Are people/men naturally sexist to women?, page 5
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reply posted on 21-6-2009 @ 10:16 PM by Edrick
reply to post by Seasick


Dear Edrick


Euphemisms now eh?

Fair enough... ill play along, dear

Firstly, my aplogies to the moderators if I have broken any rules. I assure you that my proverbial tounge is being bitten until it bleeds and, I am aware of the rules of engagement here.


As we all should...

Secondly, sticking to both topic and addressing your "points" Mr. Edrick, did I ever call you a child raping, woman hating, hate filled toroglodyte"? No, I certainly did not.


What I was referring to:

As always, I believe your unspoken, yet crystal clear contempt towards women shines through on these types of threads that you always seem to flock to, and your zeal causes you to overlook many other facts.


You keep assuming that I hate women just because I disagree with you.

You assume that my "Hate" is crystal clear, and that is an illusion that you are projecting, or something along those lines.

For the thousandth time, I do not hate women, and no perspective of yours voiced through your inability to discern my disagreement with you, and a HATRED for women in general, will change that.

I *HATE* lies, deceit, ignorance, and bias... and I attack it viciously when I see it.

Right now, I see a large contingent of women complaining that men owe them for past grievances that neither YOU (living women) nor THEY (living men) participated in, nor were victimized BY.

I also see the victimization of men being currently swept under the rug as completely unimportant.

How many soldiers have died defending the lives, and freedoms of the women who stayed home?

To say that women are victimized by men, while men defend you is SEXIST, and leads right back to the main point of this article, only with a slight meaning.

Sexism against men.


What I said, was that woman and children are the unfortunate victims of war largely at the hand of men.


Once again, you leave out all of the men who die in war, as if they are not worth consideration for being "Victums" of war...

This is a Gender (and Age) based bias, which is known as (in the dictionary) as *SEXISM*

I am not religious, nor and I trying to derail this into a religious debate on sex slaves, but here are some quotes from the bible and koran to support the sexist notions towards women in "holy" texts that support what I mentioned earlier:

From the bible:

When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)

From the ahadeeth:

Volume 5, Book 59, Number 459:
Narrated Ibn Muhairiz:

I entered the Mosque and saw Abu Said Al-Khudri and sat beside him and asked him about Al-Azl (i.e. coitus interruptus). Abu Said said, "We went out with Allah's Apostle for the Ghazwa of Banu Al-Mustaliq and we received captives from among the Arab captives and we desired women and celibacy became hard on us and we loved to do coitus interruptus. So when we intended to do coitus interrupt us, we said, 'How can we do coitus interruptus before asking Allah's Apostle who is present among us?" We asked (him) about it and he said, 'It is better for you not to do so, for if any soul (till the Day of Resurrection) is predestined to exist, it will exist."


And have you been subject to these "Holy Laws"?

Yes, people wrote some wierd things hundreds and thousands of years ago...

Have you ever been sold into slavery?

Did any of these pronouncements apply to you?

For the record, I am not dismissing honorbale soldiers who fight valiantly to defend their nations and people...be they male or female. Say what you will about me as a female ex-soldier, but I am mightly proud of my contribution to my nation and my people, and I am likewise proud of the soldiers both male and female that served with honor beside me, as well as those that were before me and after me that are honorable.


Fine...

I just have issue with reading things like this, that happen at the hands of men, against women in war. This is NOT men "laying their lives on the line to protect and defend women". This is subjugation, terror and oppression:


And I suppose that WOMEN are the ONLY people that were harmed?

Is that what you are saying?

That women are the ONLY VICTIMS OF NOTE?

Women died... YES, children died YES.

But you KEEP LEAVING OUT THAT MEN DIED ALSO!

War is not ANTI WOMAN, which is a concept that you are failing to grasp...

WAR is NOT-SEXIST!

War does not CARE whether you are man or woman... it will mess up the lives of its participants either way!

Whenever you say that Women are the victums in war, you are being sexist against all of the man;s lives that war has claimed...

As if you don't CARE.

As if ONLY WOMEN matter.

[edit on 21-6-2009 by Edrick]


reply posted on 21-6-2009 @ 10:17 PM by Edrick
Then you have the gaul to say they survive. Well, at what cost? Again, I stand firm that you see these atrocities as little more than collateral damage in your mind. It's more than wrong, it's disgusting and non-human (the acts mentioned, not you).


Yes, I have the *GALL* to state the truth.

I have the GALL to state the FACT that while the female victums of war, while their circumstances are tragic, and horrible... have the CHANCE to regain their former lives.

Something that the MALE victums of war DO NOT HAVE, mainly... because they are DEAD!


I never said chivalrous, self-sacrificing, honorable men do not exist. It's a fact that they do. In fact, in a previous post, I plainly stated that despite the men that wounded my heart, I love men and refuse to paint them all with the same brush due to my bad experiences in the past. Please don't forgive my opinion, but you seem to have a chip on your shoulder against women to me.


You seem to have a chip on your sholder against men.

In the interest of being civil, I won't even address your final comments directed to me. On topic, I will say that I do feel that women are generally more objectified, oppressed and underprivileged than men in most parts of the world, and not given chance to reach their full potential. As human beings I believe everyone deserves that chance.


Lets take that on a point by point basis, shall we?

I will say that I do feel that women are generally more objectified


Objectified... like sex objects?

Yeah, I agree, you are right... they are objectified like sexual objects.

It is a shame that men force women to wear revealing outfits, and get breast implants, and plaster their faces with makeup at all times.

IT is a shame that men hold these women at gunpoint (Against their will) and make them enhance their visual appearance of sexuality.

IT is a shame that these women are willingly purchasing, wearing, and disfiguring themselves without the help of men at all.

IT is a shame that you cannot see that women are objectifying themselves.

oppressed and underprivileged


Oppressed?

What country are you in?

I can speak for the western world, and in the WESTERN WORLD, you are completely wrong.

Women can own land, just as men can.

Women can Vote in elections, just as men can.

Women can hold jobs, run companies, own stock, create buisinesses, just like men can.

Women earn the equivilent of men for the same work (Do NOT debate me on this one, you will be saveing face by not disagreeing here)

Women can hold office, just as men can.

What oppression?

What Privlidge do men have that women do not posess? I would love to hear your responce.

in most parts of the world


Ah... the qualifying statement...

Yes, in much of the world, women are oppressed, and underprivlidged.

As are the men.

Women are not the only victums of oppresion and underprivlidgness... they are only HALF.

-Edrick


reply posted on 21-6-2009 @ 10:22 PM by Edrick
reply to post by Seasick


Do you not find your statements to be grossly generalized towards all women? Have any women here spoken in such a way to you, or any other man? What would warrant such a response from you towards all women?


From Sonya610
Wow. The definition of mysogyny! Switch teams, man on man love would be far more appropriate for you and will protect any women you come in contact with.

And in case you forgot, a woman birthed you. Possibly not the best decision she ever made, but you are HERE because a woman was willing to bring you into this world. Maybe that is all she did for you huh? Sounds like it.


From Seasick
As always, I believe your unspoken, yet crystal clear contempt towards women shines through on these types of threads that you always seem to flock to




*Cough*

That answer your question?


-Edrick



reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 01:06 AM by amazed
Originally posted by Edrick

As there is A LOT of anti-male sexism in the establishment also. (This thread is an example)

-Edrick (Ain't no sunshine when your gone)


You know what? I don't see that as much as you do obviously. I have not seen the women here bashing the men in such a manner as the men have been bashing the women.

To use the term misogynist in response to statements made by certain people, is NOT bashing on men. It is calling it like it is towards specific statements made by men. If you can't handle the truth, I am sorry for that. Ever heard, if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and looks like a duck it most likely is a duck. And you know what? Even if it is a woman pointing out that it is a duck/misogynist, it is still a duck/misogynist.

I am raising my daughter, and my son to respect themselves and others. If men and women could do that, then perhaps we could get past this hating on each other. Perhaps the next generation will be better, perhaps not. I think it will take many people, men and women, to take responsibility for their actions, and stop blaming other people. Everything, can't always be someone elses fault, and eventually you have to grow up, or always be a hateful person, and that is sad.

Edrick, women to this day around the world are still being victimized by sexism, to say that it only took place in the past is ignoring what takes place on a daily basis around the world.

I would wonder, that if what you see as lies, deceit, ignorance, and bias, are actually what you WANT to see for reasoning's of your own. Perhaps it helps you feel righteous in your hate towards women. And like several others on this thread, we hear your hate loud and clear.

I have never said that "men" owe me, I have stated we need each other, men and women. We can compliment each other, and assure that we all get what we want. Though I do feel that all of us, each and every one of us OWE each other, we owe each other respect, compassion and love.

Part of me is very angry at the statements that some men have made in this thread, and another part of me is so intensely sad. Angry that you guys would say the things you do about women. And very sad that something took place in your lives that has caused you to blame others instead of taking responsibility for your own lives.

In the end, all I know to say to people who hate others, men and women, would be to GROW UP.

And I am done with this thread, it has turned into a few misogynist bashing on women, not a true discussion of the thread topic.

Harm None
Peace


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 05:50 AM by HulaAnglers
reply to post by Edrick


Unfortunately, you offend potential female allies and seem to resist learning anything of value out of your experiences, and you have not been healing your wounds. Your story is boring us, it is egobased pure and simple. Only a uncreative coward that is afraid to stand up to this man made hypocritical system would generalize about women the way you do.

My mother was/is the biggest manipulative lying witch, I have ever encountered. She is responsible for making everybody sick, alienated and poor. My father was heartless, violent and cheap. Common unevolved human behavior, but not all people are like this and I choose to associate with people who are peace-full, highly creative and courageous. People who have learned from their experiences and don't get stuck!

You are in an emotional/mental crisis and you should get some help, especially if there are kids involved, you are really being irresponsible and immature.

Stop screaming





[edit on 22-6-2009 by HulaAnglers]


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 09:27 AM by Edrick
Originally posted by amazed
Originally posted by Edrick

As there is A LOT of anti-male sexism in the establishment also. (This thread is an example)

-Edrick (Ain't no sunshine when your gone)


You know what? I don't see that as much as you do obviously. I have not seen the women here bashing the men in such a manner as the men have been bashing the women.


Just because you don't see it, does not mean that it is not there.

To use the term misogynist in response to statements made by certain people, is NOT bashing on men. It is calling it like it is towards specific statements made by men. If you can't handle the truth, I am sorry for that. Ever heard, if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and looks like a duck it most likely is a duck. And you know what? Even if it is a woman pointing out that it is a duck/misogynist, it is still a duck/misogynist.


To use the term Mysandrist against certain statements made by certain people is NOT bashing on women. it is calling it like it is towards specific statements made by women. If you can't handle the truth, I am sorry for that. Ever heard, if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and looks like a duck it is most likely a duck. And you know what? Even if it is a man pointing out that it is a duck/mysandrist, it is still a duck/mysandrist.


I am raising my daughter, and my son to respect themselves and others. If men and women could do that, then perhaps we could get past this hating on each other. Perhaps the next generation will be better, perhaps not. I think it will take many people, men and women, to take responsibility for their actions, and stop blaming other people. Everything, can't always be someone elses fault, and eventually you have to grow up, or always be a hateful person, and that is sad.

Edrick, women to this day around the world are still being victimized by sexism, to say that it only took place in the past is ignoring what takes place on a daily basis around the world.


Amazed, Mn to this day around the world are still being victumized by Societally accepted Sexism, to say that it never took place is ignoring what takes place on a daily basis around the world.

I would wonder, that if what you see as lies, deceit, ignorance, and bias, are actually what you WANT to see for reasoning's of your own. Perhaps it helps you feel righteous in your hate towards women. And like several others on this thread, we hear your hate loud and clear.


I would wonder, that if what you see as Sexism is merely the oppression that gets handed out to EVERYONE in certain cultures regardless of sex... the oppression of tyranny that is not biased. And I hear your hate loud and clear.

I have never said that "men" owe me, I have stated we need each other, men and women. We can compliment each other, and assure that we all get what we want. Though I do feel that all of us, each and every one of us OWE each other, we owe each other respect, compassion and love.

Part of me is very angry at the statements that some men have made in this thread, and another part of me is so intensely sad. Angry that you guys would say the things you do about women. And very sad that something took place in your lives that has caused you to blame others instead of taking responsibility for your own lives.


Part of me is very angry at the statements that some women have made in this thread, and anouther part of me is sad. Angry that you women would say the things you do about men. And very sad that something took place in your lives that has caused you to blame men instead of takeing responsibility for your own lives.

In the end, all I know to say to people who hate others, men and women, would be to GROW UP.

And I am done with this thread, it has turned into a few misogynist bashing on women, not a true discussion of the thread topic.

Harm None
Peace


People suffer in the world.

This is a universal truth.

The women in this thread (That are angered by my words) are the ones who seem to think that women suffering in the world is Sexist.

IT is not, because ALL people suffer in the world.

We suffer in different ways... but Claiming that the Male led patriarchal society is oppressing women is a oversimplification of the truth, and also a blind omission OF the truth.

Life is not all candy and rainbows.... women suffer because of this, yes.... but so do men.

Inability to see the suffering of MEN is what is setting me off.

This "Patriarchy" argument used to show men to be monsters, control freaks, etc ANGERS me.

IT is a GENERALIZATION that paints women as the eternal victim of circumstance, and the man as the eternal oppressor.

IT is childish.

-Edrick

[edit on 22-6-2009 by Edrick]


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 09:39 AM by Edrick
reply to post by HulaAnglers


Unfortunately, you offend potential female allies and seem to resist learning anything of value out of your experiences, and you have not been healing your wounds. Your story is boring us, it is egobased pure and simple.


Your story of oppression bores me in a world that ALL are oppressed.

Highlighting the misfortunes of one gender, while pushing the misfortunes of another gender under the rug solely because of gender is the technical definition of sexism.

Only a uncreative coward that is afraid to stand up to this man made hypocritical system would generalize about women the way you do.


As you can see here....

So, I am not only uncreative, but a coward for not defending women against my own gender and their penis weapons... right?

You say "Man Made" system... is this not a generalization?

Are you dismissing the responsibilities of women in building this society by calling it "Man Made"?

You are in an /mental crisis and you should get some help, especially if there are kids involved, you are really being irresponsible and immature.


No, my responses... TO THE CONTRARY, are enlightened, and courageous.

Very few men have the courage to stand up to the Women's movement of perceived perpetual victimhood.

IT is SEXIST to blame men for all of the oppressions of women.

Just because I present a different opinion from your "Status Quo" does not mean that I am immature, cowardly, etc...

It means that I am not afraid of being slandered like all seekers of truth ARE.

All of this "Fight the Patriarchy" nonsense is just women not taking their own advice....

And I think Amazed summed it up quite nicely:

Everything, can't always be someone elses fault, and eventually you have to grow up, or always be a hateful person, and that is sad.


-Edrick


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 09:59 AM by wclv13
reply to post by Donnie Darko


Sexism is a defense function of the males to protect their ego. They are force fed from society that the "men" take care of the women. Even when it is not necessary because the woman is perfectly able to take care of it herself.

Most men don't want to be one upped by a woman.

Example: Yesterday I needed to fix a part on my bike. My man insisted that he do it even though I worked on my own bikes before I met him. At first glance, maybe it might seem that he was being nice, or gentlemanly.

But what happened next proved his real motive (saving his ego). He brought down tools to fix the issue and told me to bring down the old and new parts.

I looked at the tools he brought down and knew he could not get the job done without 2 channel locks, which he did not grab.

I meet him at the bike and set down the parts and channel locks by him. He looked at the channel locks but didn't use them. He struggled with wrenches trying to get pieces off the old part to put on the new part.

Not wanting to start a fight, I just watched him struggle and used my foot to move the channel locks a littler closer to him.

He then asked me to go in the house and get him a beer. I obliged, came back out, and saw he got the parts off. Yet, the channel locks were now on the other side of him.

There was no mention of it, he didn't say, "hey the channel locks did the trick" or anything.

I ALWAYS thank him if he gives me advice on something or a hand. He does not thank me unless the help I give him is because it is "women's" work (Thanks for dinner honey, or thanks for washing my bathrobe, etc)

God forbid I get the pickle jar open when he couldn't "I loosened it for ya honey" he can't just say thanks because I used a better method then he was trying.



reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 10:45 AM by wclv13
reply to post by serendipitynow


Whether men are naturally sexist to women?

Men are not born out of the womb thinking women are inferior or are only able to do menial tasks.

Society conditions them to do it. It is a brave and self assured man who ignores society norms and does what he does best and/or enjoys and it may not be "men's work".

Care to contribute to the thread?


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 01:54 PM by amazed
For the first time ever, I will be putting two people on my mute list. I have no interest in those who can only bash on others in a childish way and ignore reality. Peace to you in the long run, and I sincerely hope that someday you can grow up, and find contentment in your soul.

I know I said I was done with this thread, but I would like to turn this thread around a bit, and show the history of sexism towards women.

Understand, that I realize that sexism towards men does exist, and I am in no way trying to deny that. Yes, I do understand that quite often women are given custody of children more than men. I would like to add this in part has to do with the truth that women are in general, the main caretakers of children, even when both parents work, in general (not always), women are the ones to care for the children.

For example, in my family, both my husband and I worked. I earned as much as my husband and worked as many hours as he did. But when the day was over, guess who it was that would continue with the days work? Myself, while he would sit down at the computer with a beer, I would cook dinner, take care of our child, and clean the house.

Eventually we had to have a discussion about this, and if you are a true understanding person, you can see how this is a sexist attitude, that even though we both worked, that I was the one who "did the womans work" once we were home for the evening/weekend. I am now a stay at home mom, not because only I wanted this, but because my husband as well wanted one of us at home with our children. And yes, at one point my husband chose to be the stay at home parent. After less than a year, he decided he was not a stay at home dad, and we switched places.

Sexism, is the belief or attitude that one gender or sex is inferior to, less competent, or less valuable than the other. Including hatred or prejudice towards either sex.

History has shown that religions do treat women as inferior to men. Women have been denied leadership roles, told to be submissive, and religions are used to control women in society and in families.

Just look at the Muslim world where women are not even allowed to show their faces and have to keep covered up while men are allowed to murder them under the law if they feel that the women has "shamed" the family. While the men, IMO shame themselves every single day with this type of attitude towards women.

If you view men as superior to women, then you are sexist. If you view women as superior to men, then you are sexist.

This thread is about sexism towards women, if you would like to start a thread about sexism towards men, go for it.

Sexism towards women has taken many forms.

In the past, legally once married, the husband and wife were considered one person in law, with the legal existence of the women suspended and the man having full control.

Women only became "legally defined as persons" in 1875 in the USA. Women were not allowed to vote in the USA until 1920, and 1928 in the UK.

If you look into domestic violence, women experience what is termed "nonfatal intimate partner violence" far more than men do. Women are also more likely to be killed by intimate partners then men. 30% of female homicide victims have been killed by intimate partners compared to 5% of men homicide victims.

If you look at rape, we can see a pattern of hatred towards women, rape inflicts psychological and/or physical trauma, and has nothing to do with sexual interest, only control, ie male dominance, and objectifying and degrading women.

In regards to education, women were excluded from higher education and encouraged to follow "lesser intellects".

Boys still receive more attention and praise in the classroom to this day. What this creates is that over time, the girls learn to speak less in the classroom, and therefor end up with lower IQ's. They learn to not even try. It is a really sad situation.

In 2009, an interesting study came out in regards to men and women CEO's and obesity. Showing that overweight women are more likely to be discriminated against than overweight men. Being overweight harms the career opportunities for women, but not for men and in actuality seems to benefit male executives.

Women have as well historically earned less than men, and this continues to this day. When you look at women and men who do the exact same work, men are paid more. In 1963 women earned 58 cents to a man's dollar. Today, women earn approximately 70% to 80% of the income of men doing the same work with the same quality and/or better quality on the woman's side.

A woman has to work harder to prove herself than a man.

Research shows that 44% of women with children are less likely to be hired than men with children, even with identical resumes, experience and qualification. If hired, women are offered on average $11,000 USD less than a woman without children.

And yes, we do have sexism towards men, in that it is mandatory for males to register for the military and women are not required to. I agree, this is sexism, and either both sexes or neither sex should have to register.

In regards to sexuality, women who have multiple partners are considered "whores", while men who have multiple partners are touted as "masculine".

Women who date younger men are looked down upon, while men who date younger women are "patted on the back".

Continued next post


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 01:58 PM by amazed
Cont

Another form of abuse towards women is genital mutilation. This is described as "all procedures involving partial or total removal of the external female genitalia or other injury to the female genital organs whether for cultural, religious or other reasons". It is mostly used for religious ceremonies, where parents must give consent.

Understand that this is not the same as circumcision done on males. Under female genital circumcision, the female genitalia is partially or completely removed, which would be like completely or partially removing a mans genitals.

Understand that male circumcision is not mutilation, the cutting of the foreskin does no damage, while female mutilation causes lifelong damage.

WHO has different categories of female genital mutilation.
For more information on this please go to en.wikipedia.org...

Type 3, horrible, is the removal of the external genitalia, including some internal genitalia, and the vaginal orifice is sewed closed, being forced open for intercourse or childbirth, and then resealed. In some cases, the girl's legs are tied together for two to six weeks to prevent her from moving to allow the healing of the two sides of the vula.

Women who face genital mutilation have lifelong difficulties. With severe infections, and death with birth.

Amnesty International estimates that over 130 million women worldwide have been affected by some form of FGM (female genital mutilation) with over 2 million being performed every year.

In the past, doctors advocating these procedures, claimed that girls of all ages would engage in masturbation, and be "polluted". Well, I would like to say, and men do not engage in maturation? And why would it be considered "polluting" for women to engage in such, but not men?

FGM, is used as a means of control over women.

Serious long term health effects include urinary and reproductive tract infections, cysts, blood clots, lifelong pain, and death.

I have discussed the FGM, as it is a severe form of sexism.

For more information google "female genital mutilation" it will be an eye opener as to the extent that women to this day are treated as worth less than men, and how women are controlled.

Personally, I don't know if "sexism" is natural or not. My heart tells me that it has something to do with religion, and men controlling women, and that it is not "natural" at all, and is actually "unnatural". I think women and men were meant to work side by side in this world for the better of all, but somewhere along the way things went wrong. I feel that for someone to claim that ALL of a particular sex is (insert negative or positive description), is putting a gender in a box, and ignoring that everyone is an individual with their own "quirks".

Anyway

Harm None
Peace to you


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 02:09 PM by wclv13
reply to post by amazed


Thanks for posting all that and hope you got through to some folks.

The genital mutilation is something not alot of people know about, so kudos for bringing that up.


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 02:14 PM by Seasick
Originally posted by Edrick
reply to post by Seasick


Do you not find your statements to be grossly generalized towards all women? Have any women here spoken in such a way to you, or any other man? What would warrant such a response from you towards all women?


From Sonya610
Wow. The definition of mysogyny! Switch teams, man on man love would be far more appropriate for you and will protect any women you come in contact with.

And in case you forgot, a woman birthed you. Possibly not the best decision she ever made, but you are HERE because a woman was willing to bring you into this world. Maybe that is all she did for you huh? Sounds like it.


From Seasick
As always, I believe your unspoken, yet crystal clear contempt towards women shines through on these types of threads that you always seem to flock to




*Cough*

That answer your question?


-Edrick


Speaking only for my own comment you have highlighted above; it was not meant to be an attack on you. I apologize if you took it that way. It is simply my assessment of your particular modus operandi and approach to any thread where there is even a hint of a discussion of the sexes. I'm nearly certain I am not the only one who can attest to that...and no, your consistent and predictable hyper-criticism of everyone's remarks twisted to suit your own agenda does not answer my question. Rest assured, I am desperately trying to figure out why the ignore function does not seem to work for me.


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 02:20 PM by Edrick
reply to post by amazed


Understand, that I realize that sexism towards men does exist, and I am in no way trying to deny that. Yes, I do understand that quite often women are given custody of children more than men. I would like to add this in part has to do with the truth that women are in general, the main caretakers of children, even when both parents work, in general (not always), women are the ones to care for the children.


Sexist.... I could argue that women were excluded from Leadership roles because men in general are the main leaders of society.

Your bias is evident.

Women given custody of children more than men is sexist.

Your justification of this is also sexist.

Just look at the Muslim world where women are not even allowed to show their faces and have to keep covered up while men are allowed to murder them under the law if they feel that the women has "shamed" the family. While the men, IMO shame themselves every single day with this type of attitude towards women.


Just look at vietnam... where men who did not participat in the draft were shamed by society at large for not throwing their lives away.

In the past, legally once married, the husband and wife were considered one person in law, with the legal existence of the women suspended and the man having full control.


In the past, EVERYONE was considered the property of the government.

Serfdom... have you heard of it?

Individual freedom ITSELF is a new phenomenon.

Starting with Wealth and land owners, then going to poor people, and then to women.

Historically, NOONE has had any freedom, or power, and EVERYONE Was oppressed if they were not a part of the elite.

If you look at rape, we can see a pattern of hatred towards women, rape inflicts psychological and/or physical trauma, and has nothing to do with sexual interest, only control, ie male dominance, and objectifying and degrading women.


Leaving sexuality out of the reasons for rape is as narrow minded as you can get.

And citeing the small ammount of men who DO rape, as evidence of Male oppression of women is also narrow minded.

These are CRIMES, not institutionalized behaviors.

This is like saying that Theft is hatred towards men, since men are stolen from more often.

it is a poor argument.

In regards to education, women were excluded from higher education and encouraged to follow "lesser intellects".


As opposed to our educational system of today, where intelligence, creativity, etc are marginalized and not even rewarded at all?

EVERYONE is encouraged to "Follow" the mold today.

Boys still receive more attention and praise in the classroom to this day. What this creates is that over time, the girls learn to speak less in the classroom, and therefor end up with lower IQ's. They learn to not even try. It is a really sad situation.


Why are there no "Men's Studies" courses in collage?

Women have as well historically earned less than men, and this continues to this day. When you look at women and men who do the exact same work, men are paid more.


This is a falacy...

Check out this playlist to see why it is wrong:

www.youtube.com...

Another form of abuse towards women is genital mutilation.....Understand that this is not the same as circumcision done on males.


Let me see....

A part of my Sexual anatomy was cut off without my sayso...

My Genitals were MUTILATED because of societies "Norms" and you are justifying it?

THAT is sexism.

the cutting of the foreskin does no damage, while female mutilation causes lifelong damage.


You see, this is bias...

MY foreskin will never grow back... it is DAMAGED for my entire LIFE.

Lifelong damage.

You see how wrong you are?

So what you are saying is... Female genital mutilation is barbaric...

But MALE genital mutilation is Civilized.

Right... that is the reason that you cannot see your sexism... you have JUSTIFIED it.

And that is sick.


-Edrick



reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 02:29 PM by amazed
Originally posted by wclv13
reply to post by amazed


Thanks for posting all that and hope you got through to some folks.

The genital mutilation is something not alot of people know about, so kudos for bringing that up.


Your welcome, and I apologize to anyone I might have previously offended. This is close to my heart, as I have personally dealt with sexism in my life, sadly in several ways. I some times have an unreasonable reaction and get kinda crabby when I see people boxing someone up just because of their sex, religion, race or sexual preferences.

Hopefully, more people will be able to discuss sexism with an open mind, with the idea of learning and growing towards stopping sexism on all sides.

Harm None
Peace


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 02:50 PM by wclv13
reply to post by wclv13


have had boyfriends cut or uncut. Why do you care? Tis just a piece of skin that makes it easier for you to clean yourself, no?

I don't think women really care one way or the other as long as you clean yourself. We just push it back and go to town. How does this effect you?

The religious aspects are stupid to say the least, but to compare cutting of the foreskin to cutting out the clitoris is only a fancy of a man who is clueless about the female anatomy. Get much hon?


reply posted on 22-6-2009 @ 02:53 PM by Edrick
Originally posted by wclv13
reply to post by wclv13


have had boyfriends cut or uncut. Why do you care? Tis just a piece of skin that makes it easier for you to clean yourself, no?

I don't think women really care one way or the other as long as you clean yourself. We just push it back and go to town. How does this effect you?

The religious aspects are stupid to say the least, but to compare cutting of the foreskin to cutting out the clitoris is only a fancy of a man who is clueless about the female anatomy. Get much hon?


The you are saying that foot binding is perfectly acceptable, because it has no effect on orgasm.. right?

What about sewing up the vagina? that does not affect orgasm, as it can be opened again later... So by your logic, it is not bad, right?

What if we just snipped a part of girls labia when they are born, that would make it easier to clean themselves, so it must be good, and it does not effect orgasm, so it must be fine...

Right?

-Edrick
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