Mark and Debbie Kuhn describe home break in by cop's for flying American Flag Up Side Down

This is pretty crazy

The word that it's all up to our neighbours and our neighbour's neighbours must get out there!

reply to post by ModernAcademia


Freedom of speech and expression is not dead yet, that's what I got out of this video. Nice to know that the couple involved were not taken to jail and beaten for hours for being unpatriotic. Stories such as theirs lead me to believe that there is still hope for this country and that we have some time before shtf.

The lasxt comments made by this guy are the best.

The only hope is for people to turn off their TV's and educate themselves, and stand up to authority.

The integration of military and law enforcement is going to be a tragedy for the US people.

They're lucky I wasn't their neighbor. I have 0 respect for these nuckleheads. Law or no law, that was desecration of the flag, disrespect to our soldiers, especialy after one of them tries to get them to take it down as it deeply disturbed him. I think they got off to easy and deserve to be on a real terrorist list.

Granted our government is totaly screwed up, the goons running things are greedy, egotistical, and unabashedly selfish; but if they think that desecrating our flag and disrespecting our soldiers who have faught and shed blood so they could enjoy the rights and priveledges, as few as we have left; is ok and will get them attention; I think they found out that it's not the attention they wanted and is not ok.

There are much better ways to get the message across that our nation is in trouble than to blatantly show disrespect to our soldiers as they did. I would dare say that the sherriff officer was a veteran as well to pursue the matter in the way he did, and most likely felt it better to not say anything until he had them arrested to maintain a more professional attitude as I'm willing to bet he would much preferred to have done more to them.

I can guarentee you won't see these knuckleheads doing anything to protest unless they can get all the attention. Selfish, egotistical disrespectful, and most of all arrogant. I can't say it enough 0 respect for these knuckleheads

One of the rare moments I say Kudo's to the police for temperance, patience and civility in the face of such self serving idiocy.

Originally posted by Pappa_Bear
...if they think that desecrating our flag and disrespecting our soldiers who have faught and shed blood so they could enjoy the rights and priveledges, as few as we have left

Yeah, and one of the ones we have left is Freedom of Speech.

"Recognizing that the right to differ is the centerpiece of our First Amendment freedoms, a government cannot mandate by fiat a feeling of unity in its citizens. Therefore that very same government cannot carve out a symbol of unity and prescribe a set of approved messages to be associated with that symbol . . ."

It honestly shocks me when people can't get past idealized notions of "patriotism" and understand this issue as our Founding Fathers intended it.




[edit on 24/6/2009 by kosmicjack]

Originally posted by Pappa_Bear
I think they got off to easy and deserve to be on a real terrorist list.

Some ATS members are more and more sharing their concerns about posting on ATS thinking the govt. is watching them.

Me, I'm scared of people like you.
You make me scared to post on ATS.

Your lack of patience for people wanting to express their opinions is not only scary but also very sad.

[edit on 24-6-2009 by ModernAcademia]

ist's not patriotism, or did you not read the whole post, it is blatant disrespect to our soldiers before, present and to come that have served, died, and shed blood for the Freedom of Speech. After several attempts from police and military members asking that they take it down and flat refusing and laughing about it now is completely unforgiveable. So come off your high horse, read the entire post I made, you don't have to agree but don't confuse patriotism with blatant disrespect to fellow citizens who have faught hard and felt hurt by their disrespect not so much to the flag but to the soldiers themselves.

They could have flown the flag halfmast to get the same message across without being disrespectful, and still state the same message, Our Nation is Dying. Or better yet aks the soldiers how they could fly the flag without showing disrespect to the soldier but still get their message across, and I can bet that the answer would e fly it at halfmast. Bet you can't guess why I would know that.

Better ways than to go out of your way to be noticed by the very ones that are sacrificing themselves, which many have the same feelings and thoughts.

reply to post by ModernAcademia


Really, maybe your should read the post in it's entirety, I don't care if the Government watches me, let'em. But untill you have lived in the trenches fighting and hopeing you get to see the sun come up again, no matter if it's a worthy war or not you should look beyond patriotism and into your neighbors eyes and see the hurt you cause by being so disrespectful to their sacrifice for you.

And you should be scared, but not of people like me, I'd be the one to save your skin before these disrepectful people flying a flag upside down and laughing about it.

My ignorance; come now, you failed to read the post in it's entirety, or failed to comprehend what you read. It had nothing to do with people acting on their rights, it was their total disrespect to people who had attempted to be polite and still let them know that their act was inappropriate, and their unwillingness to try to find a better way.

These people are ignorant, can you comprehend what I'm saying, cause if not I would recomend staying away from such controversial post so that you will not be tempted to launch such negative personal attacks on someones opinion. As well as what these people did was infact disrespectful and aganst US Flag Code
Flag Code


[edit on 24/6/2009 by Pappa_Bear]

reply to post by Pappa_Bear


The only thing Free Speech has to do with respect for our soldiers is that, as you so correctly and ironically stated, many have in fact died so that even these people in the OP may exercise their Constitutional Rights.

I'm grateful to those who have fought and died for our rights. The ultimate respect to them is to utilize those rights as often as possible and fight mercilessly at every turn when our rights are threatened by enemies to our liberty - foreign or domestic.

I'm as patriotic as they come,That said I see no reason for the arrest..

We are in a state of distress..

The flag should never be dipped to any person or thing. It is flown upside down only as a distress signal.

www.usflag.org...

According to Section 8a of the United States Flag Code, "The flag should never be displayed with the union down, except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property."

The cops were only doing there job when they saw a signal of distress.

Its not the cops fault that these people were total idiots.

Now if you turn the Texas flag upside down it means that Texas is at war with someone.

reply to post by kosmicjack


That I can agree with, my issue with these people is after being asked by 2 military members to discontinue as it deepley affected them; out of consideration for their service they could have found a better way than to tell the one member that had just returned from Iraq that he is not fighting for their rights and refuse to try to find a different way was inexcusable. He wont forget them and if a time comes that they need his help I can only hope that he will forgive and help them.

Even though they may feel our soldiers is not fighting for their rights right now, the should bear in mind that they may very well need to soon as this nation deterorates. Some military members will do exactly what their told, but many will revolt, and that one soldier might be one.

Point is when you plan , plan ahead as well, if you need to change your original plan to accomodate someone, compromise if possible, especially if it is someone you may need later. Always look ahead, plan ahead, think ahead. These people did not do that.

The whole fact is that they had the right to do it, so why shouldn't they do it? Although i am a Brit, I have an American flag upside down until the last US soldier leave Iraq, and the USA comes back to be part of the United Kingdom.

*Looks outside window*... Nobody coming to stop me yet

reply to post by Redpillblues


Did you by chance read Section 8A, it is disrespectful to the flag to be flow upside down, and should only be done when in dire straits and need immediate assistance, These people were not in dire straits nor in need of immediate assistance by their own admission.

Unfortunately I do not see any form of punishment applied to said disrespect, so would be under the assumption that it may fall under a judge to determine if any crime was commited or fines applied.

reply to post by BSG75


You also are not an United States of America citizen, therefore these codes do not apply to you. But try flying your own Union Jack upside down for a while and see if you don't get visited; I would think that the UK has similar Union Jack codes.

reply to post by Pappa_Bear


I know all to well of flag conduct..

But if by chance you see a pretty woman wearing a flag bikini,would you gripe the same disrespect?..Wich it is..

Originally posted by Pappa_Bear
reply to post by BSG75

 

You also are not an United States of America citizen, therefore these codes do not apply to you. But try flying your own Union Jack upside down for a while and see if you don't get visited; I would think that the UK has similar Union Jack codes.

Just to point out.... If you fly the Union jack flag upside down, it would look the exact same, since it is a mirror image.

All this proves to me is firing off a statement from the hip without educating yourself first.

As for the topic, proud American here... if they want to fly their flag as a sign of distress of the times, so be it. This coming from someone who has served for the country (have you, before you get all patriotic) and was glad to defend our constitutional rights.

The United States Supreme Court ruled that, due to the First Amendment to the United States Constitution, it is unconstitutional for a government (whether federal, state, or municipality) to prohibit the desecration of a flag, due to its status as "symbolic speech."


[edit on 24-6-2009 by TwiTcHomatic]

reply to post by Redpillblues


Yes I would and I have on several occasions. I respect the flag of my country, I do not have to respect the idiots running my country, or the idiots being disrespectful to the flag. I do not however condemn anyone who is not of this country as they will feel differently, but I would ask them to not condemn me for not respecting their flag as well.

edit: fat fingers

[edit on 24/6/2009 by Pappa_Bear]

reply to post by TwiTcHomatic


Actualy you should educate yourself on your own Union Jack Flag, the UK flag is not completely symmetrical.

Source: Questions on the flag; UK

A brief explanation: the "X" portion of the Union Jack is a combination of the Cross of St. Patrick (the red one) and the Cross of St. Andrew (the white one), plus a white fimbriation added on either side. St. Andrew's is on the right in every quarter (as you turn the flag clockwise) due to a rule of heraldry giving Scotland a position of precedence (on the right) over Northern Ireland as the more senior member of the United Kingdom. Thus, the flag is not symmetrical, and it is possible to hoist upside-down. British Scout troops are taught to look at the first quarter of the flag (in the upper hoist) and think "White on right!" in order to make sure it's raised correctly

In answer to your question; Yes i have served my country, 6 years and was called back in to serve another 4 thank ou very much. I have earned my right to speak about disrespectful behavior such as this.

edit: to finish post

[edit on 24/6/2009 by Pappa_Bear]

reply to post by Pappa_Bear


You said "union Jack" flag.... This is a union jack flag. www.mostphotos.com... Looks pretty mirrored to me.

If you want to specify more clearly in the future, there would be no misunderstanding.