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Row over saintly push for Nazi-era pope

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posted on Jun, 20 2009 @ 10:34 PM
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reply to post by JaxonRoberts
 


There was only one christian denomination until Martin Luther tacked up his infamous 95 theses in 1517.
Have you ever heard of the Eastern Orthodox Church?
The real purpose of the Crusades was to establish an eastern military base in order to launch attacks against the Orthodox headquarters in Babylon, present day Iraq.
Do you know why the US destroyed that country? Do a search on what happened to the Christians in Iraq. The Pope is in league with Israel to kill off their opposition and we are in the Last Days of the Book of Daniel and guess who the Beast is, and the Image of the Beast.




posted on Jun, 20 2009 @ 10:58 PM
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reply to post by EricD
 


It was especially these "German Christians" who pushed for a national church under one bishop and one Fuehrer. Once Hitler consolidated his power in the course of 1933, their influence grew tremendously. They had members in every provincial church-governing body and were openly supported by members of the Nazi party, many of whom now joined the church. It was the patriotic thing to do.

OK, I think we get the picture, the Nazi's did not like Jews.
Did these "Protestant" Nazi's go on to exterminate all of Europe's Catholic population? I do not think so. Why not?



posted on Jun, 21 2009 @ 01:35 AM
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reply to post by Bigwhammy
 


What point??? And please tell us, oh wise one, what is the so called 'christian gospel'. I don't have an anti-christian agenda, as you like to call it, just my opinion, which I am entitled to. It is also apparent that I have forgotten more about the Catholic Church than you know about it. This thread is about that topic, which I apparently am much more qualified to discuss.



posted on Jun, 21 2009 @ 01:46 AM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
Have you ever heard of the Eastern Orthodox Church?


I'll give you that one, but the differences between the two are minute. In fact if a Catholic cannot find a Catholic Church to attend, it is considered appropriate to attend an Eastern Orthodox Church, and both consider themselves to be the "One, Holy, Catholic [from the Greek καθολική, or universal] and Apostolic Church". Source.


The real purpose of the Crusades was to establish an eastern military base in order to launch attacks against the Orthodox headquarters in Babylon, present day Iraq.
Do you know why the US destroyed that country? Do a search on what happened to the Christians in Iraq. The Pope is in league with Israel to kill off their opposition and we are in the Last Days of the Book of Daniel and guess who the Beast is, and the Image of the Beast.


OK, this goes down in the same category as the 'magic chair'. Where do you people come up with this stuff? Or are you off your meds?????



posted on Jun, 21 2009 @ 06:45 AM
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reply to post by EricD
 


Did the Protestant church sign a concordat with with the Vatican?

Did Protestant ministers double as Nazi's like the Jesuit Priest Stepinac and kill people?

Did Protestant missionaries maked forced conversions of Orthodox Christians like the Catholic monks?

Did the Protestant Church help SS men to escape to Catholic Parishes in South America?

Hitler was a Catholic he referred to one of his generals as Ignatius of Loyola the founder of the Jesuits.

Any pictures of Protestant minister giving the old Nazi salute? their are plenty of pictures of Catholic priests doing it!

So Hitler united the Church's he ruled the country, it still doens't take away the fact the Nazi's were hand in Hand with the Vatican.

Your poor attemp at defelcting the truth away from the vatican was pitiful.





[edit on 21-6-2009 by orangeman dave]

[edit on 21-6-2009 by orangeman dave]



posted on Jun, 21 2009 @ 10:11 PM
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reply to post by orangeman dave
 


I'll try to type s l o w l y in the hopes that it will help with comprehension.

I don't blame protestants for anything having to do WWII.

I was trying to show that it's very, very easy to cherry pick selective facts and then paint with a broad brush based on them.

I could point to action after action taken by Catholics to act against Hitler in WWII and it wouldn't influence you in the least. I could point to commendations from world leaders and Jewish luminaries of the time and it wouldn't change anything. I could point to assassination attempts by the nazis on the Pope and you wouldn't care.

That's because you don't care about the truth, you care about what will bolster your hatred of the Catholic Church.

By the way (as long as you ask), I could point to protestant parallels to your points 1, 2, 3, 4 & 6 but it would be pointless. I don't believe that it would indict protestantism and it wouldn't alter your ignorant hatred of Catholicism.

As a matter of fact, you would have read some if you bothered to check out the references provided.

Eric




[edit on 21-6-2009 by EricD]



posted on Jun, 22 2009 @ 03:01 PM
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reply to post by EricD
 


Yes if you believe they were helping the Jews dream on, you can clearly see them signing the concordat! Giving the old Salute, converting the Orthodox Christians and taking their priests robes off and swapping it for the old SS uniform like Jesuit priest Stepinac. Then to make matters worse they want to beatify him and you wonder why people hate this abomination coupled with their molestation and then they cover it up to boot.

Get your head out the clouds and try to stop being a poor apologist for them, as i said you can't defend the indefensible! People are waking up to them.

Look at the amount of threads being started about the Catholic Church i suppose all the original posters are Catholic Haters like me? No they are just wanting the truth but their threads get hijacked like poeple like you trying to turn the tables and making yourself look bad!

Get your facts correct my posts are anti-Catholic Church not Anti-Catholic, i have not said one thing about Catholics. You are Anti-Protestant saying the Protestant Churchs are stained you may be correct but not one millionth of the Abomination you defend so badly.

Everytime someone posts about another dastardly deed the Vatican does you are the first person to come onto the thread and defend i think you are a Jesuit in Disguise!

www.youtube.com...

Here just for you Eric don't try turning the tables it would do you better to explain it??????




[edit on 22-6-2009 by orangeman dave]



posted on Jun, 22 2009 @ 05:44 PM
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reply to post by orangeman dave
 


Well, this has turned personal very quickly.

Let's start with the 'defending the indefensible'. Feel free to go back through ATS threads and point out examples of where I have defended the actions of pedophiles or the institutional practices that defended them. Feel free to go back and find examples of my defending the actions of the Church during the Inquisitions. Feel free to go back and try to find examples of me defending the actions of any heinous individuals who claim to be Catholics. Good luck.

The problem with your argument is that you're a one trick pony. You have no nuance and lack the ability to see subtlety or anything positive in something that you dislike. And that now applies to your reaction to me. You imagine that I offer blanket approval and support for every action taken by Catholics and the Church as that would be convenient. It makes it much easier to dismiss refutations to your simplistic argumentative.

While 80% of European Jews were killed during WWII, 80% of Italian Jews were saved. Coincidence?

From Rabbi David Dalin:

• Of the forty-four speeches Pacelli gave in Germany as papal nuncio between 1917 and 1929, forty denounced some aspect of the emerging Nazi ideology.
• In March 1935, he wrote an open letter to the bishop of Cologne calling the Nazis "false prophets with the pride of Lucifer."
• That same year, he assailed ideologies "possessed by the superstition of race and blood" to an enormous crowd of pilgrims at Lourdes. At Notre Dame in Paris two years later, he named Germany "that noble and powerful nation whom bad shepherds would lead astray into an ideology of race."
• The Nazis were "diabolical," he told friends privately. Hitler "is completely obsessed," he said to his long-time secretary, Sister Pascalina. "All that is not of use to him, he destroys; . . . this man is capable of trampling on corpses." Meeting in 1935 with the heroic anti-Nazi Dietrich von Hildebrand, he declared, "There can be no possible reconciliation" between Christianity and Nazi racism; they were like "fire and water."
• The year after Pacelli became secretary of state in 1930, Vatican Radio was established, essentially under his control. The Vatican newspaper L'Osservatore Romano had an uneven record, though it would improve as Pacelli gradually took charge (extensively reporting Kristallnacht in 1938, for example). But the radio station was always good—making such controversial broadcasts as the request that listeners pray for the persecuted Jews in Germany after the 1935 Nuremberg Legislation.
• It was while Pacelli was his predecessor's chief adviser that Pius XI made the famous statement to a group of Belgian pilgrims in 1938 that "anti-Semitism is inadmissible; spiritually we are all Semites." And it was Pacelli who drafted Pius XI's encyclical Mit brennender Sorge, "With Burning Concern," a condemnation of Germany among the harshest ever issued by the Holy See. Indeed, throughout the 1930s, Pacelli was widely lampooned in the Nazi press as Pius XI's "Jew-loving" cardinal, because of the more than fifty-five protests he sent the Germans as the Vatican secretary of state.
To these must be added highlights of Pius XII's actions during the war:
• His first encyclical, Summi Pontificatus, rushed out in 1939 to beg for peace, was in part a declaration that the proper role of the papacy was to plead to both warring sides rather than to blame one. But it very pointedly quoted St. Paul—“there is neither Gentile nor Jew”—using the word "Jew" specifically in the context of rejecting racial ideology. The New York Times greeted the encyclical with a front-page headline on October 28, 1939: "Pope Condemns Dictators, Treaty Violators, Racism." Allied airplanes dropped thousands of copies on Germany in an effort to raise anti-Nazi sentiment.
• In 1939 and 1940, Pius acted as a secret intermediary between the German plotters against Hitler and the British. He would similarly risk warning the Allies about the impending German invasions of Holland, Belgium, and France.
• In March 1940, Pius granted an audience to Joachim von Ribbentrop, the German foreign minister and the only high-ranking Nazi to bother visiting the Vatican. The Germans' understanding of Pius's position, at least, was clear: Ribbentrop chastised the pope for siding with the Allies. Whereupon Pius began reading from a long list of German atrocities. "In the burning words he spoke to Herr Ribbentrop," the New York Times reported on March 14, Pius "came to the defense of Jews in Germany and Poland."
• When French bishops issued pastoral letters in 1942 attacking deportations, Pius sent his nuncio to protest to the Vichy government against "the inhuman arrests and deportations of Jews from the French-occupied zone to Silesia and parts of Russia." Vatican Radio commented on the bishops' letters six days in a row—at a time when listening to Vatican Radio was a crime in Germany and Poland for which some were put to death. ("Pope Is Said to Plead for Jews Listed for Removal from France," the New York Times headline read on August 6, 1942. "Vichy Seizes Jews; Pope Pius Ignored," the Times reported three weeks later.) In retaliation, in the fall of 1942, Goebbels's office distributed ten million copies of a pamphlet naming Pius XII as the "pro-Jewish pope" and explicitly citing his interventions in France.
• In the summer of 1944, after the liberation of Rome but before the war's end, Pius told a group of Roman Jews who had come to thank him for his protection: "For centuries, Jews have been unjustly treated and despised. It is time they were treated with justice and humanity, God wills it and the Church wills it. St. Paul tells us that the Jews are our brothers. They should also be welcomed as friends."

I could include much, much more but the post word count is almost up. It doesn't really matter though, as your insistence on seeing only black when there is also white and gray says more about you than anything I could express.

Eric



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 12:50 AM
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if i was in possession of the original scrolls of alexandria do you think they would do any cool #



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