Record low temperatures in 46 states during June

Originally posted by Gamma MO
I work for a company that makes raw materials to make freon for air conditioners. Our sales are down about 65% this year.

To all members of the church of AGW: It's the Sun, Stupid!

I've actually had people tell me the sun has minimal to no impact on our global climate.

Come to south Texas...we are in the middle of a many year drought.
The temp has been in to 100s in June, which is not common.

Weather Service

With only 1 day left this June... June 2009 is so far the
2nd warmest June at Austin Mabry... the 8th warmest at
Austin Bergstrom... the 5th warmest June at del Rio... and a tie
for the 3rd warmest June at San Antonio with June 1998.

...

Other records that are rare events... for June 2009 from June 20th to
June 29th... Austin Mabry and Austin Bergstrom had 10 100 degree days
in a row. Prior to this year... this broke the old records of 6 in a
row during June at Austin Bergstrom in June 1953... and the record of
8 in a row at Austin Mabry... in June 1925. San Antonio has had 6
100 degree days in a row from June 24 to 29... just short of the
record 8 days in a row in June 1990. For the month of June...
San Antonio has had 12 overall 100 degree days in June... a record
for the month of June. The old record was 11 days in June 1990.

Originally posted by Essan
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

 

Climate is more than just specific temps on one day in one place.

Anyway

Hottest June on record in Houston

Hottest June since 1951 in Beijing

Highest temperature since July 2006 in Britain

Heatwave sparks protests in Delhi

Heatwave blasts through China

In the USA Central heatwave blamed for at least 4 deaths

Many die in acute Indian heatwave

Heatwave devastates remote Nepal regions

Hottest temperatures ever recorded in Southern Florida

I could go on. But hopefully you get the point. Some places have bene cold. Some places have been hot. As has been the case every year in history. It all proves nothing except that we get weather.

What matters if whether there is any multi-decadal trend toward more frequent/regulat cold or warm periods. One month means b*gger all. One year means b*ggger all. One dacade means we maybe start to wonder.

I had my coldest June day on record. But the month as a whole was above average. And just into July had had my second warmest night on record.

But it means nothing in terms of climate.

[edit on 6-7-2009 by Essan]

Yeah, but even then, we're breaking records set in the 18 and 1900's, at least here in Utah. Things may or may not be getting warmer, as it is hard for your laymen to determine with all the misinformation storming down our walls from both sides, but I know for a fact that every time I watch the morning news to catch the weather, they list the high/low records and they range anywhere from 1899-1980's. The weather has and always will change drastically. I myself am not informed enough to make an opinion (thanks idiots from both sides) but I do know that the records we're breaking stem from over 100 years ago, and that was just in the infantcy of the industrial era.

Originally posted by brokenheadphonez
Yup, the Earth is cooling...

Second line..


Mod Edit -Mod Note: One Line Post – Please Review This Link.



[edit on 6-7-2009 by elevatedone]

I just now read the currant issue of SKY AND TELESCOPE and there was a second article about how many astromenors worry that there are to be very very few sunspots, now and during the 2012 max, of them.

the article is about how they find a correlation between few sunspots and a global cooling. the little ice age was during that time when there was no spots, in about ???? 1500, and lasted for 150 years!

they write how sunspots acually give the sun a warmer heat output.

their graph shows that there is a one-to-one correlation between few spots and colder weather.

"colder" as in a cold summer and a cold winter!

the Month of May, gets stuck and never goes away and then august comes and the frost arrives. soon, maybe, snows do not melt at all in the labrador highlands! one winter's snow is added to the next season's snow.
[you all know where *that* will lead to!]




yes, when the crowd says "yes", i run the other way, NOW is a good time to buy that wood stove and warm clothes and learn to love potatoes, cabbage, and other cold climate garden crops; I would imagine, as if this
solar max time of 2012 produces few spots, we all will have a colder earth until we each and all die of old age!

the *new* Normal: 5 to 40 degrees colder, all over the earth, perhaps!!

Maybe I am a bit into "over-reaction' mode, but if the sun spot season fails to produce, I predict that the word "global warming" will go into that same dustbin of words where the words, "real estate boom" went!

freestone

reply to post by freestonew


Haha.

You live in Florida. I'm sure you'll make it out just fine there, guy.

Originally posted by drwizardphd
...........................
There are more than twice as many record high temperatures recorded than record lows. 691 record highs for the month of June '09, 307 record lows for the month of June '09. OP you shouldn't have posted the NOAA site, it directly contradicts your "claims".

Face it, the planet is heating up. I, personally, don't think its entirely due to anthropogenic causes, as this is a cycle that is repeated every 1500 years or so. But to deny that it's happening is outright ignorant.

It's easy to only report half of the story, to enforce your point. But it is disgraceful, and eventually someone will call you on your bull#.

Wow.... Tell us, exactly what do you think you proved with that?.... Seriously IT IS SUMMER, with the oceans still having stored extra heat from the high activity of the Sun during the 20th century, and the first few years of the 21st century, plus the fact that the magnetic field of Earth has been very erratic, and there have been breaches in it which scientists didn't think could form the way they did, of course there will be hot regions, more so if they are close to the oceans, and don't tell me, those countries close to the Equator are even hotter than the ones to the north...

If there was overall warming THERE WOULD BE NO RECORDS LOW FOR JUNE.....

This is what Climate Change does, you get both cold, and hot temperatures all over the world, and the trend seems to be towards cooling, more so since the Sun's activity has been LOW, and the last time that the overall activity of the Sun was this low was a century or more ago.

If the Sun's activity continues the way it has been going, and as i have been saying for a while now, after the extra heat stored in the oceans is gone, we will find ourselves possibly in a new LIA, unless solar activity picks up....

[edit on 7-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Originally posted by Essan
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

 

Climate is more than just specific temps on one day in one place.

Anyway

Hottest June on record in Houston

Hottest June since 1951 in Beijing

Highest temperature since July 2006 in Britain

Heatwave sparks protests in Delhi

Heatwave blasts through China

In the USA Central heatwave blamed for at least 4 deaths

Many die in acute Indian heatwave

Heatwave devastates remote Nepal regions

Hottest temperatures ever recorded in Southern Florida

I could go on. But hopefully you get the point. Some places have bene cold. Some places have been hot. As has been the case every year in history. It all proves nothing except that we get weather.

What matters if whether there is any multi-decadal trend toward more frequent/regulat cold or warm periods. One month means b*gger all. One year means b*ggger all. One dacade means we maybe start to wonder.

I had my coldest June day on record. But the month as a whole was above average. And just into July had had my second warmest night on record.

But it means nothing in terms of climate.

[edit on 6-7-2009 by Essan]

the majority of the locations that experienced the heat wave had it last only about a week before the leveled off and went back to cooler temps...

The sudden spike and sudden decline make this even more odd...

haha interesting ....flagged

Originally posted by Kevin_X2
erm... i specifically stated that your wrong, and that global warmings wrong too. You think a fraction of a fraction of a percentage of the total CO2 in the atmosphere has anything to do with a 1% temperature fluctuation over the past 150 years... in comparrisson to the massive natural temperature fluctuation that has occurred over the past millions of years in a fraction of the time that this 1% change has occurred?

For crying out loud if you want to pass as being "partly intelligent" learn how to spell please...

Anyway, as I am sure I have explained several times already, if we were undergoing WARMING, we shouldn't be seeing RECORD LOWS...

Not to mention the fact that winter has lasted longer, mostly on the northern hemisphere.

Originally posted by Kevin_X2
The planet will heat and cool sparatically with an extremely general trend: general being over hundreds or thousands of years depending on the shift. Just because this year is colder doesn't mean next year wont make up for it in spades with more heat. You have given no evidence to back your claims besides saying how chilly the states has been lately.

BS, there have been Climate Changes that have occurred within a decade, and even in a few years in the past. There is not such thing as your half baked claim that "the climate will cool and heat SPORADICALLY with an extremely general trend of over hundreds of thousands of years depending on the shift"... In the past 15,000 years the climate has changed about 30-40 times at least...

Originally posted by Kevin_X2
Oh, yes. your a genius. mystery solved! you know exactly which direction this planet is moving in... you should write a book.

Did i say anywhere in my OP I knew exactly in which direction the climate was moving?.....

I have said it several times in the past, it all depends mainly on what the Sun's activity will be, but it also depends on Earth's magnetic field, and it also depends on whether we are entering a new region of the LIC (Local Interstellar Cloud) which could very well be the reason for all the Climate Changes that all other planets, and even Moons with an atmosphere in our Solar System have been experiencing...

I posted the fact that there are RECORD LOWS, which if there was actually any WARMING, there shouldn't be any RECORD LOWS, but hey, I can spell it out for you if you want.

Originally posted by Kevin_X2
honestly, just stop trying. your embarrassing my species.

You are actually part of a species? Damn, I feel sorry for them...

You can once again put both feet in your mouth now.




[edit on 7-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Originally posted by Kevin_X2
i dont think one summer, or one part of the world, justifies deeming our world a "cooling" planet. In fact, i dont think any number of temperature readings short of a thousand years should determine any fluctuation in temperature.

we know nothing, and assume everything. Which makes an @ss out of you and me

I'm in Cape Town, South Africa and I'm experiencing my coldest winter ever (I'm 41). I'm sure I read somewhere that record low temps could also somehow be attributed to "Global warming". Maybe it should be called "Global temperature fluctuations".

www.space.com...

The Sun Has Spots, Finally

Originally posted by Essan
......
I could go on. But hopefully you get the point. Some places have bene cold. Some places have been hot. As has been the case every year in history. It all proves nothing except that we get weather.

Which points to NATURAL Climate Change, and not to WARMING from CO2.

That's what it proves. But hey Essan, we know you love to pay taxes over a hoax, so pay for everyone's taxes since you are so willing.

Originally posted by Essan
What matters if whether there is any multi-decadal trend toward more frequent/regulat cold or warm periods. One month means b*gger all. One year means b*ggger all. One dacade means we maybe start to wonder.

Some people keep claiming this except for the fact that Climate Change has occurred in the past WITHIN A FEW YEARS.

Let me show you an example.

Originally published in Science Express on 19 June 2008
Science 1 August 2008:
Vol. 321. no. 5889, pp. 680 - 684
DOI: 10.1126/science.1157707
Prev | Table of Contents | Next

Reports
High-Resolution Greenland Ice Core Data Show Abrupt Climate Change Happens in Few Years
Jørgen Peder Steffensen,1* Katrine K. Andersen,1 Matthias Bigler,1,2 Henrik B. Clausen,1 Dorthe Dahl-Jensen,1 Hubertus Fischer,2,3 Kumiko Goto-Azuma,4 Margareta Hansson,5 Sigfús J. Johnsen,1 Jean Jouzel,6 Valérie Masson-Delmotte,6 Trevor Popp,7 Sune O. Rasmussen,1 Regine Röthlisberger,2,8 Urs Ruth,3 Bernhard Stauffer,2 Marie-Louise Siggaard-Andersen,1 Árn E. Sveinbjörnsdóttir,9 Anders Svensson,1 James W. C. White7

The last two abrupt warmings at the onset of our present warm interglacial period, interrupted by the Younger Dryas cooling event, were investigated at high temporal resolution from the North Greenland Ice Core Project ice core. The deuterium excess, a proxy of Greenland precipitation moisture source, switched mode within 1 to 3 years over these transitions and initiated a more gradual change (over 50 years) of the Greenland air temperature, as recorded by stable water isotopes. The onsets of both abrupt Greenland warmings were slightly preceded by decreasing Greenland dust deposition, reflecting the wetting of Asian deserts. A northern shift of the Intertropical Convergence Zone could be the trigger of these abrupt shifts of Northern Hemisphere atmospheric circulation, resulting in changes of 2 to 4 kelvin in Greenland moisture source temperature from one year to the next.

www.sciencemag.org...

You should know this by now, since I have posted other excerpts, and links which show the fact that Abrupt Climate Change can occur within a few years...

Originally posted by Essan
I had my coldest June day on record. But the month as a whole was above average. And just into July had had my second warmest night on record.

But it means nothing in terms of climate.

IF CO2 was to blame for the WARMING, then we shouldn't see any COOLING. How hard is that to understand?

Last year several countries around the world experienced the worse winter in decades up to being the worse winter in 100 years in China. The year 2007 was similar. Such wild swings in temperatures indicates NATURAL causes, and not CO2 as being the main cause, or even being a mayor cause.

There is no proof what-so-ever that CO2 causes the warming claimed by the Anthropogenic Global Warming, or Global Warming crowd. That is unless you want to believe flawed computer models which have been shown to be wrong time and again.



[edit on 7-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

reply to post by Lannock


Thanks for the input Lannock. Now we know that at least some parts in South Africa are also experiencing COOLING, and not WARMING.

In which part of South Africa are you if i may ask?

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
www.space.com...

The Sun Has Spots, Finally

Thanks for the link Stormdancer. However, remember that even during the LIA (Little Ice Age) there were SOME Sunspots.

Low solar activity doesn't mean the Sun will have no Sunspots, or CMEs. It just means it has much fewer sunspots, which is exactly what has been occurring until now.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
reply to post by Lannock

 

Thanks for the input Lannock. Now we know that at least some parts in South Africa are also experiencing COOLING, and not WARMING.

In which part of South Africa are you if i may ask?

You don't know where Cape Town is? Bottom left corner of Africa. We have a Mediterranean climate (winter rains, no snow). We have reports from all over of snow on the mountains (rare in SA). I also have to add that last summer was reasonably cool on average.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

IF CO2 was to blame for the WARMING, then we shouldn't see any COOLING. How hard is that to understand?

That would only be the case if there was absolutely no natural variation in climate and every year, everywhere on the planet, were the same - with CO2 then adding warming.

Increased CO2 may be contributing to an underlying warming trend, but that in no why whatsoever precludes natural variation leading to short periods of cooling within the longer term warming trend - as indeed we've seen to be the case over the past 150 years.

Low solar activity or other natural factors may well mask and even appear to reverse the warming trend.

The idea promoted by AGW deniers - that increased CO2 means year on year increases in temp regardless of natural variation - is the biggest, stupidest, straw man there is. And simply evidence IMO of their desperation to 'prove' that humans can do whatever they want without consequence because God said so and how dare science suggest otherwise.

Meanwhile, I'd be more concerned about precipitaton changes than temperature. It's not the cold that's causing serious grain production shortages in Canada and Argentina, for example.




[edit on 7-7-2009 by Essan]

Originally posted by Essan
Increased CO2 may be contributing to an underlying warming trend, but that in no why whatsoever precludes natural variation leading to short periods of cooling within the longer term warming trend - as indeed we've seen to be the case over the past 150 years.

I'm glad to see we've finally got you guys admitting natural variation can override CO2 for at least short term trends. Thanks for the helping hand mother nature. Keep up the good work.

So...if we are agreed Mom can be the main driver of climate in a short term trend, why then are we to believe she can't drive climate for longer trends?

See, cause the way I heard the CO2-is-the-main-driver tale, the heat bounces off the earth. It's grabbed by CO2, then re-emitted. This you - and by you I mean anybody using the word "denier - tell us is why the globe must get steadily warmer with rising emissions of CO2. What's puzzling about that is if it were true, wouldn't it be as true for a 10 year trend, as it would be for a 100 year one?

I heard this kooky explanation for that. It went something like the heat's still there, it's just hiding. Problem is, they can't find it. They say it's hiding, but they don't know where it's hiding. They tried to say it was playing peekaboo in the oceans at first, and that sounded pretty good until some skeptic said, "prove it".

Here's a couple of interesting graphs...




(The rising green line in the one above is CO2. The dashed blue line is the cooling trend)



(See that thick black horizontal line in the middle of the graph above? Do you see where it starts? Do you see where it ends?)











[edit on 7-7-2009 by Ntity]

[edit on 7-7-2009 by Ntity]

[edit on 7-7-2009 by Ntity]

[edit on 7-7-2009 by Ntity]

[edit on 7-7-2009 by Ntity]

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by drwizardphd
...........................
There are more than twice as many record high temperatures recorded than record lows. 691 record highs for the month of June '09, 307 record lows for the month of June '09. OP you shouldn't have posted the NOAA site, it directly contradicts your "claims".

Wow.... Tell us, exactly what do you think you proved with that?.... Seriously IT IS SUMMER, with the oceans still having stored extra heat from the high activity of the Sun during the 20th century, and the first few years of the 21st century, plus the fact that the magnetic field of Earth has been very erratic, and there have been breaches in it which scientists didn't think could form the way they did, of course there will be hot regions, more so if they are close to the oceans, and don't tell me, those countries close to the Equator are even hotter than the ones to the north...

I re-posted what I originally quoted, because if you can't see what that proves then you probably drive around at night with sunglasses on...

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
If there was overall warming THERE WOULD BE NO RECORDS LOW FOR JUNE.....

I don't mean this offensively at all, because I expect you must be more intelligent than that. You can't possibly be that stupid.

All of the temperature records are from June. Try to think about this:

If all of the temperature data comes from June, then when June of '09 beats June of '08 (for example), then June of '09 is obviously getting hotter in that area. If June of '09 is colder than June of '08, then it is obviously getting colder in that area. Therefore, if twice as many places are hotter in June of '09 than were colder, then twice as many places are getting hotter. This is the definition of warming. More locations are growing warmer (again, all in June) than are growing colder.

2+2=4

This is very simple logic. I'm sure a 4th grader could follow it.


Take a look at the data again. You posted it yourself, you might as well make yourself familiar with it before you say anything else quite so foolish.

I have already stated that climate change is a natural cycle that has happened thousands of times before in earth's history. To deny that it is happening is outright ridiculous. I will say it again, the planet is warming. The data that you posted proves it conclusively.

It's almost laughable how ignorant some of you can be. You post data claiming one thing, say it claims something else, and then when I call you out on it, you claim I've proved nothing. Even though that exact same data was used by you and the article in your OP to try and contradict warming trends.

reply to post by Essan


Essan.

My respect first of all.

I'd like you to answer a question from a different perspective that doesn't necessarily involve "climate change." I am curious considering your comment about the grain shortages in Argentina and Canada. As we're experiencing an exponential growth of human beings, rivaled by the exponential needs of those human beings, do you think there is a chance that the "shortages" aren't caused by drought, but by strained natural water and land features? If you increase the amount of output, you increase the amount of input. Input being irrigated water and such...

Anywhere is bound to have droughts, and the drought is going to cause more monetary loss because of the amount of soybean, corn, and grain they produce for the U.S. and whatnot creating more hysteria on their front and ours. While looking around, I found this article headlined

Worst Argentine Drought Since ’61 Cuts Soybean Crop

Nothing significant happened in 1961 except for the gradual increase of man made Co2. So after 50 years of carbon build up, why wouldn't that area be more heavily affected without the gap of 50 year "normality."

Also, from my own area, we were in a terrible drought from 1998-99 to 2004-05, and currently our watershed/basin levels are around 150%.

I'm all for cleaning up our act as a populace, as a species, really, but with the weather having such wild variables, is it safe to say whether or not we're causing this? Is the supposed "sporadic" nature of global warming literally - just the way of the world?

reply to post by DeadFlagBlues


Yep, natural extremes occur and we make ourselves ever more vulnerable to them. Hurricane tidal surges cause more damage because we chop down the mangrove swamps that used to protect the coast line. And we build more houses in low lying areas where hurricanes may land.

We use/waste more and more water for washing, drinking etc and thus make any natural drought even worse. Here in the UK, SE England needs at least it's average rainfall every single year just to keep up with demand - even a small shortfall in rain leads to shortages. That's nothing to do with climate change.

However, I do personally believe that human activities, especially deforestation, have, are and will continue to affect rainfall patterns and that that is a more serious issue than any small long term temperature rise. Whether that's the cause of droughts in Argentina, Texas and Canada I couldn't say. Although NASA studies (admittedly using a nasty computer model) have suggested chopping down the Amazon rain forest affects rainfall from North America to Arabia!

Source

deforestation of Amazonia was found to severely reduce rainfall in the Gulf of Mexico, Texas, and northern Mexico during the spring and summer seasons when water is crucial for agricultural productivity. Deforestation of Central Africa has a similar effect, causing a significant precipitation decrease in the lower U.S Midwest during the spring and summer and in the upper U.S. Midwest in winter and spring. Deforestation in Southeast Asia alters rainfall in China and the Balkan Peninsula most significantly

Also, a new study highlighted by AGW Skeptic Roger Pielke Sr

Cultivation changed monsoon in Asia

offers more evidence of the possible impact human activities have on rainfall patterns.

On a smaller level, even urbanisations can affect rainfall to a some extent.