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My Only God Thread. Why, If God Is Our Father, Doent He Intervene So We Dont Die Or Suffer?

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posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:17 AM
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For those who keep repeating that Jesus died for our sins so we could be free.

What about all the people from creation up to the point of the crucifixion? Are they doomed to be separated from god because Jesus had not saved them yet? How are their souls saved?

What purpose did Jesus fill? We were either doomed to paradise or hell before him and still are after. What was wrong with gods laws before Jesus came? If it was so important to save us, he shouldn't have waited 4,000 years to send his only begotten son to die for our sins.

God created sin.............period. God created evil..............period. It's a really sick game that I have no part of.




posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:24 AM
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reply to post by favouriteslave
 


Our Father did not want control, He wants companionship. If you stop thinking of him as a "God" one who dictates to you as tyrannical leader and start loving Him as Your Father you will begin to understand. Imagine a man here on earth that has 10 children who were raised with love by that man, 9 of them grow up and go about there lives doing whatever they want treating their brothers and sisters with disrespect and each of them causing pain in the lives of the rest and says to their father screw you I don't care about you I don't love you . This man has does have one child left who is loving, one who respects this man, its father, and understands the sacrifices through love and hard work he made in raising all 10 of them. Having one child who at least acknowledges him does make him happy and creates a source of joy in his life, but undoubtedly he longs to be loved by the rest of his children as he is their father even though he realizes that he has to let go and let them make their own mistakes even to their own detrement. Will this mans longing to have ALL of his children in his life ever go away? Would you ever stop loving your own child that hates you? No, hope would be in your heart until the day you die, making your lifes work so that you could show them the error of their ways. You are mistaken in thinking Our Father just wants control, He wants us to control ourselves. Will you continue to deny Your Father?



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:27 AM
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God said that He gave us this land (America, Zion, the Mountains of Israel) under the covenent, which laid down laws for us to live by. So far, most all Americans dont even know they are the real Israelites and none follow God's laws. It is for this reason that He said He is sending the nations gathered to destroy us. The most stated reason is because of all our images and idols. The tv is the image of the beast.

On 10-10-09 the us/israel will do another false flag and on that same day, Russia, China and the SCO are going to destroy America. Russia has told us for two years they will preemptively nuke us over Iran and they have put the hardware in place to do it.

This is the war of Armgeddon and you can know it is now by all the chemtrails hiding the sign in the heavens, Nibiru. This is also the reason the government is now classifying all asteroid events secret.

News and sources here:
www.scribd.com...



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:28 AM
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reply to post by favouriteslave
 


For those who keep repeating that Jesus died for our sins so we could be free.

What about all the people from creation up to the point of the crucifixion? Are they doomed to be separated from god because Jesus had not saved them yet? How are their souls saved?

What purpose did Jesus fill? We were either doomed to paradise or hell before him and still are after. What was wrong with gods laws before Jesus came? If it was so important to save us, he shouldn't have waited 4,000 years to send his only begotten son to die for our sins.

God created sin.............period. God created evil..............period. It's a really sick game that I have no part of.



Read my two posts on page 28, it might answer your questions, and if not keep searching.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:33 AM
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For those who insist god is just and compassionate.

To kill a percentage of evil (nephlim), god devises a flood to wipe all of humanity from the earth. On this earth were babies, children and innocent unborn in the belly of their mothers. How do you justify such a large scale slaughter of innocent people and still say your god is kind?

If god can smote cities, burn bushes I'm quite sure he could have just blinked the nephlim away. That is what an all powerful god would have done.

How do you say god is kind. How do you explain god commanding his followers to kill and keep other captive for their own pleasures?

Numbers 31:17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
Moses tells the Israelites to kill every male and all the non-virgin females, but to keep the virgins for themselves.
Is it wrong to commit adultery?
31:18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:39 AM
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He already had companionship in heaven. Heaven wasn't empty, it was full of angels, his former creations.

I presume they knew what kind of ego maniac he was and he wasn't getting the respect he deserved so he created a separate place (Eden) and put in it people which he could keep stupid and controlled. People that would do whatever you asked if you just made them fearful.

Then come the new testament.......................god completely disappears. Where does he go. First he's commanding cities in to war, demanding burnt sacrifices and then poof, he's gone? Why is he so inactive in our daily lives now? How great it could be to have him fighting by our side again, taking prisoners, hacking foreskins. Yay



Originally posted by MichaelDII
reply to post by favouriteslave
 


Our Father did not want control, He wants companionship. If you stop thinking of him as a "God" one who dictates to you as tyrannical leader and start loving Him as Your Father you will begin to understand. Imagine a man here on earth that has 10 children who were raised with love by that man, 9 of them grow up and go about there lives doing whatever they want treating their brothers and sisters with disrespect and each of them causing pain in the lives of the rest and says to their father screw you I don't care about you I don't love you . This man has does have one child left who is loving, one who respects this man, its father, and understands the sacrifices through love and hard work he made in raising all 10 of them. Having one child who at least acknowledges him does make him happy and creates a source of joy in his life, but undoubtedly he longs to be loved by the rest of his children as he is their father even though he realizes that he has to let go and let them make their own mistakes even to their own detrement. Will this mans longing to have ALL of his children in his life ever go away? Would you ever stop loving your own child that hates you? No, hope would be in your heart until the day you die, making your lifes work so that you could show them the error of their ways. You are mistaken in thinking Our Father just wants control, He wants us to control ourselves. Will you continue to deny Your Father?



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:46 AM
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Yes, I read your post. Reincarnation has not been a proven theory either. It makes as much sense and all the rest of it.....none.

Yes I will continue to deny my "father" Because he is NOT sinless. You cannot make a good example for your children if you cannot follow your own commandments. I will do as god says, not as he does otherwise I'd be a criminal!






Originally posted by MichaelDII
reply to post by favouriteslave
 


Our Father did not want control, He wants companionship. If you stop thinking of him as a "God" one who dictates to you as tyrannical leader and start loving Him as Your Father you will begin to understand. Imagine a man here on earth that has 10 children who were raised with love by that man, 9 of them grow up and go about there lives doing whatever they want treating their brothers and sisters with disrespect and each of them causing pain in the lives of the rest and says to their father screw you I don't care about you I don't love you . This man has does have one child left who is loving, one who respects this man, its father, and understands the sacrifices through love and hard work he made in raising all 10 of them. Having one child who at least acknowledges him does make him happy and creates a source of joy in his life, but undoubtedly he longs to be loved by the rest of his children as he is their father even though he realizes that he has to let go and let them make their own mistakes even to their own detrement. Will this mans longing to have ALL of his children in his life ever go away? Would you ever stop loving your own child that hates you? No, hope would be in your heart until the day you die, making your lifes work so that you could show them the error of their ways. You are mistaken in thinking Our Father just wants control, He wants us to control ourselves. Will you continue to deny Your Father?



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 11:49 AM
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reply to post by favouriteslave
 

The reason you are troubled and seek these answers is because the churches today are not teaching the original Christianity. www.abovetopsecret.com...

Reincarnation is not happening. What you are seeing is demonic possession. You don't come back here in another body, you die once.


[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]

[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 12:05 PM
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reply to post by favouriteslave
 


I do not believe that "god" in the Old testament is the same as the creator of our universe or multiverses for that matter, I understand, and at one time, had a problem with what you call god "ego", certainly serving His will and forgetting ours seems on the surface to be egotistical. Do you have a problem with accepting that you are not the most intelligent being around? Do you have children? Can you remember your own parents? Is the will of the child to be as great as the parents? Do children know whats best for themselves? You focus alot on the suffering and death and seemingly horrible things that are preached in the bible and that which is occurring today which leaves me wondering if you read my posts on page 28, for me, even though what I typed is just a simplified version, when I learned this it humbled me and made me not have a problem with casting my will aside and start to move in the direction that I should be, His will. If you are not willing to do that then so be it but at the same time what are you doing to help the people who are doing all these horrible things here and now? Are you just sitting and typing and complaining or are you trying to help your fellow man regardless of your beliefs in whatever? Undeniably, the task of trying to help all the evil hearts in the world seems daunting, but unless you are trying to help you are part of the problem, the problem you are complaining about. If you are trying to help those that need it for our species benefit, then there is no need to make complaints for at least you are doing something about it. God and the Creator (Our Father) are not one and the same. Read my posts on page 28.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 12:05 PM
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I like your way of thinking! For me that is easier to swallow than what traditional Christianity has taught. We can only hope that is the case and it is that easy. I'm not gonna hold my breath. I live a good life, if heaven were to present itself to me, I'd take it.

I'm agnostic. I don't believe a god has been proven or not. If he exists I cannot claim he is good. I don't know if a "heaven" or "hell" exists, it has not been proven. I won't know until I die.

What are your thoughts on the cruelty portrayed by our creator in the old testament. How does that make you feel about him.





Originally posted by Jim Scott
reply to post by favouriteslave
 

The reason you are troubled and seek these answers is because the churches today are not teaching the original Christianity. www.abovetopsecret.com...

Reincarnation is not happening. What you are seeing is demonic possession. You don't come back here in another body, you die once.


[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]

[edit on 6-7-2009 by Jim Scott]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 12:31 PM
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posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 12:43 PM
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Originally posted by favouriteslave
I like your way of thinking! For me that is easier to swallow than what traditional Christianity has taught. We can only hope that is the case and it is that easy. I'm not gonna hold my breath. I live a good life, if heaven were to present itself to me, I'd take it.

I'm agnostic. I don't believe a god has been proven or not. If he exists I cannot claim he is good. I don't know if a "heaven" or "hell" exists, it has not been proven. I won't know until I die.

What are your thoughts on the cruelty portrayed by our creator in the old testament. How does that make you feel about him.


Traditional Christianity isn't "hard to swallow". It's very simple. You have to acknowledge that you're a sinner, repent your sins, and accept Jesus Christ.

I'm sorry to say that God wouldn't present Heaven to you. The "I won't know until I die" attitude is dangerous, because when you stand before God on judgment day it'll be too late. You will have to give an account of everything you've ever done, said, and even thought. If you haven't accepted Christ God will say, "(Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand,) Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:." Matthew 25:41 KJV



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 12:46 PM
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Yes I do have a child and I lead by example. If I cannot follow rules and morals how can I expect my child to? I am god in the eyes of my child, I must do right. It would be wrong for me to tell my child, do as I say, not as I do. Children learn from example.

I don't focus on the evil and destruction. I'm focusing on why modern day Christianity seems to not accept the evil and destruction their lord has done. That is my problem. Most just ignore it and say because he's god, don't attempt to know the mind of god! It's a fine way of ignoring the truth. How about stepping up to the plate and saying, "wow, god was being a jerk, maybe I should be better than that"

If I want to help my fellow men, I will not do as god has done. I will do better. I will do unto others as I wish they would do unto me. God give a very poor example of kindness and good will toward man.

What is your theory on the creator and god of the bible being different people? I believe you're onto something there. I do believe in a creator, but I do not follow the god of the old testament who quite honestly, seems to be a warmonger.




Originally posted by MichaelDII
reply to post by favouriteslave
 


I do not believe that "god" in the Old testament is the same as the creator of our universe or multiverses for that matter, I understand, and at one time, had a problem with what you call god "ego", certainly serving His will and forgetting ours seems on the surface to be egotistical. Do you have a problem with accepting that you are not the most intelligent being around? Do you have children? Can you remember your own parents? Is the will of the child to be as great as the parents? Do children know whats best for themselves? You focus alot on the suffering and death and seemingly horrible things that are preached in the bible and that which is occurring today which leaves me wondering if you read my posts on page 28, for me, even though what I typed is just a simplified version, when I learned this it humbled me and made me not have a problem with casting my will aside and start to move in the direction that I should be, His will. If you are not willing to do that then so be it but at the same time what are you doing to help the people who are doing all these horrible things here and now? Are you just sitting and typing and complaining or are you trying to help your fellow man regardless of your beliefs in whatever? Undeniably, the task of trying to help all the evil hearts in the world seems daunting, but unless you are trying to help you are part of the problem, the problem you are complaining about. If you are trying to help those that need it for our species benefit, then there is no need to make complaints for at least you are doing something about it. God and the Creator (Our Father) are not one and the same. Read my posts on page 28.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 12:47 PM
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So be it! God knows my true heart with or without the bogus teachings of the new testament. I won't lose sleep over it, I know where I stand.

And thank you for the very sweet way of telling me I will burn in hell.



Originally posted by Totakeke

Originally posted by favouriteslave
I like your way of thinking! For me that is easier to swallow than what traditional Christianity has taught. We can only hope that is the case and it is that easy. I'm not gonna hold my breath. I live a good life, if heaven were to present itself to me, I'd take it.

I'm agnostic. I don't believe a god has been proven or not. If he exists I cannot claim he is good. I don't know if a "heaven" or "hell" exists, it has not been proven. I won't know until I die.

What are your thoughts on the cruelty portrayed by our creator in the old testament. How does that make you feel about him.


Traditional Christianity isn't "hard to swallow". It's very simple. You have to acknowledge that you're a sinner, repent your sins, and accept Jesus Christ.

I'm sorry to say that God wouldn't present Heaven to you. The "I won't know until I die" attitude is dangerous, because when you stand before God on judgment day it'll be too late. You will have to give an account of everything you've ever done, said, and even thought. If you haven't accepted Christ God will say, "(Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand,) Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:." Matthew 25:41 KJV


[edit on 6-7-2009 by favouriteslave]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 12:55 PM
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Also I take no quotes in the new testament as being the actual words of Jesus. They are words of man written by men who never saw or met Jesus. It's hearsay, even if they are marked in red it doesn't make them any more closer to the truth.

I think if Jesus were to come back he would be mortified on how the world has been twisted and bended around his existence. Man has fallen so far from his intentions.






Originally posted by Totakeke

Originally posted by favouriteslave
I like your way of thinking! For me that is easier to swallow than what traditional Christianity has taught. We can only hope that is the case and it is that easy. I'm not gonna hold my breath. I live a good life, if heaven were to present itself to me, I'd take it.

I'm agnostic. I don't believe a god has been proven or not. If he exists I cannot claim he is good. I don't know if a "heaven" or "hell" exists, it has not been proven. I won't know until I die.

What are your thoughts on the cruelty portrayed by our creator in the old testament. How does that make you feel about him.


Traditional Christianity isn't "hard to swallow". It's very simple. You have to acknowledge that you're a sinner, repent your sins, and accept Jesus Christ.

I'm sorry to say that God wouldn't present Heaven to you. The "I won't know until I die" attitude is dangerous, because when you stand before God on judgment day it'll be too late. You will have to give an account of everything you've ever done, said, and even thought. If you haven't accepted Christ God will say, "(Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand,) Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:." Matthew 25:41 KJV



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 01:39 PM
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reply to post by dgtempe
 


OK here is what I believe and no one is gonna like it. But remember, it is what I believe and I don't ask you to change your beliefs - just listen.
First, all organized religion is just like any organized industry - it is made to make money. Pure and simple. Most teach rubrics in a basic "Golden Rule" style so they can better handle cross overs - those that aren't happy with one religion so they move to another. All you have to do is look at their recruiting and orientation classes to see exactly what I mean. Its a business, pure and simple.
Second, institutionalization is done to keep the masses in line - religion is the main institution involved in doing just this - get them in line by love or fear of God and then keep them there.
Third, it was never done for the soul. Jesus said it would be better if you went into a closet and prayed - closet vs. church; the difference/no money changing hands.
Now for your questions: Have you ever given any thought as to whether you are a problem or solution person? Not trying to hurt you, just hear me out for a second and hold on cuz it can go over your head very fast. We are not here by mistake. We all have some important part to play in this we call the physical world. Man's duty was to steward the Earth/not make excuses for his overindulgence. It is this tendency that makes everything fall out of balance. Over eat/get fat, over drink/disease, abuse/hatred and it goes on and on. So what I am trying to say is this: it is easy to blame one who you KNOW can not defend himself and you got away with an excuse, but if you really look at your circumstances and the common denominator, it is always you and your lack of acceptance of responsibility that brings you to your ends.
We need to start looking at ourselves for our answers and stop with the "Blame God Card". I'm an OSHO kinda person - go study and find yourself approved like you are supposed to in the first place. Once you start listening to God internally then all the rest will seem like a long lost dream - one you wish stay lost! LOL.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 01:47 PM
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Originally posted by favouriteslave
So be it! God knows my true heart with or without the bogus teachings of the new testament. I won't lose sleep over it, I know where I stand.

And thank you for the very sweet way of telling me I will burn in hell.



Originally posted by Totakeke

Originally posted by favouriteslave
I like your way of thinking! For me that is easier to swallow than what traditional Christianity has taught. We can only hope that is the case and it is that easy. I'm not gonna hold my breath. I live a good life, if heaven were to present itself to me, I'd take it.

I'm agnostic. I don't believe a god has been proven or not. If he exists I cannot claim he is good. I don't know if a "heaven" or "hell" exists, it has not been proven. I won't know until I die.

What are your thoughts on the cruelty portrayed by our creator in the old testament. How does that make you feel about him.


Traditional Christianity isn't "hard to swallow". It's very simple. You have to acknowledge that you're a sinner, repent your sins, and accept Jesus Christ.

I'm sorry to say that God wouldn't present Heaven to you. The "I won't know until I die" attitude is dangerous, because when you stand before God on judgment day it'll be too late. You will have to give an account of everything you've ever done, said, and even thought. If you haven't accepted Christ God will say, "(Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand,) Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:." Matthew 25:41 KJV


[edit on 6-7-2009 by favouriteslave]


Just know that without Christ's forgiveness you won't have any excuse when you have to stand before God on judgment day and account for everything. I can't make you accept Christ, you have to find Him yourself. I don't want to argue or fight, I just don't want you to go to Hell.

[edit on 6-7-2009 by Totakeke]



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 03:11 PM
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Originally posted by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest
im an atheist, and if somehow god did exist and asked why i didnt believe i would ask him why he didnt make himself clearer. i dont know what it would take to convince me that god deserves our praise or even exists, but god would know. and if he doesnt provide that for me or anyone, then doesnt he damn us to hell because he was inadequate?


how would one learn if it didnt make mistakes?
how would learn right from wrong, value and appreciate things, if they never lost it?
you wouldn't.
there is a key difference between KNOWING AN ANSWER
and then FULLY UNDERSTANDING THE ANSWER.
its like your parents said as kids< dont do that in high school your gonna regret it!
we say oh ya mom i know...still did it...but when we grew up and look back we said, oh wow...that was stupid...why didnt i listen?

see they TOLD US THE ANSWER, it was just not in the form we wanted, or we couldn't understand AT THE TIME...
the only thing that is permanent is change.

And from that you have to expect everything changes.
god cant tell us exactly everything, because the point of being on THIS WORLD is learning right from wrong.
appreciating and understanding.

nothing more nothing less.

if we dont believe our peers/parents why would u think you would believe what god says?
first we need to learn how to TRUST FULLY and then go from there.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 04:59 PM
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Originally posted by Totakeke
reply to post by jfj123
 




So what you're saying is that you would not have a problem, going to jail for a crime your great, great grandfather committed? You'd think it was fair, YES ?


Perhaps I should've explained it a little better (I'm always learning as a Christian). Being born with original sin just means being born sinful in nature. As hard as we try not to sin we all will at one point.


I understand what you're saying but would you mind answering my question?

"So what you're saying is that you would not have a problem, going to jail for a crime your great, great grandfather committed? You'd think it was fair, YES ? "

You see what I'm comparing this question to is the fact that we're being blamed for something that we did not do just as in the example.



posted on Jul, 6 2009 @ 04:59 PM
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With respect to your religous views, if I may add mine. It may help I'm a recovering Catholic. The monotheistic Gods of the three main religions give you an all or nothing choice. Don't do what we tell you and your toast, make even an honest mistake, and if in a bad mood, we'll screw you any way. I like the non-mono God principle: You exist, go and be happy. The ancient pre-Jew/Christian/Islam views are like a school hall monitor, just waiting for you to screw up.

God or gods dont cause our pain, I think thier to busy to be honest. But we are given the gift of total free will. We alone chose our destiy. As beings of free will, that is as should be. God gives us the tools, its up to us what we do with them.



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