Flight 77 where are you?

reply to post by CameronFox


I think that he has the credentials to decipher the data. Either you will present something contrary to that or not.

Originally posted by CameronFox

Originally posted by jprophet420
m

So if I say "4+4=8, and btw I can astrally project myself", it means 4+4 does not equal 8?

Not an accurate analogy. 4 + 4 = 8 is a mathematical fact. His "opinion" was that the hole was too small for a 757. Does he offer mathematical calculations for this?

So, you are telling me that the size of flight 77 is variable? We can measure the plane, we can measure the hole, we can measure the marks from the wings. What part of that falls under "opinion"?

Originally posted by jprophet420
I think that he has the credentials to decipher the data. Either you will present something contrary to that or not.

What data has he deciphered? Can you link me to his data? Was this data submitted with the Gallop affidavit?

Since you have failed to answer my question directly. Your post shows me that you would rather listen to someone who has not been in a control tower for decades than someone who was actually IN the tower on 911. Whatever floats your boat.

Again JP, who do you think knows more about what actions / procedures were taken on 9-11 from the Boston tower?

1- Someone who was there in the 1970's

2- Someone that was there on 9/11/2001

Thank you.

That question is completely irrelevant, to answer it however...

37. After analyzing all the radar data available to me from the FAA via the 84th
RADES Radar Squadron, a military facility tasked with monitoring and recording all
radar data fed into it from its various military radar sites, FAA radar sites, and joint use
radar sites, I have concluded that three of the four airliners, AA11, UA175 and UA93
were kept in full and positive radar contact from just after lift off at their departure airports up until their respective crash points as follows:
AA11-Boston to WTC1
UA175-Boston to WTC2
UA93-Newark to Shanksville, PA
38. AA77 was lost to positive radar contact in eastern Ohio, and was NEVER re-
radar identified. The high-speed eastbound primary radar target eventually seen by
Danielle O’Brien at Dulles Tower-Potomac Approach and on a heading towards
Washington, D.C., which then made a large turn into, or over, the Pentagon, has been
PRESUMED to be AA77, but that presumption is based upon unreliable evidence found,
or placed, at the Pentagon crash site, or misread in a reverse-engineered identification
process.

The information is taken from several sources and viewed retroactively, not in real time.

Originally posted by jprophet420
So, you are telling me that the size of flight 77 is variable? We can measure the plane, we can measure the hole, we can measure the marks from the wings. What part of that falls under "opinion"?

His statement was clearly an opinion as he shows not data. The ASCE paper shows the damage to the Pentagon consistent with that of a 757.

Where is the goat talking, walk-through-wall, wacko's analysis? We should just listen to him because he has 2 stars on his shoulders? That is an appeal to authority.

The finding of the ASCE:

www.asce.org...

Here JP, are the Media Contacts for the ASCE:

Jill Dixon
703-295-6404
[email protected]

Jane Howell
tel: 202-326-5128
cell: 703-629-3827
[email protected]

Will you ask them if the hole was big enough?

If not, will you contact one of the very qualified 6 authors of the Pentagon Building Performance Report?

info here:
www.fire.nist.gov...

Really, you don't have to answer any of my questions. You have already proven to everyone that you are not interested in finding the truth.

reply to post by OrangeJuice


There are interviews with family members who are asking where their relatives and friends are from that flight if no flight or a 'Decoy' flew into the towers and the Pentagon. I have been asking this same question since this issue was raised. If no plane hit the Pentagon and a missile did where are the passengers that as many as 300 relatives, friends and business partners know flew on that flight? I have asked Craig Renke and several others only to be ignored or given answers that denigrate me for asking! None of these 'Researchers' have an answer but they keep spewing their one sided accusations and rhetoric! This question is the one variable that begs an answer!

Zindo

reply to post by CameronFox

I'm sorry but you have proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that you have no debating skills. Not one thing you have posted refutes the OP. The things you just linked to show NO evidence of flight 77 hitting the pentagon.

Engineers Report On Pentagon Building Performance Presents Significant Findings On Structural Resistance To Progressive Collapse

That is the article you linked to. It does not even mention flight 77.

reply to post by ZindoDoone


As we all know questions don't debunk.

Originally posted by jprophet420
....... that presumption is based upon unreliable evidence found,
or placed, at the Pentagon crash site, or misread in a reverse-engineered identification process.

Where is his work? He is calling the evidence unreliable or planted. Misread?

Originally posted by jprophet420

I'm sorry but you have proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that you have no debating skills.

You're so adorable. You only listen to CT's that offer ZERO evidence and my debating "skills" are not up to snuff with YOU?

You fail to recognize facts.

Not one thing you have posted refutes the OP. The things you just linked to show NO evidence of flight 77 hitting the pentagon.

Your OP shows different allegations made by those that believe 911 was an inside job and that no plane hit the Pentagon.

I was showing that the statements made by these people are not accurate.

That is the article you linked to. It does not even mention flight 77.

It was to offer you guidance as to the damage that was done in the Pentagon was consistent with a 757. It also offers you contact information that I know you will ignore.

Are you going to hop on Ranke's coat tails thinking that secret monkey charges were planted during a renovation (done by civilian contractors) With locked secret closets filled with frozen bodies and plane parts?

Dude.. have at it!

reply to post by jprophet420


How prophetic. No, questions do not debunk but Answers do and NONE are forth coming and you've just managed to do the very thing I posted about. A NON answer, answer! I guess your another one that thinks the question has no bearing on the facts.

Zindo

reply to post by ZindoDoone

So there were no remains released to the families for burial?

This is very odd for so many dead not leaving a trace buT someone had to check theM on the 77 flight

Originally posted by ZindoDoone
reply to post by jprophet420

 

How prophetic.

No, questions do not debunk but Answers do and NONE are forth coming and you've just managed to do the very thing I posted about. A NON answer, answer! I guess your another one that thinks the question has no bearing on the facts.

Zindo

Me not having the answer to your question does not have any bearing whatsoever on the evidence presented. The information I have on flight 77 neither shows me that it hit the pentagon nor what happened to the passengers. I have pretty much the same information as anyone else with google and an i.q. of over 90.

reply to post by OrangeJuice


I was referring to those that say a missile and not a plane hit the Pentagon. If no plane, then they either murdered those people elsewhere and returned a few bodies to certain folks or a plane did actually hit the Pentagon and not much was left of them. One way or another some folks are missing and the 'missile strike' idea makes it even a bigger problem for explanation. There were real people on that flight and what became of them. That goes for the plane that went down in Penn. also! Folks say no plane went down and that was a hoax. Where the hell are those passengers. The 'believers' have yet to answer the question if their hypothesis is correct!

Zindo

[edit on 7/19/2009 by ZindoDoone]

It was to offer you guidance as to the damage that was done in the Pentagon was consistent with a 757. It also offers you contact information that I know you will ignore.

Thats ******* amazing, because the article doesn't mention a 757.

reply to post by jprophet420


Read the Performance article I posted. (Chapter 3 Deals with the Crash Information)

When you have read it. I suggest you contact one of the 6 authors and ask them questions regarding it's contents

[edit on 19-7-2009 by CameronFox]

My bad, I was only reading the first article. The second one ha some pretty damning information...

A Pentagon security camera located near the northwest corner of the
building recorded the aircraft as it approached the building. Five photo-
graphs (figures 3.3 through 3.7), taken approximately one second apart,
show the approaching aircraft and the ensuing fireball associated with
the initial impact.The first photograph (figure 3.3) captured an image of
the aircraft when it was approximately 320 ft (approximately 0.42 sec-
ond) from impact with the west wall of the Pentagon.Two photographs
(figures 3.3 and 3.7), when compared, seem to show that the top of the
fuselage of the aircraft was no more than approximately 20 ft above the
ground when the first photograph of this series was taken.

The Boeing 757 approached the west wall of the Pentagon from
the southwest at approximately 780 ft/s.As it approached the Pen-
tagon site it was so low to the ground that it reportedly clipped an
antenna on a vehicle on an adjacent road and severed light posts.
When it was approximately 320 ft from the west wall of the build-
ing (0.42 second before impact), it was flying nearly level, only a
few feet above the ground (figures 3.2 and 3.13, the latter an aeri-
al photograph modified graphically to show the approaching air-
craft).The aircraft flew over the grassy area next to the Pentagon
until its right wing struck a piece of construction equipment that
was approximately 100 to 110 ft from the face of the building (0.10
second before impact (figure 3.14). At that time the aircraft had
rolled slightly to the left, its right wing elevated.

As we can see this would put the top of the fuselage 25 feet in the air at least, inconsistent with the rest of the story and photographs.




[edit on 19-7-2009 by jprophet420]

reply to post by jprophet420


And in all four instances on 9/11, the aircraft left evidence, which he either cannot or refuses to see. So, once again, I question his motives, if not his sanity at times.

posted by ZindoDoone
reply to post by OrangeJuice

 

There are interviews with family members who are asking where their relatives and friends are from that flight if no flight or a 'Decoy' flew into the towers and the Pentagon. I have been asking this same question since this issue was raised. If no plane hit the Pentagon and a missile did where are the passengers that as many as 300 relatives, friends and business partners know flew on that flight? I have asked Craig Renke and several others only to be ignored or given answers that denigrate me for asking! None of these 'Researchers' have an answer but they keep spewing their one sided accusations and rhetoric! This question is the one variable that begs an answer!

Oh really? Mind showing us those 300 family interviews? How come those 300 relatives, friends, and business partners did not show up at LAX or SFO before those two airports were evacuated and shutdown at 12:04 and 12:15 PM EDT?

September 11: Chronology of terror

This is between 3 hours and 19 minutes and two hours and 21 minutes since three aircraft which their people were allegedly on, allegedly crashed into US buildings.

There was no interest from 300 relatives, friends, and business partners on whether their people survived or missed the flights or were mistakenly mis-identified flights?

How do you explain only two people showing up from your alleged 300? Wouldn't many of them have been planning on meeting the flights anyway? Why the lack of interest from those families and friends?

Because ficticious people do not have family, friends, and business partners to worry about them? Because imaginary passengers have no families? Don't forget that the FBI stated that Ted Olsen lied about Barbara Olsen, and Barbara's very fragile to heat DNA was allegedly found out by the alleged Exit Hole, which now in the newest evolution of the 9-11 Pentagon OFFICIAL STORY, is claimed it was formed by a focused cone of heat energy from the exploding plane and burning jet fuel. Sure it was.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/87e6915579e7.jpg[/atsimg]
Original hi-reze version
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/a587ce48d962.jpg[/atsimg]

Except for the husband of Cee Cee Lyons, who probably already suspects that their calls were either faked or staged, most of the other families probably do not exist. Why else would they shut down LAX when the families of the alleged victims of the three flights which were supposed to land there, would have been showing up? How come the reporter only saw two family members of the alleged people on the three flights three hours later? Don't the airlines usually console the families of victims of air disasters? There should have been hundreds; even thousands of California family members and friends and fellow employees showing up for the victims of all four flights, and both airports were shut down and evacuated?

Flight 11 - Logan Intl Airport in Boston to Los Angeles Intl Airport
Flight 175 - Logan Intl Airport in Boston to Los Angeles Intl Airport
Flight 77 - Washington Dulles Intl Airport to Los Angeles Intl Airport
Flight 93 - Newark Intl Airport to San Francisco Intl Airport

LAX Evacuated (7:25 in video)

Why? So the American people and the reporters and the world would not quickly realize that most of the alleged passengers on board those alleged hijacked aircraft were either fictional or not dead after all?

So they evacuated and closed down LAX (and SFO) on 9-11 because???

source

Because the 9-11 perps had to quickly cover-up the fact that they had not arranged the 300 relatives, friends, and business partners to show up at LAX or SFO?

An alternate source of September Clues epilogue since there is so much censorship of 9-11 evidence.
September Clues epilogue


[edit on 7/20/09 by SPreston]

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
reply to post by jprophet420

 

And in all four instances on 9/11, the aircraft left evidence, which he either cannot or refuses to see. So, once again, I question his motives, if not his sanity at times.

See, this is where it turns into a mongolian cluster ****. There are the no planers, and there is worlds of evidence to refute them. There are the hologram guys, with worlds of evidence to refute them. This makes it pretty simple to jump on the "lots of evidence bandwagon", theres so much of it.

But the problem is this, once you're on the bandwagon it's hard to get off, and its hard to see the other side.

The pentagon wasn't even reported as a plane crash, CNN specifically said it wasn't a plane crash. MSNBC said it was a bomb.

See, that was my first impression as there was NO evidence of a plane when it first happened, and no reports of a plane. The reports were of an explosion . The first tower strike was reported as a plane. The second tower strike was reported as a plane. Anyway thats my impression as an amature. This guy is an expert, and came to the conclusion that the hole in the pentagon was not made by a boeing 757-200. He looked at the evidence with a trained eye and came to a logical conclusion. I have examined the pictures also, measured the hole in the pentagon with gimp (a photo editor), and came to the same admittedly amature but scientificaly sound conclusion. The hole is not nearly high up enough or large enough to have been made by a 757.

If as an ERT I came to a "crash site" with only 1-2% of a car, I would not be able to reach the conclusion that it was a car accident from the information available.

[edit on 20-7-2009 by jprophet420]