Chavez, Galloway to break Gaza siege: Report

Originally posted by FlyersFan
Anyone who says there must be a 'proportional response' during a war situation is a complete and total idiot. That's how wars last for years and decades instead of getting it over and done with, and with as few hits upon your own people as possible.

Fact is...that doesn't seem to be working. Time to try something new, doncha think? Cuz it doesn't look like the Palestinians read your playbook.

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck

Ok, but about my questions...are you disputing the figures of 1400 Palestinians dead (900 civilian) verses 13 Israeli (3 civilian)? Does this indicate to you a proportional response? And are you, indeed, impugning the figures because I had cited the Huffington Post?

What it tells me is that Hamas hides among the innocent civilians.

Israel should not allow that cowardly tactic to work, however. The sooner the people learn to throw those Hamas terrorists out of their homes and into the street, the better.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Excellent points on the absurdity of 'proportional response'.

Get the armed conflict over asap is the correct way.

reply to post by FlyersFan


OK, so proove the videos that you have linked in the earlier post relate to 9/11.

All your videos show the same footage of the same small group of people. There is no proof in any of them that this relates to 9/11. In the CNN video, the only verification we may get is the young man talking, but the reporter conveniently talks over him, meaning it's not possible to verify the translation. The news reports confirm that sweets were given out. There's no way to verify who by, for what purpose or when. All we know if the truth is that a small group of Palestinians one day received a bunch of sweets and looked happy about it.

Again, i stand by my point that only this footage of a small group exists, and this can hardly be related to the whole of Palestine or the whole of the Muslim world felt the same way. Similar to how we don't believe the Jewish people dancing in the streets of NY when Israeli was bombing Palestine earlier this year equates to every Jew or American supporting the bombing of innocent people.

And I notice that you use 'so called Palestines' all the time to attempt to belittle a nation of people and they're righ to existance. Palestine exists, they live there, therefore they're Palestinian. The area has been Palestine for a very long time. They have more right to be called Palestinian than the Jewish people that moved there do to be called Israeli. Palestine exists, Israel exists and if we're going to get anywhere with that part of the world people need to accept them both and try to move forward. Denying them the right to exist is as bad as them denying Israel.

I know George personally and his motives for anything are very well thought out, planned and executed with total focus. He uses his character and ego to attack those who belittle any nationality. He is not a "Nutter" as mentioned in an earlier post (although he likes the respect the label offers him).

There is a diffirence between those who use people or media for publicity to gain rewards of riches or status and those who use people or media to politically correct the unfairness in this world. George Galloway uses his reputation and " no fear" attitude to make a diffirence for the little man no matter where he lives, or, no matter the size of those who hold them prisoner.

He is very politically astute in what he says and does and wont enter a battle unless he knows he has the legal upperhand. Ask those who he has sued successfully for defamation about that one!

IMO George Galloway is a freedom fighter who takes those topics we moan about on here and acts on them. I bet he makes a diffirence for those who are imprisoned in Gaza. If the Israelis dont hate him now, they will detest him before he is finished.


Respects

Originally posted by Nammu
so proove the videos that you have linked in the earlier post relate to 9/11.

It was live feed from all three major news networks on 9/11.
The behavior was NOT a daily occurance.
It most definately was because of 9/11.

All your videos show the same footage of the same small group of people.

No they don't.

The news reports confirm that sweets were given out.

No they don't.
ONE REPORT CLAIMS they were, but there is no footage of that.
And as I said - they'd have to have a lot of candy to hand out.
The celebrations were wide spread.
Grown men aren't going to go honking horns and shooting off guns over a stick of gum.

Face it .... you are wrong.

Originally posted by Nammu
And I notice that you use 'so called Palestines' all the time to attempt to belittle a nation of people and they're righ to existance. Palestine exists,

Wrong again.

There is no country of palestine. It does not exist. And as has been previously pointed out, most of them have their recent roots in Jordan, Egypt or Syria. (countries where they have been kicked out of)

[edit on 7/17/2009 by FlyersFan]

reply to post by FlyersFan


I love you Flyers Fan. You're so like me, but completely the opposite viewpoint on some things. I totally dig that. It keeps me on my toes

It was live feed from all three major news networks on 9/11.
The behavior was NOT a daily occurance.
It most definately was because of 9/11.

You still have not posted evidence that it was related to 9/11. Cause there is none. I don't see any of those being live feeds. It looks like pre-recorded footage. Might have been taken on that day, but i don't see anyone reporting from the scene. And a lot of the 9/11 footage is questionable and shows media manipulation, so i see no reason why this would be any different. But that's for a different thread

No they don't.

Um, yeah, they do man.

CNN video shows the same woman dancing, the man in the blue shirt with sunglasses, and the guy that's interviewed at the end. Also watch out for the kid in the blue and green top popping up infront of the camera.

MSNBC shows the kid in the blue and green top a good few times, a white van and the guy that was interviewed at the end of the CNN one appears at the end of this video as well.

The Faux one shows the man in the blue shirt and sunglasses, the woman dancing (BTW, please note that you can clearly see in this video that the person with the camera, or someone just behind the camera, is trying to put cake in her mouth), the white van and then a flash of the boy in the blue and green top at the end.

So this prroves the videos are all of the same small group of people.

No they don't.
ONE REPORT CLAIMS they were, but there is no footage of that.
And as I said - they'd have to have a lot of candy to hand out.
The celebrations were wide spread.

Yes there is. Look at 37secs into the Faux news one. You can clearly see someone behind the camera waving a cake in the dancing ladies face. Anyways, so your claiming that the claims in your own footage (CNN) are incorrect? Yet rely on this as evidence?

Show me evidence the celebrations were widespread and involved more than this group of people.

There is no country of palestine. It does not exist. And as has been previously pointed out, most of them have their recent roots in Jordan, Egypt or Syria. (countries where they have been kicked out of)

There was no country of Israel until recently and they've got their roots as ashkenazi jews, not semetic jews. In fact, they're homelands are really the countries they were kicked out of after the war. The Palestinian people are more sematic than Israeli Jews. These people do not have Jordanian, Egyptian or Syrian citizenship. They were born in the land of Palestine.

Originally posted by Nammu
I love you Flyers Fan.

You still have not posted evidence that it was related to 9/11.

Again - It was a live broadcast.
This is NOT the usual behavior of the people in the area.
The people told the reporters and the reporters reported the reason.
There could be no other reason for it.
People don't dance in the streets, honk their horns, and shoot their guns
over a piece of gum or a bite of cake.

It looks like pre-recorded footage.

That's subjective on your part. All stations were reporting live.

they do man.

psssssssst ... I'm a girl.

You can clearly see someone behind the camera waving a cake in the dancing ladies face.

As I said ... the video shows one woman taking one or two bites of food from a camera man. It in NO WAY shows candy being tossed to people. It does not show any food being given to people in the cars who are honking and carrying on. it shows no candy being given to grown men to shoot off their guns. It shows one woman getting a bite or two of food from a camera man That's not enough 'evidence' to warrent the pro-palestinian youtube poster coming to the conclusion that he/she did.

There was no country of Israel until recently

But there IS a country of Israel ... and no country of palestine.
The 'palestinians' are Jordanians, Syrians, and Egyptians.

reply to post by FlyersFan

Again - It was a live broadcast.
This is NOT the usual behavior of the people in the area.
The people told the reporters and the reporters reported the reason.
There could be no other reason for it.
People don't dance in the streets, honk their horns, and shoot their guns
over a piece of gum or a bite of cake.

There was no gun shooting, i saw no reporter live on the scene to show it was a live broadcast. I see nothing that says 'live' on the broadcasts.

I also see only a few people involved (not even in the 100's), so even if they were dancing at 9/11 we can't assume all Palestinians felt the same way.

psssssssst ... I'm a girl.

Well what d'ya know. Me too. Even more in common.

As I said ... the video shows one woman taking one or two bites of food from a camera man. It in NO WAY shows candy being tossed to people. It does not show any food being given to people in the cars who are honking and carrying on. it shows no candy being given to grown men to shoot off their guns. It shows one woman getting a bite or two of food from a camera man That's not enough 'evidence' to warrent the pro-palestinian youtube poster coming to the conclusion that he/she did.

It also in NO WAY shows anything to do with them dancing at 9/11.

All it shows is a small group of people, mostly kids, one of which is being offered cake, a few of which are showing the peace sign, dancing in the street in Palestine. This is the known facts.

I'll agree with your above statement. And i think we both have to agree that the only thing it shows is what i have stated above.

But there IS a country of Israel ... and no country of palestine.
The 'palestinians' are Jordanians, Syrians, and Egyptians.

If you own land and are born in an area called Palestine, then you're Palestinian. You fly the flag of Palestine. You're not Jordinan, Syrian and Egyptian unless you have citizenship for those countries. If i'm born in Glasgow, own land in Glasgow and fly the flag of Glasgow, you can't say i'm 'so-called Glaswegian'. I'd definitely be Glaswegian.


I think we have to agree to disagree, or i can see this going on for a while. We're quite good at cancelling each other out in a reasonable manner. It's so fun

Originally posted by Nammu
I think we have to agree to disagree, or i can see this going on for a while. We're quite good at cancelling each other out in a reasonable manner. It's so fun

Okay. And it's nice to find out that you are a girl. It's funny that most folks on here expect the other posters to be guys and they are in shock when they find out they are girls.

I've been told to 'man up' or to 'grow a pair' ... then I as I explain to them that it would be physically impossible.

I know this is going to be a little off toic bt I hoenstly think it shows George Galloway in the right light when he Isn't bogged down with the middle east topic.
He was on Talk Sport tonight talking about the governments idea to have us all (uk residents) take out insurance to cover care in our old age even though we have paid through our taxes for this event. While everyone phoned in and argued whether it was a good idea or not George reminded everyone that the government was quite happy to spend billions getting our soldiers killed in Afghanistan, was happy to spend billions bailing out the banks but couldn't spend a fraction of that money looking after our own old age pensioners who had spent a lifetime paying their taxes!
That's the beauty of George! His reasoning is often unquestionable. . .