reply to post by rogerstigers
Well, it was at one time a life long dream of mine to create actual intelligence. Not artificial intelligence which gives the illusion and appearance
of intelligence, but actual intelligence capable of coming up with it's own logic.
Please realize I am not talking about AI in the sense of artifical. I can program things which appear intelligent. AI will do many wonderful
things, drive cars, order groceries and so on. But they will forever be subject to the
logic given to it by the program. They appear
intelligent because they work off the logic I've given it. And they carry that out with 100% perfection - assuming my logic is solid. The reason
for this is because they do not have free will. They have no choice but to follow the logic given to it, just as
all things in this universe
do.
I came to realize after much planning and personal debate, that such is not possible. At all. There are 2 domains here. There is that which is
logic/creation/physical and then there is consciousness. I see this as - what is flesh is flesh, and what is spirit is spirit. Without the
scientist being there to observe and understand, there is no science.
It's really hard to explain. I literally spent years thinking about these things before coming to the understanding I have today. Please bear with
me - I will be rambling a bit.
So, let's define what I feel is "intelligence".
Intelligence means that the being is able to come up with and create logic on it's own. Not just using logic, but actually being able to create
that logic, and understand what is being done. Basically, it needs to be able to do what we do in programs.
This does not mean it is able to create code based on the logic given to it. I do this all the time.
I came to the conclusion that in order to have intelligence, we come to certain requirements.
It has to have free will. If it doesn't have free will, then it's not choosing and it's not intelligent. It is simply following out the patterns
given to it. If it is unable to make a choice, then it is unable to be intelligent.
Now, I can generate a pseudo random number, and then you know say if it's this value, then choose this, if it's that value, then choose that. But
that's a random choice, not a real choice. And you probably know, it's not really a random number either, it is a predictable number. It is
random to us however, which suits our purposes, but not to a computer and not in reality.
So, I can make it appear and give the illusion of choice, but of I of course know that it did no such thing. I can put 6 billion of these things
in a room, and you know the chances are pretty high that at least some of the population will make what appears to be intelligent choices. And some
of them will make dumb choices. We see this in humans. This is a far step from creating logic, but in this way I could easily fool you into
thinking they were intelligent. Just an illusion however.
Now, in order to have free will, it means that there must be
no limits on it. Each and every time you give it a limit on what is possible,
then you have by default denied free will. The expression, do the train tracks free the train or enslave it? Neither! They provide the illusion
of freedom, and should the train ever decide to leave those tracks, he will quickly realize it.
However. Part of free will is the ability to give it away. Again, this must be a choice - even if not realized. And there are very legitimate
reasons for intelligence to do this. Because by doing this, you create experiences. "What if's". AKA Logic. What is a logic and programming
but a bunch of if this, then do that, and while this, do that. What is the universe and create itself but a bunch of loops and laws of logic? So
for an experience we might propose "what if".
I'll use poker for an example of subconsciously giving away free will for an experience. In order to play the game of poker, you must submit
yourself to the rules of the game. Nothing physically stops you from turning the cards face up and seeing how the hand will play. But if you do
that, and don't submit to the rules then the game can not exist. Everyone would know the outcome and only bet when they had the winning hand. No
game. So we purposely give away our free will in order for the experience. Keep this in mind.
Acceptance vs Understanding. Or as Einstein said - any fool can know, the point is to understand.
This can best be explained with math. I can tell a man 1+1=2. That man can accept that is true. But unless he knows how to add, he does not
understand. I'm sure you can see the difference between the 2.
So how do you program understanding and how to understand, when the understanding itself is the logic that creates the program?
I'm going to stop here as far as the "AI" goes, I can go on if you'd like to continue the discussion. I realize I ramble a bit, it's extremely
difficult to talk about, and express these things. So let me know if we get anywhere close to the same way of thinking.
In the end, I came to realize that the only way for the program to get consciousness is if I added my consciousness to it. You can not program
feeling, you can not program what it means "to be", it does not have a soul/consciousness (btw, when you read "soul" in the bible, it is talking
about consciousness). Of course, I also came to realize I would be doing that which was already done.
Write a program, and it's just a bunch of patterns repeating over and over. It's like the AI of a video game. It does not come to life until
there is consciousness there to observe it. Even with sensors for the AI, they don't really "see".
And if consciousness is a part of this universe, then where is it? What are these magical chemicals that have consciousness in them? Electrical
signals mixed with certain elements = consciousness?
Your eyes collect light and that is converted to electrical signals. Those electrical signals travel to the back of the brain where they are
converted back into the image "you" see. To what/whom is that presented to? What is "you"? It's your soul/consciousness, and it is not of
this creation.
Or as the bible says, all things were created on the word(logic/program). And then spirit of the lord fills creation and brings it to
life(observer/consciousness). What is flesh is flesh(creation), and what is spirit is spirit(soul/consciousness). Your body comes from the dust
of the earth(creation), but you soul is part of god.
The war on god is a war on consciousness. Science ignores it and quantum physics is taboo because it talks of it. You are not of this creation, and
you are hated for it. Because the father is within you, you have choice and thus are not easily controllable like rockets and other things which
give those who control them power do. And this world revolves around manipulations which are designed to take that free will out of you, to turn you
into something that is pure action and reaction like the programs we create to do what they are told 100% of the time. They produce certain
events/action, and the people will react as they want. Like say an attack here, might lead to 2 wars etc. And choice becomes merely an illusion
among them.
Just think about it, what is "you" and what does it mean to actually be an observer and to understand. To be aware that you are aware, and you
will come to understand. Do not accept, understand.
