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ABUSE CRISIS: New Photos Show More Iraqi Prisoner Abuse in Abu Ghraib Prison

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posted on May, 6 2004 @ 08:01 AM
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Additional pictures have surfaced and were published in The Washington Post showing more abuse at Bachdad's Abu Ghraib prison. The article specified a CD-ROM circulating among troops with more than 1,000 such photos taken form the summer of 2003 through the winter of 2004.
 
www.CTV.ca According to The Post, the photos were taken by digital cameras and loaded onto compact discs, which circulated among soldiers in an Army Reserve unit based in Maryland. The pictures were seized by military investigators probing conditions at Abu Ghraib, a source close to the unit was quoted as telling the newspaper. Washington Post Article (free subscription required) Related Stories In Today's News Guardsman Probed for Iraq Naked Soldier Photos The head of a U.S. military police unit at Baghdad's Abu Ghraib prison is under investigation following charges he secretly photographed naked female American soldiers, officials said on Wednesday. Bush fails to convince skeptics US President George W. Bush's promise Wednesday to punish US military personnel involved in abusing Iraqi prisoners in Abu Ghraib prison, west of Baghdad, was received with skepticism in the Arab world. Media anger at prison scandal Several newspapers on Thursday point to the contrast between US words and US deeds. One dubs the US actions "a war crime". US daily publishes more shocking pics on abuse of Iraqi prisoners Pressure is growing on the United States over the abuse of Iraqi prisoners after the publication on Thursday of more pictures taken at the Abu Gharaib prison. This issue continues to get more and more ugly. As information about the number of pictures surface (over 1,000), we bring to wonder if this type of thing has always been going on. And only now, with digital cameras and the Internet, are people learning of these events. [Edited on 7-5-2004 by SkepticOverlord] [Edited on 10-5-2004 by SkepticOverlord]




posted on May, 6 2004 @ 08:06 AM
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I am not condoning the actions of our service members but something needs to be kept in perspective. I find the treatment of prisoners under US care repulsive, but keep in mind, this is how prisoners were treated by Arabs.

(edit)
Link below is to an image that may be disturbing to some.
www.tator.net...

I think the world soon forgets what happened not more than 8 months ago. Dare I mention more?

[Edited on 6-5-2004 by SkepticOverlord]



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 08:27 AM
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I am just waiting now for the confirmation of the alleged rapes of Iraqi girls and women by U.S. and Coalition soldiers. If such allegations are true, I wonder if this will become a repeat of the vietnam situation with half-arab, half american kids who will not be wanted in either countries.

this story and these pictures of abuse really makes me sick, and I don't think this is just an isolated incident. makes you wonder how many innocents were killed just because of some trigger happy soldiers...even more reason why this invasion of Iraq is just plain wrong.



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 08:44 AM
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I think the difference between the combat arms and the civil defense portion of the military are two completely different positions and they perform their jobs differently. We are seeing pictures of the civil defense portion, the MP's. Combat Arms, infantry/armor/et al, are a bit more professional. Want the reasoning why? MP's are projected into a position of perceived power and they like to flex that muscle with an ill-perceived air of superiority. I highly doubt that combat arms personnel are 'raping' and causing miscontent on that level. I have served with Joint Operations in numerous countries in 'hot' zones. The professionalism of our ground troops is significantly different from those that perform logistical or support operations, to wit, MP's.


sorry about the previous posting of the picture, but I thought it carried more impact as a visual than as a link.



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 09:53 AM
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Wouldn't you say we are beggining to see a bigger picture here? These seemingly arn't isolated cases wouldn't you agree? Just makes me think about what is going on in camp x-ray and such apparently unlawful places were people are held. . .



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 10:01 AM
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I served at Camp X-ray. It's tip-top. It's been a housing point for years for a variety of prisoners.



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 11:09 AM
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Yeah, I've heard they have a handle on this problem now. They're going to take away all their cameras.



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 11:40 AM
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you people remember that picture of the soldier with the iraqi boys holding up a sign saying some stupid things? I wonder how come that pic hasn't made into the mass media as of yet? It just shows again that these are not isolated incidents, it's the american superiority complex that is causing all these issues.



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 12:43 PM
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I think a huge problem is all of those mercenaries, private contractors, over there. They are accountable to no one, not the UCMJ, not civilian laws, and they are commanding US troops. They tell, they direct, US soldiers what to do. This is what happens when you allow privatization and war profiteering at every level, as the Bush adminstration is doing.

CACI
Blackwater
Uncertain Future for Contractors in Iraq

Contractors On The Battlefield: Special Legal Challenges

The dogs of war: Mercenaries in Iraq



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 01:24 PM
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Originally posted by worldwatcher
you people remember that picture of the soldier with the iraqi boys holding up a sign saying some stupid things? I wonder how come that pic hasn't made into the mass media as of yet? It just shows again that these are not isolated incidents, it's the american superiority complex that is causing all these issues.


Yep, Lt. Boudreax has been on my mind recently. Considering the latest torture pics were being distributed as trophies all over the Maryland base by MP's and the whole town when the Post got a hold of them I'm disgusted with the mindset.

It comes from the top. That damn holier than thou Bush smirk. Rummy that jokes around every chance he gets at press conferences of a very serious nature. Cheney that parades around using the theme to ROCKY for his appearance entrances.

Stupid immature bravado BS cowboy wannabe Chickenhawks. Why not just elect Ahnold "Words hurt my mouf" Schwarznegger and get it over with. He's as "qualified" as Bush as far as the shamerican public is concerned.



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 01:43 PM
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Correction, it's LCpl, not LT. The person in question is an E3 in the military. He did nothing to harm those boys and the sign was merely a humorous anecdote. I think physically abusing prisoners and holding a sign are two completely different things.

Correction II, private contractors are NOT directing troops on the field of battle. I am currently considering an offer from BSC and I know their area of operations and the scope of their work. Most of the civilian contractors there, to wit security personnel, are used in a defensive posture only and their mission is to guard supplies and installations secured for CPA.


You cite the articles as point of reference but you didn't even read them. I did and they confirm the information that I have from my contacts in country and at BSC. You extend that charge to the Bush administration but it is not the US Govt that is hiring the contractors, it's private industry that is. Please differentiate between the two.



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 02:09 PM
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Blackwater, hired by the US government, protects Ambassador Bremer. Good article HERE
about all of those mercenaries running around.
And the New Yorker just came out with a great article about who did what in that prison HERE. It speaks of who really ran things, the contractors.



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 02:11 PM
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Originally posted by .E3.
You extend that charge to the Bush administration but it is not the US Govt that is hiring the contractors, it's private industry that is. Please differentiate between the two.


Like there's a difference in the Bush administration and Private contractors?



Frequently a fine line, but I know what you're trying to say.



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 02:35 PM
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I fail to see how from article two you can determine that private contractors "really ran things". The article states they had a major presence, but it does not in any way state they "ran" things. The article states they provided input but didn't run the show. As a matter of fact, it states intelligence officers and CIA. In fact, the article's discussion on civilian contractors is relatively small taking into account the length of the whole article.

Correction again, CPA hired Blackwater, not specifically the US government. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the CPA is formed up of multiple countries...



posted on May, 6 2004 @ 02:38 PM
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There's no isolated event. Our race is really a perverted race, we're regressing, and nothing will be able to stop our own destruction.



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 07:11 AM
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I had to post this:

www.whitehouse.org...

I don't know about being a perverted race. I reckon there's no great difference between men of any race.



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 09:23 AM
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.E3.: Er, what exactly is a "housing point for prisoners"? Is it similar to a "concentration camp for uncharged prisoners, indefinitely"? Please explain what you mean by "housing point".


The worst thing I've heard is people who say "Hey it was worse under Saddam, he tortured and killed all the time".

To have to compare yourself to a madman military dictator is hardly a ringing endorsement of U.S. Occupation blunders. Why not say "Hey Hitler killed millions, we're only really torturing and maybe crippling, but rarely killing".

Good job.



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 02:30 PM
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I remember seeing the response from one or two members in another thread that they believed the photos were fake, but I couldn't find that link. I also think this deserves a new thread and to be investigated.

Well, it seems these photos might actually have been staged by Al-Qaeda to inflame public opinion against the coalition forces.

According to Northeast Intelligence Network, several jihadi sites have urged all followers to stop passing around photos.

"7 May 2004 - Arabic Language Jihadi Retract Faked Rape Photos

In the past few days, a number of postings have been made on the Arabic language jihadi websites urging all followers to stop passing around the photos that were alleged to show US servicemen raping Iraqi women. The photos were staged. They were actually taken from a porn flick, and were released in a deliberate attempt to inflame both US and Arab public opinion against the coalition forces."

Excerpt taken from.
www.homelandsecurityus.com...

Muaddib--- I also found this.---

"The Daily Express is claiming the Iraqi prisoner abuse photos showing UK troops abusing troops are not genuine and probably didn't even come from Iraq. They are joined by the Sun which details many of the reasons that they feel the photos were staged (the headline today screams FRAMED) including the fact that the weapon was a Japanese copy of a British weapon. But the Daily Mirror, which first ran the story, blasts a front page headline of We stand by our story."

Excerpts taken from.
www.iraqwar.info...

Muaddib------This is old news from May 2nd.----

"Sources close to the army have questioned the authenticity of photographs appearing to show British soldiers torturing an Iraqi prisoner.
An investigation has begun into claims British troops assaulted the prisoner before throwing him from a lorry.

The claims were made in the Daily Mirror which carried photos allegedly taken during the man's ordeal.

Tony Blair says that if the photos are authentic this is "completely and totally unacceptable".

The pictures show a hooded man being urinated on, a boot placed on his head, and a rifle butt in his groin.

However the BBC's defence correspondent Paul Adams says sources close to The Queen's Lancashire Regiment believe many aspects of the photographs are suspicious.

He says they believe the pictures may not have even been taken in Iraq.


They believe the rifle is an SA80 mk 1 - which was not issued to troops in Iraq.

They say soldiers in Iraq wore berets or hard hats - and not floppy hats as in the photos.

They also believe the wrong type of Bedford truck is shown in the background - a type never deployed in Iraq.
Colonel Bob Stewart, who commanded British forces in the Balkans, told BBC News Online he could not be sure whether the photos were genuine or not."

Excerpts taken from.
news.bbc.co.uk...

Muaddib---- Also found this from May 4th--

" "The situation has not changed in Iraq; only the prison warder is different," said one report on al-Arabiya. "

Excerpt taken from.
news.bbc.co.uk...

So, they are saying even after all that was supposedly done, that the situation is the same in Iraq? This is impossible. I believe this was all a stage by Al-Q'aeda and some other jihadi sites.

You have got to be kidding......
You cannot be more obvious, this has all been staged, and even our own intelligence agencies may have fallen for it, not to mention the president.


[Edited on 7-5-2004 by Muaddib]



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 09:09 PM
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E3 , it's obvious your a Marine LCpl. So let a Marine Sergeant tell you why holding a sign above a detainee is wrong. It violates our morals, ethics and the hey... UCMJ. It is NOT exceptable for anyone to condone what a bunch of poorley trainined and irresponsable Army RESERVISTS did.

remeber, you a service member in the 21st century, we are supposed to be a "thinkin mans army". That means there is no more "Private didnt know Sir?" We all know better and those who dont are liars or idiots.

As for Blackwater. To quote you, "You cite the articles as point of reference but you didn't even read them. I did and they confirm the information that I have from my contacts in country and at BSC. You extend that charge to the Bush administration but it is not the US Govt that is hiring the contractors, it's private industry that is. Please differentiate between the two."

You are way wrong on that one. Who do you think is writeing the check. If you dont know you might want to learn up on it. Blackwater is working both the GOVY and the Private sector.

And as for the treatment of Arabs, there is NOTHING to keep in mind. We dont deal in payback, we stand for justice.

Conrtacted Security has a very important role for the US. In order to have the military do the same thing we would have to beef up our forces which over the time span of this war or ANY war would run much higher in cost then contracting it out to companies like Blackwater who recycle outstanding prior highly trained profeshional who are ready to get back to what they do best.

Taking into aspect the logistical, operational and admin requirements of a military force. Company's like blackwater provide a smart solution to a demanding requirement. In the end the choice to use them saves the GOVT money while offering outstanding opertunities for profeshionals to make a differance.

Just an example, while off the coast of Monrovia in 2003 it was going to cost 31 million to have an infantry battalion provide security support for the changeover of the government. And that was just for the first 30 days...........



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 11:51 PM
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Wow, didnt you hear that they busted that scandal wide open??? It was all a conspiracy by john kerry and ted kennedy !! The whole abu prision deal was a hoax. Put on by the democratic party to bash President Bush..
I thought everyone was privy to that.

The piece of evidence that nailed john kerry, was all the photo's. You see when you do something that is wrong, like abuse a few prisioners, you dont want to make it a "Kodak Moment".

So investigators started to piece the puzzle together and found one common thread. Who would allow their pictures or video to be taken that would later incriminate themselves ??????

Presto #*$&$&@$ john kerry !!!!!!!

"I voted for the 87 billion before I actually voted against it."
"I didnt actually throw my medals over the Fence."
" I voted to invade iraq, but I was against it."

It was an open and shut case.......... I hope this didnt slip through any of the truth seekers or scholars hands.

Common sense people !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nothing more than a hoax !!!!!!!!!!! Where are all the truth seekers on this one???????????

If you fail to see this whole prision scandal as a hoax, next time you decide to break the law , take plenty of pictures and distribute them on CD's to your entire city as trophies of your accomplishments. Now dont just take 1 or 2 photo's, take 1000 or so.

I hope this was able to bring you back to the real world !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[edit on 14-7-2004 by sniper068]




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