It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

We Masons are not Illuminati!!!

page: 29
8
<< 26  27  28    30  31  32 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 02:39 PM
link   

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.
reply to post by Majestic23
 


Have you ever considered that the masons on here may not know about their fraternity's involvement with the NWO. We've got to stop gathering all freemasons together and accussing them all of being part of the NWO. They simply cannot all be in on it.
It seems to me that the masonic lodges may be hunting grounds for the NWO. A place where they can find and groom rich businessmen, bankers, members of the law and politics, and prepare them for greatness.

I dislike masonry but they really can't all be in on it can they?



Of course, I have tried to explain this a few times.




posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 02:43 PM
link   

Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by Majestic23
 


I am sorry to put you through this, and I truly hope your week at work gets better. I answered your question and I have a few of my own to ask you. I am not in a hurry for the answer, so take your time.
1. What constitutes a "High Level mason"?
2. Where do "High Level Masons" meet?
3. What is it that they want?
4. Are you sure?


An addendum: How is it that a non-Mason presumes himself better versed than a Mason on the structure of Masonry?



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 02:59 PM
link   

Originally posted by Majestic23

Not at all. It is no surprise you are left brained.

So, we see such mysticism in the Masonic teachings etc...

We also see such mysticism and numerology in events like 9/11, not only that, but the twin towers were built on a leyline (in fact at a node/chakra between them). You will find this corresponds with the mystic traditions that Freemasonry is built upon.

So I am of the opinion that the only group capable of doing this was the Freemasons or a group working through them.

Your opinion on this please.


From what I know, Ley lines are not masonic. They were around long before masonry was in existence. they are a mystery in themselves. Speculative masonry was derived from Operative masonry. Operative masonry is the dudes who cut stones and built magnificent structures. Speculative masons adopted the esoteric teachings and adopted them into lessons for life. We are given three lectures when being initiated. One for each degree. We even have slides. (I am installing a projector and setting up a power point presentation to get our lodge out of 1972) Each lecture expounds on the working tools of that degree, and the symbolism that surrounds that degree. I can't tell you all about them since I took an oath to keep the secrets, but I would be very surprised if you had not goggled them as they are very easy to find. It would be cool to think that masonry in any form had the power you suggest it does, but from what I have seen, it just doesn't. If the WTC was built on a ley line, it very well may be symbolic and may indeed be a conspiracy within a conspiracy, but nobody I know thinks that. It may not be the answer you are looking for, but it's the best I can do.

edit to add: bottom line is, I am probably not the guy you need to ask these questions to. If you answer my questions, specifically number 2, I will go there and ask them.

[edit on 21-7-2009 by network dude]



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 03:05 PM
link   

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.
reply to post by Majestic23
 


Have you ever considered that the masons on here may not know about their fraternity's involvement with the NWO. We've got to stop gathering all freemasons together and accussing them all of being part of the NWO. They simply cannot all be in on it.
It seems to me that the masonic lodges may be hunting grounds for the NWO. A place where they can find and groom rich businessmen, bankers, members of the law and politics, and prepare them for greatness.

I dislike masonry but they really can't all be in on it can they?



Of course, I have never once thought that all Masons are when I was a novice conspiracy theorist, Ive tried to indicate this a few times.



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 03:12 PM
link   
reply to post by Majestic23
 





conversing with multiple Masons on this topic is enough to make anyone irate


Now you know how I feel. But, currently there are 3? 4? Masonic threads, all of which I don't have the energy to keep up with. Besides, if I stuck with that same topic I'd be bored to tears.



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 03:26 PM
link   

Originally posted by Majestic23
And then I gave a broken link. This should be the correct one.

www.freemasons-freemasonry.com...

So you can see how alchemy and mysticism are relevant to the Freemasons.


Relevant in relation that certain symbols were co-opted, this does not automatically demonstrate a 'belief' in magic.


Originally posted by AugustusMasonicusBecause it is not. Religion offers salvation, show me where Masonry preaches salvation.



Religion
Noun
1. A strong belief in a supernatural power or powers that control human destiny; "he lost his faith but not his morality".

2. Institution to express belief in a divine power; "he was raised in the Baptist religion"; "a member of his own faith contradicted him".


Or, from Dictionary.com. :

Noun

1) a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.

We do not wish to force our 'moral code governing the conduct of human affairs' on anyone.


And if you wanted to add salvation to that then knowledge acceptance and mastery of the afterlife is as good a salvation as anyone of us can hope for. This is literally "enlightenment" or "illumination" or arguably salvation.


While I respect that this is your opinion of what 'light' may be, as Masons we are reminded that light is always meant to be knowledge.


Maybe on its own it doesant. But then one keeps seeing more and more of this type of thing. Perhaps when I mention the all seeing eye on also on the dollar you will say it is not Masonic,


It is not and there are numerous non-biased sites and publications which show the origins of the Great Seal of the United States.


...perhaps when I mention Masonic architechture in Washington and its street layout you will say its not Masonic.


It is not and if you are going to super-impose crudely drawn stars and squares and compasses then you will not really be helping your arguement. Think about this for a second, if Masons really wanted to create a street layout the had a square and compass, or any other Masonic symbols, why would they not make them a more correct representation?


When I metion the Skull and Bones club you will say the skull and bones is not linked to Masonry etc...


It is not, I will grant you that there may have been Bonesmen that went on to be Masons that does not make Skull and Bones masonic or Masonry involved with Skull and Bones.


This goes on ad infinitem. If the Masons are so concearned with denying all links to the secret government...


If this government is so secret then how do you know about it and its members?


then why arent you refuting any of these things catagorically, all I hear is "coincidence". If you want to defend Masonry all you have to do is explain all these coincidences.


I do not see it as coincidence, I see it as a combination of poorly researched theories, laziness in regards research and paranoid extrapolation of similarities.


Apologies, when I said explain I meant understand.


No worries. I can not help anyone understand (or explain) life. I have yet to find the meaning of it all and I think the only way I will discover this is by traveling to a place that none of us can return from.



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 03:42 PM
link   
Oh dear. How to argue your case if your a mason. . .

Why are many occultists also masons?

Answer,

Just because occultists become masons doesn't mean masons are occultists!

Why do freemasons wear aprons?

Answer,

Just because all masons wear aprons doesn't mean all aprons belong to masons. . .!

Why do freemasons wear white gloves?

Answer,

Just because all masons wear white gloves doesn't mean that all white gloves are worn by masons. .

Enough already!! We get it. You aint going to answer a simple question without going around in circles and speaking down to people. It's utter tripe. If you've got nothing of interest to say please, for the love of all that is holy, stop with the grasshopper-esqe dialogue. Its getting real dull.



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 03:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.
Oh dear. How to argue your case if your a mason. . .

Why are many occultists also masons?

Answer,

Just because occultists become masons doesn't mean masons are occultists!


You're asking a sort of loaded question. It's kind of like asking "Why are many occultists non-Masons?"

I think it's pretty obvious that a lot of Masonic symbolism and ritual is based on traditional western occultism. That's probably the reason a large number of occultists became interested in Freemasonry, and is why I myself became interested in it.

On the other hand, even though Freemasonry was influenced by the western occult tradition, it is today composed mostly of members who are non-occultists. So if a an occultist joins Freemasonry in hopes of fellowshipping with others of like mind, he will probably be disappointed. But if he joins because he wants to personally experience authentic initiation, he will probably be pleased.



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 03:50 PM
link   
reply to post by Mintwithahole.
 


do you really want to know about the aprons?
relax. this is supposed to be fun. If it was work, you would be getting paid for it.



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 04:20 PM
link   
How about this?

Why did the Freemason cross the road?



A. Because he did!! but can you prove it?
B. Did you see such road? Was it paved or cobblestone?
C. What was his name? No name? AHA! No proof he crossed!
D. It is a secret. This stupid question will self-destruct in 5 seconds



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 04:41 PM
link   

Originally posted by suzque66
How about this?

Why did the Freemason cross the road?


Because he was stapled to the chicken???



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 04:46 PM
link   

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.
Why are many occultists also masons?


Perhaps they are attracted to the occultic base that forms part of Masonic ritual.


Why do freemasons wear aprons?


It symbolizes innocence and purity of heart.


Why do freemasons wear white gloves?


Same as above but these are typically not worn with the same frequency as aprons. This does vary, however, from jurisdiction to jurisdiction.


Its getting real dull.


You make it sound if your arm is being twisted for you to stay and read posts on this forum.







[edit on 21-7-2009 by AugustusMasonicus]



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 04:49 PM
link   

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by suzque66
How about this?

Why did the Freemason cross the road?


Because he was stapled to the chicken???


have you ever seen The Last Boyscout? Bruce Willis movie. I was going to answer Suz with that one, but I didn't want any red added to my avitar.



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 04:52 PM
link   


have you ever seen The Last Boyscout? Bruce Willis movie. I was going to answer Suz with that one, but I didn't want any red added to my avitar.


No, and you masons watch too much tv an movies. I know why they wear the aprons now, for sure.


POPCORN holders!

[edit on 21-7-2009 by suzque66]



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 05:05 PM
link   

Originally posted by network dude
have you ever seen The Last Boyscout? Bruce Willis movie. I was going to answer Suz with that one, but I didn't want any red added to my avitar.


Better if you did not, they already think we get it on with the goat, leave the avians out of this.



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 05:30 PM
link   

Originally posted by network dude
I am sorry to put you through this, and I truly hope your week at work gets better. I answered your question and I have a few of my own to ask you. I am not in a hurry for the answer, so take your time.


Please, I was explaining my behaviour, if I am going to apologise it should at least be sincere. But thankyou for showing concearn.

1. What constitutes a "High Level mason"?

A Mason generally who has been in the order for some time and who has a good standing in society and position of influence. I would suggest that some personalities are "fast tracked" through the Order as it were, this is often relative to money or family ties. Iam sure this is not the case for the majority of the groups, but some undeniably practice this. There are many Masons and ex Masons who would corroberate this.

2. Where do "High Level Masons" meet?

If we are talking about regular high level Mason I would say Masonic halls and clubs etc...

If we are talking about high level Masons involved in the secret government then we might look at places like The Bohemian Grove and related places. It could be in any number of locations as the Masons we are talking about have a lot of money and resources.

3. What is it that they want?

They are pawns in the game of tptb ( I would call tptb Luciferic consciousness in essence, but this is too abstract for most ). By falling into line and playing ball they get power, wealth and influence or they simply get wrapped up in the game. If they reach a high enough level, or are seen to have potential or are the relative bloodlines of the tptb they are fully initiated into the mystical traditions as tptb know them.

I am going way off course with this but the overall goal of the powers that be is complete control of our souls and our reality. They are obsessed with the game of re-incarnation and do not want spiritually developed humans to gain power outside of their sphere of control. So it goes far beyond real world activities. In essence all of our reality is dualistic forces, the powers that be might be a manifestation of Yang forces. If they are evil or not is open to interpretation. My understanding though is that illumination of any kind is actually transcendance of these forces. This is why you Masons will hear a lot about Masonic architechture like Cleopatras Needle or the Washington Monument representing the phallus and such, it is also why some believe the Masonic order will cease to function as it does after 2012. This currant epoch was one of male dominance and the next will be female. Its as though we can see these changes happening in society already.

4. Are you sure?

Unfortunately yes. This appears to be the state of play. Everything I have discovered thus far and my instincts say it is so.
What surprises me is that most every faith that adheres strongly to raising ones vibration ( in essence soul alchemy) with set rituals and principles. Such as The Hindu faith, the Muslim, ancient Jewish religions, the Kahuna of the South Pacific, the Vodoo, Native Americans and many more all generally come to the same conclusions about the nature of reality.
And yet the Freemasons dont approach these secrets.

Or do they?

May I ask what the Masons have to say about the afterlife?



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 05:38 PM
link   

Originally posted by Majestic23
May I ask what the Masons have to say about the afterlife?


Interseting question, I wish I could give you a definitive answer but I often vacilate between: nothingness (my least favorite), re-incarnation (with-out prior experiences), a different level of consciousness or another plane of existence of which the one we recently departed was only a 'proving ground' of sorts.

You?









[edit on 21-7-2009 by AugustusMasonicus]



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 05:45 PM
link   

Originally posted by Majestic23
May I ask what the Masons have to say about the afterlife?


When we say a prayer, like at the opening of the lodge, we talk about the house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. This is a reference to the afterlife of course, but each mason is implored to follow his own religious path. In that, his own version of the afterlife. We discuss that our journey isn't over when we die, it actually just begins. In fact, if you look at Appaks last post, he mentions that as well. My belief is personal to me and I doubt most would think along the same lines, but I believe that way just the same. As was stated earlier, masonry doesn't offer salvation, it only offers a guide to put what you learn into perspective. you own perspective. I hope that answers your question. I have to go to practice for a second degree now so I will check back tomorrow. this is the one where we get to bar-b-q the sacrificial goat. oops, I wasn't supposed to tell that.



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 05:48 PM
link   
Wow...Did I just watch Masons argue about if "lucifer and Jesus" are the same thing? Call me ignorant if you wish, thats fine, ignorance is bliss in this case! This thread has already proven to *me* at least why some think this "secret scociety" is up to no good. Just by hearing some of these long-time Masons speak about their "wise" positions on Lucifer, KKK and the occoult, I can see much clearer now, why they are so often accused of being NWO/Illuminati/Satan worshipers etc. I can also tell, just by pure observation and nothing more, that some of them think *way* too highly of themselves by patronizing other (perhaps not even by intent!) "brothers" because of their lack to conform to pro-lucifarian positions. It's kind of like watching the twighlight zone. Anywoo, Whether it's a myth or not is moot, "lucifer" is an icon associated with Satan, like it or not.



[edit on 21-7-2009 by Wookiep]



posted on Jul, 21 2009 @ 06:29 PM
link   

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Majestic23
May I ask what the Masons have to say about the afterlife?


Interseting question, I wish I could give you a definitive answer but I often vacilate between: nothingness (my least favorite), re-incarnation (with-out prior experiences), a different level of consciousness or another plane of exisitence of which the one we recently departed was only a 'proving ground' so sorts.

You?


There is doubtless a degree of crossover. I believe we, conscious beings, are in effect divisions of God, if we think of god as the pure force of creation, a being whose infinate mind is the matrix on which all conscious experience is played out upon).

We see things continously divide and replicate once we get into sacred mathematics and also all that is (in our highly restricted viewpoints as incarnate humans, the artificial place that is our waking reality) follows the Hermatic laws of repetition.

So, all past present and future and all possibilities are out there in existance at all times. It is like a symphony and our souls are like instruments that sound out the notes, the experiences we have in life and the path our incarnations take. The score is always there but it is not activated until it is played.

Our higher selves, which are like demi-gods or deamons ( we are lesser gods, divisions of god on a small scale, we are still linked to all other incarnations of god and are all one, we are just further away from the source) act as managers for our currant incarnations. It is possible that higher selfs maintain multiple Earthbound incarnations across space/time at any one instance. There is no time in the regions outside our waking reality, when I say regions outside they are neither inside or out as such, the multiverse as per the rules of sacred geometry can be infinately small and infinately large at the same time.

In a sense unless we reach enlightment while in our human earth incarnations we never actually reach the afterlife. We simply start the process again as another incarnation or on a slightly differant life path than the last. This allows a great amount of information to be obtained by a higher self, and so enlightment will eventually come naturally down the line of incarnations.

We never actually reach a point of death from our perspectives, time simply doubles on itself in our dieing consciousness and our higher self runs our life pattern again. Like a record being changed (sorry Scoot, 70s referance there!).

It is apparent that the Jesus characters we see are basically higher selves being incarnated into regular human bodies. IE god come down to Earth.

It is hard to explain, I will be glad to try and flesh out any of that if you are interested.





[edit on 21-7-2009 by Majestic23]



new topics

top topics



 
8
<< 26  27  28    30  31  32 >>

log in

join