That's because Tamiflu has never worked against any flu. As I said in another post try Colloidal Silver. See here for description....
www.energiseforlife.com...
Swine flu 'shows drug resistance' , page 1
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Topic started on 29-6-2009 @ 11:44 AM by Haydn_17
news.bbc.co.uk...
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[edit on 2-7-2009 by DontTreadOnMe]
Experts have reported the first case of swine flu that is resistant to tamiflu - the main drug being used to fight the pandemic.
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[edit on 2-7-2009 by DontTreadOnMe]
reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 11:51 AM by warrenb
With the death toll from the pandemic at 311 and total cases at 70,893, according to the WHO...
www.nst.com.my...
311 dead out of 70,893 infected = nothing to worry about or something to worry about?
also it seems strange but different media outlets are giving different numbers of people who have H1N1 and people who've died. For example the US supposedly has about 27,717 infected and 127 dead, though they admit that the figures may be understated. (see link above for that)
reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 12:43 PM by CultureD
I also just read this article on BBC:
news.bbc.co.uk...
Interesting that the case of resistance is in Denmark. I think this shows that the mutated strain from South America has circled the globe; or, there are multiple strains circulating, which are developing resistance- or finally, that the SEASONAL H1N1, whis IS resistant to anti-virals, has reassorted with the new strain(s) and appearing in areas where developd nations prescribe Tamiflu for seasonal flu.
The other hypothesis is the one we're leery of mentioning- and that is that this outbreak is following 1918 almost to the letter. It was in early July that mutated strains started showing up- no one had PCR, etc., but people used clinical presentations to differentiate between the milder, first strain and the newer, more lethal one. It dovetails (in this outbreak) with the faster rates of death in those who lose the battle with flu- the morbidity time- even in overweight people, diabetics, people with autoimmunes, etc., who were in hospital for a few weeks before succumbing- are now dying in 2-3-4 days. And young, healthy children and young adults are dying in 48 hours- exactly as it happened in mid- to late summer, 1918. It's how doctors came to realize that the virus had mutated.
The Japanese are the highest users of influenza anti-virals, per capita in the world (and having worked for a Japanese company, I understand why- NO ONE stays home sick- I was treated like garbage for taking two days off with a bad cold; both to get well and not to share it at work- my boss was livid for weeks! I've never met another group of people- cultural, ethnic- whatever- who have such a complete devotion to one's job).
Because the country uses so much Tamiflu and Relenza, I expect that will be the next country in which we see resistance emergence.
This also forces all of us to think more seriously about what's coming. Those of you here with kids will have to give them possibly 4 vaccines before school starts. A series of vaccines ginned up under an Emergency USe Authorization, that might not even pass Phase 1 Clinical Trials, if they had the opportunity. As well- in the back of our heads, I think we have all thought that while the anti-virals are toxic- they were a sort of bright red life preserver. Even if we didn't admit it to ourselves.
Now- we have to become cohesive. We joined this forum for a myriad of reasons, but on this topic, I am begging for cohesion. Let's lay dawn the debate of bioengineered vs. wild type- if we find evidence, post it- but I think we'll find out at some point, and there will be hell to pay if it's lab-made. We'll all make sure of that. Let's be a community- support each other; let's NOT judge someone who does or does not take the vaccine(s). Let's post what we know from where we are in the world (we must be on 6 continents). Our friends, coworkers, families, etc., in many cases, don't realize the magnitude of this. The more information we share, the more we can be of use to those whom we love.
In the next 12-24 months there is a real probablitity we will each lose someone we know, someone we love. We will be frightened. We will be called upon to help others. Let's live up to that and act as a true thinking organism- questioning- indeed- but also working toward solutions sharing wellness techniques, checking in on one another. Is that not why we're on ATS? We all crave an intellectual debate- a site where we can share information. So let's do that- but then, let's USE it.
Wellness and blessings to you all.
news.bbc.co.uk...
Interesting that the case of resistance is in Denmark. I think this shows that the mutated strain from South America has circled the globe; or, there are multiple strains circulating, which are developing resistance- or finally, that the SEASONAL H1N1, whis IS resistant to anti-virals, has reassorted with the new strain(s) and appearing in areas where developd nations prescribe Tamiflu for seasonal flu.
The other hypothesis is the one we're leery of mentioning- and that is that this outbreak is following 1918 almost to the letter. It was in early July that mutated strains started showing up- no one had PCR, etc., but people used clinical presentations to differentiate between the milder, first strain and the newer, more lethal one. It dovetails (in this outbreak) with the faster rates of death in those who lose the battle with flu- the morbidity time- even in overweight people, diabetics, people with autoimmunes, etc., who were in hospital for a few weeks before succumbing- are now dying in 2-3-4 days. And young, healthy children and young adults are dying in 48 hours- exactly as it happened in mid- to late summer, 1918. It's how doctors came to realize that the virus had mutated.
The Japanese are the highest users of influenza anti-virals, per capita in the world (and having worked for a Japanese company, I understand why- NO ONE stays home sick- I was treated like garbage for taking two days off with a bad cold; both to get well and not to share it at work- my boss was livid for weeks! I've never met another group of people- cultural, ethnic- whatever- who have such a complete devotion to one's job).
Because the country uses so much Tamiflu and Relenza, I expect that will be the next country in which we see resistance emergence.
This also forces all of us to think more seriously about what's coming. Those of you here with kids will have to give them possibly 4 vaccines before school starts. A series of vaccines ginned up under an Emergency USe Authorization, that might not even pass Phase 1 Clinical Trials, if they had the opportunity. As well- in the back of our heads, I think we have all thought that while the anti-virals are toxic- they were a sort of bright red life preserver. Even if we didn't admit it to ourselves.
Now- we have to become cohesive. We joined this forum for a myriad of reasons, but on this topic, I am begging for cohesion. Let's lay dawn the debate of bioengineered vs. wild type- if we find evidence, post it- but I think we'll find out at some point, and there will be hell to pay if it's lab-made. We'll all make sure of that. Let's be a community- support each other; let's NOT judge someone who does or does not take the vaccine(s). Let's post what we know from where we are in the world (we must be on 6 continents). Our friends, coworkers, families, etc., in many cases, don't realize the magnitude of this. The more information we share, the more we can be of use to those whom we love.
In the next 12-24 months there is a real probablitity we will each lose someone we know, someone we love. We will be frightened. We will be called upon to help others. Let's live up to that and act as a true thinking organism- questioning- indeed- but also working toward solutions sharing wellness techniques, checking in on one another. Is that not why we're on ATS? We all crave an intellectual debate- a site where we can share information. So let's do that- but then, let's USE it.
Wellness and blessings to you all.
reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 12:59 PM by -Rugged Shark-
reply to post by CultureD
The mutated strain in South America wasn't ,as far as I'm aware, resistent to Tamiflu. This Danish news could mean that there now is a new mutation, which isn't good news at all. If it is resistent to Tamiflu, then the patients can only be treated with Relenza. If this new mutation starts to become resistent to Relenza than we're in deep, deep trouble.
I think you're right about Japan, they do use heaps of Tamiflu and Relenza overthere. It could well be that the next mutation will take place there.
The mutated strain in South America wasn't ,as far as I'm aware, resistent to Tamiflu. This Danish news could mean that there now is a new mutation, which isn't good news at all. If it is resistent to Tamiflu, then the patients can only be treated with Relenza. If this new mutation starts to become resistent to Relenza than we're in deep, deep trouble.
I think you're right about Japan, they do use heaps of Tamiflu and Relenza overthere. It could well be that the next mutation will take place there.
reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 01:03 PM by apacheman
Who needs Tamiflu?
Your best bet as far as I can tell, is to gargle something like habenero hot sauce as soon as you notice a sore throat. Take a tablespoon of hot sauce and push it as far back in your throat as you can without gagging then swiftly tilt your head back and allow it to enter your throat. If you do it right you won't burn your mouth. Repeat whenever you feel symptoms return, but at least every couple of hours for a day or two.
The capsaicins in hot sauce have an antiviral effect that immediately changes the local environment (your throat) in ways that make it extremely difficult for virii to survive. It slows the virus down enough to give your body a better chance to fight it without necessarily killing you in the process. I suspect that it attacks the virus in multiple ways: Ph balance, direct anti-viral effect (i.e., it kills the virus directly somehow), and by making better resources available to the immune system (biochemistry via flavinoids).
Plus it is cheaper and more available.
www.indoindians.com...
jimmunol.org...
Your best bet as far as I can tell, is to gargle something like habenero hot sauce as soon as you notice a sore throat. Take a tablespoon of hot sauce and push it as far back in your throat as you can without gagging then swiftly tilt your head back and allow it to enter your throat. If you do it right you won't burn your mouth. Repeat whenever you feel symptoms return, but at least every couple of hours for a day or two.
The capsaicins in hot sauce have an antiviral effect that immediately changes the local environment (your throat) in ways that make it extremely difficult for virii to survive. It slows the virus down enough to give your body a better chance to fight it without necessarily killing you in the process. I suspect that it attacks the virus in multiple ways: Ph balance, direct anti-viral effect (i.e., it kills the virus directly somehow), and by making better resources available to the immune system (biochemistry via flavinoids).
Plus it is cheaper and more available.
Hot Peppers. A source of capsaicin, a vital immune, mood and metabolic booster with powerful anti-viral effects. Capsaicin is linked to decreased risk of stomach cancer due to its ability to neutralize nitrosamines, a cancer-causing compound formed in the body when cured or charred meats are consumed. Capsaicin also kills bacteria believed to cause stomach ulcers... and appears to turn on the fat-burning capacity.
www.indoindians.com...
jimmunol.org...
reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 01:07 PM by CultureD
reply to post by apacheman
I'm a huge fan of capsasin (capsacin?) -sorry- can't spell it- for everything.
I use it to stop migraines; for ladies issues, to prevent infections; to help my spine, and the pain due to the piles of titanium, etc.
It's brilliant and I'm so glad you brought it up- thank you!
I'm a huge fan of capsasin (capsacin?) -sorry- can't spell it- for everything.
I use it to stop migraines; for ladies issues, to prevent infections; to help my spine, and the pain due to the piles of titanium, etc.
It's brilliant and I'm so glad you brought it up- thank you!
reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 01:12 PM by CultureD
reply to post by -Rugged Shark-
Shark-
I have read differening articles about the S. Am. strain- some are claiming its resistant, and some are not. I know there's a shift in the M2 RNA sequnece, but it will remain to be seen.
You make a good point, however, that this is probably a case of unique mutations popping up all over-passaging viruses through humans does one of two things- in Ebola and like-viruses, it tends to render them LESS lethal after having passed through 5-10 generations (e.g., people). In influenza, like HIV, Herpes strains that cause Epstein-Barr, etc., passaging tends to INCREASE virulence, which is why flu can travel the globe for years and keep killing, whereas Ebola tends to "burn out" rather quickly.
It's a nasty trait of a brilliantly evolved organism.
If anyone has info on the S. AM strain and if it's resistant, I'd love to hear- the sources I've read about t have been sketchy, to say the least, and I'd like some sort of scientific confirmation either way.
Meantime- strap in and enjoy the ride, eh?
Shark-
I have read differening articles about the S. Am. strain- some are claiming its resistant, and some are not. I know there's a shift in the M2 RNA sequnece, but it will remain to be seen.
You make a good point, however, that this is probably a case of unique mutations popping up all over-passaging viruses through humans does one of two things- in Ebola and like-viruses, it tends to render them LESS lethal after having passed through 5-10 generations (e.g., people). In influenza, like HIV, Herpes strains that cause Epstein-Barr, etc., passaging tends to INCREASE virulence, which is why flu can travel the globe for years and keep killing, whereas Ebola tends to "burn out" rather quickly.
It's a nasty trait of a brilliantly evolved organism.
If anyone has info on the S. AM strain and if it's resistant, I'd love to hear- the sources I've read about t have been sketchy, to say the least, and I'd like some sort of scientific confirmation either way.
Meantime- strap in and enjoy the ride, eh?
reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 01:37 PM by apacheman
www.breitbart.com...
www.cidrap.umn.edu...
www.postchronicle.com...
www.thedaily.com.au...
www.medcastle.com...
en.mercopress.com...
There's what I found so far on the Sao Paulo variant. It appears, if it is truly a new variant (the CDC disagrees), that it is adapting to become more easily transmissable. I can't find anything that implies that the Brazilian and Argentine strains are the same yet; the lethality of the Argentine strain seems to be a lot higher than the Brazilian. If they combine.....
But scanning those stories makes me glad I can bunker up for awhile if need be.
www.cidrap.umn.edu...
www.postchronicle.com...
www.thedaily.com.au...
www.medcastle.com...
en.mercopress.com...
There's what I found so far on the Sao Paulo variant. It appears, if it is truly a new variant (the CDC disagrees), that it is adapting to become more easily transmissable. I can't find anything that implies that the Brazilian and Argentine strains are the same yet; the lethality of the Argentine strain seems to be a lot higher than the Brazilian. If they combine.....
But scanning those stories makes me glad I can bunker up for awhile if need be.
reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 02:06 PM by -Rugged Shark-
reply to post by CultureD
The most complete info that I've found on the A/Sao Paulo/1454/2009 strain is from biohealthbase.org
They show the following:
Oseltamivir resistance - NA 275Y in N1 subtype Segment/protein not present
Oseltamivir resistance - NA 292K or 119V or 294S in N2 subtype Segment/protein not present
So by going by that it isn't resistant to Tamiflu.
The most complete info that I've found on the A/Sao Paulo/1454/2009 strain is from biohealthbase.org
They show the following:
Oseltamivir resistance - NA 275Y in N1 subtype Segment/protein not present
Oseltamivir resistance - NA 292K or 119V or 294S in N2 subtype Segment/protein not present
So by going by that it isn't resistant to Tamiflu.
reply posted on 2-7-2009 @ 07:52 PM by CultureD
reply to post by CultureD
Well- I'm really sorry to say that I called it- but Tami- resistance in Japan is no surprise:
www.google.com...
We should all work for CDC- fire the idiots there, and at WHO....
Well- I'm really sorry to say that I called it- but Tami- resistance in Japan is no surprise:
www.google.com...
We should all work for CDC- fire the idiots there, and at WHO....
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