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Indian yoga guru challenges gay sex ruling: report

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posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:32 AM
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Originally posted by ModernAcademia

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
Really? There's a huge difference between "gays not existing" and an oppressive culture. I mean look at the Indian culture toward widows, kissing in public, "supposed witchcraft" seems like a primitive oppressive system to me.

I usually agree with your posts but i'm surprised that you made this one.
India does not have an oppressive culture.
Have you ever visited India, how can you know from afar?

Firstly what is wrong is your perception of India, you do not understand it.

Kissing in public is fine. However mostly for couples that seem married.
But if a young couple is kissing than yes that's frowned upon.
Only because parents in India are strongly against pre-marital sex.
Is that wrong?
Kissing is not sex no, I understand that, but parents are just being cautious.
You may not agree with it but I commend this culture.

I much rather be part of this community than part of a community where parents buy their daughters breast implants for their 16th birthdays.

And supposed witchcraft?
Dear god buy a plane ticket to India and educate yourself.
You think you will find this supposed witchcraft allegations in city areas or even villages? No
You'll only find it in remote remote remote remote villages.
Villages far far from civilization and organized education.
What else would you expect?

But what do you do? You generalize an entire country based on the beliefs of a few, very few, in a remote remote remote village.

And I know which video you are referring to as well, even in that remote remote village it was only 3 or 4 individuals calling that woman a witch and almost everyone in the backround was opposing it.

I'm surprised at you, I usually like your posts.
But this one is WAYYYY OFFFFFFFFFFF!!!!!!!!



Ok let me explain.

On Indian Widows and orphans...




On Indians treatment of so called "witches"



As for Kissing, when Richard Gere kissed Shilpa Shetty in public, there were death threats out for him.
www.dailymail.co.uk...


Now, did you look at the poster I replied to? He seems to assume that homosexuality is a phenomenon that is alien to India and that was something which was repugnant.

I just wanted to remind him that India isn't some holier than thou place either.

Yes, having been to India, I can say without a doubt that India has a very oppressive system, but I will say that it's not an oppression which comes from the government so much as it comes from the people themselves. And their crazy superstitions.

[edit on 10-7-2009 by HunkaHunka]




posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:37 AM
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reply to post by HunkaHunka
 



I just wanted to remind him that India isn't some holier than thou place either.


Seriously, what does the extent of holiness have to do with this.

Culture is different from holiness.

For your clarification,


Culture (from the Latin cultura stemming from colere, meaning "to cultivate")[1] is a term that has different meanings. For example, in 1952, Alfred Kroeber and Clyde Kluckhohn compiled a list of 164 definitions of "culture" in Culture: A Critical Review of Concepts and Definitions.[2] However, the word "culture" is most commonly used in three basic senses: excellence of taste in the fine arts and humanities, also known as high culture an integrated pattern of human knowledge, belief, and behavior that depends upon the capacity for symbolic thought and social learning the set of shared attitudes, values, goals, and practices that characterizes an institution, organization or group.


Culture


Holiness is a synonym for sanctity, the state of being holy or sacred.


Holiness

That being said, the various religious groups not accepting this is because that the culture does not accept this.

Not as what you think.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:39 AM
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reply to post by peacejet
 


Here in the US the phrase "Holier than thou" means "Better than you".

My point is that India is not any better than any other culture.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:41 AM
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reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


Fine. Let India not be better than any other culture(only for your contentment that is). It is not the point of this thread anyway. Please get back on topic.


[edit on July 10th, 2009 by peacejet]



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:44 AM
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reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


You don't understand.
Homosexuality IS alien to India, but you don't get that.

I don't know why you refuse to accept people as different.
Everyone has to be like America.

Homosexuality is very much alien to India
especially compared to the western world.
There hasn't been on homosexual movie in India ever.

Only movie was a recent movie called "dostana"
but it was two guys pretending to be gay so they could get closer to a girl.

Homosexuality is foreign to India but you won't understand that
And even those that do know about homosexuality in India, I bet you a million bucks they have no clue that gays actually have sex and how.
They will have no idea.

And I can't see the videos you posted from where I am now.
I'll check them when I get home.

But i'm sure it's the same thing, you generalizing an entire country based on a few.

I've been to India and lived there for a while.
I know the culture like the back of my hand.
I grew up in an indian family, i'm hindu vegetarian and an indian traditionalist.

If I make myself as ignorant(which you usually aren't) as you, I should think that all americans are polygamists after seeing the news regarding the Texas Polygamist Ranch.

If I make myself as ignorant as you(which you usually aren't) I would think that all americans buy their daughters breast implants on their 16th birthdays.

Do you see what you are doing now?



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:45 AM
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reply to post by peacejet
 


Yes the topic is that a HOLY MAN in INDIA feels that Gays can be CURED.

This is in line with the same supersitious beliefs that fuel Evangelicals in here in the US.

And judging from the films I posted earlier about how the Indians treat Widows, orphans, and so called witches, this is par for the course.

It's all rather disgusting if you ask me, but as I've said before, you can't divorce stupidity from humanity.

We are all just a bunch of monkeys throwing feces.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:57 AM
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Originally posted by ModernAcademia
reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


You don't understand.
Homosexuality IS alien to India, but you don't get that.

I don't know why you refuse to accept people as different.
Everyone has to be like America.



I'm sorry, I just have a huge distaste for superstition.




Homosexuality is very much alien to India
especially compared to the western world.
There hasn't been on homosexual movie in India ever.


See this is my point. Homosexuality always exists in human society... whether or not the culture allows people to be open about it is a different thing.

Ahmadinejad claims there are no gays in Iran either, but that's because they will be SHOT.

I'm not saying that homosexuality is part of Indian Culture or has been.. .I'm saying that to act as if homosexuality doesn't exist in a group of people the size of those on the Indian Subcontinent is insane.





Only movie was a recent movie called "dostana"
but it was two guys pretending to be gay so they could get closer to a girl.

Homosexuality is foreign to India but you won't understand that
And even those that do know about homosexuality in India, I bet you a million bucks they have no clue that gays actually have sex and how.
They will have no idea.



I'm sure it would be easy to hide homosexuality in India. Male relationships are a HUGE part of Indian culture. And if I were gay, I'd probably leverage this social custom as a guise to satisfy my own inclinations.





And I can't see the videos you posted from where I am now.
I'll check them when I get home.

But i'm sure it's the same thing, you generalizing an entire country based on a few.



Once again... you didn't read the post I was reacting to. Peace Jet was generalizing homosexuality as a western infection of some type.

The videos show a women tied to a tree and beat for being a witch, shows the places where widows go to die because they are shunned by their families, etc.

My point is, that India isn't somehow a better place or culture than any other part of the world.





I've been to India and lived there for a while.
I know the culture like the back of my hand.
I grew up in an indian family, i'm hindu vegetarian and an indian traditionalist.



That's great... I've got tons of dacy friends and we get on great. But I also have a lot of Christian Conservative friends I get on great with as well.. .but they are still superstitious and act out toward others based on these crazy beliefs.




If I make myself as ignorant(which you usually aren't) as you, I should think that all americans are polygamists after seeing the news regarding the Texas Polygamist Ranch.

If I make myself as ignorant as you(which you usually aren't) I would think that all americans buy their daughters breast implants on their 16th birthdays.

Do you see what you are doing now?


What I see is that you are defending a fellow country man who when disparaging the west I retorted to with hyperbole.

Why don't you rail on him for being so disparaging to the west? It's because of bias. That's normal.

One thing you must know about me.... I can't stand crazy. Anyone who bases their actions on beliefs they feel are more valid than anyone else, is a nutjob. Plain and simple.

I'm not singling out Indians here... this goes for Americans as well.

And this yoga guru is one of said nutjobs. (bringing it back on topic)

I appreciate everyone, and all diverse cultures, but I will not stand back and allow one culture to assume they are better than another. I *will* mimic their insanity to prove a point. That is called hyperbole, and I use it often. Sometimes too often, but that's just me :-)

BTW... I do enjoy your posts as well and thank you for engaging in this discussion.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:57 AM
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Originally posted by HunkaHunka
And judging from the films I posted earlier about how the Indians treat Widows, orphans, and so called witches, this is par for the course.


Anyhow, since logic isn't getting through your skull i'll just say one more thing and leave this thread since debating with you seems more and more futile.

How you believe india treats widows, orphans or witches is NOT what india is about.

As someone who lived in India let me tell you that you don't know what you are talking about and you can't understand an entire country with a few youtube videos.

If you go to India now and live there, you will see understanding and compassion for widows, you will see groups trying to help orphans and you will see nothing whatsoever regarding witches unless you do some extensive research and find a remote village and go there.

The whole witches argument is one you really gotta leave man, the people who contribute to this belief in the overpopulated country in India make up less than the number of overly superstitious people living in America's bible belt. It's not even a topic in India whatsoever.

And you know who are mistreated worse than widows in India?
People who mistreat widows that's who.

India is all about family, that's the epicenter of everything.
So if someone mistreats a widow in India, most indians will say "look that that guy mistreating that widow, he must be from a bad family".

That's how people think, because they believe being a good person mostly comes from having a good family which teaches good values.


Male relationships are a HUGE part of Indian culture. And if I were gay, I'd probably leverage this social custom as a guise to satisfy my own inclinations.

Om my GODD
Did you just say that?
Are you paranoid?

Firstly, any relationship is a HUGE part of indian culture.
What do you know what is a HUGE part of indian culture?
Youtube videos?

It's not about male relationships, it's about friendship period.
Indians heavily respect the institution of friendship.
Guys say to other guys I love you... as a friend
girls do the same to girls.

If you are going to interpret that as a possible disguise for homosexuality then I must say you are a cynic and possibly have a dirty mind.

That movie I spoke about called Dostana
Guess what that means?
Dost means friend, dosti means friendship

have a nice day

[edit on 10-7-2009 by ModernAcademia]



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 10:01 AM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 

Ok I went back and read through... you did read my post...


You are not understanding what I said.

I said that I understood that male relationships were huge... I never said they were a disguise for being gay.

I said that if someone was gay, that this normal custom would allow for them to be that way without anyone knowing differently.

I think you are just acting out now... because you are seeing someone who you think is attacking your culture... and I'm not.


I will say though, that of the dacys I know.... most of them do seem to look down on Indian culture as being overly discriminatory.



[edit on 10-7-2009 by HunkaHunka]



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 10:07 AM
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You said "I'm not singling out Indians here"

I am responding ONLY because you are.

You are trying to dictate to me(an indian) what India is about.
You are trying to tell me(an indian) that male relationships are a HUGE part of indian culture.

You are trying to tell me that the few cult-like beliefs of a few in a remote village represent the entire country of India.

I am only responding to you because you ARE singling out Indians.

When I read your psots, it's like a fallacious syllogism.

One man in a remote village in India believes a woman is a witch
therefore all indians believe many are witches

you are VERY much singling out indians in an illogical manner.
Iran is not india, gays in India won't be shot or even arrested
and it's not dacy is desi



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 10:17 AM
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Originally posted by HunkaHunka
reply to post by peacejet
 

Yes the topic is that a HOLY MAN in INDIA feels that Gays can be CURED.


Ahem. For your clarification. Just because that the person is a guru doesnt necessarily mean that he must be related to religion. All teachers are referred to as gurus here in India.

With regards to your misunderstandings about yoga.


Yoga (Sanskrit, Pāli: योग yóga) refers to traditional physical and mental disciplines originating in India.[1] The word is associated with meditative practices in Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism.[2][3] [4]In Hinduism, it also refers to one of the six orthodox (āstika) schools of Hindu philosophy, and to the goal toward which that school directs its practices.[5][6] In Jainism it refers to the sum total of all activities—mental, verbal and physical.

Major branches of yoga in Hindu philosophy include Raja Yoga, Karma Yoga, Jnana Yoga, Bhakti Yoga, and Hatha Yoga.[7][8][9] Raja Yoga, compiled in the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali, and known simply as yoga in the context of Hindu philosophy, is part of the Samkhya tradition.[10] Many other Hindu texts discuss aspects of yoga, including Upanishads, the Bhagavad Gita, the Hatha Yoga Pradipika, the Shiva Samhita and various Tantras.

The Sanskrit word yoga has many meanings,[11] and is derived from the Sanskrit root yuj, meaning "to control", "to yoke" or "to unite".[12] Translations include "joining", "uniting", "union", "conjunction", and "means".[13][14][15] Outside India, the term yoga is typically associated with Hatha Yoga and its asanas (postures) or as a form of exercise. Someone who practices yoga or follows the yoga philosophy is called a Yogi.[16]


yoga

Yoga is an exercise method for attaining concentration and training our soul. And many religious gurus practise yoga because it allows them to concentrate.

And that is not to be confused with the use of yoga as a treatment method for curing various illnesses.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 10:39 AM
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Where I come from men act like men (not women) and the women are proud of it.


If it is a disease then it must be spread by way of recruitment, which is done by older men who entice, manipulate, and initiate young boys into their sub-culture.

With a life expectancy of 42 years compared to the hetero man's life span of 74 years, I would conclude it's a disease leading to premature death.

Take it up with your Yogi or Psychologist, don't air your sex life in public. Would all you Pro Gay ATS's want me to air my sex life in public? How would the community react if a guy wears a shirt that says, "I'm a cuckold, do my wife while I watch"....or a young couple wearing T shirts that say, "We are swingers, come swap with us"....or "My wife likes backdoor sex"? Where do we draw the line? There are all kinds of fetishes and sub cultures into those fetishes....do they all come out of the closet and start making demands on the rest of us.

The Gay fetish is a paraphillia like any other fetish. Have fun with it or seek help, but don't advertise it in public places with Gay pride marches and protests....please!

And Gay marriage? Why would they want to get entangled in the family court system? They must be crazy.

The reason such a small percentage of the population has gained such a big voice in politics is because the courts and family law lawyers see it as a HUGE cash cow for them. Think about all those nasty Gay divorces and bizarre child custody battles.
The lawyers will make a fortune off Gay family law cases.

Fighting for gay marriage laws is the height of stupid. They want the same rights as heteros? They can have the government intrusion and it's messed up family law for all I care. But please keep it to yourself so others can more easily tolerate it, otherwise you are deliberately throwing out a stumbling block and causing controversy. You have the same rights as me, except maybe marriage rights, but why would you want that?.....that just leads to divorce court and injustice.

What will Gays want next.....their own separate public washrooms? Ooops...I should not have given them the idea.

I can see dads and moms taking their kids to the washroom at public restaurants: "mommy which door is it?......the stick man with pants......the stick girl with a dress.....or the stick man bent over showing his bummy?
Oh, and then we would need a washroom for lesbians and I won't discribe that door here.


That's it!! I'm taking up Yoga.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 11:28 AM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 


I am singling out Indians only so much as to show there is no better or worse culture on the planet.

India is NOT better than any other culture, period.

It is as full of superstitious nutjobs as any other culture.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 01:14 PM
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reply to post by tezzajw
 


What if mass murder or child molestation "comes naturally" to you. Should that be condoned as well? Sorry to say this but human behavior needs boundaries, as much as that flies against the face of the post-christian pc worldview.

No doubt you will say that homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone. That has already been disproven. Unless you consider a 20 year shorter life expectancy and STDs a positive devleopment. Of course that and the fact that homos don't reproduce is exactly why the TPTB love to promote that particular form of hedonism.

I'm amazed at their complete control over the world view of the helpless citizen. The demoralization of society has been well planned and people actually think that it's their idea!



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 06:42 PM
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Originally posted by ModernAcademia
I much rather be part of this community than part of a community where parents buy their daughters breast implants for their 16th birthdays.


Originally posted by ModernAcademia
But what do you do? You generalize an entire country based on the beliefs of a few, very few, in a remote remote remote village.

You just generalised an entire country based on a few parents who buy breast implants!

Contradict yourself much?


Originally posted by ModernAcademia
Homosexuality IS alien to India, but you don't get that.

That statement proves how oppressive India must be towards the homosexuals who live there. I'd hate to live in a country where I would be persecuted for being who I am.

I can't believe that some people try to justify why people should not kiss in public. Arse-backwards oppression right there, no need to say any more.

[edit on 10-7-2009 by tezzajw]




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