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My Only God Thread. Why, If God Is Our Father, Doent He Intervene So We Dont Die Or Suffer?

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posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:18 AM
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reply to post by Divinorumus
 


Pretty sure it was a fig. After Adam and Eve ate the fruit they sewed fig leaves together to make clothing, so the fruit was probably a fig.




posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:18 AM
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Originally posted by T0by
Originally posted by jfj123

If there is, the evidence seems to show, he's a pretty crappy parent.



A bad parent to the physical body, yes.
To the soul/spirit? I doubt it.

Why would you doubt it?
Are you actually suggesting that god wants the physical body to suffer so the spirit can be better somehow? That would be a very imperfect system which indicates an imperfect god.

Why would any parent want their children to suffer?


And noone has any idea of what their soul wants or needs.

This is one of those CRAP excuses I mentioned earlier.



Who is to say it is not provided for it via experience, both good and bad?

Another CRAP excuse.
That's like excusing torture to get information.


p.s - I like offering opposing views, sometimes even if i don't believe them myself.

[edit on 2-7-2009 by T0by]

That's perfectly fine. Sometimes it's important to play the devils advocate....so to speak



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:19 AM
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Originally posted by bonsaisert
reply to post by Divinorumus
 


Now you sir are my kind of Human


And yes also good point...if God is there to be found, don't you think it can be found for free?


YOu can get the Bible for free as a PDF ebook online.
There is also the library and if you really wanted one, I'm sure if you dropped into a Church and asked a Priest, he'd give you one. There are millions in circulation and can be picked up a for a few bucks in an Op shop.

I don't know one person who paid $50 for a bible.

BTW the Bibles copyright isn't owned by anyone.
you can make up your own copies.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:20 AM
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Originally posted by Totakeke
reply to post by bonsaisert
 


As far as I know you can still find the original texts written in Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek, the original languages used.

[edit on 2-7-2009 by Totakeke]


Oh right yes sorry i forgot about the stuff God wrote
Don't you see the irony...We both think God exists, its just I know this through more comprehensive ways than reading any form of religious texts could ever do.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:21 AM
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Originally posted by Flighty
reply to post by jfj123
 


Why not blame Satan for that?

Because god made everything right?
So why can't he prevent satan from hurting his children? Better question to ask is....WHY WON'T HE ???


It's been said that it's incomprehensible that God would do these things and yet no one seems to blame the old "lover of misery and death" himself.

Again, didn't god create everything ?


It seems more Satans Modus Operandi than Gods.

[edit on 2-7-2009 by Flighty]

Then shouldn't god step in and have a chat with satan?
After all, if as you say, satan is abusing his children, wouldn't any good parent stop the abuser??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:22 AM
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Personnaly I do not believe in any religion, but I am not an atheist. I believe god is a name that was given for energy, so that god exists, energy surrounds us everywhere, god is always around everyone, god (energy) created life.
To me god does not have power over life or death of a person, but if you psychologicaly believe in something you want or need (by praying for example) the positive energy will help you.

I think only we have the possibility to change things, to demand the energy to intervene.

Anyway it's just my POV, people will think i'am mad.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:23 AM
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reply to post by bonsaisert
 


Well, I was just saying that if you wanted a version of the Bible that hasn't been, as I'm fairly sure you alluded to in your post, altered, you could read the Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek texts.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:26 AM
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reply to post by jfj123
 


God is planning on stepping in and having that chat with Satan very soon.
It's what the religious ones are waiting for, haven't you heard?

BTW Why compare God who created everything, to a human parent?
It's a bit like comparing a human to a molecule.

[edit on 2-7-2009 by Flighty]



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:48 AM
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reply to post by bonsaisert
 





They're looking for God and you have sent them on an Easter egg hunt in search of religion.


Indeed, religion being the source of god, sometimes when on an easter egg hunt we may find jewels and not eggs, but we also may find cat crap.

So did you suddenly wake up one morning believing in a deity ?
Or did you read about one or were told about one ?


Me ? well I've yet to be persuaded that there is a creator of all that there is, although it would seem there's a 50/50 possibility.

But a yahweh jesus god,? Well although I find it laughable and childish, the OP would do well to find there's no truth in the "big" god delusion " first.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:51 AM
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I Know What You Mean, An Artist Doesn't Destroy His Masterpiece



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:53 AM
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god is a story. a bed time story


furthermore, what I am going to say, as a scientist, is true .

most animals on this planet, live the life of an animal. short life, no way out, and die not knowing much of anything

humans. are lucky, we live at a high rate of health, drive powerful cars, dominate the land, have warm shelters eat incredibly good food, and have an abundance of food and equipment and new tools, and products, that an animal can only dream of, and we have and made technology, we basically ARE GODS. ourselves.

compared to animals, we are all powerful, all lucky, and very well off.

ok, so I said what I said

and i thank you for, getting me, to remind myself, and remind us, or how INCREDIBLY lucky we humans are

also how incredbibly lucky we are to be on this planet, a planet of life and living, which is really amazing considering the #ed up cold and desolate planets in our system


so, a scientist, will see things this way. a religious person? mostly they are stupid. but there is a place for religion. most astronauts are very religious. i would be too, if you blew me away in a massive rocket that may very well kill me,

to save the rest of the humans,,, or do some exploration.

anyway, being a scientist, is a damn good thing.

you see reality, and face it. you see how lucky and blessed you really are. and thats religious too, to be lucky to be alive.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:56 AM
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Im not a religious person but i consider myself to be very spiritual. The way I see it is for a start our concept of death is all wrong. All death is is a transition into another realm, death should not be feared or hated for it is the most natural process there is. I think we are a spiritualy imbalanced species probably due to the amount of manipulation we have recieved during the last few hundred if not thousand of years. We aren't here for everything to be perfect and happy and simple, we are here to be tested and to gain experiences which will progress us spiritually and to give us a deeper understanding of ourselves and the consciousness around us.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 05:59 AM
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Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by T0by
Originally posted by jfj123

If there is, the evidence seems to show, he's a pretty crappy parent.



A bad parent to the physical body, yes.
To the soul/spirit? I doubt it.

Why would you doubt it?
Are you actually suggesting that god wants the physical body to suffer so the spirit can be better somehow? That would be a very imperfect system which indicates an imperfect god.

Why would any parent want their children to suffer?


Again, back to the experience theme.

You can't experience up, if you don't know what down is.

You'll notice the universe works with dualities. Hot, cold. Negative, positive.

It's a reoccurring theme throughout the universe.
Why should the human experience be any different?



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 06:01 AM
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reply to post by T0by
 


This is easily solved by looking at the Bible. Eve didn't eat the fruit so she could see just how good she really had it, she ate the fruit because she was tricked into it. It says it right there in Genesis.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 06:04 AM
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Originally posted by Totakeke
reply to post by T0by
 


This is easily solved by looking at the Bible. Eve didn't eat the fruit so she could see just how good she really had it, she ate the fruit because she was tricked into it. It says it right there in Genesis.


What are you referring or relating to? I mean which post.

By the way when debating religion in general, it's best not to quote directly from the text because that is what is being debated in the first place.
Thereby making the quoting of scriptures invalid since that is what is being questioned.

Also this thread seems to be more about god in general, not a bible thread.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 06:07 AM
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Originally posted by michaelj_321
anyway, being a scientist, is a damn good thing.

I don't know about that. It's always been my belief that you scientists will be the death of us all one day. You invented the nuclear bomb, deadly chemicals, GM foods, tools that enable the overlords to control our very lives, extended the lives of humons so that they no longer die when they should and thus so many on Earth now .. .. I could go on and on, ha. Of course, science has brought us some good things too, but is a delicious looking worm hanging on the end of a deadly hook really worth it? If science ends up the death of us all, I'm never going to be able to forgive you all.
So, how's that research going on the search for the god particle? I swear though, if you scientists create a black hole that ruins my future plans, I'm gonna follow you all into hell just to kick ur butts. (lol)

[edit on 2-7-2009 by Divinorumus]



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 06:09 AM
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reply to post by T0by
 


I was referring to your post right before my previous one. If I interpreted your post correctly, you were saying that we experience good and evil because the contrast makes us better appreciate the good, correct? I was just saying that the Bible explains this differently (I referenced the Bible because I assume we were talking about the world in the context of Christianity).



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 06:16 AM
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Originally posted by dgtempe
I never post about religion. I grew up Catholic but i dont know much about religion.

I am wondering, instead of sending us fire and brimstone, why doesnt a compassionate God intervene in a way that will not kill, men women and children, a planet that will hit and blow us out of orbit, and horrible things like that???

He made us, damn it. Why did he make us FLAWED. Its HIS fault.


There's nothing compassionate here that i can see.



I am no theologists, but I will try to answer to the best of my understanding.

First, intervention is contrary to free will. You cannot give someone free will and then intervene, that is not free will.

Second, If you were going to spend eternity with someone, wouldn't you want to make sure they were not a jerk first?

If you were to intervene every time it would be oppressive in relationship to free will, if you were to only intervene in some cases, you would not be seen as fair.

I think every Christian at one point or another has questioned God's motives. For me that was when my father died, I was very close to my father and my brother was not, yet God allowed my brother to spend my father's last few minutes with him and I was not allotted such time. Although my brother never said the things to my father I would have liked to, he was given the opportunity. But looking at it in hindsight, had God intervened for my sake and not when a child was being raped and murdered, that would not really have been very fair and would have been quite contrary to the philosophy of free will.

No-one will ever understand God's motives or plans, this manifest itself in most people as denial, "Surely if I can't understand it, it doesn't exist." I could never stand here and give anyone any evidence that they would accept proving God's existence the same way that no-one else could ever provide evidence to the contrary. If the ticket to Heaven was that easy, it probably wouldn't be worth having. People in our culture have come to expect everything to be easy or else it isn't worth having. What have you taken the most satisfaction out of in life? Things you knew you could do that were easy? or things that you had to work hard for that you didn't think you could accomplish?

Look at it from this perspective:

What is the worst thing that happens if you believe in God and try to live by His standard? It seems the worst that can happen is that you find some purpose in life, conduct yourself in an honorable manner and die with many people knowing your love and you are remembered as a kind and loving person. This also has the benefit of influencing others that see your fine example of humanity, so the world also becomes a slightly better place to live in.

I don't really have a problem being remembered in that way.

Why does it have to be God's fault that we as human beings do evil things. Something that has always bothered me is when society makes excuses for people's actions. I will try to give an example. A young black man makes the choice to rob a store or sell drugs, it is often said that he was a victim of his environment, that because he was brought up in poverty he did these things. Does this help the individual? If a problem does not exist can it be solved? The young black man from my example needs to understand and take ownership of HIS bad decision in order for him to learn from it and grow, denial only promotes more of the same behavior.

We are in denial of our own inherent nature. We do bad things and then look for someone else to blame for them, when we cannot find an easy target, we blame God for not breaking his promise of free will and providing intervention. If God were to intervene there would be a thread here saying that he breaks his promises and says we have free will and then denies us that right. Either way people are going to blame God for man's problems.

How could anyone expect to understand God, when we don't even understand ourselves?

It would appear from my perspective that all we really want is a scapegoat.


[edit on 7/2/2009 by DarrylGalasso]



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 06:20 AM
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Originally posted by Totakeke
reply to post by T0by
 


I was referring to your post right before my previous one. If I interpreted your post correctly, you were saying that we experience good and evil because the contrast makes us better appreciate the good, correct? I was just saying that the Bible explains this differently (I referenced the Bible because I assume we were talking about the world in the context of Christianity).


Kind of. I meant more than appreciate,
I meant that one cannot be known without the opposing force.



posted on Jul, 2 2009 @ 06:20 AM
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reply to post by dgtempe
 


God is not an external entity, the old man in the sky metaphor, imo. God is a conscious energy field subjacent to reality. I think the universe works just unlike a computer. In a computer you have hardware which, through the aplication of electricity, generates software, which I guess we can call analogous to thought. Now, the universe is software, running on nothing but pure electricity, pure energy. This software then, throught vibration generates matter, ie hardware. God here would be the electricity. This is why god is silent, as David Icke says, if you already know everything you don't need to think, God just is.

And we are part of God. Think of the implications of this... most religions put you in subjagation to an authoritarian God, but the reality is that you are a sub routine of God, you can chose how you interact in the field, what realities you manifest. This is where The Secret somewhat touches on the nature of reality. This is also why there is good and bad in the Universe. God works with fractal geometry, so, up from source, which is God itself, there is a subdivision, which is energy and lack of energy, order and entropy. This is at the most basic level, as they feed off each other. You can't understand anything with out understanding it's polar opposite, and this is physics, not just philosophy. There is so much bad in the world so that there can be so much good in the world. And vice versa. It's all a matter of choice really, all a matter of focus. If you're linked to your inner God, if you ressonate the basic geometry of the universe and are not stuck in the subrouting of ego, regardless of the status quo you can always manifest good and evil. Evil however is self defeating and parasitic, there isn't much evil in the world for the simple reason that it kills it's hosts most of the time. All evil does is create the energy needed to overcome itself. This is why all tyrannys fall for example, they are born of evil and they generate revolt and freedom, in a cycle of every growing freedom. Despite all our problems there have never been more free people alive than today. We have the energy although we are still working on manifesting it. It's a natural process.

I could go on but the core idea is people are looking for God in the wrong place. Look inside yourself. Specifically in the heart chakra region. That connects to source. Purify the body and calm the mind and all will become clear. There is nothing to fear. And don't subjugate your spirituality. This is what locks people up in the "body computer", the false ideas of control freaks. All that has to go, regardless of what formal religion it is. At the end of the day there has to be one person's relation to God in freedom. And all becomes clear. And then you have the choice: Good or Evil? Order or Chaos? Truth or Lies? This choice will either develop or downgrade your soul...

All of the above is pretty hypothetical as I'm on a process of discovery myself. However it's the only cosmology and religion that makes any sort of sense in my life and has brought me joy. Take it, or not, for what it's worth I guess.



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