Originally posted by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest
reply to post by Watcher-In-The-Shadows
Please forgive me if any of this comes off as a personal attack or character assassination. I don't want either of us to fall into the "WELL U DO IT
TOO LOLOLOLOL" trap that people of our respective schools of thought fall into.
atheism is a lack of belief in a god.
STRONG atheism is stating there is no god. dont assume someone is a strong atheist unless they state it. its a straw man argument if you do that, and
that is what you seem to be doing. youre painting al atheists with a very broad brush
most atheists are agnostic atheists(whether they know it or not). thats pretty much the only intelligent stance on the subject you can
Ok i really have never understood this line of thinking, i almost always see it balled up with silly statements such as "bald is a hairstyle and not
collecting stamps is a hobby." Which in reality go to show how little thought is actually put into ones opinions and viewpoints and is generally used
to quickly shut down logical or analytical debate.
How can you state that you "lack belief" in a god when you openly acknowledge that you do not believe in any god? In order to truly lack belief you
would have to be totally ignorant of gods and religions in general. The mere fact that atheists both weak and strong are posting and voicing an
opinion in things such as this thread, books, Atheist groups (IE the freedom From Religion Project, Richard dawkins "followers" and similar websites
and groups where atheists join together to discuss religion, atheism,science and philosophy ) is philosophical proof that you are NOT ignorant to
gods, religions and concepts there of. Therefore you do have belief about religions. You BELIEVE IN the concept that there are no gods or a lack of
evidence for gods. This in turn creates a form of faith because you are basing your belief on an issue that is neither empirically or philosophically
The mere statement that you "lack belief" is a statement of belief in and of itself. You believe that you have not found any evidence whatsoever
to support the idea of a creator yet you are somehow shoe-horning it to mean you are either ignorant or genuinely lack belief. To state otherwise
would be a gross display of intellectual dishonesty or an eschewing of rational/logical thought and analysis. You do not believe in god. Period. And
you may even maintain this belief regardless of contradictory philosophical,tehological or scientific evidence.
Correct me if i am wrong here but you stated that an agnostic approach to Atheism is the most logical which in turn has lead me to conclude that you
are a weak atheist. I concur with this idea, In fact i myself am largely agnostic on the issue as well, and i am a follower of christ. But you need to
understand that an agnostic stance is in and of itself a belief as well. You and i maintain the idea that gods or religions are not provable due to a
potentially broad list of reasons.
most scientists who bash religions and such, dont do so claiming they know there isnt a god. They do it bashing the people who claim to know
there is a god with the evidence out there. and face it, many of those who get bashed deserve it. (see: Ray comfort, etc...)
[edit on 15-7-2009 by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest]
Scientists who bash religion do it because they do not believe in gods of any sorts. To say otherwise would be like me saying "the klan hates black
people because of X issue, not because they are black". The truth is that it is both. If scientists really didn't care that people believe in a
certain religion then they would not voice an opinion on the matter. Like any decent scientist they would hold their tounge until they are either
proven right or wrong. Seriously, it's like listening to a Young Earth Creationist say that their disbelief in an old earth is because it is Junk
science. It's not junk science. They simply do not agree with it and will use any excuse they can muster up to "prove" themselves "right"
At the end of the day the most logical conclusion we can come to is that there may be no logical (and by extension) empirical conclusion. It is my
firm belief that so long as atheists both weak and strong maintain this idea that they genuinely lack belief they will risk alienating themselves from
potential religious allies who disagree with there.
The biggest danger that science, atheism and religion face today is the rift between believers and non-believers. If we allow it to keep widening and
to increase in hostility we may see an age where people of faith are persecuted and oppressed by an atheistic society. In addition we may face a
complete reversion another dark age where religious fervor and sentiment will result in a persecution of science.
Many christians and other religious people have chosen to set aside their opinions so that we may better understand and appreciate the world and
universe that was given to us.
So i ask of you friend. Unite with me, let us put our petty differences aside and stand together so that we may build bridges and usher in a new era
of religious and scientific enlightenment. Please. Atheist or not, you are a child of god, and you should be regarded as such. For people like me it
is my duty to assure that you and anyone else of conflicting faiths and ideologies are regarded as such. All i ask of you like you is that god or not
you will realize and recognize that I like you am a fellow member of the human race.
Again dear brother. Let us stand united as children of god and as members of the human race and the wonderful world we occupy.