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Bail outs for THEM, But 9/11 Rescue Workers Can Fend for Themselves!!

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posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 07:43 AM
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Originally posted by zysin5
Belive what you want about 911.. These are some cold true facts about the men and women who gave so much to save those with so much less!
As I stated before.. This isnt about buildings or inside jobs.. This is about the human factor that seemed to sit on the way side, for how many God Damn years now? Close to 8 freakin years.. Shameful!


This may be the first thread I have flagged on ATS, but i cannot disagree with the sentiment. Rescue workers sacrificed their health in an effort to save people, the very least that can be done is to cover their healthcare costs entirely.

edit:

Id like to find a couple debunkers to come into this thread and tell me what they think about all this..
I'd like a few answers to all this.. I think our government owes us some answers on this..

Just saw this ^^

I am a debunker I guess. What would you like to know?

[edit on 10-7-2009 by exponent]




posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 02:14 PM
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Originally posted by exponent
This may be the first thread I have flagged on ATS, but i cannot disagree with the sentiment. Rescue workers sacrificed their health in an effort to save people, the very least that can be done is to cover their healthcare costs entirely.

I am a debunker I guess. What would you like to know?


Greetings Exponent! Thanks for the flag and your time! You pretty much said what any good person would say about the health costs for these people who gave it all...

My question is to you, as a "debunker" Or 911 skeptic..

What does this tell you about our government? Does this thread not raise a valid question?
And once that question is raised.. Could that lead you to wonder more about 911?

Such as lets just say for the sake of argument.. The officals story is the truth.. So if the offical story is the truth.. And Terroists attacked us.. Why are these firefighters being harmed and treated this way..

Wouldnt it make more sense that our government might have had some hand in all this?
Now Im not trying to put words in your mouth.. Or tell you what to belive.
But to me.. They really want these guys to just die off..

That way the people in power can play the heroes.. And all the real heroes are DEAD.. And no one left to speak out aginst those in office.

I understand the politics game.. But this reaches a little bit further.. Yes in politics people sling mud.. But rarely do people DIE!!

Thus people are dying, and nothing is being done to stop this.. While at the same time they Bail out wallstreet and friends..
Its utter insanity..

I think this is the crowbar.. Or the 1 weak card in the house of cards to bring the whole thing down...

As thats the point of most 911 truth seekers.. We only have to expose one thing.. And one thing will lead us down a very dark road, that most would rather not face..

Im ready to face it.. As I have always known our government doesnt honestly give a damn about us.. Or those who work to protect and save its people..
So what would stop them from fooling us all into thinking terroists are attacking us.. While planning a stagged war, and allowing our men and women to die..

I don't want to get to deep into what I feel personally becasue this thread really isnt about what happened that day.. Its about these men and women! Who really need some help..

So ask yourself.. Is this right?
Ask yourself.. Is this something a good government would do to its own "Heroes"?



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 04:33 PM
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I notice a bit of 911 threads going on here today.. So before I leave for the evening I wanted to give this thread another shot.
So far so good... But I would like to see a few more people in here.
Thanks to everyone who flagged this thread, and those who took the time to come in and say something..

Granted you don't have to come in and post.. But please show your support by flagging this thread!!!

---Note: Never in any past threads of mine have I asked for members to flagg a thread.. Please note this is NOT a fishing thread for points.. This is NOT an attention game.. This is not about my status here on ATS..
This is about the MEN and WOMEN of the first responders!! Bottom line..
This must be addressed as its a big web site with alot of thoughts.. Im sure it will go through someones head.. And I want to cover that before you say anything outloud and offend yourself..

Thanks again!!

As stated this is the weakest Card we have right now in the house of CARDS.. Please help me uncover the truth to 911!!!

All theroies can follow if we EXPOSE this one weakness within the elites game plan!!
There are many great theories and truthers out here working overtime to expose what really happened! They would rather we forget than remember and keep up with this fight!!

Also I understand we can not be online all the time.. So i will respectfully wait on each answer or question and get back with you when I can!!!



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 04:44 PM
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Originally posted by zysin5
What does this tell you about our government? Does this thread not raise a valid question?
And once that question is raised.. Could that lead you to wonder more about 911?

Such as lets just say for the sake of argument.. The officals story is the truth.. So if the offical story is the truth.. And Terroists attacked us.. Why are these firefighters being harmed and treated this way..


I don't think it does raise a valid question about 911 no. I don't trust the US Government any more than I trust my own government (the UK Government), and in my eyes they're treating the firefighters this way because they're easy to ignore. They set up some funds for them which were good, but obviously some firefighters are still suffering.

I don't think it's a requirement that 911 be an inside job before the US Government can fail to act to protect its own citizens.


Wouldnt it make more sense that our government might have had some hand in all this?
Now Im not trying to put words in your mouth.. Or tell you what to belive.
But to me.. They really want these guys to just die off..

I see it the opposite way in fact. If this was in fact an inside job, wouldn't it be better to provide excellent health coverage for the people who worked the pile? If anyone could have discovered suspicious evidence it is the people who worked on stripping out the debris and searching for survivors.

To me it makes much more sense to keep them happy and contented, becuase if they did see something, then denying them coverage will only lead to bitterness and resentment, and any possibly negative facts they have will be made public.


Thus people are dying, and nothing is being done to stop this.. While at the same time they Bail out wallstreet and friends..
Its utter insanity..

I don't quite think they're bailing out individual friends, more the companies these friends work for, but yes there's no reason they cannot spare a few million to pay for the healthcare of any rescue worker. Of course, over here it is not a matter of having to pay, and hopefully you guys will end up with a similar system soon.


So ask yourself.. Is this right?
Ask yourself.. Is this something a good government would do to its own "Heroes"?

Please don't fall into the trap of thinking I trust the US Government any more than I trust the average joe on the street. I do not



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 05:06 PM
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First off Thanks for getting back with me so quickly.. I am able to give you a reply before I leave for the night..



I don't think it does raise a valid question about 911 no. I don't trust the US Government any more than I trust my own government (the UK Government), and in my eyes they're treating the firefighters this way because they're easy to ignore. They set up some funds for them which were good, but obviously some firefighters are still suffering.

They may be easy to ignore.. But they under estimated the power of the people who really do care about them.. Like me and many many others.
Sure they set up a very limited fund.. But it pales compared to the Bail outs given..



To me it makes much more sense to keep them happy and contented, becuase if they did see something, then denying them coverage will only lead to bitterness and resentment, and any possibly negative facts they have will be made public.

If thats how you see it. That by all means is your right.. And why I wanted someone with your mind set to give me other thoughts.. I only know what I think.. Thus its helpful to hear what you say.. Such as this..
I guess you could think of it that way..
But to me, if they funded these guys with the money they used on wallstreet many of these eye wittness would still be alive today to give their side of the story.. Such as bombs going off in the basement of the Trade towers.. Eye wittness accounts that could infact bring the offical story to its knees.. Thus it makes perfect sense to just let them Die off!
Dead men tell no tales!!!



I don't quite think they're bailing out individual friends, more the companies these friends work for, but yes there's no reason they cannot spare a few million to pay for the healthcare of any rescue worker. Of course, over here it is not a matter of having to pay, and hopefully you guys will end up with a similar system soon.

Is that so? If this is the case please provide me the links and facts that indeed the government is not Bailing out companies in their best intrest..
Give me some time here.. When I come back I will be more happy to lay out some links and facts about Individual friends they bailed out..

They are not helping companies that will not show them profit! They are sertinly helping out criminal friends.. And personal friends.. I can say that with 100% truth! Some may be family friends.. Mob connections.. Or just outright under the table friends.. But rest assured they are not bailing out people that will not return their profits 300%
They are looking out for their best intrests.. Not to save the system as they claim..
No thats a pack of lie after lie.. And if you belive that, well again its your right to belive that and I will not resort to befaulting you for the limited knowledge you have of this issue.. After all you do not live in the USA.. But in the UK.. And I can't sit here and claim to know it all either..

You where nice enough to come in here and debate with me.. So I sertinly don't want to make you feel unwelcomed.. Nor do I want to make you feel as if I would attack you for any thoughts you might add here..



Please don't fall into the trap of thinking I trust the US Government any more than I trust the average joe on the street. I do not



I will take that into consideration.. I really honestly do not want to put words in your mouth.. Or take what you say out of context.
Since you are like me in that sense, You don't trust them.. So why do you feel like they are being honest with you about all this?
Such as bailing out friends.. covering up 911..

If you don't trust them.. Why do you feel they are being honest? Or if thats not the right question, feel free to create your own question so IM not putting words into your mouth..

I just feel betrayed by my government.. I feel like they are telling lie after lie, and I can not belive a word they say..
Infact when they say something, I tend to belive the opposite.. And thats tuff on me.. As if they where to tell the truth at one time.. I wouldnt be able to tell the truth from the lies.. As thats part of the bigger plan..
To me they confuse the hell out of me... And I can never be sure what they are up too.. Or where they really stand..

To me my Goverment is the biggest Gang of them all.. They run drugs. They control all the smaller family mobs.. And have ties to the vatican..
Which I belive is at the Top.. To me the Vatican is the head of the USA government.. But thats really not what this thread is about.. So I will leave it at that.. But so many false deals, and empty promises leaves a person like me with more questions than answers..


So to end this post. I want to thank you again for having the courage to debate me on this issue.. And I want everyone to take in what he has said.. And if you wish to debate him aswell.. Please keep in mind, he could have very well NOT posted..
It does take a level of courage to come in and debate what Im talking about.

[edit on 10-7-2009 by zysin5]



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 05:10 PM
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Great thread! This needs as much attention as possible. These people risked their lives for their country and all they get is the title "hero". That still does not pay for their medical bills. There was asbestos in the building so these guys might have cancer and similar diseases.

My heart goes out to them.



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 07:08 PM
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Thank you for making this thread. As I to can say I DO not belive in most of the 911 "conspiracy theories".
The offical story is also a conspiracy theory aswell. Its just our governments version on the truth.

But in light of current times.. Our government is handing out power, and billions of dollars to wallstreet and beyond. Blank checks, Growth in power.
While the firefighters in NYC 2001, God Bless them all.. Died that fateful day.
And now those with the power to help, are battling it out in court?
It really hurts to start to see the truth.. I guess thats why most people like me fight it so much..
But I can not deny this story and this thread.. Very well put together..
Leads me to ask many quesitons about 911 all over again..



posted on Jul, 10 2009 @ 09:06 PM
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Greetings Seaside..
IM glad this information has brought you to a point where it leads you to make up your own mind on whats right.. Not allowing the government to give you the final all said answers.



Originally posted by Seaside
I guess thats why most people like me fight it so much..


I can say at one time we all have truths we never want to face.. And subconsiously we lie to ourselfs just to make our own personal lives more comfortable. Yet after 911 that was the staw that broke the back..
I woke up.. And from that time I really started looking into things on a much deeper level..



But I can not deny this story and this thread.. Very well put together..
Leads me to ask many quesitons about 911 all over again..


If you don't mind me asking.. What other questions do you have now? I would be more than happy to see if I can not point you in the right direction. There are many great threads about 911..
I just felt this topic was the urgent topic right now, as these people still need are help reguardless of who done it..



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 12:04 AM
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Originally posted by exponent
I don't quite think they're bailing out individual friends, more the companies these friends work for, but yes there's no reason they cannot spare a few million to pay for the healthcare of any rescue worker. Of course, over here it is not a matter of having to pay, and hopefully you guys will end up with a similar system soon.


Hello again Exponent.. I wanted to address this part of your post.. As I said I would come back with some information to help clear this up..
If you don't quite think they are Bailing out friends.. Just listen to what Ron Paul has to say about the Fed.


I honestly think the Fed should be footing the bill for Each firefighter who got sick from working at ground Zero..
100% funding for these men and women.. Plus I would like to see them get bounus for all their hard work..

I would be proud if they got half the bounus that was given to those who failed to do their Jobs in AIG!!! And other places who got FAT checks and bounus money!

Here are some links and souce material for you.. As promised..

Note another thing that the bailouts represent: special privilege to particular market players to protect them from failure. This isolates these firms from the market forces, such that they remain afloat whether they do good or bad at satisfying consumer wants. Resources cannot be reallocated from what have been revealed as useless projects to more urgent ones, again, as determined by the consumers. The government is channeling the money into uneconomic uses.

Bailouts as Privilege (source link)

Elliot's Mess: Spitzer Investigation Tied To Fed Bail Out

This week, Bernanke's Fed, for the first time in its history, loaned a selected coterie of banks one-fifth of a trillion dollars to guarantee these banks' mortgage-backed junk bonds. The deluge of public loot was an eye-popping windfall to the very banking predators who have brought two million families to the brink of foreclosure.

Source link

And now for the crowning Gem of this Post.. Overview.. Might make you sick..


The Cost to Taxpayers and the Bailout Type

$ 700 billion+ - Proposed Treasury Department legislation
$ 29 billion - Bear Stearns financing
$ 200 billion - Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac nationalization
$ 85 billion - AIG loan and nationalization
$ 300 billion - Federal Housing Administration housing rescue bill
$4 billion - Mortgage community grants
$87 billion - JPMorgan Chase repayments
$200 billion+ - Loans to banks via Fed’s Term Auction Facility
$ 50 billion - Loans from Depression-era Exchange Stabilization Fund
$144 billion - Purchases of mortgage securities by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac

TOTAL: $1.8 trillion+
COST PER US HOUSHOLD: $17,064+

The members of the Federal Reserve Board have essentially been bailing out their friends in private business enterprises that pay their employees exorbitant salaries while lowering the value of assets held by ordinary people (via higher inflation) and increasing the tax burden that Americans, their children and grandchildren will need to pay sometime in the future to compensate for the worthless mortgage-backed assets now held by the Fed.


Source Link

All those companies are tied together, and if not All of them are buddies behind closed doors.. And they all are looking out for themselfs..

Now you don't think the Fed or our government couldn't cough up atleast 100 or 500 millioin for these firefighters?
Thats a drop in a bucket when compared to the TRILLIONS!


[edit on 11-7-2009 by zysin5]



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 12:08 AM
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Thier wa a documentary on HBO last year, about this. If i rememebr correctly..thier was a 53 million dollar fund set aside for those workers...and at leat in the documentary, NOT ONE honorable person who caim to aid 9/11 had access to that money. They were ed tpaed i guess is the word im looking for, ripped off. Was it Pataki the governor of NY then?



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 12:23 AM
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Originally posted by ziggy1706
Thier wa a documentary on HBO last year, about this. If i rememebr correctly..thier was a 53 million dollar fund set aside for those workers...and at leat in the documentary, NOT ONE honorable person who caim to aid 9/11 had access to that money. They were ed tpaed i guess is the word im looking for, ripped off. Was it Pataki the governor of NY then?


Hi Ziggy! Thanks for the info there.. I did not see that documentary on HBO.. If you can dig up any clips that would be wonderful!!

Yeah all the money that was suppose to go to families and workers somehow ended up just gone!!! Much of the money collected via the number you could call afterwards just magically disapeared aswell..
Not every last bit.. But enough to make it reek to high heavens..

I will also have to look into who was mayor at the time Rudy or Pataki..

Either one of them I do not care for.. They are both Fear mongers.. And try to take the glory when they have earned NO such glory.

Or even be called Heros...


But anything you can dig up and add here would be great!! Links, videos, sources.. Any documentry or something you might think might help this thread along with some valid info on said topic..



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 12:32 AM
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I want to make this post seperate of the one above.. This should be said twice and shown just how much has been spent before funding 911 workers..

Lets take another look shall we? Mind you this is not everything.. This is only an overview of past spent monies..
More Bail outs are on the way as I type this out...


$ 700 billion+ - Proposed Treasury Department legislation
$ 29 billion - Bear Stearns financing
$ 200 billion - Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac nationalization
$ 85 billion - AIG loan and nationalization
$ 300 billion - Federal Housing Administration housing rescue bill
$4 billion - Mortgage community grants
$87 billion - JPMorgan Chase repayments
$200 billion+ - Loans to banks via Fed’s Term Auction Facility
$ 50 billion - Loans from Depression-era Exchange Stabilization Fund
$144 billion - Purchases of mortgage securities by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac

TOTAL: $1.8 trillion+
COST PER US HOUSHOLD: $17,064+


Sickening huh? 17 Grand per house hold..
For criminals!! For fraudster...
And our so called heros Don't even see 1% of all this...

That right there says sooo damn much that I really don't have to add much more to this part..

It speaks for itself.

I for one feel some of this money needs to go to them right away.. No courts no arguing!
That way if the government has nothing to hide.. Keep these guys alive so they can tell their tales of 911 and open our eyes..

Right now they can not travel and speak to large groups of people in there medical condition.


[edit on 11-7-2009 by zysin5]



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 08:14 PM
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I don't mean to sound jaded or like I need the points or flag points.. But really people.. These are the very people who gave life and limb.. To save the people they could save on 911..

And all the truthers on this site.. I only get a very limited reaction from you guys..
(While at the same time, I know Im not the first person on ATS to bring this up.) But I am the first person on ATS who linked Bail outs, and 911 rescue workers together in the same idea..
I just thought that would lite a fire under some of your butts!

That facts and thoughts like these can sit on the side lines while you all hash it out over stuff No one can proove 100% without a doubt..

Would you rather claim you are trying to uncover the truth.. While on the same hand totally ingoring the facts presented in this Thread?

I will be happy if 20 people will have agree enough to flag this thread.

But I guess there are more important flags concerning 911 other than firefighters well being, and knowledge of what is going on..
(Yet I will give this some more time, to see if I can hit my goal of 20 flags.)

I mean if my thread is a pack of lies.. Please let me know what I posted that was incorrect!!
As I can't spead the word alone.. I really do NEED your help in this effort..

I don't want to sound like IM personally mad at anyone.. It just upsets me a little bit that these facts are falling at the wayside..

Yet those that did take the time.. You have my honest thanks! To those who flagged this and didn't post you have my thanks..

Yet if you came in here and just passed these people up and you call yourself a truth seeker.. Shame on you!!

You must live the work you do.. otherwise it does no good to claim you are a truth seeker.. And pass up GEMS like this!!!

Again Im not even wanting credit for anything here! I just put the facts together so more people could learn if they don't already know..

Its these people I care for.. And its the knowledge getting passed about is what is important to me!!!

So I will bump this thread one more time tonight.. and if that doesnt help.. Well I will just have to live with it. But atleast I know in my heart I tried here on ATS.. There are other places for me to spread the word aswell..

(Im going to try sending out u2 mails to those on my friends list to see if that will help get a better reaction.. Tho granted I do not like to spam, or send out mass mails, but its looks like the only way Im going to get the word out.) So if you got a U2 from me about this thread.. It was not spam, and I hand wrote each letter to reflect upon the person I sent it too


So Im not downing anyone.. Or letting my temper get the best of me..
I just gave it the best effort..

And thought since all this money is going out to Bail out Them.. IT would make more sense in light of all that happened..

To many threads about how it happened.. And not enough threads about the people its been effecting.. Lets work on something we can change. Something we can do something about!
Be it our time, our wishes, or just spreading the word to those who might have some real power to help!!

[edit on 12-7-2009 by zysin5]



posted on Jul, 11 2009 @ 11:26 PM
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Conspiracy debate or not, we need to help the people that help us. First responders don't deserve to be left behind, and leaving them behind sends a message that it is not o.k. IMHO.

You want to see more angry cops with tazer threads?
Don't help 1st responders.
You want the firefighter to think about running into that burning house?
Don't help 1st responders.
You want full emergency rooms 24/7?
Don't help 1st responders.

What kind of message does the Obama administration want to send to the citizens of the US and the rest of the world?



posted on Jul, 13 2009 @ 02:50 PM
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Why don't they ask us on our tax forms at tax time if we'd like $1.00 to go to a 911 rescue responder's trust fund of some sort? This seems like the least that could be done from Washington doesn't it?



posted on Jul, 13 2009 @ 04:02 PM
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You have my support.

Imagine all those people dedicated to saving lives dying from asbestus and other chemicals which they breathed while cleaning up after the giggling elite. They will get what´s coming to them, I promise you that.

S+F, Thanks for reminding us all of the injustice.

T4H



posted on Jul, 13 2009 @ 07:11 PM
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Originally posted by Truth4hire
You have my support.
S+F, Thanks for reminding us all of the injustice.

T4H


Thanks Truth4hire! Aswell as the others who came in to lend a hand and support while I was away..

I have beat my head into a stone wall when trying to talk about 911 events. Trying to get others to understand the injustice to 911..
Yet with all my energy.. I can not get "through" to some people..
They right me off as a loon.. Or as some "truther".

Which I am a truther.. But I have learned over the past 6 years to keep to just the facts.
No one is going to agree 100% on all these theories we have out.

So with alot of thought I came up with this thread.. In hopes it would prove just one injustice that is out there..
1 Card in the house of cards that might bring it all crashing down.

Im pleased with everyone in here.. And the questions from skeptics..

Reguardless this is one injustice that needs to be exposed and well known when you talk 911 conspiracy theory.



posted on Jul, 14 2009 @ 01:15 AM
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Originally posted by plainmike
Why don't they ask us on our tax forms at tax time if we'd like $1.00 to go to a 911 rescue responder's trust fund of some sort? This seems like the least that could be done from Washington doesn't it?


Plainmike! Wow man! Thats simple yet very great idea! That would atleast give us a choice to say yes we would like to offer up 1$ out of our taxes to go to this fund..

Yet sadly enough.. Somewhere down the line.. That 1$ would turn into 25 cents.. The other 75 Cents would end up going right into the pockets of the elite..

Where did the 911 fund go to anyway? So much money was gathered by red cross and helpful american people..
Yet somehow most all that money just went "poof"..
And I only saw a family guy cartoon that questioned that..

Yet no real questions in real life.. People joke about it.. Yet when it comes down to really getting any answers.. WE are given like 30000 page reports that bore people to death, and you can not get through all the BS!!!

Its a shame.. And as good of an idea that it is.. Its never that simple..
Why couldn't it just be that simple.. I honestly wish it was..

But Rep Tape is brought out.. pages of pages of none sense words strung together to put us all even further asleep..
And in the end its our fault for letting them put us to sleep...
Yet theres not enough of us who stand together to do anything about it.

Truthers are divided into so many factions..
Makes me think its all part of the master plan..



posted on Jul, 15 2009 @ 06:41 PM
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Just a quick video I think everyone should watch..



posted on Jul, 15 2009 @ 06:57 PM
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Another short video to watch.. And why they want these people dead..
Dead men tell no tale.. NOr can dead men be in court when eye wittness are needed when all this comes out!


Sadly by the time this gets to court.. Most of these men will be dead...
A God damn shame..
So many will just ignore this thread becasue well.. I guess it doesnt fit into your debunking agenda..
I have 1 brave skeptic come in here.. And that was the only one with the balls to face up to the truths here..


NYFD Firefighters say they heard explosions and believe the towers were brought down by high-explosives. Radio recordings show the NYFD Firefighters say they heard explosions and believe the towers were brought down by high-explosives. Radio recordings show the firefighters in the towers saying there were only two small pockets of fire and should be able to knock it out with two lines. But then the buildings came down...it wasn't the small fires in the towers, it was high-explosives!
FireEngineering Magazine says there is no way that jet fuel brought down the towers, and to stop hauling away the debris at the crime scene!






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