House passes Pelosi's climate change bill

Originally posted by whatukno

Originally posted by lynn112
I'm at a loss for words anymore.

Apparently not.

This man has somhow managed to destory a nation in just a few short months. God only knows what our country, our world, will be like after 3+ more years of this man being in office.

I mean with the total destruction, flames, famine, hell on Earth that it is now. It's hard to imagine how your able to post on the internet. I mean with the lack of power and those roving gangs of liberals clawing at your door asking for change and all.

Sorry, but it is hell on earth. People are suffering & while I have have all the comforts of a normal family in the US, how long before that changes? How much more can the average family take before those comforts become a thing of the past? Yeah, I'm the internet. I paid for the use out of my money, money I earned & money that is disappearing because some lazy person decides he doesn't need to work because they have Obama to take care of them.

As for the liberals clawing at the door, tht would require them to actually do something other than spew their opinion as fact & throw their money at trying to convince the "little people" that they know what's best for us.

Yeah, like I'd listen to the likes of Sean Penn, the man with a history of drug abuse & spousal abuse. Or hey, how about Pitt/Jolie? Should I listen to a woman who also happens to be a complete flake? You know the gal who likes to make her men bleed to get off, the woman who lives in her multi-million dollar homes & tells the "little people" we don't do nearly enough? Yeah, this is where I'm going to get the facts. Sorry, but I'll make up my own mind thank you

My heart breaks, but I dare not speak out, I'll be labeled a "domestic terrorist" & "detained indefinitely" for the "safety of the country." It's a sad day when a citizen of The United States fears speaking out against their government, a right our constitution supposedly protects.

Yep, man those human FEMA cars are just filling up aren't they? You say your afraid to speak out, yet here you are.

I have never really believed in those FEMA camps, trains, etc. What I do believe is Obama's own words. His government has labeled several of my beliefs as being terroist. Why should I not think I would make some government watch list if I dare speak my opinion? His words say i will.

Now I have to go figure out how my family will stay afloat in an economy where hard work is rewarded with the government taking your money to give it to others.

Yea that charity and good will toward others bull [snip] so overrated right?

I am a very charitable person. I volunteer a ton of my free time and money to several organizations. The thing is, the government has no right to stick their noses into that part of my private life. (and no, none of the org's I work with are politcal, they work with victims of crime)

I'm sorry Obama, but my wallet is not yours to plunder everytime you want to make your friends filthy rich.

Hey, look at the bright side of things, if they get nice and rich they won't want to give it all away and Obama's buddies will make him pass more republican like measures so that they (and therefore you) can keep more of their money.

For some reason you seem to think I'm a republican? Well, you are sorely mistaken. I'm not affiliated with any party because my beliefs cross the spectrum from Libral to conservative.

As for the money, your statement just does not make much sense. How can you think any average family will gain from measures that raise our tax burden and make our everyday costs sky rocket when pay rates remain the same? Explain to me how I'll have cash rolling in when my wallet keeps getting used as the governments personal bank account?

Oh screw, IMO, Obama is a corrupt SOB & he should be removed from office under the rights afforded to the American people while we can still actually do it.

Perhaps pitchforks and torches?

None of that nonsense is needed when our laws say we can remove him in a very legal and peaceful way. Besides, if Obama keeps on this destructive path, no one will be able to afford a pitchfork or torches.

BTW, to those talking about cow gas, the good old state of NY was actually considering a law that would charge tax on farmers for this very thing. I thought it was a joke at first, but nope, they really went there.

Yep I thought I smelled BS in this thread.

Touche.

ATS is quickly becoming little more than a republican talking point website.

how is a climate bill a conspiracy...its transparent...it was a talking point for months if not years before the election.

now...unless somewhere buried in there it says "and zeta reticuli citizens are allowed to harvest souls in high pollution areas..." then I am not seeing this befitting a conspiracy website...this is just sour grapes from a political party...

if I want to read republicans moaning, I would go listen to Rush Limbaugh...not here..

grrr

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
Here are the 8 Republicans that voted FOR the bill:

Bono Mack (CA) 202-225-5330
Castle (DE) 202-225-4165
Kirk (IL) 202-225-4835
Lance (NJ) 202-225-5361
Lobiondo (NJ) 202-225-6572
McHugh (NY) 202-225-4611
Reichart (WA) 202-225-7761
Chris Smith (NJ) 202-225-3765

Can you spell treason?

You forgot the 219 democrats who do not care what the American people think.

It is both sides.

I think a republican (or democrat) should be able to vote however they want - but that doesn't mean this bill is good.

reply to post by earlywatcher


Oh just really fascist/communist stuff like this

(b) Distribution of Allowances- The Administrator shall, in accordance with this section, distribute emission allowances allocated pursuant to section 782(i) of the Clean Air Act not later than September 30 of 2012 and each calendar year thereafter through 2025

Section 136(d)(1) of the Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007 (42 U.S.C. 17013(d)(1)) is amended by striking `$25,000,000,000' and inserting `$50,000,000,000'.

God this is bill is literally the take over of the entire country by the Federal Government.

Click Here and select bill number then type in HR 2454

Originally posted by whatukno
Does it matter?

Uh, yeah, it does matter whether you have any idea of what you're talking about.

The cap and tax plan will cost everyone immensely, and the worst part is that it will eliminate millions more jobs at the worst possible time.

If this legislation is not stopped in the senate it will be time for Americans to revolt.

The US must be destroyed at several levels in order for the Obama administration and congress to achieve their ultimate goals, they know it, they also know they do not have a lot of time to make it happen... And they are well on the way to accomplishing their goals.

Think of what they have control over now, and what they are openly planning to do in the future.

We will become a socialist country, with a government that is more massive and powerful than ever before, and will be more intrusive into our lives than at any time in our history. This government will crush the capitalist system, what is left they will own and control. You will work where they want you to, you will drive what they tell you to, you will have NO choice in your personal and family health care plan, your success potential will be severely limited. You will be taxed in every possible way.

The final blow will be when it all breaks down and this government gets complete control of the food industry. And that is also in the works.

They MUST be STOPPED.

Fight the passage of this legislation in every way you can, let your voices be heard and fire them all when the time comes to vote... It is the only way, and could be our last chance to save our country as we know it.


[edit on 27-6-2009 by Walkswithfish]

Originally posted by SaturnFX
ATS is quickly becoming little more than a republican talking point website.

how is a climate bill a conspiracy...its transparent...it was a talking point for months if not years before the election.

now...unless somewhere buried in there it says "and zeta reticuli citizens are allowed to harvest souls in high pollution areas..." then I am not seeing this befitting a conspiracy website...this is just sour grapes from a political party...

if I want to read republicans moaning, I would go listen to Rush Limbaugh...not here..

grrr

I'll put it as simple as possible. People are ticked off because this bill will cost the average person a lot of money they no longer have in our crappy economy. The only people who will get anything out this bill are those in charge of the company that will auction off these carbon credits, the price of which will be an additional burden on the taxpayer.

People are also ticked because this bill is disguised as a "green bill" when it does nothing to help the enviroment. The same pollutants will be used, companies now just have to pay Uncle Sam to do it.

Originally posted by SaturnFX
ATS is quickly becoming little more than a republican talking point website.

how is a climate bill a conspiracy...its transparent...it was a talking point for months if not years before the election.

Is adding a 300 page amendment to the bill at 3:00 am to be voted on the same day transparency? Does Obama bribing a Republican Representative to vote for the bill sound ethical to you?

We don't even have definitive proof that Global Warming even exists, yet the Democrats want to use it to justify a huge tax increase on each and every American. The way this bill was debated and passed is just another Obamination.

[edit on 27-6-2009 by RRconservative]

Originally posted by SaturnFX
ATS is quickly becoming little more than a republican talking point website.

how is a climate bill a conspiracy...its transparent...it was a talking point for months if not years before the election.

now...unless somewhere buried in there it says "and zeta reticuli citizens are allowed to harvest souls in high pollution areas..." then I am not seeing this befitting a conspiracy website...this is just sour grapes from a political party...

if I want to read republicans moaning, I would go listen to Rush Limbaugh...not here..

grrr

So let me get this straight. You were cool with ATS when it was all about Saintly Obama and the devil himself, Bushie, but now that he is pissing people off left and right, we are not allowed to disagree with what he is doing because only Bush is allowed to get stomped on for his screw-ups?

Nice to know that you seem to think ATS shouldn't allow people to express their opinion. Maybe the real problem you have is that people everywhere are seeing your Saint for the con is he.

reply to post by SGTChas


Well.. Normally Im not for violent revolution. But since they were so discrete about it..

edit: Im paranoid. Don't want to get flagged by he NSA.

[edit on 27-6-2009 by Miraj]

[edit on 27-6-2009 by Miraj]

Thank You pelosi supporting the climate (shame) bill that the House passed yesterday and that could come to additional taxes and skyrocketing energy costs per year of $3000.00 per household that will include the poor. Now on to the Senate next and 300 pages were slipped into the bill at the last hour for no one would have time to read the fine print in the House Of Representatives. What a shame perpretated on the U.S. taxpayer and energy consumer.

So this means that Congress does not read the bills they pass correct, including the stimulus package, what a joke. So since we can depend on Congress not reading a bill before it is passed and signed lets send Congress a bill that would give everyone in the U.S. $1,000,000. You want a stimulus package you've got it and just think how many cars, houses, goods, services and jobs this would create in the U.S. Dah!



[edit on 27-6-2009 by amari]

Originally posted by FritosBBQTwist

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
Here are the 8 Republicans that voted FOR the bill:

Bono Mack (CA) 202-225-5330
Castle (DE) 202-225-4165
Kirk (IL) 202-225-4835
Lance (NJ) 202-225-5361
Lobiondo (NJ) 202-225-6572
McHugh (NY) 202-225-4611
Reichart (WA) 202-225-7761
Chris Smith (NJ) 202-225-3765

Can you spell treason?

You forgot the 219 democrats who do not care what the American people think.

It is both sides.

I think a republican (or democrat) should be able to vote however they want - but that doesn't mean this bill is good.

You really miss the point. Representatives are supposed to carry out the will of the people they represent.That is if they care to get reelected!
They are not "MINI" Presidents that dictate policy to the people that elect them. When the incomming calls to congress are 8 to 1 against a bill and you still vote for it. You should lose your job.

This bill is a complete disaster. Even if your manage to power your home off the grid, the cost of everything else you purchase in order to continue living in that home will increase. Gasoline & diesel prices will go through the roof because the oil companies will be facing very stiff taxes. They will simply pass the cost of the taxes on to their customers - us. Diesel fuel powers the trucking industry. The trucking industry delivers food to your local grocer. Food costs will rise as a result.

Farmers are being given incentives to grow corn to use in the manufacture of ethanol. This "Ethanol Corn" will force "Consumable Corn" prices to rise, again raising the price of food and animal feed. The increased cost of feed will make beef more costly.

Then there is the manufacturing aspect. What do you think business will do when their costs' rise? They will begin to think about relocating - out of America...or maybe "Uncle O" will just buy them all out. What's a few more trillion? As if things weren't bad enough now, wait until this legislation becomes law.

I get a headache just thinking about this mess. If this bill makes it through the Senate we are in for some serious trouble.

The President himself has stated that this legislation will increase costs' across the board and that it will indeed hit every one of us in the wallet:

www.youtube.com...

Did you catch the part where they say how our newly-lowered taxes will offset the increased costs' this legislation will create? What a f**king joke.

Folks, we are in serious trouble.

Call or write your Reps & Senators in DC. Tell them that you will do everything in your power to see that they are not returned to office if they support this legislation.

Don't know who your reps are?
Here's the number:

DC info: (202) 224-3121

reply to post by jerico65


This piece of legislation is horrible. If this does make it through the senate, one good thing will come from it. That is the very very good possibility of a viable third part rising to the fore front. It almost isn't worth it for us to get a third party this way though.

If this passes through the senate people are going to be some kind of PO'd. This will be the Third Bill that has gotten shoved down our throats.

For the record I consider myself a centrist, and I shamefully admit that I WAS an Obama supporter. I was a fool. Nothing else I can say at this point.

This is not a partisan issue anymore people, I don't give a damn where you are in your political ideology. Its time to wake up to the new reality and to what is being forced on the American people... And that is all of us, regardless of what party you are in.

The only answer that those in Washington seeking to destroy this country in order to build a new socialist nation is

NO

!

They need to hear it from all of us.

If you value your jobs (provided you still have one), if you value your freedom, if you have lived long enough to have seen the greatness that was, is and should be the United States of America, then the time is now, the word is simple.... Tell your congressmen and senators NO.

If they hear from enough of us they will know that to continue to participate in this kind of destructive reform of our nation will mean political suicide for them. If they ignore us they will pay for it in the polls when the elections come.

Their plans amount to kicking the American people while we are already down. Fight back!

reply to post by whatukno
Have you read the bill? It is over 1300 pages long. The Dems slipped in a 300+ page amendment at 3:09 AM Friday, June 26th. A copy of the entire bill was not even made availabe until Thursday. We only have some idea what the amendment said because House Minority leader took over an hour(over the protest of the Dems) to read aloud the highlights of the bill.
What happened to the transparency Obama promised?
He's all blow and no go, apparentlhy.

reply to post by SaturnFX
Are you kidding? Everytime I post my conservative views on a thread, with few exceptions, I am horribly flamed. Not that I care, since I stand up for what I believe in, regardless of what oters think.

probably get something like this trying to be brought in in the uk.

it all seems a bit contrived at times, and are they really bothered about the environment?.

Bureaucratic nightmare?Thats an under statement.You would have to be lawyer just to understand this bill.But i can read english so here it goes.
Page 1071 PART 2—INTERNATIONAL CLIMATE CHANGE
ADAPTATION PROGRAM
SEC. 491. FINDINGS AND PURPOSES.
a) FINDINGS.—Congress finds the following:
(1) Global climate change is a potentially sig-
nificant national and global security threat multi-
plier and is likely to exacerbate competition and con-
flict over agricultural, vegetative, marine, and water
resources and to result in increased displacement of
people, poverty, and hunger within developing coun-
tries.
(2) The strategic, social, political, economic, cul-
tural, and environmental consequences of global cli-
mate change are likely to have disproportionate ad-
verse impacts on developing countries, which have less
economic capacity to respond to such impacts.
(3) The countries most vulnerable to climate
change, due both to greater exposure to harmful im-
pacts and to lower capacity to adapt, are developing
countries with very low industrial greenhouse gas
emissions that have contributed less to climate change
than more affluent countries.
(4) To a much greater degree than developed
countries, developing countries rely on the natural
and environmental systems likely to be affected by climate change for sustenance, livelihoods, and economic
growth and stability.
(5) Within developing countries there may be
varying climate change adaptation and resilience
needs among different communities and populations,
including impoverished communities, children,
women, and indigenous peoples.
(6) The consequences of global climate change,
including increases in poverty and destabilization of
economies and societies, are likely to pose long-term
challenges to the national security, foreign policy, and
economic interests of the United States.
(7) It is in the national security, foreign policy,
and economic interests of the United States to recog-
nize, plan for, and mitigate the international stra-
tegic, social, political, cultural, environmental, health,
and economic effects of climate change and to assist
developing countries to increase their resilience to
those effects.
(8) Under Article 4 of the United Nations
Framework Convention on Climate Change, developed
country parties, including the United States, com-
mitted to ‘‘assist the developing country parties that
are particularly vulnerable to the adverse effects of climate change in meeting costs of adaptation to those
adverse effects’’.
9) Under the Bali Action Plan, developed coun-
try parties to the United Nations Framework Conven-
tion on Climate Change, including the United States,
committed to ‘‘enhanced action on the provision of fi-
nancial resources and investment to support action
on mitigation and adaptation and technology co-
operation,’’ including, inter alia, consideration of
‘‘improved access to adequate, predictable, and sus-
tainable financial resources and financial and tech-
nical support, and the provision of new and addi-
tional resources, including official and concessional
funding for developing country parties’’.
b) PURPOSES.—The purposes of this part are—
(1) to provide new and additional assistance
from the United States to the most vulnerable devel-
oping countries, including the most vulnerable com-
munities and populations therein, in order to support
the development and implementation of climate
change adaptation programs and activities that re-
duce the vulnerability and increase the resilience of
communities to climate change impacts, including
impacts on water availability, agricultural produc-
tivity, flood risk, coastal resources, timing of seasons,
biodiversity, economic livelihoods, health and diseases,
and human migration;
BREAK-this is just 3 pages of the 1090 page bill.
link for UN framework
unfccc.int...

ill need at least a few days to read an understand the implications of this bill.Briefly i counted at least two bureaucracies that would be created maybe more.I could be wrong but the wording of it can be misused in many ways.All of it based on global warming theory aka climate change.