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My Only God Thread. Why, If God Is Our Father, Doent He Intervene So We Dont Die Or Suffer?

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posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 06:31 AM
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Originally posted by Totakeke
reply to post by FlyersFan
 


The world is in pain because of sin. We chose to disobey God in the beginning and this is what happened. We got what we paid for.


Please stop peddling that crap here.

We choose to disobey god? Really? SERIOUSLY????

So what someone did a long, long time ago, we must suffer for?

That's like a parent punishing you because your great grand dad stole a sucker from the general store 100 years ago. That's just plain DUMB !




posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 06:41 AM
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reply to post by dgtempe
 





I can love, but do I have to worship???


For anyone to be worshiped, they have to do things that make them WORTHY. When someone sits and begs, and begs and begs God for something, and the only thing they get in return in moldy promises, and then excuse after excuse followed by backstabbing, b****ing from his over privileged little sheeples, does NOT make for any reason to worship, love or do anything but rip the crap out of this moneygrubbing, slimy, reprehensible religion. I swear, if I have one more puerile little sack of mucus tell me "God isnt a genie, vending machine, what have you", I am gonna punch them in the nuts- and failing that, in the face.



Why not send tribulation to the lives of leaders, and the greedy corporations, and things like that? Nope. We all must pay dearly. TRIBULATION FOR ALL!!!!!


All, huh? The above mentioned don't have 'tribulation'. Those aforementioned "Christians" don't have it. What separates them from those of us who do?

M O N E Y. Little green strips of paper with pictures on them. Not talent, not self respect, not integrity, nada. If you took away a rich Christian's money, You'd have a devil worshiper in a week flat.
And BTW- dont sit there and tell me how 'poor' any of you are. I know better.

Another little tidbit- Someone like me, who has no one- no wife, g/f, family, relatives, basically- just me on this planet with no one to turn to is destined for pity, and not much else. Says so in the fairy tales- I mean bible. Go to church? And watch how the church excludes people like me, treat them like some sort of pet, or object of pity as well. And dont even DARE to think about trying to work up a relationship with any of the women... 'No money? *insert long loud giggle of derision here*... Oh, you're nice, but God told me to tell you to take a hike, you pitiful little suckwad.'

You're right. WE got cheated. We got cheated but BAD. Try to vent the frustration, and you get God's little glee and backstabber's club marching up your butt. Meanwhile, God grabs another box of popcorn and tries not to choke while he laughs at our predicament.



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 06:59 AM
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For djtempe's only God thread.

Because life is a pathway to enlightenment which helps us further in the afterlife. Souls live for a very long time and are reborn into worlds, mostly the same one, many times.

The suffering of children is horrid but as with all suffering it is there to help us make sense and understand what we truly are.

One should focus on the vastness of our world and our universe which for this generation is clearer because of technology [lucky us]. One should also except that there are many gods, not just one, and that all gods and spirits should be respected and praised.

If I had not suffered in this world [and I have suffered], and had I not seen the suffering in this world, I would not understand as much as i do today. And I thank the gods for this.

"Thank the gods for your own suffering, and the suffering of children!" Yes, for the enlightenment. But that’s not to say we should not try to stop the suffering. We should make every effort to stop it. "But would that not be going against the wishes of the gods!" No. And that is enlightenment.

But the suffering does not end just because one has a little understanding, knowing and enlightenment.

Life is not fair, nobody ever told you it was.

Get over it, and get on with your living your life!



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 07:36 AM
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Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by dgtempe
 


Dg in my Opinion the creator is flawless and so are we when we leave the human body and become one with the creator.

As humans we are nothing but perfect.

Remember that the god that people worship in this earth was created in the image of man not the other way around., that is why it seems imperfect.


It only seems imperfect because of the way you are looking at it, but it is NOT the other way around. You are made in the image of the El(ders) of you. You are created in the image or likeness that created you and so on and so forth, therefor you are one image. I'm sure you probably resemble one of your parents or maybe both. That's all the bible ever meant confirmed by "the life in the blood."

"The life is in the blood"....blood is required for life as it is the river of life. True sacrifice is laying down ones own life, or parting it for another and the "two become one" thus rendering you and your partner a "new creation" in your child. This is the way the truth and the life. There is no other way then this. If you are not "procreation", you are "concreation"."The kingdom is at hand"....now and always now. The cross to bear is the son of man and that ones name only you know...the one you are naming. "Forbid not the children to come unto me, for the kingdom belong to such as these"..."and if i go, I will prepare a place for you, that where I am, you may be also"...when people pass and see the light, it is the light they lit to guide them home, unless they lit no light then they see darkness and their name is remembered no more....literally. We stand in the assembly of the "Living God".

Peace

[edit on 3-7-2009 by letthereaderunderstand]



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 07:38 AM
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So that you grow to become spiritually mature enough not to ask questions like that.



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 10:26 AM
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reply to post by Silenceisall
 


well said!

star
short but sweet



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 10:36 AM
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Star also! Pretty much sums it up!
Tanks mane!

I seriously hope we are not just slightly mutated monkey genes after all,
statistically more than likely doomed to extinction in the end.



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 10:41 AM
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reply to post by dodadoom
 


Well in time we will find out heh i just hope the rest of the god huggers wake up be for its to late

they very thing they question "god" will be the thing that destroys our planet

great :/

star for you as well



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 12:43 PM
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reply to post by symmetricAvenger
 





why do people think god is a guy? do you equate god as a man???



Because the bibles are quite explicit that yahwehgod is a man -

Genesis chapter 32 verse 24 - 36

Ezekiel chapter 1 verse 27

Neddless to say Jesus and yahweh are one and the same being so if jesus is a man yhawheh is a man = god is a man



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 12:47 PM
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reply to post by Totakeke
 





Before I continue, the word is "Christianity". I have no idea what "xtianity" is

Dont be silly, if you din't know what xtianity is you wouldn't have responded would you.

Anyway you now know, learn something new everyday on ATS, cool no ?



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 12:54 PM
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Anyway, the story's been straight for thousands of years. It's in the Bible; it doesn't change
reply to post by Totakeke
 


Well I'm fraid someones been feeding you bull crap there my friend, heres one example of changes. I had this at hand from a previous post and is in relation to the subject of the number of the beast in the book of revelation. --

"The newest volume of Oxyrhynchus Papyri contains a fragmentary papyrus of Revelation which is the earliest known witness to some sections (late third / early fourth century). A detailed discussion of its place in the MS tradition is given in the printed volume.
One feature of particular interest is the number that this papyrus assigns to the Beast: 616, rather than the usual 666. (665 is also found.) We knew that this variant existed: Irenaeus cites (and refutes) it. But this is the earliest instance that has so far been found. The number — chi, iota, stigma (hexakosiai deka hex) — is in the third line of the fragment shown below."


I can't seem to locate my refrences of the uncorns in the bibles so you'l l have to take my word on that one for now, as laughable as it may seem.



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 01:06 PM
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reply to post by Totakeke
 





Those who do not accept Christ's free gift of salvation are unsaved and can't get into Heaven.


And as heaven is described as eternal life then those who do not believe in yawhjesus god are condemned to death.

"So little children please understand you must believe, the invisible man in the sky is real , because if you don't he will kill you"!





God doesn't want that to happen,


If the (alleged) creator of all that there is didn't want something to happen then it wouldn't happen period.

How is it possible for god, not to get what god wants ?




but God gave people the ability to choose whether they want to accept Christ or not
.

It never ceases to amaze me, how a child can observe the stupidity of this statement but grown up xtians just don't want to wrap their minds around this logical fallacy .

You don't have to do this, but if you decide not to do it I will torture you for all eternity .

"Son you can behave or misbehave the choice is yours and yours alone, I love you"

"Gee thanks Dad, I love you too"

"Son if you behave I'll get you Pizza, because I love you"

"But what if I decide to misbehave dad ?"

"I will kill you"






If He didn't we'd all just be a bunch of robots.


Well my friend I'm sorry to tell you but we more or less are. There is no escaping the fact that if we are designed then we have a designer. Xtians believe our designer is the yahwehjesus god, who they also believe created all that there is.

There is no getting away from the fact that if we wre to act in anyway contrary to our design, then that wold negate the omnipresence of the god that is supposed to have designed us.

It is completely useless to discuss "free will" as this has absolutely no logical meaning if we are designed.

I have used this(quite popular) analogy before -

It would be impossible for Mickey Mouse to take a dump without Walt Disney knowing about it. The xtian proposition is that Walt draws Mickey taking a dump and closes his eyes somehow forgetting that he drew the dumping.

Then Walt, infuriated by Mickeys disobedience proceeds to draw a hell and put the cartoon mouse in it, blaming the mouse.

Xtianity is a joke my friend, little children observe many of the logical dilemmas , it's a shame the big xtian children don't.



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 01:11 PM
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reply to post by Silenceisall
 





So that you grow to become spiritually mature enough not to ask questions like that.


How about 'brainwashed so such questions never cross your mind'?

One line was all this quote needed, really.



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 01:29 PM
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That invention of original sin came with the invention of the christ/savior theme. So which is it? It can't be both ways. Is man eternally punished for the action of one woman? If there were no original sin then Christ would have died in vain no? They go hand in hand and rely on each other. God IS the original sin. He created sin, set things in order for them to happen. Of course he knew it would all happen anyway since he knows everything. So WHO is to blame here. Eve was framed.

The bible says not.

Deuteronomy 24:16
The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.

Ezekiel18:20
The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.






Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by Totakeke
reply to post by FlyersFan
 


The world is in pain because of sin. We chose to disobey God in the beginning and this is what happened. We got what we paid for.


Please stop peddling that crap here.

We choose to disobey god? Really? SERIOUSLY????

So what someone did a long, long time ago, we must suffer for?

That's like a parent punishing you because your great grand dad stole a sucker from the general store 100 years ago. That's just plain DUMB !


[edit on 3-7-2009 by favouriteslave]

[edit on 3-7-2009 by favouriteslave]



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 02:06 PM
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reply to post by '___'eviant
 


According to the lost book of Adam and Eve, the serpent... aka.. Satan, seduced Eve, thus causing her to sin. This was her first sexual encounter, she got pregnant and gave birth to Cain, the murderer. The whole fruit thing is a metaphor. Of course this opened hers and Adams eyes to the fact that they were naked and what that could entail. True? I have no idea, but it makes more sense than a tree and a piece of fruit!



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 02:07 PM
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Originally posted by dgtempe
While i think Genesis (from what little i have read) is a fairy tale, I think Revelations is or could be right on.
You would say well, if you believe in one, the other must be right. Hmmm..
You're right. I suppose, or it could be that the old Bible has been doctored many times thru the years.

In any case, i think the eating of the apple by one person, leading us to a path of destruction is just ridiculous.
Couldnt the snake (devil) have tempted like two out of three or something?
It doesnt make any sense to me, still.
And a few more little tests could have been in order before marking us all as demons and ...where's the compassion. Is there any?
Nope. From day one there was no compassion.

I hope i dont sound ruthless when i say that the worshiping aspect of it turns me off too.
I can love, but do i have to worship???
If God asked to be loved, i could handle it, but worship??? He's got our future in his hands, we are no good in his eyes, and the punishment is really for everyone, including the innocent.
There's nothing fair about this game.
Why not send tribulation to the lives of leaders, and the greedy corporations, and things like that?
Nope. We all must pay dearly.

TRIBULATION FOR ALL!!!!!

We got cheated, folks. I sincerely mean it. i dont pretend to want to live in Paradise, but it would be nice to be able to live without threats from our creator hanging over our heads.

I dont know. :shk:

Hi dgtempe/

In Genesis the eating of the fruit symbolized ''Fasting'' One commandment given to Adam the first man.
Fasting is seen throughout the Old Testament and the New Testament.
All the Old Testament prophets FASTED...and the New Testament.
What is the meaning of the Tree?
The very Tree is a sign of the Cross...Man ate the Forbidden fruit,and therefore fell way from God(sin)
In order to be reconciled with God,The WORD of God became Man. ..Jesus Christ The Son of God!
No ordinary man was able to reconcile man to God,but God Himself!
SIN....falling away from God caused man to DIE!
Physical DEATH occurred that of which God did not create in man but created man to live forever,eternally!
Prophecy.....
Genesis 3:15 states that the seed of the woman would crush the seed of the serpent who brought in the curse of death.?
The Lord Jesus Christ fulfilled this prophecy!
The Serpent is no other then Satan...he who tricked Adam and Eve...you shall not Die he said to them!
The Chosen one was Theotokos....?
Literally means....."the Mother of my Lord" (Luke 1:43)
Archangel Gabriel greeted Her with the words: "Rejoice, O Blessed One, the Lord is with Thee!
Blessed art Thou among women!"Luke 1:28-42
and ''All generations shall call me blessed" (Luke 1:48)..talking to Elizabeth her cousin(S.John the Baptist's mother)
Again from Genesis...God said to the devil: "I shall put enmity between thee and the Woman, and between thy seed and Her Seed" (Genesis 3:15)...this is a future prophecy of DEATH will be destroyed!
"God Himself shall give you a sign," explained the prophet Isaiah to the disbelieving descendants of king David, — "the Virgin shall accept into her womb and bear a Son, and shall name Him Emmanuel, which means: God is with us" (Isaiah 7:14).
"His life a ransom for many" (Matt. 20:28).
"For even the Son of man came not to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many" (Mark 10:45).
The "ransom" is paid to the grave....unto DEATH.
As the Lord revealed to the Prophet Hosea (Hosea 13:14), "I will ransom them (us) from the power of the grave, I will redeem them from death." In a sense, He pays the ransom to the devil who has the keeper of the grave and holds the power of death (Heb. 2:14)....IT was because of the serpant man sinned and fell away from God.
Satan caused death...But he lost at the Resurrection of Jesus Christ.
The apostle Paul calls death the "last enemy" (1 Cor. 15:26)..It has been destroyed by Christ Resurrection!
O Death, where is thy sting?
O Hell, where is thy victory?
"For as by a man came death,(remember DEATH In Genesis?)
by a man came also the resurrection of the dead.(prophecy fullfilled in Christ)
For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive" (I Corinthians 15:21-22)...Adam caused the DEATH of the body to all of mankind not HIS OWN sinful nature(Catholic teaching is wrong)...By DEATH, all have the chance to be with Christ.
A prophecy in Psalms...Christ, risen from the dead, cracks the fortress of death and takes "captivity captive" Psalm 67:19
Christ is risen from the dead,
by death He has trampled down death,
and on those in the tombs He has bestowed life.

The Old Testament ~Work of the Seventy~The Septuagint~
Oldest known Old Testament ''Work of the Seventy'' available now in English.
Work of the Seventy?


The Septuagint has its origin in Alexandria, Egypt and was translated between 300-200 BC... According to an ancient document called the Letter of Aristeas, it is believed that 70 to 72 Jewish scholars were commissioned during the reign of Ptolemy Philadelphus to carry out the task of translation.



The Septuagint contains the standard 39 books of the Old Testament canon, as well as certain apocryphal books.
The term "Apocrypha" was coined by the fifth-century biblical scholar, Jerome, and generally refers to the set of ancient Jewish writings written during the period between the last book in the Jewish scriptures, Malachi, and the arrival of Jesus Christ.
The apocryphal books include Judith, Tobit, Baruch, Sirach (or Ecclesiasticus), the Wisdom of Solomon, First and Second Maccabees, the two Books of Esdras, additions to the Book of Esther, additions to the Book of Daniel, and the Prayer of Manasseh.
All Theologists use the Septuagint...now available in the English language.

The threats are not from God, but of the people who think they KNOW God!
take care,

ICXC NIKA
helen



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 02:13 PM
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Originally posted by dgtempe
I grew up Catholic but i dont know much about religion.


Ain't that the truth
I know what you mean. Actually, there is much spirituality to be found in the RC church, but you have to search for it, and ignore what others have to say.



Originally posted by dgtempe
I am wondering, instead of sending us fire and brimstone, why doesnt a compassionate God intervene in a way that will not kill, men women and children, a planet that will hit and blow us out of orbit, and horrible things like that???

He made us, damn it. Why did he make us FLAWED. Its HIS fault.



I guess church dogma speaks about "original sin", that it's a human condition brought on by humans, not God.
Should be more like, regardless of dogma, it can suck to be human. Period. Life is eating and crapping, sometimes on oneself or on others, sometimes intentionally.


Originally posted by dgtempe
There's nothing compassionate here that i can see.


I dunno, dg, I have seen some incredible acts of compassion by my fellow human beings.

Sometimes I hear about what suffering other people go through. I can't believe what they go/have gone through. Here's the catch, some of them don't see themselves as being miserable while suffering. Unbelievably, they even find it in themselves to try to relieve other people's suffering!

When my son was hospitalized for a terrible injury, I had parents of other hospitalized children come by to comfort ME. THEIR children were in horrible suffering themselves, some I knew were nearer death than my son or whose outcomes could not be as well, and yet, here they were to comfort me. And they were not sobbing, they had somehow found the inner strength to be calm and cheerful. It was Their Inner Strength which helped me find My Inner Strength.

This past year I became aware of a co-worker who had found her inner strength to deal with multi-tragedies in her life. My personal "problems" paled in comparison to what she had been dealt. I only found out, because a fellow co-worker told me about it; I never would have guessed this person had gone through that much!



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 03:36 PM
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There is a Simple Answer to this question

-But I, as only a part of God cannot give you the most complete answer, and I also may be incorrect about what I have to say, however I offer some better understandings for whomever comes across this reply.

Lets first be clear and define who / what GOD is.

GOD IS EVERYTHING .... (PERIOD)

There is nothing that the Original Creator of Everything is not one with and apart of. The Stuff, the Energy that makes up everything that has ever been created and ever will be created from Stars and Planets to the hundreds of Pixels on your Monitor to the very air you are constantly breathing, is made up of this "STUFF", this Energy. This "Stuff" is God made Manifest. This Universal Energy that makes up Everything is God.

God is Not, This thing and Not This Other thing. God Is, to be put simply.. Everything. Therefore it may be more beneficial to understand God not as a he or a she watching over you in Heaven or other such man made illusions, but God expressing herself as Love, Truth, and Life. Have you every heard that there is None But Love? Well this is true!! This equates that Love, Truth and Life are all One and are all connected with that which is GOD.

(~now put that in your pipe and smoke it) (its a joke com'mon! =)

Now, My personal answer to your question: I can only say that God always offers your highest good in all situations, but "she" (God) will never force her will upon you. Each Individuation of God expresses themselves in their own freedom and God will never interrupt that freedom for to do so would be God Limiting God Itself... and this, God will Never do.

Also for Life in this World, Death is an essential part. Birth and Death are the same thing. Birth bringing the individual into this World, and Death returning the Individual to the Core, or Eternal Home. I'm sure some have heard the quote, "You are in this world, but you are NOT of it."

(By the way, the Series of books by Neale Donald Walsch titled "Conversations with God" is an incredibly great source for these exact understands as well as many hundreds more. As I have personally read them all, I can only express my gratitude and offer you a reading you will not regret)

[edit on 3-7-2009 by Sk8rDude7]



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 04:07 PM
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reply to post by wylekat
 


All I can say is that I know how you feel and I'm also tired of the religious one liners used to brush aside our feelings and pain.

IF there is a god, he/she/it has failed US, not the other way around. The all mighty creator has allowed us to suffer. What type of person ignores the pain of another let alone the creator of everything????

And for the record, your pastor should not be a pastor but might better serve the lord as a cashier at McDonalds.



posted on Jul, 3 2009 @ 04:13 PM
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reply to post by desert
 




I dunno, dg, I have seen some incredible acts of compassion by my fellow human beings.


me too

I don't think it helps to always sell ourselves short - we can do some amazing things sometimes - just beautiful

it gets lost in all the rest somehow

also - the billions of tiny little kindnesses we show each other each day all add up - they just don't show up on CNN




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