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My Only God Thread. Why, If God Is Our Father, Doent He Intervene So We Dont Die Or Suffer?

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posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 10:30 PM
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Ok, so I'm looking at rays of light. One has a dot in it.

I don't need to gain confidence in scripture! I have logic.

One man said it best... Buddha 500 years before christ

"Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it."





Originally posted by Jim Scott

Originally posted by favouriteslave

I'm sorry............seriously. Satan can enter a snake and make it talk?

Have a look at this photo of Earth, and tell me Satan can't make a snake talk upload.wikimedia.org...


Saying your god can do whatever he wants without repercussion is reprehensible. Trying to make excuses for his actions is worse. The god of your bible is a made up story by men. [snip]


Sorry if I come off as reprehensible.

There are several evidences to give you confidence in the scriptures. Here's a great link, so I don't have to go over it. www.equip.org...




posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 10:38 PM
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They are strictly my beliefs, they need no evidences. I'm not taking them out of a book I claim to be the word of god, so therefore there is no scripture to back them up. It's just simply me connecting the dots of all the religions, races, practices of the entire world and not relying on on one source. I'm not asking anyone to believe it, it's simply how I perceive the world and it's workings. Ancient histories of people has a lot to do with it. Their stories of creation and what they called "gods" has had a big influence on me. Particularly the Sumerian, Babylonian, Egyptian and Indian cultures.




Originally posted by Jim Scott
Could you please give evidences for the beliefs you have stated below?


Originally posted by favouriteslave
Yes you are correct, I do believe in a creator/s.
I have read the bible, I have asked god to show me the way. I used to be christian. None of this is new to me. Ask and ye shall receive. This is what "god" showed to me....

I believe in a creator of sorts, if he is indeed the same god of the bible then he's one bad dude and I will separate my self from him. When I say creator I mean other beings from another place, dimension or time scientifically created our race of beings and placed us here. As to their purpose in creating us, I can only speculate.

I believe our creator did not act alone. We have creators......plural

I believe they gave us a basic set of rules and turned us loose

I believe that possibly our creator and what is considered god could be entirely different beings.

I believe there was disagreements between our creators on what should be done with us. Thus the story of war in heaven and the inventions of the opposing force "satan"

I believe some creators or creations may have come and gone throughout history and interfered or interacted with our race.

I believe all races have their own unique story of life and their encounters with the "gods"

I believe all religion is man made to explain what we cannot. It's spliced together with fact and fiction. They are all wrong in some sense.


I do not believe the bible is gods/creators word in it's entirety

I do not accept Jesus as the saviour

I do not believe our creators conjured us up out of dust of the earth but used DNA either from themselves or other races in the universe.

I do not believe our creators made the world in 7 days or even created earth at all.

I do not believe the story of Adam and Eve


I do not believe in sin. Sin is being human


I am not sure what happens after death, but can't wait to find out! I do not fear death

I am not sure if there is a heaven or hell but do consider that they are places in the cosmos or possibly other dimensions

I am not sure if we get another life or if we reincarnate, it's a possibility

I'm sure theres more but I'll stop there.







Originally posted by dodadoom
reply to post by favouriteslave
 

Okay, so I'll try this again without laughing this time.
Now it sounds like you believe in a "creator",
but just not in God or the bible? Is that right?
Or should I use quotes like everyone else?
Maybe that makes the point sharper.....
and the haze clearer.
You really should read the bible and ask God before
making these assumptions. IMO


[edit on 6-7-2009 by favouriteslave]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 10:40 PM
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reply to post by favouriteslave
 

Star for that post! I appreciate your taking the time to answer.
I agree I would like to know how you arrived at that conclusion.
You used to be a christian, it sounds like you divorced God!
Maybe you bailed when you shouldn't have.
Forgiveness is one of "it's" gifts for us too!

I actually think you may have some arguing points here.
I mean who knows God could be an alien, I guess.
He seems like one to alot of people,(not his fault btw)
You think he enjoys making nasty on humans?
It's a mighty powerfull & smart alien if it is one!

I suppose we will find out for sure in the next life!

If there isnt one, we'll never know anyway.
Thanks again for the post!

[edit on 6-7-2009 by dodadoom]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 10:47 PM
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But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it."

It's no wonder that you believe Christianity does not fulfill these tenets.
Perhaps you would do better to refer to this thread I wrote about the true Christianity. The Christianity of Jesus is not like the Christianity of today. www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 10:51 PM
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Originally posted by favouriteslave
They are strictly my beliefs, they need no evidences.
Originally posted by Jim Scott


I see your point. You do not need evidences to have your belief.

Do you believe you are alive? Why?

[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 10:52 PM
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Well technically god/creator would have to be an "alien" since he is not of our earth, dimension or time. I'm not saying the creator some green reptilian from Vega. The creator is way advanced. Only a highly advanced being to design a human they way it is. It takes advanced genetics and physiology to create. We are creating clones now with science. We have become "creators" ourselves. When we created we do not claim to know the beginnings and ends of our creations, we just let them be.

I encourage everyone to read other races tales of creation and their "gods" It's all so similar. Much of what was written thousands of years ago is repeated in the bible but in different ways. Which leads to me to believe much of the bible was old stories being retold with a different spin. Some will say straight up plagiarism. Some races even drew pictures of their gods and their "chariots" It's worth the investigation. Start with things like the Code of Hammurabi, Epic of Gilgamesh, Enuma Elish etc...





Originally posted by dodadoom
reply to post by favouriteslave
 

Star for that post! I appreciate your taking the time to answer.
I agree I would like to know how you arrived at that conclusion.
You used to be a christian, it sounds like you divorced God!
Maybe you bailed when you shouldn't have.
Forgiveness is one of "it's" gifts for us too!

I actually think you may have some arguing points here.
I mean who knows God could be an alien, I guess.
He seeems like one to most it seems, who
just enjoys making nasty on humans!
It's a mighty powerfull & smart alien if it is one!
I suppose we will find out for sure in the next life!

If there isnt one, we'll never know anyway.
Thanks again for the post!


[edit on 6-7-2009 by favouriteslave]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 10:56 PM
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I did read your thread and liked it. I do not accept the christ and him dying for our sins. I like to see others thinking outside of the traditional christian box. Throughout time all beliefs have some important contributions and some are just plain silly stories. Knowing that when you are reading it means you are using logic. Logic is something that is foreign to those in the grips of traditional religions. Thinking for yourself is dangerous for their pocket book.





Originally posted by Jim Scott

But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it."

It's no wonder that you believe Christianity does not fulfill these tenets.
Perhaps you would do better to refer to this thread I wrote about the true Christianity. The Christianity of Jesus is not like the Christianity of today. www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 10:59 PM
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Thats a tough question. This could all be an illusion of life. We may be plugged in to the matrix............just kidding. I popped off the grid a long time ago.

Yes, I am alive. Either through creation or complete random evolution. This is the only life I know and I'm going to enjoy it like it may be my last.



Originally posted by Jim Scott

Originally posted by favouriteslave
They are strictly my beliefs, they need no evidences.
Originally posted by Jim Scott


I see your point. You do not need evidences to have your belief.

Do you believe you are alive? Why?

[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:23 PM
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Do you believe you are alive? Why?


Originally posted by favouriteslave
Thats a tough question. This could all be an illusion of life. We may be plugged in to the matrix............just kidding. I popped off the grid a long time ago.

Yes, I am alive. Either through creation or complete random evolution. This is the only life I know and I'm going to enjoy it like it may be my last.



Originally posted by Jim Scott

Originally posted by favouriteslave
They are strictly my beliefs, they need no evidences.
Originally posted by Jim Scott


I see your point. You do not need evidences to have your belief.

Do you believe you are alive? Why?

[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]


[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:28 PM
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I have many answers to that question.

I am alive because I have an only begotten son, who shares my DNA. From my life I have created his. This is really my only and best achievement. He is my way, my truth and my life, through him I will live forever.



Originally posted by Jim Scott
Do you believe you are alive? Why?


Originally posted by favouriteslave
Thats a tough question. This could all be an illusion of life. We may be plugged in to the matrix............just kidding. I popped off the grid a long time ago.

Yes, I am alive. Either through creation or complete random evolution. This is the only life I know and I'm going to enjoy it like it may be my last.



Originally posted by Jim Scott

Originally posted by favouriteslave
They are strictly my beliefs, they need no evidences.
Originally posted by Jim Scott


I see your point. You do not need evidences to have your belief.

Do you believe you are alive? Why?

[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]


[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:29 PM
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Originally posted by favouriteslave
I encourage everyone to read other races tales of creation and their "gods" It's all so similar. Much of what was written thousands of years ago is repeated in the bible but in different ways. Which leads to me to believe much of the bible was old stories being retold with a different spin.


Copying Jesus before/after his existence is a Satan thing.

Mark 13:5 And Jesus answering them began to say, Take heed lest any man deceive you: 6 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. 15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:32 PM
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I have many answers to that question. I am alive because I have an only begotten son, who shares my DNA. From my life I have created his. This is really my only and best achievement. He is my way, my truth and my life, through him I will live forever.

Theoretically, then, if your son dies, you are no longer alive, and you will no longer live forever.
Your belief in existence is that you see others that exist because you exist? Isn't that evidence? You stated that you do not need evidence to believe.


They are strictly my beliefs, they need no evidences.



[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:45 PM
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reply to post by Jim Scott
 





And here's a start on talking animals:


Ummm- that's less 'talking' and more animals using the art of imitation. Now- for animals to 'talk'- my cat does to me- just no words are exchanged. And nope- no telepathy. He's learned how to get my attention and show me what's wrong. Like the other day when his mate caught a mouse. She left it in the middle of the kitchen. I got up, came out, and before I ever got to the kitchen, I was met by the cat, who would go a few steps, turn around, and give me a look. A few steps more, tiny meow, and that look. And we get to the kitchen, he stands by the (still WARM!
) body and just STARES at me. He's 'knocked' on my back when the food bowl is empty and it's morning. He plays gargoyle on the litterbox when it's time to change it. He'll give me a good stare when the water needs changing. He even knows when I am upset, and comes and sleeps with me, and pets ME. So, yes, in a way, my cat can 'talk' up a storm without uttering a 'word'. He just uses ASL.


Now...
For the animals in that link to talk, there is a vocal system. Snakes, DO NOT HAVE ONE. For a snake to talk is physically impossible. Isnt it odd for God to 'just not notice' Satan monkeying with a reptile's dna in the Garden, where Evil is supposedly NOT allowed... Smacks of something fishy. And just for the record- snakes do not particularly strike me as 'intelligent'. Fast? Yes. Vicious? Yes. Smart? Not so smart. Eve, on the other hand....? *ahem* No comment. I'll save that for another thread.


[edit on 7-7-2009 by wylekat]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:46 PM
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that has been used way too many times by christian apologetics. First of all if it's not in the first 5 books (torah) I won't even consider it's value. I can't believe hearsay writings of a man with no proof of existence. Without proof the bible is absolute then none of it can be believed to be 100% truth.

In order for any of that to be true you must prove

#1-The bible is the absolute infallible word of our creator....impossible

#2-That Jesus actually lived and wasn't a rehash of all the other "saviour" stories throughout time and races

#3-Satan is actually an evil being or did he actually want want god didn't want for us. To be smart, to be logical, to have knowledge, to think for ourselves. Just because he is opposite of what god want doesn't automatically make him evil. I think it's evil that god didn't want us to know good and evil. I think it's evil that he preferred us to stay like infants in constant need of a parent. Just because the bible says he's evil doesn't mean his is. First of all you have to prove #1 in order to prove #3




Originally posted by Jim Scott

Originally posted by favouriteslave
I encourage everyone to read other races tales of creation and their "gods" It's all so similar. Much of what was written thousands of years ago is repeated in the bible but in different ways. Which leads to me to believe much of the bible was old stories being retold with a different spin.


Copying Jesus before/after his existence is a Satan thing.

Mark 13:5 And Jesus answering them began to say, Take heed lest any man deceive you: 6 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. 15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:48 PM
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reply to post by Jim Scott
 





Theoretically, then, if your son dies, you are no longer alive, and you will no longer live forever


Also means people like me who have no children at all aren't alive in a sense.... Figures.

Never ceases to throw me how it's all about family, and the alone are left... well- alone.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:50 PM
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Don't take it to heart, I was simply being facetious and smart elleck




Originally posted by wylekat
reply to post by Jim Scott
 





Theoretically, then, if your son dies, you are no longer alive, and you will no longer live forever


Also means people like me who have no children at all aren't alive in a sense.... Figures.

Never ceases to throw me how it's all about family, and the alone are left... well- alone.



posted on Jul, 7 2009 @ 12:32 AM
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Originally posted by favouriteslave
that has been used way too many times by christian apologetics. First of all if it's not in the first 5 books (torah) I won't even consider it's value. I can't believe hearsay writings of a man with no proof of existence. Without proof the bible is absolute then none of it can be believed to be 100% truth.

In order for any of that to be true you must prove

#1-The bible is the absolute infallible word of our creator....impossible


www.equip.org...


#2-That Jesus actually lived and wasn't a rehash of all the other "saviour" stories throughout time and races


www.answerbag.com...

Our initial witness makes a contribution of a unique sort inasmuch as he had no intention of making Christianity to appear genuine. To the contrary, Thallus, a Samaritan-born historian who lived and worked in Rome about A.D. 52, wrote to offset the supernatural element which accompanied the crucifixion. Though the writings of Thallus are lost to us, Julius Africanus, a Christian chronographer of the late second century, was familiar with them and quotes from them. In a comment on the darkness that fell upon the land during the crucifixion (Mark 15:33), Africanus says that "Thallus, in the third book of his histories, explains away this darkness as an eclipse of the sun."3 Africanus stated his objection to the report arguing that an eclipse of the sun cannot occur during the full moon, as was the case when Jesus died at Passover time. The force of the reference to Thallus is that the circumstances of Jesus' death were known and discussed in the Imperial City as early as the middle of the first century. The fact of Jesus' crucifixion must have been fairly well known by that time, to the extent that unbelievers like Thallus thought it necessary to explain the matter of the darkness as a natural phenomenon. Will Durant observed that Thallus' "argument took the existence of Christ for granted."4 Neither Jesus nor the darkness at his death were ever denied as factual. Durant summed up the matter of Christ's historical existence for himself by saying that it never occured to the early opponents of Christianity to deny the existence of Jesus.5 Ironically, Thallus' efforts have been turned into the mainstream of historical proof for Jesus and for the reliability of Mark's account of the darkness at his death


#2. The Talmud

There are two separate books of writings dealing with Jewish law called the Talmud. The first of these is the Mishnah, which is the Jewish code of religious jurisprudence. It began to be compiled sometime after the destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70 and was completed about A.D. 200. This great body of newly codified case law became the object of Jewish study from which grew a body of commentaries called Gemaras. Together, the Mishnah (the law book) and the Gemara (the commentary) are called the Talmud. Being Jewish, suffice it to say, all references to "Yeshu'a of Nazareth" in the Talmudic writings are unfriendly, but nevertheless sufficient in number to establish beyond doubt his historical reality.

#3 Josephus

The most important references to the historical Jesus from a Jewish source is from a former Jewish general turned historian by the name of Flavius Josephus. In his writings he tells us who he was, what he did, and his own evaluation of a historian. He wrote of many of the outstanding persons we read of in the New Testament: Pilate; Quirinius of Syria (during whose governorship Rome enrolled the Empire for taxation purposes); the Caesars; the Herods; the Pharisees and the Sadducees; Annas and
Caiaphas, who had Jesus crucified; Felix and Festus, under whose governorships the apostle Paul was arrested and before whom he spoke of Jesus; Jesus' brother, James; and John the Baptist.


#3-Satan is actually an evil being or did he actually want want god didn't want for us. To be smart, to be logical, to have knowledge, to think for ourselves. Just because he is opposite of what god want doesn't automatically make him evil. I think it's evil that god didn't want us to know good and evil. I think it's evil that he preferred us to stay like infants in constant need of a parent. Just because the bible says he's evil doesn't mean his is. First of all you have to prove #1 in order to prove #3


www.equip.org...
The minimum necessary to believe in order to be saved is: (1) human depravity, (3) Christ’s sinlessness, (4) Christ’s deity, (5) Christ’s humanity, (6) God’s unity, (7) God’s triunity, (8) the necessity of God’s grace, (9) the necessity of faith, (10) Christ’s atoning death, and (11) Christ’s bodily resurrection.



posted on Jul, 7 2009 @ 05:13 AM
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Originally posted by favouriteslave

I encourage everyone to read other races tales of creation and their "gods" It's all so similar.


Such is the work of the Spirit!

The differences in the various traditions are a result of human intellectual or cultural interpretation of the work of the Spirit.

Jesus's life, death, resurrection and ascension changed how the Spirit works in the world.

But one thing that has never changed is that there have and until the promises of the Revelation are fulfilled, will always be, power hungry human ego's that seek to use that which is good to control and subjugate others.



posted on Jul, 7 2009 @ 05:20 AM
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Originally posted by Watcher-In-The-Shadows

So says the guy that claimed that because there are a lot of Christians what they say about the concept of a "God" is the only one that counts. All the while portrarying childish absurd abstractions as their beliefs. You in your over eager foolishness to attack Christianity show little more than you're lack, not theirs.

Never said that. I like the way you make things up. Proves what a big boy you are



How can evil be man made if god made everything?

Remember god has a PLAN so he has to know everything that will happen from beginning to end. He allowed for the creation of evil within his design.

God must have created evil by allowing the design for it to exist within his plan.



Which is of course a silly childish completely absurd abstraction of a Christian belief, they do not believe that God made buildings, computers, hammers, etc etc etc. Yet you claim it is so. I wonder why.

Actually yes we do. God created everything from the beginning and through his design, created everything that ever existed and ever will exist. Thus the word DESIGN. You see if god DESIGNED the Universe, by default, he designed everything within it. Simple concept really.


You say I believe in good and evil despite constant reiterations to the contrary. Remember when you said this?:
You seem to be sticking to your tired old lines.

Yes because you keep saying the same things over and over which is what you accused me of. That's what this means



And of course you don't your whole strategy is most likely to annoy your opponent into quitting or getting banned the debate thusly giving you the chance to feel the hollow victory you percieve as being right.

Funny this is EXACTLY how I figure you are acting

The difference between you and myself is that I don't have "opponents"....I have discussions with other adults. The way you describe this is very telltale about your mindset though. I'm sure this really gives it away to everyone



Not based off of facts, but based off acting like an annoying five year old with a axe to grind til those that dare disagree get annoyed to the point they either get in trouble or walk away.

That makes sense since up to recently, I've been nothing but nice to you even though you started personally attacking me. I can disagree with people and still respect their views. Too bad you can't do the same



You repeatedly fail to pay attention to anything your opponent says, yet when called on it your response is a childish "I know you are but what am I.", here's proof, what I said first:

umm.....that's what you did in your post I'm responding to.....


It's all there in the history, you betraying your ignorant over eagerness to call others fools all the while making a fool of yourself. I could go on.


To this point I haven't called anyone a fool. I've tried to go out of my way to be kind and understanding about others viewpoints and am simply trying to get questions I have, answered. Obviously, you are not interested corresponding as an adult. You'd rather attack me personally then provide your point of view or explain why my point of view may be wrong....wait I'm suggesting that I may be wrong??? Of course ! That's why I'm asking questions and not just making statements, like yourself.

You don't want to discuss this subject with me so why do you keep responding?
You're not going to bait me into saying anything that will be me banned.
You're not going to get me angry.

The subject to this thread is:
My Only God Thread. Why, If God Is Our Father, Doent He Intervene So We Dont Die Or Suffer?

This is a good question as god has, according to the bible, intervened throughout history. So there he has set a precident for getting involved. So why not continue getting involved? I understand what others have said about balance, yin-yang, etc... and although it does sound neat, it doesn't really answer the question.

So once again, if you can't handle an adult conversation where you act like an adult, don't bother responding. It won't get you anywhere. All you're doing is pulling this thread off track and by continuing to respond to your tantrums, I'm encouraging the thread to be pulled of track, which I don't want to do.


[edit on 7-7-2009 by jfj123]

[edit on 7-7-2009 by jfj123]



posted on Jul, 7 2009 @ 05:34 AM
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reply to post by jfj123
 


Mayhap you keep telling yourself that it stuff it will become true.
Either way, I stated my case with cited to source proof.
All you can do is state otherwise when the evidence is stacked against you *meaning your own comments*. Good day.


[edit on 7-7-2009 by Watcher-In-The-Shadows]



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