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This is HUGE...

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posted on May, 7 2004 @ 06:48 AM
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Dude. I've read the link and it doesn't sway me.

As for me proving you wrong? You're the one with the theory. The ball is in your court and you have to prove it correct.




posted on May, 7 2004 @ 07:00 AM
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Like I could prove, beyond a doubt, that this is really happening.



Mr. M



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 07:11 AM
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"ATS is about uncovering the truth, not refusing to acknowledge theories and research information. I think it is childish of anyone to blatantly refuse to believe ANYTHING."

i refuse to believe in the christian god because the theory's so ridiculous with countless flaws. your theory is pretty stupid aswell. i dont understand why you would think the government staged 9/11 so they could increase security in airports, meaning they can take more people in and implant things into their body....but not before injecting them with a special chemical that'll mean they'll forget it ever happened!



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 07:15 AM
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Well then don't worry about it then! You obviously could not give a #, so just forget about it! Stop posting on my thread and just leave it at that...

If you don't have anything positive to contribute, don't contribute...

Jeez...


Mr. M

[Edited on 7-5-2004 by StarChild]



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 07:42 AM
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It seems to me that if you post a THEORY and want feedback on it you should be willing to hear positive or negative.




If you think my theory is bunk, fine. DON'T POST ON MY THREAD! I started this thread based on a "theory" (key word), and I hoped to get some positive feedback from ATS.


As has been pointed out if the only reason for the WTC was to increase airport security there are so many easier ways to do that. I can see the increase as one of many things that have come out of WTC, but the scale of the attack seems to be designed for a much greater impact then to have people ingnore someone being taken for questioning at an aiport.

I am not trying to shoot down your theory just for the sake of it. You have stated your theory, I have looked at what you said and provided, and have some questions thats all.

Why the WTC if the ONLY thing you want to accomplish is to increase airport security?


I do not think that an increase of airport security in and of itself would have caused much concern to the public in general. "WE'RE SAFE, WE'RE HAPPY". If needed an event could have been used but I think would not have been needed.

However with WTC you have people not only not concerned about an increase in airport security but asking for more in all facets of their lives. For most, "I'm a law abiding citizen therfore I have nothing to worry about with ALL of these security measures, besides it's about time the goverment did something"



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 07:50 AM
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The WTC, in my opinion, was used to trigger many significant events, not only "airport security".

The events proceeding 9-11 have changed the lives of people all over the world, in many ways other than security. Some good, some bad.

Here are a few reasons I can think of why it would be beneficial to the U.S. Government to stage 9-11...

1) Increased airport security (for the previously mentioned reasons).

2) Invade Iraq and take control of the oil.

3) Remove Saddam Hussein and his regime.

4) Remove nuclear weapons from all countries determined by NATO, in order to increase the effectiveness of our own fire power.

5) Create the ability for U.S. Troops to move more freely under the guise of the GWOT.



Mr. M



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 07:56 AM
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That was all I was trying to get across, was that the WTC seemed more than just airport security. Thank you for the clarification.



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 08:01 AM
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No problem.


I understand the ramifications of 9-11, however, the point I am trying to get across here in this thread is that the actions of 9-11 make it a lot easier to detain people in airports. And when you consider the location of the underground facility in Denver (an AIRPORT!!!), it makes perfect sense why they would use airplanes to hit the towers.

Understand my point now?


Mr. M



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 11:15 AM
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A few musings on this idea. Firstly, to come to a conclusion that the attacks on the WTC/Pentagon on 9-11 were staged is to make some rather big leaps of judgement.

Firstly and most obviously, motives are not evidence, sure we can say 'the govt' had a series of hidden motives to stage this. But we also should take into consideration the motive of Al-Qaeda to carry out an attack on America. Another in a series of attacks on the US' interest, and an attack that had been promised for some time.

Secondly, such an attack is a massively expensive, convoluted and downright risky way to achieve those goals. Especially if we are willing to accept the idea that 'they' are ready to kill thousands of US citizens, stall the Economy and knock down half of Manhattan to achieve them. Surely it would be easier to just stage some sort of nuclear attack on a US target in the Gulf and claim it was from Iraq. Even a series of WMD attacks, perhaps not all on US targets, making it far easier to get int'l support. Smaller simpler missions with the same result. Less risks.

Now, as I pointed out earlier, there are leaps of judgement there to reach the 'staged' conclusion. There is a large number of possible 'real' stories behind the attacks. The 'staged by the govt' one is at one end of the spectrum, and the perfect plan by Al-Qaeda that noone saw coming is at the other end. In between we have such fun things as the govt having prior knowledge but not being able to stop it, or the govt having prior knowledge and still somehow allowing it.

I think at the moment it is still in the 'not being able to stop it' category. Sure afterwards people have jumped on the bandwagon, many pushing their own agendas. Some of them utterly lacking in tact as they did so. But that isn't really anything out of the ordinary.

Now I think as far as we can push it with what we know is to this. Maybe a small group of people did know (or at least very strongly opinions) that an attack was imminent. Even perhaps that it involved hijacking a plane. Maybe the figured a little homeland terrorism would be a good wake up call. Boost their importance, tighten up a few loose ends around the place. So they didn't push so hard. It is rather unlikely that this would be the case if they knew exactly what the scale of this attack would be. There is still no reason at all to conclude that anyone in the US govt had full prior knowledge and was either involved with staging, or gave their blessing to this attack. There are still a hell of a lot of other options to expend before reaching that one.


Plus, if this really was the plan, wouldn't 'they' have come up with someone smoother to pull it off?



posted on May, 7 2004 @ 12:25 PM
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Just a few points to address here.




1) Increased airport security (for the previously mentioned reasons).


I've already pointed out that increased airport security has no baring on airport securities ability to detain perceived security threats. The criteria for a perceived security threat in an airport is much loser then it would be say at a bus stop. About the only thing it really does is increase wait times at security check points and allow for more random checks. In fact the TSA will randomly search one passengers carry on items per-flight. You can increase the changes you will be that person by having a one-way ticket.




2) Invade Iraq and take control of the oil.


Do your homework and it'll prevent you from sounding very uninformed. OPEC controls oil prices in the Middle East... not us... not us now, not us in the future. So why would we care about controlling oil if we can't control the prices? We don't. We never did. Anyone who tells you differently has an agenda.



3) Remove Saddam Hussein and his regime.


This would of happened 911 or not. It just happens that 911 happened and it made the process for Bush to wage war MUCH easier. In fact if you again do your homework you would know Bush was planning a war on Iraq BEFORE 911. Which pretty much blows a hole in the meat of your argument.



4) Remove nuclear weapons from all countries determined by NATO, in order to increase the effectiveness of our own fire power.


This is one of the most ambiguous statements yet. It's pretty well known we don't want irresponsible people to have high destructive weapons. This of course will make us that much more powerful. But as a nation our track record in how we use our WMD's is pretty damn good. We dropped nukes on Japan once and now everything is forgiven. Otherwise we just sit on them and say if you hit us we're going to plaster you to the wall back. That's about the only thing we do with our nukes.




5) Create the ability for U.S. Troops to move more freely under the guise of the GWOT.


How didn't we have that ability to being with? Our troops end up all over the world as it stands. They always have and always will. We get involved where no one else will. Personality I'd rather us get involved with "other peoples problems" then sticking our heads in the sand and ignoring the world around us. Just because it "doesn't involve us".



Anyhow I'm sure you'll gleam over this post just like my last one.


-s0ck

[Edited on 7-5-2004 by s0cket]

[Edited on 7-5-2004 by s0cket]



posted on May, 8 2004 @ 12:13 AM
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Originally posted by StarChild

Originally posted by Phenomium
First and foremost, they had proof that the terrorist was on the planes and did the deeds of destruction. there was the video footage of them on the airports boarding, there was evidence they were members of al-quida in the airline logs and flight stubs and books, they left evidence on computers and other items behind in their apartments attesting to their involvement,as well as the earlier flight training and the ultimate slap in the face Bin Laden and other upper echelon testamenting their masterminding and laughing all the way to the next cave.The idea of a worldwide airline moneymaking scheme at the higher cost of the 2 towers and thousands of lives, seems a bit greedy even for a corporation, indeed a bit risky. It seems that if airports were to do that for security funding.......the rest of the world is who really needs the funding from the airlines.
Another point I might make is, islamic people dont work well with us, so the worldwide thing is out the window seeing that an islamic people did the actual crime.
Also, a better idea in this same process might be that bush ordered an inclandestine cia based attack on the towers and allowed bin laden to do this terrible deed on our own soil......to give him a reason to go to Iraq and attack in retribution for the attempted assasination of his father and in the process turn on Bin Laden and hunt him down as well while over there. The whole process backfired and now we are all screwed for messing with a country whos very kids don't grab backpacks before going to school..............but AK-47's. These people eat bullets instead of cereal in the morning before school as well, so they don't know how to quit, bush may have negated this fact.
Back to the order to make a hit on our own soil by the hands of our own government..........what better way to get population support to go to war than to frame another country for an attack of such magnitude.


And you know all of this, HOW? By the media...

My point exactly. You don't REALLY know anything about what happened.



Mr. M


I figure I know just as much as YOU and the rest of the world about this, and your theory is also, just that, a theory from someone who watched the same images as me FROM THE MEDIA. I will say this, the airports certainly don't own the whole of the world's media, so for the media from all countries to collaborate the same evidence and messages says alot. I also know that the media doesnt work for anyone but themselves and certainly will do whatever it takes to get the real story out and fast, because if they put the wrong story out there will be embarrasing apologies and/or repremands. So for you to suggest that the media may be apart of this conspiracy to tell us lies to help the government with their conspiracy................just remember who put all of those pictures of military members roughing up the Iraqi prisoners on the tube for the world to see..............that certainly was in no favor to the government, the media are greedy and self indulgent..........but they do (sometimes unfortunately) tell the Blunt and sometimes painful truth. So in response to what you said, yeah, I got this info from the media, same as you, and I know as much as you do about 911................and thats my point exactly!
(dont tell me youre some government agent with inside ties that bestow you with supernatural intelligence from the CIA or anything.....I won't believe you).


[Edited on 8-5-2004 by Phenomium]



posted on May, 8 2004 @ 05:45 AM
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Before he was strangled by NSA goons for speaking out about what he saw during his work as a tunnel engineer constructing top-secret underground bases, Phil Schneider declared that the building of Denver International Airport was part of the New World Order's preparation to establish Denver as the capital of the western sector of the New World Order. Having established the global, Orwellian, fascist state, the Illuminati will have protestors rounded up and distributed to the hundreds of concentration/detention camps now manned all over the USA and ready to take people. Tunnels and chambers have been built under the airport to detain and transport people elsewhere. You will see this scenario symbolised in the murals in the airport. 9-11 was NOT primarily about providing justification for tightening security (Homeland Security/ Patriot Acts 1 and 2, etc). This was just one small aspect of the murder of several thousand people in New York. It was about duping the American people into supporting the criminal Bush cabal's invasion of Iraq to grab oil and provide fat, post-war reconstruction contracts for Haliburton, the Carlyle Group and other companies owned by their friends, like Bechtel. The next stage will be an even worse catastrophe than 9-11, which will bring martial law to the USA, as General Tommy Franks has already warned. On April 29 a plot to detonate a dirty bomb in the Sears Tower was foiled, thanks to a tip-off from British Intelligence after arresting a terrorist cell in Britain. It was due to take place 911 hours after the Madrid bombings on March 11, which was 911 days after September 11, 2001. This was covered up (apart from a deliberate leak to a little-known intelligence review website) so as not to upset Americans with the knowledge that, despite all the security measures, terrorists could pull off another 9-11. The people who were running the American branch of this terrorist cell were prevented from carrying out the outrage because they could not control officials in the FBI once they had been tipped-off by the British a few days before the Sears Tower was going to be bombed and told who to arrest.



posted on May, 10 2004 @ 04:38 PM
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Originally posted by StarChild
Also, something I just thought of...

How many times in the past 2 years have you heard about people being detained in airports?



Once detained, by drug inducement, they could force a loss of memory on the individual, causing lost time. This would prevent the individual from remembering what happened to him/her. They could take them down below for experiments/implants, then put them on a later flight, and the person would never know what happened, only that they missed their flight, and boarded a later one. Mind control is a wonderful thing...

Hello Starchild. I know one person who was detained recently,made to strip down, because this person changed flights at the last minute. I'm sure it happens alot.
and the mind control and drug inducement.. I think it happens.. I know I was at a place once where I was given a small amount of wine. I lost time and can't remember but portions of this ordeal. Maybe hypnosis???



posted on May, 11 2004 @ 07:50 AM
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That is very interesting. What was the wine given to you for? Formal or informal?


Mr. M



posted on May, 11 2004 @ 04:57 PM
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It was informal. He was susposed to be military. A dentist. He had an examination table set up in the house. Above was a lamp. I remember entering the house and leaving. Very strange!!



posted on May, 11 2004 @ 05:26 PM
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Did you know Starchild that the former head of FEMA ....Joseph Allbaugh is the head of security of Denver International Airport.

i find that quite interesting dont you ?????

why would an airport ....especially the dia need a former head of fema to be the head of security......?



posted on May, 11 2004 @ 05:34 PM
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Originally posted by ms_Bhavn
It was informal. He was susposed to be military. A dentist. He had an examination table set up in the house. Above was a lamp. I remember entering the house and leaving. Very strange!!


How long ago did this happen? From the sound of it could have been Versed aka Midazoliam
I am not saying that is what was used or what happened, but you statement of "I remember entering the house and leaving" Is exactly what surgery patients say when they are administered the drug before surgery. Normally it is something like "So when am I going to the operating room?" right after they wake up.
I am not trying to scare you but your description sounds like an amnesia drug



posted on May, 11 2004 @ 05:54 PM
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This happened years back. I don't think there was a surgery. Wouldn't there had been a noticable incision?.. I am thinking he used hypnosis.



posted on May, 11 2004 @ 05:59 PM
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Originally posted by ms_Bhavn
This happened years back. I don't think there was a surgery. Wouldn't there had been a noticable incision?.. I am thinking he used hypnosis.


No no you misunderstand. An amnesia drug is used mainly for surgery to help the patient "forget" about the surgery IE if they wake up during the surgery etc.
Versed does come in a liquid form, it can be administered in a drink, a dropper, it is given to babies via syrup.
I was simply stating that if you drank wine, ANYTHING could have been in the wine.
Hypnosis, no matter how good does eventually wear off.



posted on May, 11 2004 @ 06:13 PM
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OK, I understand. Yes, I suspose he could've used a drug. I know something wasn't right. My friend left me there. This man ask me if I wanted to see the rest of the house, he walked me to the back where there was the examination table ..the next thing I remember is leaving out the back door.. I haven't a clue about how much time had passed or what happened


[Edited on 11-5-2004 by ms_Bhavn]




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