the other "one-sided" approach...OT's out here to present the other side...

The logic side, in my opinion...

Time will tell, as I have told you before, my posts are a record....check back with them after you lived a few decaeds after your schooling...

I'm sorry they are not value-added to you...maybe a lil less sauce bro

OT

reply to post by OldThinker

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"One sided approach" my foot. Science follows the evidence. Perhaps you've heard of the scientific method. You yourself have admitted to a bias therefore you hardly have the right to "logic" is on your side. Oh and yea "because your side and science are the only players in this game." [/sarcasm]
You're having a laugh and arrogantly ignoring all other just as valid religions here.

You have faith, that's it.
Faith is defined as "belief without evidence." That is why you have nothing.

And you never got back to me on that video link I sent you.

[edit on 21-7-2009 by Welfhard]

reply to post by OldThinker

---

It would probably be within the possibility that I been using it, as long as you have been alive, friend?

Closed question.

No.



Faith is the antithesis of the Scientific Method. Perhaps you need to freshen up on intellectualism through the annals of time. It's plainly obvious you haven't if you think for an instant that Genesis is anything more than a bad fairy tale.

Originally posted by Welfhard
Faith is the antithesis of the Scientific Method. ...

W, you are entitled to this belief..."evidence" as you say would disagree...

www.answersingenesis.org...

There is a widespread, but erroneous, view today that real scientists do not accept the truth of the Bible. It is therefore interesting to learn that many of the founding fathers of modern science were Bible-believing Christians, as were many of the less-well-known scientists who expanded our scientific knowledge. This book tells of the life and work of some of these great scientists who were Bible-believing Christians.

Each of these scientists either publicly acknowledged the Creator, or opposed evolutionary thinking, or, in many cases, did both. These scientists found their faith in God’s Word to be perfectly compatible with their scientific investigations. In some cases, their faith sustained them through times of physical hardship and professional difficulties. Samuel Morse, the American who invented the telegraph and Morse code, endured many frustrating years during which his ideas were rejected. Although he was penniless and frequently hungry, Morse never stopped trusting God because he believed that God’s guiding hand was on his life.

In other cases, the influence of their faith on the development of science was more direct, providing a framework of thinking which helped lead them to their discoveries. For example, astronomers had charted the paths of the planets across the sky, but could not make sense of the complicated paths they saw. Many scientists gave up searching for a simple logical pattern. After all, they reasoned, hadn’t the universe emerged from chaos anyway? In contrast, German astronomer Johannes Kepler reasoned that since the universe was designed by an intelligent Creator, it should function according to some logical pattern. To him, the idea of a chaotic universe was inconsistent with God’s wisdom. Kepler’s Christian faith led him to a way of thinking which eventually enabled him to solve the riddle of planetary motion.

others here:

ANTISEPTIC SURGERY JOSEPH LISTER (1827-1912)
BACTERIOLOGY LOUIS PASTEUR (1822-1895)
CALCULUS ISAAC NEWTON (1642-1727)
CELESTIAL MECHANICS JOHANN KEPLER (1571-1630)
CHEMISTRY ROBERT BOYLE (1627-1691)
COMPARATIVE ANATOMY GEORGES CUVIER (1769-1832)
COMPUTER SCIENCE CHARLES BABBAGE (1792-1871)
DIMENSIONAL ANALYSIS LORD RAYLEIGH (1842-1919)
DYNAMICS ISAAC NEWTON (1642-1727)
ELECTRONICS JOHN AMBROSE FLEMING (1849-1945)
ELECTRODYNAMICS JAMES CLERK MAXWELL (1831-1879)
ELECTRO-MAGNETICS MICHAEL FARADAY (1791-1867)
ENERGETICS LORD KELVIN (1824-1907)
ENTOMOLOGY OF LIVING INSECTS HENRI FABRE (1823-1915)
FIELD THEORY MICHAEL FARADAY (1791-1867)
FLUID MECHANICS GEORGE STOKES (1819-1903)
GALACTIC ASTRONOMY WILLIAM HERSCHEL (1738-1822)
GAS DYNAMICS ROBERT BOYLE (1627-1691)
GENETICS GREGOR MENDEL (1822-1884)
GLACIAL GEOLOGY LOUIS AGASSIZ (1807-1873)
GYNECOLOGY JAMES SIMPSON (1811-1870)
HYDRAULICS LEONARDO DA VINCI (1452-1519)
HYDROGRAPHY MATTHEW MAURY (1806-1873)
HYDROSTATICS BLAISE PASCAL (1623-1662)
ICHTHYOLOGY LOUIS AGASSIZ (1807-1873)
ISOTOPIC CHEMISTRY WILLIAM RAMSAY (1852-1916)
MODEL ANALYSIS LORD RAYLEIGH (1842-1919)
NATURAL HISTORY JOHN RAY (1627-1705)
NON-EUCLIDEAN GEOMETRY BERNHARD RIEMANN (1826- 1866)
OCEANOGRAPHY MATTHEW MAURY (1806-1873)
OPTICAL MINERALOGY DAVID BREWSTER (1781-1868)
PALEONTOLOGY JOHN WOODWARD (1665-1728)
PATHOLOGY RUDOLPH VIRCHOW (1821-1902)
PHYSICAL ASTRONOMY JOHANN KEPLER (1571-1630)
REVERSIBLE THERMODYNAMICS JAMES JOULE (1818-1889)
STATISTICAL THERMODYNAMICS JAMES CLERK MAXWELL (1831-1879)
STRATIGRAPHY NICHOLAS STENO (1631-1686)
SYSTEMATIC BIOLOGY CAROLUS LINNAEUS (1707-1778)
THERMODYNAMICS LORD KELVIN (1824-1907)
THERMOKINETICS HUMPHREY DAVY (1778-1829)
VERTEBRATE PALEONTOLOGY GEORGES CUVIER (1769-1832)

We will disagree, that's OK...you don't believe in God, but He and OT believe in you

reply to post by OldThinker

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You see this is what I'm talking about! Biased and one-sided opinions that highlight or fabricate favourable evidence and buries & misrepresents unfavourable evidence is USELESS. You aren't applying the scientific method if you lean on the absurdly biased website, Answers in Genesis.

ANTISEPTIC SURGERY JOSEPH LISTER (1827-1912)
BACTERIOLOGY LOUIS PASTEUR (1822-1895)
CALCULUS ISAAC NEWTON (1642-1727)
CELESTIAL MECHANICS JOHANN KEPLER (1571-1630)
CHEMISTRY ROBERT BOYLE (1627-1691)
COMPARATIVE ANATOMY GEORGES CUVIER (1769-1832)
COMPUTER SCIENCE CHARLES BABBAGE (1792-1871)
DIMENSIONAL ANALYSIS LORD RAYLEIGH (1842-1919)
DYNAMICS ISAAC NEWTON (1642-1727)
ELECTRONICS JOHN AMBROSE FLEMING (1849-1945)
ELECTRODYNAMICS JAMES CLERK MAXWELL (1831-1879)
ELECTRO-MAGNETICS MICHAEL FARADAY (1791-1867)
ENERGETICS LORD KELVIN (1824-1907)
ENTOMOLOGY OF LIVING INSECTS HENRI FABRE (1823-1915)
FIELD THEORY MICHAEL FARADAY (1791-1867)
FLUID MECHANICS GEORGE STOKES (1819-1903)
GALACTIC ASTRONOMY WILLIAM HERSCHEL (1738-1822)
GAS DYNAMICS ROBERT BOYLE (1627-1691)
GENETICS GREGOR MENDEL (1822-1884)
GLACIAL GEOLOGY LOUIS AGASSIZ (1807-1873)
GYNECOLOGY JAMES SIMPSON (1811-1870)
HYDRAULICS LEONARDO DA VINCI (1452-1519)
HYDROGRAPHY MATTHEW MAURY (1806-1873)
HYDROSTATICS BLAISE PASCAL (1623-1662)
ICHTHYOLOGY LOUIS AGASSIZ (1807-1873)
ISOTOPIC CHEMISTRY WILLIAM RAMSAY (1852-1916)
MODEL ANALYSIS LORD RAYLEIGH (1842-1919)
NATURAL HISTORY JOHN RAY (1627-1705)
NON-EUCLIDEAN GEOMETRY BERNHARD RIEMANN (1826- 1866)
OCEANOGRAPHY MATTHEW MAURY (1806-1873)
OPTICAL MINERALOGY DAVID BREWSTER (1781-1868)
PALEONTOLOGY JOHN WOODWARD (1665-1728)
PATHOLOGY RUDOLPH VIRCHOW (1821-1902)
PHYSICAL ASTRONOMY JOHANN KEPLER (1571-1630)
REVERSIBLE THERMODYNAMICS JAMES JOULE (1818-1889)
STATISTICAL THERMODYNAMICS JAMES CLERK MAXWELL (1831-1879)
STRATIGRAPHY NICHOLAS STENO (1631-1686)
SYSTEMATIC BIOLOGY CAROLUS LINNAEUS (1707-1778)
THERMODYNAMICS LORD KELVIN (1824-1907)
THERMOKINETICS HUMPHREY DAVY (1778-1829)
VERTEBRATE PALEONTOLOGY GEORGES CUVIER (1769-1832)

It doesn't matter if a person believes in God or not in science - science does not ask you to be atheistic therefore a list of believers means nothing and you'd know that if you had any real interest in being scientific here.


I can't believe the depths that you'll seek while pretending to be noble.

[edit on 21-7-2009 by Welfhard]

reply to post by Welfhard

---

W, your argument is not with me....

You know that still small voice, after the party, when you are alone...?

OT's just a messenger...

Me noble? now you sound like my wife

reply to post by OldThinker

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Faith is the antithesis of Science, not scientists. You can believe what ever you like and still work in science but you need to apply the entirely faithless scientific method to attain accuracy.

Again, faith is defined as belief without evidence and therefore science is investigation without faith.

W, your argument is not with me....

Yea it is with you and the bull faeces that you present as "proof" of God when clearly you wouldn't know what proof was if it hit you in the face.

[edit on 21-7-2009 by Welfhard]

Originally posted by Welfhard
[Again, faith is defined as belief without evidence and therefore science is investigation without faith.

What is the definition of faith?

The dictionary definition of faith is, “the theological virtue defined as secure belief in God and a trusting acceptance of God's will.” For a Christian, this definition is not just words on a page it is a way of life. Faith is acceptance of what we cannot see but feel deep within our hearts. Faith is a belief that one-day we will stand before our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ.

The Theological Virtue For Christians, believing is not seeing. Our life is built on the knowledge that God came to earth, died on a cross, rose again on the third day, and then ascended back into heaven. Why do we believe, because the Bible tells us so. We were not there when Jesus was crucified, yet we believe. We were not there when Jesus rose again, yet we believe.

Too many people want physical proof. Even Thomas, one of Jesus’ twelve disciples, said he would not believe unless he saw Jesus. What was Jesus’ answer to him when he saw Jesus? “Because you have seen me you have believed, blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe” (John 20:29). This is the theological virtue known as faith, believing what we did not see because we know it in our hearts to be true.

link: www.allaboutreligion.org...
= = = =

Why don't you re-edit, your edit...the bull feces, comment makes you looked frustrated...OT wouldn't be surprized if you hit the Ignore button now...I'm still surprized (and glad) you haven't yet...

Please notice, I rarely hit my edit button, why? because the ole' guy is settled, my friend, sorry

OT

reply to post by OldThinker

---

I'm wasting my time here, I don't know why I bother.


The scientific method is used to examine nature because it produces accurate conclusions that become more and more accurate as new evidence is uncovered. What a person believes about the supernatural or the hereafter is irrelevant, as long as he follows the method, all is well.

That is why a list of scientists (even though it is silly to post people from before 1900 as atheism wasn't really kicking off yet) who believe in god is totally besides the point. This is not evidence of anything.

Originally posted by Welfhard
reply to post by OldThinker

---

I'm wasting my time here, I don't know why I bother.

OK...

I have to go to dinner anyway....

Did you look up the job title I gave you? You'll find a lot there...

You know where to find me

When you are ready to step up...I'll be here!

OT

Originally posted by OldThinker
Why don't you re-edit, your edit...the bull feces, comment makes you looked frustrated...OT wouldn't be surprized if you hit the Ignore button now...I'm still surprized (and glad) you haven't yet...

Please notice, I rarely hit my edit button, why? because the ole' guy is settled, my friend, sorry

OT

Or not..

Let's actually consult a dictionary rather than a religious site.

1 a: allegiance to duty or a person : loyalty b (1): fidelity to one's promises (2): sincerity of intentions
2 a (1): belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2): belief in the traditional doctrines of a religion b (1): firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2): complete trust3: something that is believed especially with strong conviction ; especially : a system of religious beliefs

[Source]

The call it faith in God is a belief without evidence. You choose to conveniently interpret creatively nature into something that is totally unrealistic.

[edit on 21-7-2009 by Welfhard]

Webster’s dictionary, huh?

Good, think he may have something to add here….?

Well, let’s see…”The Bible must be considered as the great source of all the truth by which men are to be guided in government as well as in all social transactions.” And… “All the miseries and evils which men suffer from vice, crime, ambition, injustice, oppression, slavery and war, proceed from their despising or neglecting the precepts contained in the Bible.” Is he an idiot too??? W, Have you seen Axions, WIMPs and MACHOs in your studies? These concepts are scriptural...

Info: arxiv.org...

Ever heard of Carmeli? More here: creation.com...

Well, what he proposes lines up with scripture. The Milky Way at the centre of the universe. The equations describe the visible universe quite well, that the universe is accelerating and an extrapolation describes a state in the past where the universe was given a big push to expand out to its present locations. The heavens and earth are said to be stretched out at creation. The Hebrew word ‘hfn’ is used for the heavens while the Hebrew word ‘uqr’ is used for the earth. This occurs ten times in the OT in the context of God stretching out the heavens. It is used five times in the book of Isaiah (40:22, 42:5, 44:24, 45:12, 51:13). It also occurs in Job 9:8, Psalm 104:2, Zechariah 12:1 and in Jeremiah 10:12 and 51:15. In Jeremiah hfn is used as a Qal perfect, which means the "stretching" is past completed action. In all other references it is a Qal participle. The participle indicates continuous action; however, the context of these verses show that they are also past completed action at the time of creation.

The dark energy describes a property of space-velocity. The big push was intialted by JC, see Col 1:15-20, ….. 15He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. 17He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. 19For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.” Could he be the unseen force in the universe? Could God have designed the creation, such that it would naturally expand, relaxing the fabric of space itself like an uncoiling spring? Mind boggling I know….source:www.bibleandscience.com...


Thoughts?

Got distracted with work….I’ll be back from dinner in an hour or so…

OT

reply to post by OldThinker

---

Yea I do have a thought here but to be honest, my brain is reaching is religious faeces tolerance limit.

Is he an idiot too???

The short answer is yes hence:

”The Bible must be considered as the great source of all the truth by which men are to be guided in government as well as in all social transactions.”

Q.E.D.

But I will add that I find this hilarious:

“All the miseries and evils which men suffer from vice, crime, ambition, injustice, oppression, slavery and war, proceed from their despising or neglecting the precepts contained in the Bible.”

But I'm done, I can't stand this garbage. I hope you have lots of funny talking to your imaginary friends.

[edit on 21-7-2009 by Welfhard]

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