It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Are the soldiers who protect America bad?

page: 13
27
<< 10  11  12    14  15  16 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jun, 22 2009 @ 03:25 PM
link   
reply to post by disgustedbyhumanity
 


Does the cashier shoot his customers if his boss asks him? Does the cashier occupy the competitions stores?

Your analogy fails because there are various degrees of urgency and consequence seperating a soldier, who is a potential tool of opression and conquest, from a cashier, who is just menial labour. If all cashiers were soldiers the US would be in the hands of the NWO already.




posted on Jun, 23 2009 @ 03:10 AM
link   

Originally posted by Kombatt98
USA now(since 1870-) is evil and genocidal, so any soldier who protects it is evil .

the only good USA was the USA created by George Washington (which Ron Paul endorses)

if good USA does not return , then Russia must destroy USA to save the world from the jaws of this monstrous american evil


ROFL!




posted on Jun, 23 2009 @ 07:09 AM
link   
reply to post by Kombatt98
 

One quick question, If Russia is so great and America is so bad Why are Russians flocking here by the droves?



posted on Jun, 23 2009 @ 12:04 PM
link   
reply to post by mf_luder
 


I can understand your fustration to a degree, but you cannot deny for one moment that the US UK forces were sent to war on false pretences, that both institutions had some serious questions to answer regarding the treatment of prisoners, or that the real reason you were sent there by your government , is that some rich people wanted to get richer by investing YOUR spilt blood, YOUR comrades broken bodies, and by sacrificing the honour which is supposed to come with the job you do. I maintain that I have no problem with soldiers as a whole. I do have a big problem with the people who get to say what they do and where they do it .
Its a straight up FACT that the entire weapons of mass destruction element was a fat bull turd, just like its a FACT that there was never a real threat of Iraq invading your nation. Therefore , although I respect that as a military person , you feel duty bound to do as you are told, I believe that the entire war (much as it may have had SOME positive results) was a scam , and possibly one of the most disgusting acts commited by a developed nation in several decades. I mean , we get reports here of how many personel on the British side lost there lives. Its a damned small amount. Its even smaller when you consider that the conservative estimates (ie the small ones) bring the non combatant civilian death toll to something like 93,000 people , and that this number is not taking EVERY civilian death into account. Just the ones that can be positively identified as having been killed by coalition forces. Now Im sure, by dint of the fact that there were more US troops on the ground than Brits, you took more of a slapping in the death toll department, but I bet there arent nearly as many mothers missing sons in america, as there are in Iraq.
Thats not your fault, nor is it the fault of anyone else who is sent somewhere by a blatantly corrupt, evil , disgusting corperate government ... but its still wrong. Thats the real problem with the whole mess. You all got used.



posted on Jun, 23 2009 @ 12:18 PM
link   

Originally posted by Kombatt98
USA now(since 1870-) is evil and genocidal, so any soldier who protects it is evil .

the only good USA was the USA created by George Washington (which Ron Paul endorses)

if good USA does not return , then Russia must destroy USA to save the world from the jaws of this monstrous american evil


Evil and Genocidal???? Was it evil and genocidal to stop the Kaiser from dominating Europe during WWI? Was it evil and genocidal to stop the Axis from dominating the world during WWII? Was it evil and genocidal to stop the genocide in Gemany in WWII and Bosnia in the 90's?

Also, George Washington did not create the USA! He was not one of the signers of the Declaration of Independence, he had nothing to do with the Articles of Confederation (which I doubt you even know anything about), and he had nothing to do with the creation and ratification of the US Constitution (which was adopted on September 17, 1787. Well past your 1870 'creation' date) which is what Ron Paul is all about.



Edit to add: As one of those evil soldiers you refered to (1987-1995), you are cordially invited to go frak yourself!!

[edit on 23-6-2009 by JaxonRoberts]



posted on Jun, 23 2009 @ 01:58 PM
link   
Put it this way though. If this was Lord of the Rings or any instance of polarising force, you would be the bad guys.



posted on Jun, 23 2009 @ 02:18 PM
link   
reply to post by Majestic23
 


And if my aunt had wheels, she'd be a wagon! Has the US made mistakes in the use of force by our military? Yes, but name one nation that has not! Does this make the soldiers on the ground who had nothing to do with the making of these decisions bad? FOR THE LAST TIME, NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

*Of course, the likelyhood that it will be the last time I have to say that is about 0%!



posted on Jun, 23 2009 @ 09:51 PM
link   

Originally posted by Majestic23
Put it this way though. If this was Lord of the Rings or any instance of polarising force, you would be the bad guys.


Pssttt.....Lord of the Rings is a fiction book. This is real life. There is a difference between the two. Nothing is as clear cut and black & white in the real world.



posted on Jun, 23 2009 @ 11:59 PM
link   
reply to post by Silver Shadow
 


I don't think I am a hero, but I did fight in Iraq.

First, their are Islamic extremists that want to kill Americans. I am glad that I was able to fight them over there instead of over here.

Second, I am glad that we were able to free the oppressed people over there. It doesn't take too many Iraqi's that had been tortured by Saddam to figure out that we did a good thing.

Third, go ahead bring up other waste lands of human excrement like Darfur, and ask why we didn't go there and I will tell you "lets go!" I enjoy liberating people. I bet you are willing to spend money on "aid" but you aren't willing to spend blood, sweat, and tears to keep liberty on the march.

So, to answer your question about how I protected Americans by fighting in Iraq.

It was October 2003 that we American soldiers in Iraq started fighting "foreigners" from other countries, not the local Iraqi army.

I took the fight to the enemy.
The enemy that is willing to spend their blood, sweat, and tears to get what they want.
The enemy that puts remote bombs on mentally disabled people, and on woman, and on kids.

So, unless you do not believe their is a tangible threat to the US or you want to fight terrorists in the US be happy that we are in their country fighting not ours.

Try and fight a war on terror in the US with the police. it is impossible. Mostly because we want to retain our freedoms.

So, it is unfortunate that in Iraq innocent people are caught in a war that they had no part in... I guess I am selfish that I want volunteers who are the best trained and equipped to fight a hidden enemy on terms that we may be able to win with.

Hope that clears it up a bit



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 12:05 AM
link   
I tell ya, I'm darn proud if you go get your legs blown off for Bush, invading a country that never attacked the USA. Darn proud! keep up the good work.



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 12:23 AM
link   

Originally posted by WEOPPOSEDECEPTION
I tell ya, I'm darn proud if you go get your legs blown off for Bush, invading a country that never attacked the USA. Darn proud! keep up the good work.


Wow, what a funny guy!! And your post contributes what to this conversation?? I mean, besides you showing your ass to everyone?

Move out and draw fire.



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 10:03 AM
link   

Originally posted by mf_luder
reply to post by Drexl
 


The US Army is trained to take cover when explosions start going off, especially if there is the off-chance it is artillery. Sure, those kids you found that video of were scared and cowering - but they were doing like they were supposed to... waiting for the explosions to end.



Theres no guarantee they have even come out yet . I feel sorry for their wives and girlfriends if they ever make it home . Shut that cupboard door too loudly , and you won't be getting this crew out from under the kitchen table for at least a week .

[edit on 24-6-2009 by Drexl]



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 10:40 AM
link   
reply to post by blupblup
 


I couldn't agree more. Obviously there are bad apples in any group however as a whole I have the up most respect for our military and am quite grateful for what they are willing to do.

However on the flip side I have the up most resentment and disgust for those who start the wars and would be willing to easily sacrifice the lives of other human beings for their own personal profit and their geopolitical agendas. These people who wage these wars are NOT in the military save for a few very high ranking Generals possibly.

Soon I fear there will be little divide amongst the Military and the Citizens as we all are being forced to face an ever increasing common and domestic enemy that is the 'elite' tearing apart our constitution for the sake of increasing their power while taking away the power of the people.

Should it come down to it and all of us find ourselves defending against a domestic enemy you will find me standing by the side of our armed services just as I expect them to stand by my side to defend our constitution and our freedom.

Military or not we have all the responsibility to defend our freedom and our country and we will all need each other.



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 11:09 AM
link   

Originally posted by jerico65

Originally posted by Majestic23
Put it this way though. If this was Lord of the Rings or any instance of polarising force, you would be the bad guys.


Pssttt.....Lord of the Rings is a fiction book. This is real life. There is a difference between the two. Nothing is as clear cut and black & white in the real world.


But thats what you have to do in order to make people go to war. That is what the American Government did to the American people to make them go to war, Good vs Evil. I am saying that going by this outlook you are definately the bad guys. If you werent then so many people would not be claiming "everyone hates America".

I understand your point that things might not be black and white from our perspective but the Lord of the Rings was derived from mythos that probably had a basis in the ancient world and certainly had a basis in the 1930 and 40s, the Second World War.



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 11:12 AM
link   

Originally posted by Drexl
Theres no guarantee they have even come out yet . I feel sorry for their wives and girlfriends if they ever make it home . Shut that cupboard door too loudly , and you won't be getting this crew out from under the kitchen table for at least a week.


Oh, yeah, that youtube video.


Ever been rocketed before? Been under a mortar attack? Probably not from your comments. And Call to Duty doesn't count.

How about this one:

www.clipsyndicate.com...



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 11:18 AM
link   

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
Now let's look at the modern military. It's a volunteer force. You have to make a conscious decision that you want to be in the armed forces to get in today. You sign the papers, get a contract deal, it's a job. The big difference is, the point of any military is to kill people. And here you are, volunteering to do just that.


[edit on 19-6-2009 by TheWalkingFox]


Boom. That statement right there is WRONG WRONG WRONG. You are killing your own power by making such a blatantly poor statement.

The point of the military is NOT to KILL PEOPLE. The point of the military is to AVOID having to kill people. The stronger your force the less likely it is to be attacked by others.

Now, if you would have made your point in a different way I may have started to agree with you. The problem with HOW our military is being used today is what has me going. We have been lied into wars that have cost over a million innocent lives. I do NOT count our military personell as innocent lives because as you have pointed out they have chosen to enlist knowing that they may have to see action.

Our military focus should be on us, the U.S. alone. Securing our borders, training, and so on. Not fighting in other countries NON-STOP like we have been for as long as I have been alive and longer. We keep getting into these wars so the rich can get richer so in response to the OP, there you go. They don't fight FOR the rich but the rich benefit a great deal from their fighting. Period.



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 12:23 PM
link   
reply to post by jerico65
 


Just average stuff . I'm looking for heroes , the french army could do that too . You must have some awe inspiring stuff to show , for all this hero acclaiming rhetoric . That is just what average troops do . I have a video showing absolutely useless troops that would be called heroes for their avoiding actions and was just wondering if there was anything special that would tip the average balance towards at least the mediocre .


I can understand your predicament . To be the hero you portray, you would need to be fighting an enemy that was similarly armed and posed something of a threat , and be seeing to counter that equal threat , which is not the situation . I have all the advantages , in that a lightly armed insurgent group of no resources can keep your heroic forces pinned down and crying for the lord despite all their advanced training and equipment .

It's just to bring it into perspective really . All we hear about is american heroes . I know the truth lies somewhere between my video of the useless ones and this mythical unseen video of american rambo's . But thats all they are , they aren't super heroes, they are just human . I'm just trying to bring the balance back where it belongs.



[edit on 24-6-2009 by Drexl]



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 03:32 PM
link   
I don't feel that those in the military are "bad" or "naughty". I have been in for 10 years now. Am I a bad person? I don't feel like I am. I'm a medic and my sole purpose is to help those sick or wounded. Whether they be US Soldiers, Al Qaeda, or whoever. I make no distinction. I'm also Buddhist. How many Buddhists have you seen that are bad people?

Granted there are a lot of bad apples. We have relaxed the standards a few years ago because we were losing good men and women. Do I believe the original reasons for going into Iraq now? Not a bit. Do I feel that we should be in Afghanistan? Most definitely. DO I believe in torturing human beings to extract some sort of information? Not on your life.

Each and every one of us must live with our decisions on a daily basis. I live each and every day with the fact that I had to shoot a child because he had a rocket propelled grenade pointed at me and my medical evac helicopter. There's not a day that goes by that I don't relive that moment.

But not all Soldiers are bad. Remember this: I serve so you can have the freedom to post anything that you want on this board. I serve so you don't have to.



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 03:57 PM
link   

Originally posted by Drexl
Just average stuff . I'm looking for heroes , the french army could do that too . You must have some awe inspiring stuff to show , for all this hero acclaiming rhetoric . That is just what average troops do . I have a video showing absolutely useless troops that would be called heroes for their avoiding actions and was just wondering if there was anything special that would tip the average balance towards at least the mediocre .


Yeah, a fire fight is "average". Once again, you really don't have anything to base your comments on, do you? You have no experience at all.



Originally posted by Drexl
I can understand your predicament . To be the hero you portray, you would need to be fighting an enemy that was similarly armed and posed something of a threat , and be seeing to counter that equal threat , which is not the situation . I have all the advantages , in that a lightly armed insurgent group of no resources can keep your heroic forces pinned down and crying for the lord despite all their advanced training and equipment .


Once again, have you ever been mortared before? That's the worse thing to go thru, since you can't fight back. You just take cover and wait for the rounds to stop. These guys look like they were on a FOB; they were in a tent and I didn't see any wearing body armor. So much for the "advanced training and equipment" you commented on.


Originally posted by Drexl
It's just to bring it into perspective really . All we hear about is american heroes . I know the truth lies somewhere between my video of the useless ones and this mythical unseen video of american rambo's . But thats all they are , they aren't super heroes, they are just human . I'm just trying to bring the balance back where it belongs.


And I really don't recall calling anyone "heroes", but before you spout off, maybe you ought to spend some time in the beaten zone first.

You are a no go at this station. Try again.



posted on Jun, 24 2009 @ 04:34 PM
link   
All you got is . .. have you been mortared etc, blah blah , in a cyclic repetative form throughout that whole post . That is the way you types work, accept your notion of the righteousness of these so called purveyors of freedom , lest you have been there yourself to say otherwise .

You think just because some half wit has put themselves into a position to have a mortar shell land by them , they are the only ones that ought to have a say on the rights and wherefores a shell should have landed by them at all .

It don't work that way , genius, in fact , the last person to decide the rights and wrongs of such an event is the doofus that get killed or injured by one .

Who said it was a mortar attack anyway ?, I did . You want to take my word for it that it was a mortar attack at all ?

Nothing you say detracts from the fact , that these homeboys are not exactly the picture you want to represent of the fearless fighting for freedom crusaders that you would like the US public to envisage . Doesn't matter that I'm not dumb enough to go fighting corporations and Israeli's battles for them.

In fact, if your that short on intelligence to end up in that kind of situation to have shells land by you in the first place , your hardly likely to be capable of much more than ' errr . i did it for freedoms , i spill blood so you dont have to' umm , anyone see where my leg went ?.


[edit on 24-6-2009 by Drexl]



new topics

top topics



 
27
<< 10  11  12    14  15  16 >>

log in

join