The end of "911 Conpiracy", and the beginning of "911 Common Knowledge"

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posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 02:37 AM
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*Important* Please read and understand everything I write before writing a response, too many times in the past I end up repeating myself several times in my thread. If you need to, please read the thread several times before posting comments or questions. Thanks. *Important*

An Important Distinction
Too often, as our society always does, we begin to divide ourselves against each other. Though we often share the same goals, we continually let ourselves be divided and conquered. And this is evident within the 911 movement. The truth movement is continually divided so that it can easily be conquered through ridicule and false science. Fellow members of the movement will argue endlessly about points that will likely never be proven either way, all while they let the goal of exposure slip away.

Always remember, there is only two sides here, you are one or the other.

You are either a person who does not believe the Official story, or you are a person that does believe the official story. That is the ONLY thing that matters. It doesn't matter if you believe there was no planes, or that I believe that there was planes, if we both agree that the official story is nonsensical. Through this division we are conquered, and we need to end that here, because we all have a common goal. When responding to this thread, I want you to begin by making this distinction prior to any comments. Either “I believe the official story (insert comment)” or, “I do not believe the official story (insert comment)”

Another... Important Distinction
Many people seem to think that it is on the truth movement, to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that the Government was involved. This is FALSE. It is NOT on us to prove that, and it is definitely not possible for us to prove that entirely. Through this false mind set, we limit ourselves from ever making any true headway. Our only goal is to prove that it did not happen the way they said it did, and through that fact we can understand that they must have done it, because only the guilty must lie in explanation.

Short Anecdote:
A young boy walks out of a store, the owner quickly catches up and feels the young man may have stolen some items. He asks the boy “do you mind emptying your pockets?”. If the boy has not stolen anything, he would quickly empty his pockets confirming his innocence. But, if the boy has stolen something, he will do whatever he possibly can to avoid a search.

So why the anecdote? Because it illustrates exactly what we DO need to prove in this movement. We don't need to know what the boy stole, or why the boy stole, we don't even need to prove how he stole. We just need to listen to him do everything possible to avoid that search, because even if you don't know or cant prove all the variables, we still know based on his unwillingness to allow a search, and the fact that he is lying, prove his guilt.

In essence, I can't prove 100% why the government conducted 911, though I have some ideas. Or exactly how, everything was accomplished, though I have some ideas. But what can be proven is that their story does not add up, and because of that I know they are guilty, because if they were innocent their story would add up and they would have done everything in their power to divulge every piece of information. It's the unknown, and currently – unprovable, variables that are derailing this movement.

It's why we still have people on this forum, who believe in a completely illogical and outright blasphemous version of events that day. And with that view, they base their life, making decisions, building their perception, and influencing the way they act and interpret new information. It is dangerous. Because it's through this ignorant perception, that people allow illogical and threatening laws to be passed, wars to be launched, people to be murdered, and countries destroyed.

We must use undisputed facts, inconsistencies in the official version, and highlight the astronomical coincidences to make our point.

Why 911?
911 was a classic Problem, Reaction, Solution event. To help illustrate this point, even before the Problem (911) was created, the Solution, had already been formulated. Like the fact that "Game plan to remove al-Qaeda from the face of the Earth" is on Bush's desk September 9th, 2001.

This game plan includes invasion plans for Afghanistan. Which “coincidentally” would be the first illegal war launched based solely on the fact that the Problem (911) was created. The reaction to the problem, always allows the solution – no matter how ludicrous it may seem.



You show me one reporter, one commentator, one member of Congress who thought we should invade Afghanistan before September 11 and I'll buy you dinner in the best restaurant in New York City."

- Sandy Berger, Clinton's National Security Adviser



To be truthful about it, there was no way we could have got the public consent to have suddenly launched a campaign on Afghanistan but for what happened on September 11.

- Prime Minister Tony Blair


It's time for people to understand that there are no coincidences in the grand scheme of this world. Failing to understand that fact seriously limits your ability to evaluate the current state of your reality. You are limiting your perception. Especially since, these coincidences are absolutely astronomical.

A brief moment for another astronomical event. If you think it is a coincidence that the English secret service, with a company of 1000+ officers, were conducting a terror drill based on a scenario in which the exact same targets, would be attacked at the exact same stations, at the exact same time, you are absolutely oblivious to reality. That is an astronomical coincidence. Through this Problem, they created a Reaction from the people, and implemented their Solution of expanded police state, and war on terrorism. In the process, removing rights, destroying lives, and misleading the public.

Another Problem, Reaction, Solution (PRS), event was Swine Flu. I spoke out against it immediately, and stood fast while hysteria gripped this forum and our society. What you were witnessing was the Reaction, to a Problem that the Media had created so that the powers could implement a solution.

We wont know exactly how devastating the vaccines are until 100's of millions have taken them, that will be this winter. But, we can already see that the WHO has been granted sweeping powers, through the use of a media hyped “Pandemic Level”, and vaccine manufacturers have already been given Legal Immunity. So that when people start showing up maimed, sick, dying or dead. They have no legal recourse against toxic vaccines.

“This is a 911 topic, why talk about swine flu?”

Because it highlights the exact same scam that was used with 911. The solution, is always worse than the original problem. But since their solution has been allowed due to peoples reaction, to a completely fabricated problem, it is acceptable. Where as, prior to the problem, people would have never accepted the solution.

Amazing Coincidences...
Is it a coincidence that the “Pentagon Attack” happened to hit the only section designed to take such a hit?

Is it a coincidence that the hijacker, was so nice to go out of his way to attack that portion, rather than any other portion? Going so far as to execute almost an entire downward circle, to avoid all pentagon brass stationed directly on the opposite side of the building. Just a coincidence?

Is it a coincidence that 3 steel structured towers collapsed into themselves on 911, yet it has never happened before or since? How does a fire, a jet, a bomb, or anything which compromises less than 10% of a steel structure, some how cause a unilateral, complete systematic failure?

Is it a coincidence that some how, for the first time in history that day, we had almost two entire planes vaporize? Such as in Shanksville or at the Pentagon. It must be merely a coincidence, that these two planes practically disappeared. And in the Pentagon attack, it is simply a coincidence that the wings did no damage to the exterior of the building, nor did the engines, before they were 'sucked' into the building and vaporized. Riiiight.

Is it a coincidence or simply amazing luck, that Silverstein purchased the WTC complex 6 weeks prior to 911

It is especially convenient, since purchasing the WTC's were theoretically the worst business move in history. The towers were a black hole, that were only a burden. It was losing money hand over fist, and the cost of needed renovations were staggering. It would be cheaper to rebuild the towers, than to go through purchasing them.

It's just a coincidence, that he profited to the tune of 4.5 billion dollars on a six week investment which cost him 14 million out of pocket.

Thus, it must also be coincidence, that he happened to miss a very important meeting in the World Trade Center that day due to his wife “demanding” he see his dermatologist.

CONTINUED NEXT POST.

[edit on 19-7-2009 by king9072]



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posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 02:37 AM
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It's then, also a coincidence that Rumsfeld announced that the Pentagon could not account for $2.3 trillion in spending, on September 10th. Luckily for him, the next day a problem would occur, which would enable trillions more in wasted spending.

I suppose it must also be a coincidence, that WTC 7, which was never hit with a plane and had sustained only superficial damage to one part of its facade, with small isolated fires burning, collapsed at near freefall speed mirroring the exact look, and movement of any controlled demolition.



Is it just a coincidence, that on the one time that America is actually attacked, that it is the one time Norad fails to scramble any jets towards the threat. Wait, make that, fails four times to scramble jets to neutralize a threat. All on one amazing day.

Is it just a coincidence, with so much debate about what happened at the Pentagon, that they have still never released anything more than 6 frames of footage? Especially when, not even those 6 frames even show anything conclusively. Perhaps an innocent Government, which had actually been attacked, would show every single tape, from every single angle of that plane hitting that building. So why do we only have 6 inconclusive frames?

Is it just a coincidence that scientists have found Military Grade Thermitic Materials in all dust samples studied from the debris?

Is it just a coincidence, that Marvin Bush was a principal in a company called Securacom which handled security of the WTC? At the exact time, someone was able to smuggle in and plant an estimated 10-100 tons of thermite? Obviously just a coincidence.

It's also just a coincidence, that for the first time in history, with the country under direct attack the preisdent sat still, in a location that had been publicly announced. He was never carried off by the secret service to somewhere “safe”. Perhaps he figured, he was safe.

It's also just a coincidence that pools of molten metal were found under the WTC rubble upto 6 weeks after the attacks. This is obviously something fire alone cannot accomplish, and it's additionally coincidental since it's been scientifically proven that thermite was used that day.

It's also interesting that they spent $65 million investigating Clintons Sex scandal, and only $3 million was designated to investigate the most devastating attack on American Soil ever.

Why did the government feel the need to lie about practically every aspect of that day, continually, when they should have wanted to know for themselves exactly what happened. Perhaps, it's all just a coincidence that they did not care.

Thus....?

The government has lied. Their story does not add up. And thus they must be guilty. There are elements of that day which will likely never be uncovered, as well as theories that will never be proven. But what is clearly evident is that we have been sold a joke, and because of that joke our entire life and our destiny has changed.

Our perception as a planet shifted that day, and layers of ignorance were imposed. As I mentioned, it is this intentionally imposed ignorance that has allowed our world to decay to it's current state. Sweeping police state measures added, absolutely unconstitutional laws passed, trillions of wasted spending, millions of innocent people dead, thousands of soldiers dead, thousands of soldiers taking their own life, thousands of first responders to the attacks are DEAD or dying.

We had our perception and future altered that day, those people had their perception and future ENDED. All because of a monstrous myth, that logic and scientific reasoning has quickly debunked. If you believe any one of those “coincidences” may, NOT have been a coincidence, that means you do NOT believe the official story. If this were an unexpected tragedy that were a genuine attack on the country, do you honestly believe there would exist so many astronomical coincidences? It's like winning the lottery 100 times consecutively it just doesn't happen – by chance.

It's time to quit letting people everywhere perpetuate the official story MYTH. Because the fact that people believe it shows that they are intentionally ignorant to the situation, and their reaction to events and perception of reality is crippled at best, and damaging to themselves, their family and their country at worst.

So lets end this divide in the movement, and begin to vigorously out those who want to be intentionally ignorant of the facts of a day which has forever changed the lives of everyone on this planet, and has ended the lives of millions permanently.



[edit on 19-7-2009 by king9072]


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posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 03:18 AM
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Yep not much to say except it boggles the mind really...
If you honestly believe the OS you have serious mental issues.



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 03:23 AM
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Excellent post, it really does explain the whole scenario and how we should go about it. The weakness of any theory is knowing there is something amiss with the OS, but not knowing 100% what did actually happen, this causes a breach in our defences.

Again.. a great post OP /salute
.



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 03:58 AM
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Dear me. I bet you are a laugh to live with - seeing conspiracies around every corner... The postman's late, which must mean "xyz".

It seems to me that all sorts of "evidence", omission or discounted theory gets blown out of all proportion and escalates into so-called fact in the eyes of people who don’t want to believe the evidence before their eyes – or ANY official story.

Every missing comma in a report is "proof". All actions beforehand are reinterpreted to fit the new story hypothesis. Everyone has been fooled, even though they had eyes in their head. Broadcasters got it all wrong. It was all a plot. There were no terrorists. All those who actually take the mainstream view are gullible or brainwashed. All those who take the "quack" view are correct - they know the truth for they are the self professed “truth movement”. Fantasy movement more like.

The Partnair Flight 394 tragedy back in 1989 was first thought to have been a bomb and this was "confirmed" when traces of military grade explosives were found. A bit of digging found that the seas around Denmark are awash with munitions from two world wars and the actual cause was eventually identified as being something else. No doubt, there are still those who believe that it was a bomb and the official explanation was a cover-up.

Regards



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 04:09 AM
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reply to post by paraphi
 


Because in this case there is a whole heap more evidence proving the OS is flawed, how many conspiracy theories have captivated such extinguished believers as 40 plus ex and still serving national security forces king pins?, these people know a whole heap more than we ever will re terrorist protocols etc to be adhered to, now go do some proper research.

/sigh.



[Mod Edit - Replaced unnecessary quote with Reply To Tab]

[edit on 19/7/2009 by Sauron]



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 05:01 AM
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reply to post by Seventh
 

Go on then... name the 40+ extinguished (I assume you mean "distinguished") national security king pins. Please don't direct me to some ranting twit on YouTube.

Please don't think that because I take a contrary view from you that I have not done research, mate.

Regards




[Mod Edit - Replaced unnecessary quote with Reply To Tab]


[edit on 19/7/2009 by Sauron]



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 05:08 AM
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I do not believe in the official story because of the points you have raised. I just hope that like with all common knowledge, complacency does not set in. The momentum has to be held and increased for justice to actually take place.



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 05:38 AM
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reply to post by paraphi
 



Sorry was busy then, anyway as requested here`s a list of some pretty impressive people..........

patriotsquestion911.com...




[Mod Edit - Replaced unnecessary quote with Reply To Tab]


[edit on 19/7/2009 by Sauron]



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 06:01 AM
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just playing devil's advocate here...but would a list of 40+ people with the same qualifications as those provided be convincing to you that the official story was true?



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 06:19 AM
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reply to post by king9072
 


Hi
- I don't believe the OS-
star and flagged, just a remark:

"Short Anecdote:
A young boy walks out of a store, the owner quickly catches up and feels the young man may have stolen some items. He asks the boy “do you mind emptying your pockets?”. If the boy has not stolen anything, he would quickly empty his pockets confirming his innocence."

The comparison should acknowledge the fact that the government actions should be public. In the case of the boy, one can argue privacy.

good work.
TheTilde



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 06:25 AM
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Originally posted by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest
just playing devil's advocate here...but would a list of 40+ people with the same qualifications as those provided be convincing to you that the official story was true?


Sure if the official story that they were backing was based on the laws of physics and was scientifically replicable or theoretically even possible.

How anyone can believe that fires in one portion of any steel structured building could cause uniform, and complete structural failure, to allow almost free fall descent speed - is beyond me.

How anyone can not recognize the Problem, Reaction, Solution pattern that was used and its resulting byproducts - is beyond me.

How anyone can think that the same government who systematically lied, distorted facts, and buried evidences, (admittedly, and proven over time) can believe their root and reason for all that deception - is beyond me.



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 06:44 AM
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Originally posted by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest
just playing devil's advocate here...but would a list of 40+ people with the same qualifications as those provided be convincing to you that the official story was true?


This my friend is why the whole conspiracy theory re 9/11 started, the 40+ people with same qualifications as provided have stated this, in the form of Bush and his national security personal at the time.

When a theory starts to emerge there are many aspects of it that beg questioning, imho I cannot think of any that has been ripped to bits as much as 9/11 by those that know the complexity of such protocols as the counter terrorism do`s and dont`s, when these have been blatantly disregarded and evidence being completely overlooked and neglected the alarm bells ring.

I mean come on, it`s a fair chance that everyone has seen the site of a serious crime before and what happens, it`s cordoned off and forensic experts are there for days if not weeks sifting through the minutest of particles looking for clues, how many huge court cases have ended in guilty or not guilty solely on the support of forensic evidence.

Now the twin towers were designed to withstand planes hitting them, they supposedly collapsed due to this point, if so then is it not the case that 1 of 2 things could have happened......

1. Gross negligence on behalf of the structural engineers and architects, who would argue that the builders cut corners or did not stick to the building regulations, either way there are similar buildings and the cause of collapse should have been thoroughly investigated starting with the buildings backbone... the steel, why was it exported the next day to China?.

2. Something other than a plane hitting brought about the collapses, stringent testing done on the steels for explosive residues, why was the steel exported to China?.

No matter what happened that day there should have been a bucketful of tests on the steels to expose why they failed horrendously that day, instead of sending them off to China, like I stated above.. Forensic evidence is a huge factor in court cases, for a huge crime scene (the biggest terrorist attack in modern history), not to be completely cordoned off and public access denied until the forensic experts are more than done with their tasks, is beyond rational thinking at the very least.



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 07:01 AM
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alright. thanks for the replies to my question. i was just curious. i have asked other people similar questions regarding other topics and gotten flat out "NO" as a response. if i offended you or something sorry. i just wanted to know.



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 07:23 AM
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Originally posted by king9072
How anyone can believe that fires in one portion of any steel structured building could cause uniform, and complete structural failure, to allow almost free fall descent speed - is beyond me.


I guess you are not a structural engineer! The properties of steel changes when subjected to heat and the effect of collapse in one area would have a cascade effect. I am not structural engineer myself, but there are quite a few studies and commentators who have shown that the collapse was legitimate and not a result of (say) a controlled demolition.



Originally posted by Seventh
Now the twin towers were designed to withstand planes hitting them, they supposedly collapsed due to this point...


We live and learn. HMS Sheffield was supposed to withstand a hit from a missile, but it burned. The hypothetical or theoretical testing which goes on in all walks of life is often based on assumptions which may not translate well into reality, either baecause they are the wrong assumptions or they are "of a time".


Originally posted by Seventh
... the steel, why was it exported the next day to China?.


Scrap? Besides, it was obvious that the towers were hit by aircraft. There was thousands of tonnes of steel and rubble. Nowhere to store it all.


Originally posted by Seventh
Sorry was busy then, anyway as requested here`s a list of some pretty impressive people..........
patriotsquestion911.com...


Thanks. I would argue that they are not that impressive. Most are individuals with opinions and books to sell, retired years ago or have a grudge and some were not that senior at all. I thought you were going to provide some real heavy weights.

Regards



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 07:23 AM
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Originally posted by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest
alright. thanks for the replies to my question. i was just curious. i have asked other people similar questions regarding other topics and gotten flat out "NO" as a response. if i offended you or something sorry. i just wanted to know.


It`s cool, everyone has questions no matter what side of the fence they sit
.



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 07:24 AM
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**I do not believe the official story.**

Nicely put together King9072. I really don't know why debunkers get so angry and frustrated with truthers! It's like they don't care about 9/11 itself, they just want to prove the truthers wrong for whatever reason I don't know. Maybe they've nothing better to do. I think whichever side of the fence you sit on and whether you fervently believe it was an inside job or you fervently believe the official story is true or maybe you've just started looking into the events of 9/11, there are enough unusual events that happened on 9/11 and in the following days/weeks for anyone with a bit of common sense to think, "Yeah, that does seem a bit strange and should be investigated further."

Seventh also raised a good point about the rapid removal and destruction of evidence and that must surely seem a bit unusual to anyone who's watched a crime drama in their lifetime.

I can understand them obviously wanting to clear the area as rapidly as possible to try and find survivors, but shipping it to Asia for immediate destruction with no analysis? That is not right! I could accept maybe getting rid of some of it because there was so much of it, but even in NIST's final report for the collapse of WTC 7, they had to report their findings based on computer simulations because the government left them absolutely no evidence whatsoever to work with. Using just a bit of common sense, doesn't that seem just a little bit strange?



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 07:34 AM
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**I do not believe the official story**

Paraphi - Honestly, I despair with people like you. The simple fact that you can get more accurate information about 9/11 from a site like ATS, than you can the official report says it all for me.

There's a difference between playing devils advocate and being obstinate in the face of overwhelming FACTUAL evidence. Your arguments are hollow, and your judgement poor.

What harm can a PROPER investigation do? None. It would clear things up once and for all. The OP's main point about raising the right question, and getting a proper answer by the lack of one is excellent.

Off you toddle back to the NSA.

The Para.



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 07:36 AM
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Originally posted by paraphi
Please don't think that because I take a contrary view from you that I have not done research, mate.

The only reason why anyone would take a contrary view to 9/11 truth would be the very definition of "denial disorder" that is defined in my signature.

If you think you're researched enough, care to take a stab at my post below?

www.abovetopsecret.com...


Nobody has been able to counter the evidence in that post as of yet and I'm wondering if you might be the person who's done their research and can counter the evidence. Care to take a stab at it? Mind you, everything in my post is provable and factual, so anything to the contrary would also have to be provable and factual.



posted on Jul, 19 2009 @ 07:42 AM
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Originally posted by paraphi
I guess you are not a structural engineer! The properties of steel changes when subjected to heat and the effect of collapse in one area would have a cascade effect. I am not structural engineer myself, but there are quite a few studies and commentators who have shown that the collapse was legitimate and not a result of (say) a controlled demolition.


This statement would hold water if there were intense fires everywhere but there were not, as the firemen reported whom made their way to the 78th floor, two isolated pockets of fire we can knock them down with two lines, two lines for alleged fires that melted and weakened 1000`s of tons of tempered steel, somewhat complacent fireman don`t you think?.




We live and learn. HMS Sheffield was supposed to withstand a hit from a missile, but it burned. The hypothetical or theoretical testing which goes on in all walks of life is often based on assumptions which may not translate well into reality, either baecause they are the wrong assumptions or they are "of a time".



A fire raging in Madrid in a building built to withstand intense heat, guess what it withstood...






Scrap? Besides, it was obvious that the towers were hit by aircraft. There was thousands of tonnes of steel and rubble. Nowhere to store it all.


Yep no need to gather any evidence it was the Muslims, off we go to Afghanistan.



Thanks. I would argue that they are not that impressive. Most are individuals with opinions and books to sell, retired years ago or have a grudge and some were not that senior at all. I thought you were going to provide some real heavy weights.

Regards

Your welcome.

Impressive or not they know more than we will ever know, and coming from government run agencies does it not strike you as strange, that having 1st hand knowledge of their old boss it would not be out of character for them to lie!!

[edit on 16/07/2009 by Seventh]





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