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Senate bill fines people refusing health coverage

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posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 04:40 PM

Senate bill fines people refusing health coverage

Americans who refuse to buy affordable medical coverage could be hit with fines of more than $1,000 under a health care overhaul bill unveiled Thursday by key Senate Democrats looking to fulfill President Barack Obama's top domestic priority.
(visit the link for the full news article)

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 04:40 PM
They are pushing healthcare reform HARD, and it will happen under some form. In it's current form YOU will be REQUIRED to have health coverage or YOU WILL BE FINED.

In a revamped health care system envisioned by lawmakers, people would be required to carry health insurance just like motorists must get auto coverage now

This is worse then socialized health care. What freedom will they come after next.

(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 2-7-2009 by MysterE]

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 04:43 PM
What if I'm an immigrant and can't afford it?

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 04:45 PM
How are people going to afford that? I have a neighbor rite now who is about to have a baby . She just lost her state medical because they said her husband makes too much money.

She only works about 10 hours a week now with the job market here.

They can barly pay for their 400 a month apartment! How can they pay a 1,000 fine, or health care even. They do not have it. This is NUTS.

Another one of those, make to much to get help, but can not make enough to pay for everything , but it will fall on deaf ears like everything else when it comes to government.

Also want to add: Requiring car insurance did NOT lower the rates at all! Think this will?

[edit on 2-7-2009 by amatrine]

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 04:48 PM
Living in Canada, we do not have this problem, because we have universal health care here... I think that forcing people (even those who can't afford it) to get insurance is a form of facism from the people elected. When will that domination end?

Laws that are manmade should be intelligent in their structure. Health care is a must, for everyone. A life is a life, no matter what social ranking you have, no matter how much (or not) money you have.

The root of the problem is the money system. It should not exist. We put values in the wrong place, what a shame...

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 04:52 PM
reply to post by lagenese

Because Americans do not value life, as you can see.

From my observation, Americans hate the old, kill the unborn, scorn at the mentally ill, disgust at the fat, scrim at the anorexic, and in general are simply hateful people to life.

None the less, Universal healthcare can work in Canada probably because of thew significantly lower population. 300 million people are hard to afford when they're all fat, lazy, and the nation is in mountains of debt.

I am a Socialist in riches, and a scorn capitalist in times like now.

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 04:59 PM
reply to post by Gorman91

If people where really conscious of what life is, we wouldn't have this problem. So, unconsciousness is probably the real problem here.

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:04 PM

Originally posted by MysterE
They are pushing healthcare reform HARD, and it will happen under some form. In it's current form YOU will be REQUIRED to have health coverage or YOU WILL BE FINED.

In a revamped health care system envisioned by lawmakers, people would be required to carry health insurance just like motorists must get auto coverage now

This is worse then socialized health care. What freedom will they come after next.

These Nazi bastards are really pushing their luck and pissing people off big time.

Mark my words, it's not going to be long before people are pushed beyond their breaking point and start killing politicians!

This country is going to fall into violence soon. ATSer's, please prepare yourselves.

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:18 PM
Well I guess I'll be one of the first to be fined. Oh well I really couldn't care less about a government run health care nazi regime. Thanks to these morons I have no official job and nearly completely out of money. So they want me to buy their health care plan. All I can say is "Stick it where the sun don't shine and piss off.

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:28 PM
Yea I can see this going over really well.

They can shove it as far as I'm concerned. This fascist crap is going to come to an end sooner or later.

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 07:36 PM
Star and flag from me, but, disappointed you beat me to this topic.

I almost fell out of my chair laughing when I read this article. Who are most likely to not purchase health care coverage? Those with the least income or who already have mountains of medical bills. It is not those who can, easily, afford insurance premiums.

Let me get this straight, the "government" is going to fine me for "not" spending my money on the largest scam (insurance) in the history of America?
oes this not reak of the stench of insurance lobby money?

Oh, but, what about the promises to help the middle class? No tax increases for those making less than $250,000? Hope and change and all that malarky? I just can't believe so many people bought into the hype.

The only answer is to keep the government out of it. Let me decided who can provide the best coverage for my money. Let me decide to change my carrier if I feel I'm getting screwed.

The problem has come about by the cycle of the health care providers trying to screw the insurance companies and the insurance companies trying to screw the health care providers. Back and forth and back and forth. Meanwhile, the patient is the one suffering the backlash.

It is not right for a hospital to charge an insurance company $10 for one aspirin. It is not right for the insurance company to tell a health care provider what medications or procedures are acceptable.

However, the solution is for the market to determine the norms. If an insurance company is not providing the coverage they agreed, the patient should change companies. Those who lose all of their customers will fail. If a health care provider does not provide quality, reasonably priced services, the customer needs to seek treatment, elsewhere. The provider will either change or fail.

I hate to keep harping on this, but, the consumer needs to educate themselves. Cheaper is not always better.

[edit on 2-7-2009 by WTFover]

[edit on 2-7-2009 by WTFover]

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 07:46 PM
Here's another excerpt from the article. This is just another way to extort money out of Americans. Why don't they fine the insurance carriers for not covering sick people?

The Congressional Budget Office estimated the fines will raise around $36 billion over 10 years.

[edit on 2-7-2009 by In nothing we trust]

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 07:48 PM
This is so terrible.

The democrats in power would make Stalin jealous.

They found a way to take the negative aspects of our current plan and expanded on them to create a plan that will only further hurt those who could not afford health care before.

If they want everyone to have health coverage, why don't they just create a single payer system like every other wealthy developed nation, instead of shafting us with this piss-poor excuse for a plan. It's fairly obvious that those in Washington have quite a few friends in the insurance industry, when they come up with an idea as imbecilic as this.

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 07:48 PM
First they wanted to go after business to fine them for not offering health care to their employees now they want to fine people? like I say morons is what we have in government this days and to think that we put them in power.

I wonder who is pulling the strings on these morons for this change in the bill.

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 07:50 PM

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by lagenese

From my observation, Americans hate the old, kill the unborn, scorn at the mentally ill, disgust at the fat, scrim at the anorexic, and in general are simply hateful people to life.

It is a shame you have that impression of Americans, and I assure that those types do not make up the majority. The vast majority of Americans are good, kind hearted people. Please don't fall for the generalizations you see in the MSM.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 08:18 PM
Education does not mean intelligence, these bafoons prove that theory.

How do they truly think they can raise any money by fineing those that can not afford their scam insurance which does not cover anything but the bare essentials anyway. Families laid off, reduced income for many that are working, food and shelter are the first priorities, Car insurance may be mandatory, but more and more are letting it lapse because they can't afford the premiums now much less add on a mandatory premium for more insurance that will not pay for what is truly needed or will require yoj to wait till you die before it is authorized.

$1000 fine would be equal to half the premiums for yearly coverage. So what; I don't have the money to pay an extra $2000 a year now, do these bafoons really think I'm going to pop out $1000 for a nazi fine; not in this lifetime.

I paid attention, I paid off credit cards and chopped them up. Everything else is paid for, and have been stocking up over the last couple of years. i have enough to pay all current necessity bills, buy groceries, and retain auto insurance. but thats it; no extra for any more taxes or mandatory scams.

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 10:11 PM
So I take it that when the police pull you over for speeding now they will ask for license, registration, proof of insurance and proof of medical insurance?

And the democrats (government) is going to enforce this how? The same way they stop illegal aliens? Fines will raise $36 billion, that's absolute bull#.

After the first thousand fines the same morons that put the democrats in power will be coming for them with a hangman's noose.

hope & change and you will buy medical insurance or I'll fine your ass $1000, yeah, when monkeys fly out of my butt.

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 11:36 PM
reply to post by lagenese

Why not give free houses to everyone? i mean, people MUST live somewhere right? and the cost of houses and even apartment costs these days have skyrocketed. So why shouldn't everyone have a "free" house?

A life is a life, and without a home people can get sick for working too much to have a home for their children. So why not "free" houses?....

posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 11:49 PM
This is stupid. You can't squeeze blood from a rock. If people can't afford health insurance, how the hell can they afford to pay a 1000 dollar fine? I am uninsured, and I sure as hell couldn't afford to pay the fine. If they sent me one, I would seriously stand out in front of my local police station and burn the damn thing. What will they do? I don't have the money. They could arrest me, but then I would be sitting in prison watching cable TV and eating food at the cost of you, the taxpayers, who until then, had never had to pay for me before. I do work a job - its just minimum wage. What do you expect me to do? I can't afford healthcare, that's why I don't have it. I am this close >| |< to snapping right now. I want to see someone try to fine me. I will #ing flip out.

posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 12:27 AM
reply to post by lagenese

the Canadian healthcare perfect?.... Pleeease...

If the Canadian healthcare was so perfect, why is it that Canadians can die waiting for an MRI scan, or and X-ray?

Natasha Richardson dies, victim of Canadian nationalized health care?

Sadly, Natasha Richardson died after her simple ski accident on a “bunny hill” in Canada. After spending a day in a Canadian hospital with only observations, she was rushed to a well-equipped New York hospital where it was discovered the 45 year old was brain dead.

Why wasn’t there a scan and X-ray? The normal procedures in a head trauma. The blood could have been drained and prevented her death. That is a snapshot of what socialized health-care is about. Basic services. Get to a U.S. hospital as soon as possible.

Helmets will become much more popular on the slopes. Nationalized healthcare will still be on Obama’s agenda. The media will not go there.

But of course, citizen journalists will.

Here are some facts that you may never see in your “friendly neighborhood media” –

Despite spending more on health care than any other industrialized country in the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) except Iceland and Switzerland, Canada ranks poorly in several categories according to a new study by the Fraser Institute.

For instance:

Canada ranks 17th in the percentage of total life expectancy that will be lived in full health.
It also ranks 22nd in infant mortality, 15th in perinatal mortality and fourth in mortality amenable to health care.
Other rankings for Canada included 9th in potential years of life lost to disease, 10th in the incidence of breast cancer mortality and 2nd in the incidence of mortality from colorectal cancer.

On an age-adjusted, comparative basis, Canada, relative to comparable countries of the OECD, has a small number of physicians, ranking 24th out of 28 countries.
Notably, Canada had the second-highest ratio among 20 OECD countries for which data were available in 1970.
Since 1970, however, all but one of these countries have surpassed Canada’s growth in doctors per capita.
While the age-adjusted proportion of doctors in Canada grew by 24 percent, the average increase in the proportion of doctors in the other 19 countries was 149 percent.
With regard to age-adjusted access to high-tech machinery, Canada performs dismally by comparison with other OECD countries:

Canada ranks 13th of 24 in access to MRIs and 18th in access to CT scanners.
It also ranked 7th of 17 in access to mammographs, and tied with two other nations at 17th of 20 in access to lithotriptors.
Lack of access to machines also means longer waiting times for diagnostic assessment, and mirrors the longer waiting times for access to specialists and to treatment found in the comparative studies examined for this study.

Source: “The Fraser Institute: High-Priced Canadian Health Care System Provides Poor Access to Care Compared to Other Nations,” Fraser Institute,” November 5, 2007.

For study:

But hey, this barely happens right?.... then why is canadian private healthcare BOOMING?... Isn't the Canadian "free" Socialized healthcare perfect?...

Private for-profit clinics are a booming business in Canada -- a country often touted as a successful example of a universal health system.

Facing long waits and substandard care, private clinics are proving that Canadians are willing to pay for treatment.

"Any wait time was an enormous frustration for me and also pain. I just couldn't live my life the way I wanted to," says Canadian patient Christine Crossman, who was told she could wait up to a year for an MRI after injuring her hip during an exercise class. Warned she would have to wait for the scan, and then wait even longer for surgery, Crossman opted for a private clinic.

As the Obama administration prepares to launch its legislative effort to create a national health care system, many experts on both sides of the debate site Canada as a successful model.

But the Canadian system is not without its problems. Critics lament the shortage of doctors as patients flood the system, resulting in long waits for some treatment.

"No question, it was worth the money," said Crossman, who paid several hundred dollars and waited just a few days.

Health care delivery in Canada falls largely under provincial jurisdiction, complicating matters.

Private for-profit clinics are permitted in some provinces and not allowed in others. Under the Canada Health Act, privately run facilities cannot charge citizens for services covered by government insurance.

But a 2005 Supreme Court ruling in Quebec opened the door for patients facing unreasonable wait times to pay-out-of-pocket for private treatment.

"I think there is a fundamental shift in different parts of the country that's beginning to happen. I think people are beginning to realize that they should have a choice," says Luc Boulay, a partner at St. Joseph MRI, a private clinic in Quebec that charges around $700 for most scans.

Oooh, but I forgot...ALL of the Liberal media proclaims that the Canadian healthcare system is perfect, and better than that of the U.S.

I guess that must be the reason why even Canadian politicians come to the U.S. to receive medical care....

Oh but wait, even back in 1999 Canadian politicians were calling for an expansion privatized healthcare clinics...

Canada's publicly funded, universal healthcare plan, which many Canadians consider the pride of their social security system, is currently being challenged by politicians urging more participation of private medicine.
Ralph Klein, the premier of the western province of Alberta, has introduced legislation that will allow private clinics to perform major surgery, such as joint replacement, which under the Canada Health Act is illegal. In addition, Dr Keith Martin, the health spokesman of the federal government's official opposition (the Reform Party), presented his shadow cabinet with a plan that would have a private medical care system function in parallel with the public one.

Here is another example of the so wonderful Canadian healthcare system.

Canadian Survivor

The Ugly Truth About Canadian Health Care
David Gratzer

Socialized medicine has meant rationed care and lack of innovation. Small wonder Canadians are looking to the market.

Mountain-bike enthusiast Suzanne Aucoin had to fight more than her Stage IV colon cancer. Her doctor suggested Erbitux—a proven cancer drug that targets cancer cells exclusively, unlike conventional chemotherapies that more crudely kill all fast-growing cells in the body—and Aucoin went to a clinic to begin treatment. But if Erbitux offered hope, Aucoin’s insurance didn’t: she received one inscrutable form letter after another, rejecting her claim for reimbursement. Yet another example of the callous hand of managed care, depriving someone of needed medical help, right? Guess again. Erbitux is standard treatment, covered by insurance companies—in the United States. Aucoin lives in Ontario, Canada.

More lies from Moore

Friday, July 6th 2007, 4:00 AM

Be Our Guest
In "Sicko," Michael Moore uses a clip of my appearance earlier this year on "The O'Reilly Factor" to introduce a segment on the glories of Canadian health care.

Moore adores the Canadian system. I do not.

I am a new American, but I grew up and worked for many years in Canada. And I know the health care system of my native country much more intimately than does Moore. There's a good reason why my former countrymen with the money to do so either use the services of a booming industry of illegal private clinics, or come to America to take advantage of the health care that Moore denounces.

Government-run health care in Canada inevitably resolves into a dehumanizing system of triage, where the weak and the elderly are hastened to their fates by actuarial calculation. Having fought the Canadian health care bureaucracy on behalf of my ailing mother just two years ago - she was too old, and too sick, to merit the highest quality care in the governments eyes - I can honestly say that Moore's preferred health care system is something I wouldn't wish on him.

[edit on 3-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

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