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Nine ex-Nazis given life sentences

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posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 01:46 AM
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Originally posted by Awolscout
reply to post by Ace High
 


Saying "Mass Murder is not the business of the US" I will say that I do agree with a lot of what you said about jumping to defend other country's by saying "we did such and such" but at the same time we are also most definitely not above mass murder. Personally I wouldn't put america anywhere near the same level as the nazi reich however we still aren't all cupcakes and daisy's we really are one of the more... violent country's out there in how we operate.

When I say that sentiment I'm referring to the "we can do no wrong" thought that I was subjected too for so long... that said if that's not what you meant I apologize I do tend to go at people's throats over what I saw pretty fast.


The US does plenty of wrong. I blame the politicians! If the real citizens had a say it wouldn't be so.

I still stand behind the sentiment that all Nazis should be persecuted to the full letter of the law.

Maybe I have studied history too much, my hatred of the Nazis is so pronounce.




posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 01:48 AM
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reply to post by BlasteR
 


That's perhaps one of the greatest war crimes I can think off. It's funny how the Nazis had tribunals.. As where the japanese who did equally evil things.. Simply gave intel the US and almost none of them were tried.


The winners really do write history.



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 01:54 AM
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Originally posted by Ace High
The US does plenty of wrong. I blame the politicians! If the real citizens had a say it wouldn't be so.

Unless the politicians are the ones pulling the triggers, then it's the pawns who are firing their rounds into the civillians. The pawns are there by choice, they didn't have to sign up to be grunts. They chose to be slaves to their masters and they're the ones putting innocents in their graves. Ooohh - rah!


Originally posted by Ace High
I still stand behind the sentiment that all Nazis should be persecuted to the full letter of the law.

Because they were Nazis or because they committed war crimes? Perhaps there were some completely innocent Nazis, have you ever thought of that? I'm sure that some of them would have had a conscience.


Originally posted by Ace High
Maybe I have studied history too much, my hatred of the Nazis is so pronounce.

There would be very few people who would think that what Hitler did was good.

Looking at it dispassionately, Hitler didn't bomb two civillian cities with nuclear weapons, did he? The commanders of those two war crimes were celebrated and recognised as being heros. Double standards, huh?



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 01:56 AM
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reply to post by Ace High
 


I cant entirely share the sentiment that it's the politicians that are doing this sad to say... Like you said you study history I study people and societal norms and Im almost scared that as evil as our government can be that you get glimpses that underneath it all they represent the truly average american in how they act towards the world, we are a greedy people and were not the most forgiving either


But at least I still got some hope left



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:10 AM
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Originally posted by tezzajw
Unless the politicians are the ones pulling the triggers, then it's the pawns who are firing their rounds into the civillians. The pawns are there by choice, they didn't have to sign up to be grunts. They chose to be slaves to their masters and they're the ones putting innocents in their graves. Ooohh - rah!


The pawns who just wanted a college education, the GI Bill? How many soldiers do you know personally? I know 3. Three may not be a lot but that is who I know. They shared their photos with me. They told me how happy the children were when they played soccer with them. They shared with me how they mourned the deaths of their friends killed by IED's. They were heros. Those that committed atrocities should be burned at the stake.



Originally posted by tezzajw
Because they were Nazis or because they committed war crimes? Perhaps there were some completely innocent Nazis, have you ever thought of that? I'm sure that some of them would have had a conscience.


Clearly, you did not read the thread that I posted about Reserve Battalion 101, it discusses the psychology of the German citizen during World War II. If you were okay with humans being shuttled like cattle into death camps then fine. Do you realize that the trains were loaded so tight that many died in transit? They were forced to defecate on the dead bodies below them. The ones who tried to escape the trains were shot by the guards riding the train. If you read my thread, many were afraid to be called cowards so they went along with the atrocities.


[edit on 28-6-2009 by Ace High]



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:21 AM
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reply to post by Ace High
 


And how can you know that you would react any differently? Talk is one thing. Howver you've proved nothing until you stand up against the tyranny when a line of soldiers are pointing their rifles at you.

The well understood fear tactics, they did them very well. Those people that got shot? They wanted to let people know their fate was the same if they got out of line.


Besides that. I've met a couple of marines personally.. They were pretty normal guys, though I dont think many of them had actually been to combat. My brother is one. He told me about how when he ate lunch one time, his friends were showing him pictures of dead bodies in Iraq, "Crispy critters" as they're called. All soldiers are different, some have had some worse experiences.. but too many civilians have died due to carelessness.. And just because something may have been an accident doesnt make it ok


[edit on 28-6-2009 by Miraj]



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:21 AM
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Originally posted by Ace High
Those that committed atrocities should be burned at the stake.

I wouldn't go that far, but soldiers who commit war crimes should be treated the same way - no matter who's side they are on.


Originally posted by Ace High
If you were okay with humans being shuttled like cattle into death camps then fine.

No. I am not ok with that. You probably didn't read my previous post where I clearly stated that few people in the world would agree that what Hitler did was right. I think it's a blight on humanity what the Nazis did in the concentration camps. I also think that it's a blight on humanity what the USA did to Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Too bad the Japanese don't have as much political pressure as the Jews do, hey?


Originally posted by Ace High
If you read my thread, many were afraid to be called cowards so they went along with the atrocities.

Could the same be said for the pilots of the Enola Gay?



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:31 AM
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Originally posted by tezzajw

Originally posted by Ace High
Those that committed atrocities should be burned at the stake.

I wouldn't go that far, but soldiers who commit war crimes should be treated the same way - no matter who's side they are on.


Originally posted by Ace High
If you were okay with humans being shuttled like cattle into death camps then fine.

No. I am not ok with that. You probably didn't read my previous post where I clearly stated that few people in the world would agree that what Hitler did was right. I think it's a blight on humanity what the Nazis did in the concentration camps. I also think that it's a blight on humanity what the USA did to Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Too bad the Japanese don't have as much political pressure as the Jews do, hey?


Originally posted by Ace High
If you read my thread, many were afraid to be called cowards so they went along with the atrocities.

Could the same be said for the pilots of the Enola Gay?


The nukes are your problem?

LOL

Check out the fire bombings of Dresden and Tokyo. Those were the true ugliness of war.

en.wikipedia.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

Only after the fire bombing of over 50 cities did the US bomb Nagasaki and Hiroshima.

Of course, I read your thread, and I understand what you said. Why would I not read your thread?? I am trying so hard to see why everyone is attacking me for simply saying that the Nazis should pay for what they have done. I just wish you could understand that the US is nothing compared to the Nazis that is my only point in this thread.

[edit on 28-6-2009 by Ace High]



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:34 AM
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Originally posted by Miraj
reply to post by Ace High
 


And how can you know that you would react any differently? Talk is one thing. Howver you've proved nothing until you stand up against the tyranny when a line of soldiers are pointing their rifles at you.

The well understood fear tactics, they did them very well. Those people that got shot? They wanted to let people know their fate was the same if they got out of line.


Besides that. I've met a couple of marines personally.. They were pretty normal guys, though I dont think many of them had actually been to combat. My brother is one. He told me about how when he ate lunch one time, his friends were showing him pictures of dead bodies in Iraq, "Crispy critters" as they're called. All soldiers are different, some have had some worse experiences.. but too many civilians have died due to carelessness.. And just because something may have been an accident doesnt make it ok


[edit on 28-6-2009 by Miraj]


I know for a fact I would react differently. I have stood up for the the down trodden and protected the innocent with my very life. These things I have personally done. I have put it all on the line.



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:37 AM
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Originally posted by Ace High
The nukes are your problem?

War is my problem.

Hitler's actions. The nukes. Dresden. Japanese POW camps. Everything.

There were numerous war criminals on both sides.

I rank all of those actions as equally deplorable.

What I don't like is when ONLY the Nazis are persecuted for all time. The OP shows how stupid it is. Trying to prosecute old men, before they die, is nothing but glamour-justice.



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:42 AM
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reply to post by Ace High
 


I'd like to know when you had to stand up with the AUTHORITIES pointing loaded guns at you.

It's BS to say you know how you would react, and I doubt any of us have been put in that situation unleess you come from a place such as North Korea, or Iraq (Before we bombed it...the second time)

Personally I'd like to think that I would risk my life and die a martyr, but I can't guarantee that. I've never been in such a situation to dictate how I would act.

If you have been put in that situation and did the right thing, then good for you. But realize that the human psychology begs authority, no matter how ruthless it might seem.



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:46 AM
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Originally posted by tezzajw

Originally posted by Ace High
The nukes are your problem?

War is my problem.

Hitler's actions. The nukes. Dresden. Japanese POW camps. Everything.

There were numerous war criminals on both sides.

I rank all of those actions as equally deplorable.

What I don't like is when ONLY the Nazis are persecuted for all time. The OP shows how stupid it is. Trying to prosecute old men, before they die, is nothing but glamour-justice.


Old men now. They have evaded justice for 60+ plus years. Years that 6 million Jews never had. That is why I say a public hanging is more appropriate.



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:48 AM
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Originally posted by Miraj
reply to post by Ace High
 


I'd like to know when you had to stand up with the AUTHORITIES pointing loaded guns at you.

It's BS to say you know how you would react, and I doubt any of us have been put in that situation unleess you come from a place such as North Korea, or Iraq (Before we bombed it...the second time)

Personally I'd like to think that I would risk my life and die a martyr, but I can't guarantee that. I've never been in such a situation to dictate how I would act.

If you have been put in that situation and did the right thing, then good for you. But realize that the human psychology begs authority, no matter how ruthless it might seem.


All I can say is that I have had a sawed off shotgun pointed at me and my life on the line for the innocent and I stood my ground. My wife is alive thanks to it.



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:48 AM
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Once the fanaticism of the nazi empire took over Germany, it was do your job and commit atrocities, or be killed yourself.

These old men probably didn't have too much of a choice in what they did. The real lesson, I think, is that war should be avoided at all costs -- used only as a LAST RESORT. It's also a wonderful demonstration of what happens when democracies fall victim to personality cults.


This might also act as a warning to US troops -- because, lets face it, America may not be on top forever, and if we ever go down (so to speak), the same trials will be used against US soldiers and allies who committed atrocities in Iraq. Everything from torture to gunning down crowds of civilians because one guy, out of 30 or 40 people, pulled out a gun and shot at American troops.

History will remember that the occupation of Iraq was a war of aggression, and an unnecessary one at that.



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:52 AM
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reply to post by Ace High
 


Good enough


But still, when the system is working against you, the very thing that is supposed to protect you.. What do you do? In the case of the jews, you get killed if you tried to stand up. Nobody will be there to help you, and everyone will be against you. It's a sad situation, but I fully understand how it happened.



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 02:57 AM
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Originally posted by Kaytagg
Once the fanaticism of the nazi empire took over Germany, it was do your job and commit atrocities, or be killed yourself.

These old men probably didn't have too much of a choice in what they did. The real lesson, I think, is that war should be avoided at all costs -- used only as a LAST RESORT. It's also a wonderful demonstration of what happens when democracies fall victim to personality cults.


This might also act as a warning to US troops -- because, lets face it, America may not be on top forever, and if we ever go down (so to speak), the same trials will be used against US soldiers and allies who committed atrocities in Iraq. Everything from torture to gunning down crowds of civilians because one guy, out of 30 or 40 people, pulled out a gun and shot at American troops.

History will remember that the occupation of Iraq was a war of aggression, and an unnecessary one at that.


The Germans had a choice. Read the thread I posted.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

These men had a choice. Their commander offered them the opportunity to opt out from all Jewish actions. They chose to stay in b/c they would be considered cowards. Which is ironic b/c they are considered cowards for killing the innocent Jewish women and children.

With regard to the Iraq war, most troops served their country with honor.




posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 03:05 AM
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reply to post by Ace High
 


I think you are misunderstanding facts here.

The U.S. government is still run by Nazi's and no I'm not saying "Nazi" as in "bad" people. I really mean LITERALLY Nazis. When WW2 was over, the U.S. gathered up lots of Nazi scientists and leaders, and brought them over to the U.S. and gave them high profile ranking jobs.

Most changed their names and their companies names as well.

The Skull and Bones was started by Nazis, and every member of the club is a closet Nazi as well (Bush, Kerry, etc.).

So when you say what the Nazis did is nothing compared to what the U.S. is doing, you are simply being mistaken.

The Nazis are running this government like they did with Germany. As a matter of fact, Nazis are pretty much running most of Europe as we are currently writing this. You can go research the facts yourself.

Don't let the name of "Democracy" fool you. It's just another name for Nazism.

Hitler's idea never died, and it is going to be in full effect very soon. You will see what I'm talking about VERY soon.

It's all part of a plan to reduce the population and get rid of the "undesirables".

This is the direction that the world is heading into.

[edit on 28-6-2009 by bobbylove321]



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 03:14 AM
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Originally posted by bobbylove321
reply to post by Ace High
 


I think you are misunderstanding facts here.

The U.S. government is still run by Nazi's and no I'm not saying "Nazi" as in "bad" people. I really mean LITERALLY Nazis. When WW2 was over, the U.S. gathered up lots of Nazi scientists and leaders, and brought them over to the U.S. and gave them high profile ranking jobs.

Most changed their names and their companies names as well.

The Skull and Bones was started by Nazis, and every member of the club is a closet Nazi as well (Bush, Kerry, etc.).

So when you say what the Nazis did is nothing compared to what the U.S. is doing, you are simply being mistaken.

The Nazis are running this government like they did with Germany. As a matter of fact, Nazis are pretty much running most of Europe as we are currently writing this. You can go research the facts yourself.

Don't let the name of "Democracy" fool you. It's just another name for Nazism.

Hitler's idea never died, and it is going to be in full effect very soon. You will see what I'm talking about VERY soon.

It's all part of a plan to reduce the population and get rid of the "undesirables".

This is the direction that the world is heading into.

[edit on 28-6-2009 by bobbylove321]


Bobby it appears you are talking conspiracy, etc. This thread was starting on an article about elderly Nazi criminals being thrown in jail for life. All I was saying is that it is too little too late.

Yes, the US brought in Nazi scientists after WWII. We pretty much split them with Russia. In fact they were the backbone of both the US and Soviet space and military programs.

Many US trusts were pro-Germany during WWII. I have done extensive research on the involvement of US companies in Nazi Germany. IBM was very involved in Nazi Germany. It is disgusting.

This does not seem on topic with the original thread with regard to elderly Nazis being sentenced to life in prison.






edit for typo.

[edit on 28-6-2009 by Ace High]



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 03:15 AM
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Originally posted by Ace High
Years that 6 million Jews never had.

Just like the 200,000 Japanese who were incinerated by the nukes.

Why aren't the Manhattan war criminals hunted down like the Nazi war criminals?



posted on Jun, 28 2009 @ 03:16 AM
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Originally posted by Ace High
Old men now. They have evaded justice for 60+ plus years. Years that 6 million Jews never had. That is why I say a public hanging is more appropriate.

And also years that you cannot take back... Or give.

The war ended over 50 years ago, we should put it to rest sometimes. Sentencing old men will do nothing except tear up old wounds.



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