this is not necessarily about the climate change as it is about the upcoming resource crunch. not sure if this has been mentioned but the US has only about 5% of the global population, yet uses up 25% of the global energy and creates about 20% of the total the global pollution.

the problem is that china, and other countries in south america and asia are becoming more industrialized and require more resources. so there will be a point where it will be our lifestyle vs the chinese. not sure if you want to be drafted for a china energy war but i surely don't!

so the solution is simple: raise prices slowly, indirectly through taxes that will force more people to become energy efficient. it will be cheaper to buy energy efficient bulbs than pay the electricity for traditional light bulbs. insulate homes because it's cheaper than pay 1 year for the air leaks. buy a laptop which uses far less power than a desktop. you get the point...

this way people will adjust over the next 10 years or so to a lower energy usage and thus we can avoid energy wars. it will be unpleasant but we will be better off in the long run. and it will stimulate some segments of the economy, those that help increase energy efficiency. and of course we'll have another exchange that we can invest our money in...

Take heart; Obamination can not perpetuate his fraud indefinately. When he is exposed as an illegal alien, everything he has done, said, or signed, will be null and void. It will probably take us many years to undue the damage this Nephalim has done, but in the end, he has already lost! And we have already won...

Yup great time to impose onerous shackles on America's dying factory infrastructure. Right when the economy is in the toilet hole and no one can compete with the slave labor camps running the factories overseas.

Once we are all on the dole we can join the obama work camps and bow down every day to our fearless leader. That's one thing I can say for the democrats, they sure know how to increase their support base. Simply impoverish the middle class and make everyone needing a handout.

I can't believe that I'm on an ATS site!

Conspiracy theorists that don't tag the biggest conspiracy of all!

Take away the inventions that save energy in the name of national security and then tax the hell out of current methods.
Suggest old fashioned windmills and over expensive solar power which would take a 20k investment per household to properly install at a time that houses have lost value and banks won't cant lend a copper penny?

Duh! Its about driving us into the dust of poverty. Nothing More.

If you haven't read about the 80 years of inventions / inventors being silenced or killed then why did you enter the ATS site?

I thought it "almost" passed... At least that's what I read on the news.. I must've missed something O.o

Edit: WAIT Nevermind! I misread the article... Shame on me

[edit on 6/28/09 by MoothyKnight]

I wonder how the states are going to respond to this bill?. Are they talking at all of this bill?.

they had only 3 hours to read it. it was over 2000 pages allegedly. for sure it was over 1200 pages.


also i have been fallowing this bill with Alex Jones. they have been changing the billls name non stop so ppl cant protest it like;

a protester might be saying; "DONT PASS carbon stoping act of 2009"
when the bill is named like carbon reduction act.-i made those names up just an example

they even changed the bill number because we where protesting the bill number

also we where calling into congress and they kept on turning the switch boards and out of 20 numbers they gave to alex jones none worked. he had to look it up adn he gave them up.

I read this forums for such a long time, but never really write anything.

First while I am not fan of Obama (he is not my president), why on earth you guys think he is doin any worst then Bush?

From my perspective almost all things Obama did - was good - around 90% of them.

Even helping some of your industry to get out, was GOOD things, not cause it was easy, but cause it was hard.

So many people here have no idea what economy really is, and that economy is just one big circle that can be cut anywhere.

You cant say "I dont care for this or that" - cause it will bit you in the ass down the road.

Economy is like Eco system. You remove the BEE's then there is nobody there to make what is need for flowers to grow and expand.

And look how BEE's ar small.

Regarding your TAX.

You ar all small minded in my eyes, USA have 10x more military budget then any other country out there.

All world combine dont have military budget that you guys have, and yet, you dont really geting upset over that.

Now when something good happen for a change you ar not happy.

Also all this bull# that MAN dont have influence over earth clime, that's all just BS.

Saying it's a BS and this or that, it's really crazy.

What we have no is everyone say "Ok, earth is geting hoter, but that's not cause of us, but it's natural thing".

Everyone who thing that's the case is just pure ignorance.

Also, almost all EUROP countries ar doin x10 times more then USA for goin GREEN.

Is it cost us more? Yes. Ar we stupid for giving money for it? No.

I want my kinds to have ability to go in nature and do all things I can still do today.

Also all this SOCIAL crap you guys ar scared of is really a joke as well. Almost all Countries at EUROP north ar based on SOCIAL model, and they ar working just fine (ofcourse not witout problems). So for sake of reason, if you cant really stop saying "We american ar best" be the man and admit there is BETTER/DIFFERENT models out there - that others ar doin it better then USA.

On topic of CHINA/INDIA/others country who ar poluting earth.

That's all CORRECT.

But this countries ar trying to catch up - and trying to expand industry at x10 times speed of what EUROP and USA did.

Look at past what kind of polution happen in USA before alot of rules and laws was setup to prevent it.

It did not happen over night for sure. And there was ALOT Of resistance.

So welcome to the club, now you know how we feel when we ar looking at Americans driving all big stupid cars and trying to explain them, that's a total waste of energy, but nobody really care that. You guys only care how much it will hurt your wallet.

You ar still paying 2x less fuel then we pay in EUROP.

And you know why we doin so? Casue we stupid?

NO! Cause we care MORE then just small mind personal gain for our self.

Ofcourse there is people in EUROP who will not agree on me.

All the crap happening in USA did not start with OBAMA or, it's a process that last for many many years.

All the DEBT you guys have and all other issues you pile up, did not happen just in 24 hours.

Nobody really care about any of that, you just type "It's OBAMA, its' a NWO, it's bla bla bla bla".

Moste of you should be really shame to even talk about any of this things, and if you really want to make a difference, start from your own life.

Go greee, go buy smaller car, go fix your house, so you dont have alot of bills to pay, do whatever is need to get things done.

And if you then have something to bit** about, then bring it.

But at the any given moment/day, anyone in USA is paying any utility bills lower then anywhere in WORLD.

Except many fuel that compare to Saudia Arabia or similar country's cost much much less for well know reasons.

This BILL is good for USA people as well for the world.

One day maybe some of you will maybe even see it.

Luckily - bovine farmers will probably be able to catch a tax break if they attach a wonderful apparatus to their livestock to catch their farts before they destroy the atmosphere and cause global warming:
(there are trials being conducted in the EU...)



*We can build more of them, we have the technology.

Soon people will be forced to where masks with filters which turn blue after being saturated with C02. These will be placed in masks that you will be obligated to wear in public -

They will have about a twelve hour life span and being caught in public with a 'blued filter' will result in fines and possibly six months in jail depending on whether or not you are a repeat offender. The filters will be sold everywhere and given out for free to low/no-income Americans - you will have no excuse.

*Obviously there will be nose plugs to prevent cheating (which will be a felony anyways) - below is an example of what is to come:



You guys still think I'm joking?


[edit on 28-6-2009 by Exuberant1]

Oh my god. You guys need to turn off Fox TV and do some research. Deny ignorance right? Give me a freakin' break

Here in Ontario they just passed the "Green Energy Act". Scary stuff. If people can't see the fascism creeping into this, then I just give up.

As I understand it, this bill passed in the US is very similar. The devil is in the details.

The Ontario Bill 150:

Takes away your civil right to object to any infrastructure project proposed for your neighbourhood regardless of impact on you and your family.
Strips municipalities of their planning protection rights, effectively re-zones all of Ontario into an Industrial zone.
Severely curtails environmental rights.
Eliminates the need for proper Environmental Assessment thus putting Threatened and Endangered Species at risk.
Eliminates previously protected designated Green Spaces and gives them to Industrial Wind Turbine developers.
Excludes Ontarians from any say or objection in the establishment or location of industrial wind turbine plants.
Systematically Silences Ontario citizens .
Fails to address health issues or any impacts on residents whatsoever
Bestows the Energy “Czar” power over pricing and procurement.
Awards aid to commercial wind-turbine developers, whose profits will come exclusively from public funds (guaranteed 20 years).
Enacts a ”reverse onus” clause whereby developers will no longer be accountable, but rather it is the “victim” who must prove harm by doing their own costly environmental assessment. The victim is allowed only 15 days to complete.
Infringes on our right to fair government, health and safety, and erodes trust and checks and balances in the system.
Raises your electricity bill by an estimated 30%
Search and Seizure – Grants the government the right to enter a place of business without a warrant to ensure conformance to energy audit standards with fines of up to $25,000.