The Incorruptables: Another Catholic Lie?, page 3

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reply posted on 27-6-2009 @ 08:02 PM by helen670

Hi/

I dont understand what the fuss is all about!
It is known in the Torah, the OLD TESTAMENT!
It is not a NEW thing?
This is in the Old Testament....it is NOT a new type if INVENTION?
As it is written in the Old Testament...IT's not the Churches INVENTION!

ICXN NIKA
helen

reply posted on 27-6-2009 @ 09:53 PM by helen670

Hi again/

This is how I see it,
WHY does it have to be the Christians fault all the time?
People kill,murder steal etc......
The MEDIA....Yep, they were Christians,or were they Muslims?
Terrorists,anyone???
It's always a main stream religion,isn't it?
BUT,it always points to the Christians(seems like they are the true religion!)

If people can put the blame on GOD and His followers,then WHY can't the blame be also be put on SATAN?(He is also called the devil which means slanderer)
I mean, if God exists, then so does SATAN.
So,if the facts point more to that of satan, then to that of the Lord,is it not more likely that the fault lies with SATAN(devil) then that of God?
Well,the fault of the Devil directly is not so true, as much as it is the fault of the people that Follow in satan(devil) and his deceptive and false LIES...
Every EVIL has a name.....Legion of demons.
The Demon ''Mammon''....avarice...love of money, this demon is worshiped by everyday human beings.
Since DEMONS were once Angels of God,they are now fallen angels.
Lucifer who fell became SATAN(devil)....took with him his legion of his fallen angels,'demons' and they play MESSENGERS of SATAN(THE DEVIL)....WHO IS the father of of LIES!
"There occurred a war in the heavens.
Michael(ANGEL-Messenger) and his angels fought against the dragon9another name for satan),
and the dragon and his angels fought against them.
However they did not prevail,
and there was no room for them in heaven.
The great dragon was cast down,
that ancient snake(another name for satan), known as devil and satan … and his angels were also cast down with him" (Revelation 12:7-9)....
Angels on the other hand,are MESSENGERS of God...When the prophet Daniel saw God the Father, in the form of the "Ancient of Days," he also saw that "A thousand thousands ministered to Him; and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before Him" (Daniel 7:10).
During the birth of Jesus in Bethlehem "a multitude of the heavenly host" extolled His coming to earth (Luke 2:13)
....A Psalm that says about God... "He commands His angels regarding you to guard you in all your paths … The angel of the Lord encamps all around those who fear Him, and delivers them" (Psalm 91:11, 34:7).
Also the Word of God calls some Angels and some Archangels (1 Thess. 4:16; Jude verse 9)
The Savior our Lord Jesus Christ, calls the devil "murderer from the beginning and the father of lies," having in mind that moment in which, taking the form of a snake,
..... deceived our forbears Adam and Eve to break the commandment of God and by doing so deprived them of everlasting life-eternal life (Genesis 3:1-6; John 8:44)...and so DEATH entered onto the first man named ADAM(which literally means first man)and to all mankind!
The cherubim with a flaming sword was set to guard the gates of Eden (Gen. 3:24).
The Angels who also APPEARED to Abraham,in the Old Testament in the form of 3 men..."The Lord appeared to {Abraham} by the oaks of Mamre,
as he sat at the door of his tent in the heat of the day.
He lifted up his eyes and looked, and behold, three men stood in front of him." (Gen 18:1-2).
Enough on the Angels.

So as the Original Post reads...The Incorruptables: Another Catholic Lie?
The term Catholic should be understood as UNIVERSAL.
So, being that it is understood as 'UNIVERSAL'....it is as much as to say that The Old Testament is also a LIE as what the TORAH teaches?
Why call it a Christian LIE?
The Old Testament also believes, in the incorrupt relics of Saints!
I posted Old Testament Scripture in my previous posts....about the Relics of Saints and what they stand for!

ICXN NIKA
helen

reply posted on 28-6-2009 @ 05:51 AM by KRISKALI777

reply to post by helen670

Hi Helen,
it doesn't have to be a Christians fault about anything!
The purpose of this thread was to outline, yet another falsehood portraited by the Catholic Church as Miracle.
There is no need for endless bible quotes.
Bible quotes are not going to change the fact that the 'Incorruptables' are normally decaying human corpses, and yet decaying more slowly because of their controlled environment and frequent repairs.

Please give me a biblical quote to help me understand why this logically may be so. It must refer directly to maintenance needed to be carried out on miraculously un-decaying bodies!!!!

reply posted on 28-6-2009 @ 06:26 AM by helen670

reply to post by KRISKALI777

Hi Kris/

Darn the internett,so you are going to get a short answer here!

The Orthodox Church does not and is not allowed to embalm the bodies at all...
Monks at Mount Athos are exhumed after 3 years to test for incorruption.
I presume a body can be tested if such methods were used?
eg/to stop it decaying and such.

Is that it?

ICXC NIKA
helen

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:01 AM by KRISKALI777

reply to post by helen670

Iam sorry but controlling the corpses environment, so there will be no further decomposition is an an untraditional sense embalming.
Embalming has many different applications.
We think of the mummies of ancient Egypt (this was ancient embalming), we look at todays embalming with the use of agents such as Formaldehyde, and Formalin.
Embalming could be classed as pumping a sealed environment with particular aerosols/gases.
The sole purpose is to control the amount of decay.

Helen if they are indeed "Incorruptable"; WHY THE WAX MASKS, AND CONTROLLED, SEALED ENVIRONMENT

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:05 AM by helen670

reply to post by KRISKALI777

Hi Kris/

I am not Roman Catholic!
Therefore I do not know how they do it!

The enclosures would be for sacred keeping...otherwise people would be touching the relics...this is done so they are not handled!
As for the wax

Again,I am Greek Orthodox and I dont know of the wax thing you are talking about!

ICXC NIKA
helen

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:11 AM by spellbound

reply to post by KRISKALI777

I believe that the Catholic Church is the biggest liar on earth.

It its a corrupt church, it is all about money and power, and it is the Beast mentioned in the Bible, I think.

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:14 AM by helen670

reply to post by KRISKALI777

Hi/
Ok,
Lets see it like this,if a person dies and is put into a glass case, would that body decay?
How long would it take to show decomposition?

The bodies of Orthodox Christians are pulled out of their coffins or wherever they may be, and their are signs to look for if found to be holy?
There's a certain colour or fragrance....especially to those individuals who lived exceedingly and exceptionally virtuous and righteous lives.

Hope that helps with your query!
ICXC NIKA
helen

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:16 AM by helen670

Originally posted by spellbound
reply to post by KRISKALI777

I believe that the Catholic Church is the biggest liar on earth.

It its a corrupt church, it is all about money and power, and it is the Beast mentioned in the Bible, I think.

Hi spell/

And why have you come to that conclusion?
Do you have an opinion as to why you think that?
Im just curious as to why you think that this is so...don't go by others opinions, but as to why you think that?
ICXC NIKA
helen

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:17 AM by KRISKALI777

reply to post by helen670

well Helen, you are making more sense to me now! (Should I call you Helen of troy?)

As far as I know it is not the Greek's who fabricate these 'enigmas', but the Roman Catholics. I guess alas the greek orthodox is probably an off-shoot anyway! I mean you guys have the Icons and are big followers of Mary. Remeber the first commandment Helen???

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:24 AM by spellbound

reply to post by helen670

Hi Helen,

I think that the Roman Catholic Church instills guilt in all their followers.

This is bad.

I know they oblige them to confess. But they can go and do the same thing and confess again next week.

I know that the Roman Catholic Church is very rich, so why are they letting starving people die?

They are totallly corrupt.

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:26 AM by helen670

Originally posted by KRISKALI777
reply to post by helen670

well Helen, you are making more sense to me now! (Should I call you Helen of troy?)

As far as I know it is not the Greek's who fabricate these 'enigmas', but the Roman Catholics. I guess alas the greek orthodox is probably an off-shoot anyway! I mean you guys have the Icons and are big followers of Mary. Remeber the first commandment Helen???

Hi/

An off shoot!
Do you know History?
BYZANTIUM!!! Here's your History
An Icon is not an IDOL or an Image,many times I posted this, and wont post it again!
It is revvered!
There's a DIFFERENCE!

An Idol is something like KISS being potrayed on a wall and idolized!
We do not IDOLIZE, we know beauty!

ICONS

As for Theotokos?
She is the Bearer of God,therefore she is revered as such...not idolized!
another of my posts Theotokos~means God bearer1and why?

does that make sense,Kris?(isn't Kriskali a godess of some sort?
Refresh....

ICXC NIKA
helen

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:32 AM by spellbound

reply to post by helen670

You cannot answer me.

I rest my question.

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:32 AM by KRISKALI777

reply to post by helen670

Helen. Decomposition is a variable. It deepends in the environment that the deceased is found in.
Different factors influence the rate of decomposition. Some of these are:
The amount of bacterial flora on the body and particularly in the digetive tract of the deceased at time of death. Heat; dry heat and dampness will caiuse different effects, Cold, generally dry cold environments are best for preservation. Mineral content in soils and presence of other chemical/mineral elements are contributing factors to preservation also.

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:33 AM by helen670

reply to post by spellbound

Hi spell/

Well to the extent of the Roman Catholic church teachings and of their NEW teachings, they are wrong!
As for the many people that follow them..we cannot judge them as being corrupt as much as we can say they are Lost?
The church should belong to the people!
The Church should NOT be in One name.

Only God knows what is each of our hearts.

ICXC NIKA
helen

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:37 AM by KRISKALI777

reply to post by helen670

Helen. If rationalization is the changing of terms to suit convenience within an argument, you have it then. you have your belief, no matter how irrational it is to anyone else.
I still affirm: the incorruptables are a farce.
They are preserved by modern means, and are no more saints than the "Peat Bog man".

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:39 AM by helen670

reply to post by KRISKALI777

hi/

Yes, I agree with you have said!
And so, is it not that the evidence should be left in the hands of God?

Saints come from the Old Testament and therefore it is followed through to the New Testament..I mean,who am I to judge?

Here is an example why Theotokos is blessed...

Archangel Gabriel greeted Her(Mary) with the words: "Rejoice, O Blessed One, the Lord is with Thee! Blessed art Thou among women!" announcing to Her the mystery of the conception of the Son of God.
A few days later with the words "Blessed is the Fruit of Thy womb," the righteous Elizabeth saluted the pure Virgin.
St. Luke explains in his Gospel that the Holy Spirit revealed to Elizabeth that Mary had become the Mother of the Lord, the promised Savior of mankind (Luke 1:28-42).
There's also genesis Prophecy.....after the fall of man.
God said to the devil: "I shall put enmity between thee and the Woman, and between thy seed and Her Seed" (Genesis 3:15).
It's amazing how the Devil worked evil as soon as Man was created...He is good!(Old Testament the progeny were always called the seed or descendant of a male parent.)
birth to the Messiah-Emmanuel, will be a virgin. "God Himself shall give you a sign," explained the prophet Isaiah to the disbelieving descendants of king David, — "the Virgin shall accept into her womb and bear a Son, and shall name Him Emmanuel, which means: God is with us" (Isaiah 7:14)

ICXN NIKA
helen

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:40 AM by spellbound

reply to post by helen670

Wow, Helen,

Yes I totally agree - but there should be no churches and no preachers - we should reach the truth in our own minds.

Thank you for agreeing with me!

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:41 AM by helen670

reply to post by KRISKALI777

hi/
Peat bog?

who is this..

don't worry about that!

take it easy,

ICXC NIKA
helen

reply posted on 29-6-2009 @ 05:44 AM by helen670

reply to post by spellbound

Hi spell/

I didn't say there should NOT be churches...This was instituted by the Apostles,who were followers of Jesus Christ.
We cannot go making up stuff just BECAUSE!

I said OWNING..there is a difference!

When Jesus was speaking about the temple been broken down, He meant His Temple,in other words...His Body!

ICXC NIKA
helen

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