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US Masons - Recognition of Prince Hall Masonry

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posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 12:27 AM
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Hi guys,

I saw a statistic on the net which got me thinking (and more than a little... concerned).

Of the 51 Grand Lodges in the United States, apparently only 38 recognise Prince Hall Freemasonry as regular. The other 13, presumably, regard it as irregular and clandestine.

My question is... why?

We're living in the 21st century, right? Why have the other Grand Lodges not followed suit? Have they made official statements explaining their inaction in this regard?

Does anyone here belong to a Grand Lodge jurisdiction which doesn't recognise Prince Hall Freemasonry and, if so, what has been openly publicised about this stance?

I did attempt to research this, but my search-fu is apparently a bit weak.

Thanks.




posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 06:54 AM
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In NC it just passed last year. And I heard nothing but grumbling from my area. Sometimes I think we are getting somewhere, and others I think we are destined to be stick in the dark ages. Time will tell. I am still not sure about what the PH being recognized means as far as visitation and all. I would like to go see a degree or two and find out what differences there are, but nobody has been very clear over what the new rules are. It will be interesting to see what other areas are still holding out.

In our closing charge it is said that a man should be judged on his inner qualities and not the exterior, and then go right back to 1962. There is a term that comes to mind. It starts with an H and ends in cryt.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 12:01 PM
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Because contrary to most Conspiricy theories about the Free Masons they are not one group but really a divided group.

One sect is controlled by the illuminati and the other is free of it. They have been fighting each other clandestinly for the last 240 years or so.

Its very hard to tell them apart though. I can say this the more rural groups tend not to be controlled by the illuminati where the urban ones tend to be apart of the illuminati.

I still wouldn't join one... but I do have some information about them that would lead me to believe that both groups are gearing up for a real fight right now. Against who or what is yet to be seen.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 01:02 PM
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it never ceases to amaze me how much everyone else knows about masonry. And to think that I go to almost every meeting and communication. I wonder when the Grand Master will tell us who we are at war with. I have been cleaning the guns and sharpening the swords. (The tyler hates when the sword is sharp, he cuts himself)

Oh, well. Once the Illuminati city folk tell us country bumpkins whats up, we will be ready for a scrap.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 03:20 PM
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Originally posted by network dude
Oh, well. Once the Illuminati city folk tell us country bumpkins whats up, we will be ready for a scrap.


Message from the New York City area:

Check your pantry, I just walked off with your pickled beets and the 12 gauge ammunition you were stockpiling.


On topic, my jurisdiction has had mutual recognition for some time and we have frequently gone to each others degrees. Anyone who gets a chance to see a Prince Hall Master Mason degree is in for a a good show.


M74

posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 06:48 PM
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I live in a jurisdiction where Prince Hall is not recognized. Part of the reason why is because the Prince Hall lodge has never approached us formally about seeking regular amity. Masonic tradition prescribes that the younger of two lodges should be the one responsible for beginning discussions on regularity with an older lodge. My Grand Lodge is still waiting for them to ask. In addition, the Prince Hall lodge in my jurisdiction is not recognized by the UGLE (I suspect for the same reason; they never bothered to ask). We tend to follow closely with the list of regular lodges published by the UGLE.

Edit: I forgot to mention that there is also a book published by The Masonic Board of Relief of the United States of America and Canada which is used by many Grand Lodges in determining the regularity of other lodges. Also, at least in my jurisdiction, there is a difference between "regularity" and "fraternal relations". A lodge can be determined as regular, but still not be acceptable for fraternal relations. Some of the Grand Lodges in the US who recognize the regularity of Prince Hall lodges may still not be in fraternal relations with them.

[edit on 7/10/2009 by M74]



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 07:20 PM
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reply to post by M74
 


So far as UGLE recognition is concerned, UGLE will not recognize a Grand Lodge that shares territory with a currently recognized Grand Lodge until those two have a pact of mutual recognition. At least that was how it was explained to my Grand Lodge (also Bro. Network Dude's)


M74

posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 07:47 PM
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Originally posted by Viking04
reply to post by M74
 


So far as UGLE recognition is concerned, UGLE will not recognize a Grand Lodge that shares territory with a currently recognized Grand Lodge until those two have a pact of mutual recognition. At least that was how it was explained to my Grand Lodge (also Bro. Network Dude's)


But there are also Prince Hall lodges which are recognized by GLs in some states which are still not recognized by the UGLE, regardless of their mutual pact, so that's not absolute either. I should have been more clear. The younger lodge still has to ask the UGLE, too, from what I understand.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:21 PM
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reply to post by M74
 


That may well be true. I can only pass along what I was told when we were voting for recognition.



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 01:11 AM
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reply to post by Roark
 

I'm not sure why. Back in the 80s or 90s the Grand Lodge of Oregon refused to recognize Idaho as we recognized the Prince Hall. Slowly but surely the GLs are recognizing them and shedding some of the racist backdrop. I believe one of the Carolinas is coming close to coming around.



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 01:26 AM
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reply to post by KSigMason
 


Bro:

GL of NC went through recognition last year. I cannot speak for the GL of SC.



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 08:45 AM
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reply to post by Viking04
 


did your area meet any of the same resistance mine did? Have any of the lodges in your are visited with other PH lodges? I saw a diverse crowd at a few public functions, but nobody has come out with any new information.



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 12:00 PM
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reply to post by network dude
 


There was some resistance, but over the past few years, most of it waned. I am not very active right now, having finished two consecutive years in the East a couple of years back. I am spending time with the family. I have not heard about visitation occurring around here.

As I noted in that U2U, the ruckus that I have been hearing is more focused on the tactic that GL used. That they spent years pumping 'Recognition only' 'Recognition is not visitation', until it was passed, then visitation is a fait accompli, that has concerned many. Visitation isn't the issue, the bait and switch is.



posted on Jul, 12 2009 @ 01:18 AM
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reply to post by Viking04
 

That's what I thought, but I couldn't remember. I know it happened around the time NY and DC were having their disagreement over the Lebanon Lodge.



posted on Jul, 12 2009 @ 11:46 AM
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reply to post by KSigMason
 


Bro.: I am not familiar with a Lebanon Lodge. What was the basis of the disagreement?



posted on Jul, 12 2009 @ 11:52 AM
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funny thing is the Prince hall lodges as far as I know, don't let Non-African Americans to join, however there is no such restriction in the regular lodges.
so mutual recognition may be part of this issue.
i have a few African brother in my lodge, and we have visited a Prince Hall lodge, as a lodge group, but I can't join the PH lodge if I was geographically closer fro whatever reason.
It may not be universally true. just a quirk to some lodge or so.
i would petition the prince hall lodges simply be taken into the fold of the Grand Lodge here in the states and the Prince Hall name be part of the identity but I don't think they need to exist as separate, but they must want this as well.



posted on Jul, 12 2009 @ 12:36 PM
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reply to post by fiorano
 


I don't know where you might be located, but I am aware of a couple of men who are PHA and are not African-American. I have never heard that PHA was restricted in this manner. Of course, there may well be irregular Lodges that masquerade under the name Prince Hall, but with such an unmasonic restriction.


M74

posted on Jul, 12 2009 @ 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by Viking04
reply to post by KSigMason
 


Bro.: I am not familiar with a Lebanon Lodge. What was the basis of the disagreement?


The Grand Lodge of DC chartered a new lodge in the Republic of Lebanon (Ahiram Lodge No. 1000), a place which the Grand Lodge of NY felt they had exclusive jurisdiction because they had previously chartered other lodges in that area. NY withdrew its recognition of DC. There were also some other miscellaneous complaints about the two GLs interfering with each other's business.



posted on Jul, 12 2009 @ 03:47 PM
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Originally posted by Viking04
reply to post by KSigMason
 


Bro.: I am not familiar with a Lebanon Lodge. What was the basis of the disagreement?

There are many Lebanese Brothers in DC who go back home and wanted to establish a DC ran Lodge in Lebanon. DC granted it, but NY threw a fit because they say they lay claim to have Lebanon. It was a big pissing match.

reply to post by fiorano
 

I was under the impression that anyone could join PHA.



posted on Jul, 12 2009 @ 03:58 PM
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I think for me at least, that as masons, we claim to transcend the racial and even physical barriers in the way we are supposed to live our lives, yet we are still human and subject to our environment. With racism as strong as it has been, it is unlikely that it will dissipate anytime in the real near future. I just hope that we continue to move in the correct direction and find out what we could learn from each other. After all, in the end, isn't that what we are all here for?



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