I am a Military Recruiter and would like to clear up some misconceptions.

I'm kind of appalled by some of the comments in this thread. I can fully understand hating your government. I mean they do a lot of things that are just plain wrong.

Please, don't take this out on enlisted men. Do you not respect a sacrifice (and if not have you really ever had to make a real one)? A marine goes to Iraq a war that should have never happened just to follow orders, fights this battle and dies. Is he not a tragedy? Have you ever had to make the decision to kill a child because they are behind an AK-47? Have you ever been in a stressful situation involving bullets whizzing by your head? Have you ever feared for your life every second of every day? Should those that fight for us but under the control of evil men be liable for their sacrifice and deserving of disdain?

It is ok to hate the government, but quit taking out your frustrations on those that fight in the name of YOU!

Respect should be given to those who have fought and to those who have died even in wars that should have never occurred because they are our brothers and sisters!!

What happened to "hate the government but support our troops"?

That is one thing I don't like about some of the people here, they always go to the extreme. I couldn't believe some of the rude and undeserved comments in this thread. You should be ashamed of yourselves!! I hate what our government does as much as the next guy, but how can you really hate our soldiers!?!?! They are doing what they have to do to end this war and get back to their families, their children. Could you see what they see everyday and maintain your sanity? Hate the government, hate the war, but for the love of god give our soldiers some f.....g respect!

reply to post by iraqvet85


This is another reason why I do not get why people hate the military (especially our own).

It lets the U.S remain a super power (everyone likes a better economy).
Allows people with a rough start in life to make something out of themselves.
Some people WANT/LIKE the idea of traveling or killing "bad guys".

To those who say they are feeding the rich...seriously, who cares? Almost everyone works for someone else, and there will always be someone on top. Not everyone can be a millionaire (with todays standards).

Some people are just to insecure about their own life. or have family members who CHOSE to join the military, and want to make decisions for everyone else's life.

You guys wan't people sitting at home feeding off of welfare, or doing something with their life such as joining the military?

as i was almost recruited by the army at one point in time, i was smoking marijuana like i do every day for my autism.
the recruiters knew i failed the drug test and they told me that they had to get me clean for MEPS.
i know that the military wants YOU to join
because THEY get paid.

its a sad ordeal, but after recieving niacin and being instructed not to smoke, i gave up thinking about joining.
they then proceeded to harass me with phone calls telling me i needed to be a man and put down the pipe.
so i generally have a distorted view on recruiters, though not all may be bad.
so you yourself cannot possibly speak for them all OP.

i have thought about joining before. i dont think i would anymore.

if there is a major enemy force which tries to take over our country (such as china decides to get its payment) i will be up in arms to defend the people around me. i will not preemptively go to war with the hopes that killing people first will make me safe later. its an escalatory system that goes nowhere but down.

i feel bad though. i wish i could hear juston's side to an argument it seems he is dodging. there have been many anti-war, anti-recruiter, anti-"juston" sentiments that havent been addressed. the most ive heard from him, is that he isnt recruiting, and he likes slayer (albeit doesnt support any views or anything from their albums or lyrics).

i would like to hear his side on the threads that portray him and others in the military as the proverbial "baby killers" that so many others here have cased against him.

i mean this is a thread to clear up misconceptions right?

Originally posted by TwiTcHomatic
You know what is funny....

You come here speaking of miscommunication.... but your avatar shows a skeletal body with symbols arranged in a pentagram....

You represent yourself in one way.. but show yourself in another. In the future, maybe you should consider your advertisements a little better.

Who exactly do YOU thing you are trying to persuade?

-EDIT- Just so you know, my father was once a marine recruiter.. he had carte blanche to offer anything to get someone to sign papers.

To all those considering the military.. get ANY promises in writing before signing papers.. see how well that goes over.




[edit on 19-6-2009 by TwiTcHomatic]

Exactly, recruiters promise all kinds of things, but if you do NOT get it in writing, they are just blowing words out their you know whats.

I respect, in general, the people in the military, I don't always agree with the decisions that are made IE Iraq, but the men and women who are in the military are just doing their jobs. Most feel they are keeping this country safe and are just humans doing the best they can.

The fact that military recruiters use subterfuge and lies to get young people to join, is not rumor. It is truth. Sorry if you can't see that.

I have many family members in the military. We have learned to make sure that anyone wanting to join, get's the information about making sure any promises are in writing and signed by the recruiter. I also have some family members who are special forces, and they love what they do, but they definitely make sure to tell others to get anything a recruiter promises you in writing. And to make sure you UNDERSTAND every single word in the contract you sign, and until you do, don't sign.

Recruiters are salesmen/saleswomen going after a quota any way possible. Meaning the will use subterfuge, is that not one thing the military is good at? Subterfuge? And you really think recruiters won't use it?

Harm None
Peace

reply to post by amazed


With all due respect.

Your generalization that all recruiters lie is uncalled for. That's encourageing ignorance.

Furthermore, the rest of your post is based on outside observations and heresy. Did I ever lie to you, or anyone that I work with? No. And I know for a fact that they would'nt either.

Recruiters are salesmen/saleswomen going after a quota any way possible

Please read all my posts. For quite a while now, our quotas have been coming to us, rather than us going to them.

To mahtoosacks:
Members who ask me questions receive a U2U from me so I'm not accused of promoting the Navy publically on ATS I can only answer so many U2U's in a short amount of time.

reply to post by Capt. Charisma


Like what stereotype? The proud american middle class, that has his family that he cares and provides for. That stereotypical blood thirsty american who would gladly take a life in order to protect our freedom, and our way of life. Not just for you but for myself and my family. That evil war monger that spends every moment with my family, doing all kinds of evil things like volenteering my time to help conduct gym classes at several local inner city highschools, also providing counsel for students that are having hard times. The same elitist pig that experiences headaches juggling bills....

Originally posted by Juston
I wanna make a disclaimer now

Yes, I like the band Slayer. But really, what does that have to do anything? It's music, not my personal mantra or ideology.

I'd like to point something out here, not for the sake of disagreeing with you, but rather to share a thought or two about something you dismissed as seemingly a non factor.

I have come to the awareness of the fact that nothing could be further from the truth if you say you are not what you listen to.

The music we listen to puts us into different mind frames. The thoughts we have while listening to music go out into the world and become our reality. Being a musician and fan of music of all types, metal included I can tell you that I use music to invoke moods all the time. In fact, adding a Slayer tune or two on my mp3 player might come in handy to help me make better time as I power walk to the train station after work. But once on the train I'll definitely be switching back to some Jim Croce or Journey in order to calm down and relax for the 40 minute ride, lol...

You happen to like the drummer, cool, I have a few faves myself but when listening to music am I humming the drum line or singing the lyrics?

We don't want to open that book right I mean after all, Slayer didn't pen "We are the world".

What we listen to and enjoy is a direct reflection of what reverberates within us, melodically and harmonically.

Anyone who doesn't see a connection between what they listen to and who they are, is simply not looking.

PS, I'm all for having the muscle to defend our country against REAL threats, but this BS about "Spreading Democracy" has got to stop. Two thousand and nine years in this current era have proven that peace does not come from behind or out of a gun.

America rocked the world when it led by example. Since it's been shoving muzzles into the faces of non-white people everywhere for the last fifty or sixty years, we've lost quite a bit of shine on our reputation, tens of thousands of loved ones, and spent billions and billions of dollars. Yet the world is worse off today than it was fifty or sixty years ago.

Your solution to this is what? Throw more American bodies at the problem?

I understand your inability to see the other side... Your paycheck depends on your blindness.

reply to post by maus80

I didn't pay attention and had no idea what the ASVAB(sic?) was for when I took it in highschool, so unlike pretty much everyone else I actually tried to do well.

I did way too well; I'm sure they were full of crap, but recruiters kept calling and telling me that my score was in the top 2% for the entire country, and qualified me to enlist directly in a nuclear physics program. What the hell? I got the feeling they will say about anything to get you to enlist. They called constantly, tried to meet with me at my school and wouldn't take no for an answer, came to my house unannounced, etc.

Wow, it sounds like we had the same recuiter. That is almost exactly what happend to me. I was excited because I was going to the big city to take the "nuclear physics" test.

Luckily my next-door neighbor was outside working on his Jag that day. So happens he was a flight instructor officer at the local NAS. He asked where I was headed; when I told him he gave me the lowdown of what was going to happen. Had I had calculus? No. trigonometry, physics, etc? All No. I barely graduated in the top 1/2 by 1 (that changed a lot later in college BTW).
I learned that by the time I took the so-called nuclear physics test, I would already be signed up, I would fail, and likely wind up swabbing the deck somewhere. I decided to stay home, got a few phone calls but no harassment that I recall.

Apparently the job is weighing heavily on some by now.
Slayer Lyrics - Caution

[edit on 19-6-2009 by 1SawSomeThings]

Originally posted by nowshining
Agreed, but just so everyone knows - isn't it odd that everytime I reveal something of myself - someone from the Gov. posts...hmmm

Just so everyone knows - there is at LEAST 1 gov. spy on this forum....- that one everyone should know by defualt....

Then again I will never join the military - I don't have to....

- if you followed my posts - you'd know why this is so as I am protected by copyright laws locally, and internationally.... Let us just say 99.99 percent of the Mil population wouldn't even know who or believe who I was if I walked right in front of them...

Who is this government spy you speak of?

How are you protected by copyright laws?

Who are you?

What does any of this have to do with this thread?

I just dont understand how you can say you would never join. What if we were attacked by the Chinese tomorrow? Are you saying you would just sit their and be ok with it?

reply to post by Juston


whats the point of this thread then if we cant read what you say to clarify the misconceptions?

that is the point of this isnt it?

edit:

that reminds me. i was thinking of going to west point when i was in highschool. i was a boyscout and at the time, who was thinking about war?? i actually remember saying that to my mom to get to her calm down about it.

but after that i got calls at all hours. made me not want to join, really... but main reason was i had messed my leg up pretty bad and couldnt do anything from that point.

[edit on 6/19/2009 by mahtoosacks]

recruiters are like a diamond in the ruff..when your looking for a good one you cant find one,and when looking for a bad one you cant find one..But there out there none the less..

I have been in and around recruiter offices,The worst I have heard when one got off the phone with a young man was,''I GOT ANOTHER ONE!!""

reply to post by mahtoosacks


The misconceptions I wanted to clear up were in the first two posts. If something you would like to discuss is not listed there, please feel free to shoot me a U2U, and in turn I'll answer it for you, so as long as I feel it's a warrented question, not something like, OMG how does it feel to send ppl to their deaths or something equally assinine, I'll try my best to answer it in turn. I'm sure other members can attest that I have done just that.



[edit on 19-6-2009 by Juston]

OK, great and all of God's created said "halaluya and amen brother". Please no offense, retired military myself. The point is, their is now "NO F**KING POINT". This nation (whats left it) is screwed a thousand times over and then some. Drag in the rest of the world and sh*t, just say good by and bend over. Have I given up, no I'm just looking in a different direction. The signs are here and becoming increaslingly clear, if you are blind then your (a**) IS royally screwed. Please don't argue with me or try to hurt my feelings. This gov of ours has gone to the "dark side" and their are alot of fools that will follow. "Look up and rejoice", it has come down to your are either in or you are out. If you want to know how to get in (real freedom) just ask, its not a secret. God help us all for that is the only source able to correct this very sick misstake called "human nature".
Let him who has ears, hear.

A few things about the military I would like to point out.

One, I met the most knuckleheads I have ever come across in my life. Many, many of them were headed down a bad path in life. They either chose to go into the military to escape some sort of punishment from trouble they had been in while a civilian, or had nothing going for them, so joined for college money. That is not downplaying their service. It changed them. It gave them structure, and tools to succeed in life. That is the good side of the military in my opinion.

That being said, if you have aspirations and dreams of doing something with your life. You have good character, and know what it takes to attain your goals I would definitely say, go to college. Get a degree. Dont get caught up in patriotism (another reason I joined...after 9/11) and the feeling of a need to serve your country. Believe it or not, being successful in whatever you do is a good service to your country.

The second point I want to make is for those thinking about joining and have the qualities mentioned above. Now, I cant speak for other branches, but the Navy is so full of beaurocratic b.s. it is quite disgusting. It does not matter how good you are at your job. It does not matter about your performance or how you complete the tasks given to you. To succeed in the Navy and move up in rank, all you have to do is be in a certain top percentage of a test you can take once a year. But you had better be on the good side of your chief or whoever is in charge of you or you may not even get the chance to take that test. Along with the many good people who do their job well, and take pride in what they do, there are more sh**bags (a Navy term) that could give a crap. They will use excuses to get out of resposnibility and then suck up to those higher in rank. The sad part is this actually gets people somewhere.

Like I said, not all enlisted members are this way and their certainly are people who deserve their ranking and do a damn good job at their job, but for a U.S. military branch of service you would think discipline and hard work would get you much farther than the person next to you that doesnt lift a finger and always has an excuse as to why they can't do what they are told. That is just not the case.

So, do your research and know what you are getting into, because like everything in life, it is not all black and white. There are undesireable gray areas that are not talked about by recruiters. If you are thinking about joining, go to a base and talk to people about their experiences. Don't just trust what a recruiter says to be true. Know what job you are going to be doing. Understand that you probably won't be where you want to. Orders get filled on a personnel need as necessary, and that you will have to put up with people who have bias or people (higher ranking individuals) that dont like you for whatever reason. The experience is good on a resume, but I know people who have left the service and years ago and still dont have a job. There will be people where you have to pick up there slack. There will be people who ruin things for you because they do not do what they are told. You may have to work harder or do more menial tasks because someone messed up, and therefor your command gets punished. And understand those will get recognition for things you have done and they did not do but get credit because of said bias. These are the gray areas that recruiters do not tell you about. These are things you will deal with at some time or another.

I'd like to thank the recruiter from the OP for his service, even if he is a squid...

I still stay in touch with the retired Gunny that was my principle recruiter, and sometimes hang out at the RS locally. My sister was a Navy recruiter in Detroit up until last year, when she finally got to deploy.

I can tell you that no recruiter can force anyone to join the military. It just doesn't happen. Sure, some things may be a bit misconstrued, but that very easily may be due to the prospective recruit's excitement. I know that there was NOTHING "candy coated" in the USMC RS... If anything, the recruiters enjoyed turning away mentally weak fatbody potheads.

I know when I enlisted, I was in the Delayed Entry Program, as were 80-90% of the other local recruits. It basically gave us a year or so to "marinate" on what we were doing, and also get used to a bit of the military lifestyle.

Keep up the good work... You know right from wrong, as is obvious in your posts here. You'll continue to do the right thing.

I'm glad that there are so many good recruiters out there.

I'm sure I'll get blasted by the progressive crowd here for having a good experience with my recruiters.

Like a duck's behind, OP... Like a duck's behind.

Semper Fi

- I would join the Defense Forces if I could justify killing another man just because his belief system is different (which I can't);

- I would join the Police Force if I could justify human rights abuses and imprisoning people based on the fact they choose to take drugs (which I can't);

- I would become a Politician if I could justify lying to the general public in order to keep my plush office (which I can't).

Quite frankly the very fact that time and time again our governments make the SAME mistakes of going to unjust wars, or declaring a war on drugs or any other of the LONG list of human and civil rights abuses is more than enough for me to wish to my very core that I could take a spaceship and go set up camp on another planetary body. This is simply to get the hell off this decrepit, dirty, corrupt, stinking cesspool of a planet before it finally sucks the last of the life out of itself and disappears without so much as a whimper to indicate the thousands of years of human existence.

Yeah, I'm a little bitter - so shoot me.

Originally posted by cbianchi513

mentally weak fatbody potheads.

Ignorance at it's finest - well done on that.

reply to post by Kryties


Ignorance? I got that directly from the context of this thread!

One poster admitted that they were unwilling to "lose the pipe" in order to join...

Can you come up with a finer example of psychological addiction?

To me, that qualifies as "metal weakness".

Not in MY Corps... No thanks.

I think "fatbody" is self explanatory... Try checking out your local Wal Mart for a shining example or fifty.

Sorry I can't be "politically correct"... I calls em as I sees em.

We are probably one of the few organizations left in the country who are not required to adhere to the Americans with Disabilities Act.

Trust me- there's a lot more than a few!

As for the 'intelligence' of recruits- When I signed up, I took the pre ASVAB- came out in record time with a score so high, the recruiters sent me right back in, and stood there and watched while I repeated the feat! I had 'scored so high, and finished so fast', they said, they swore I was cheating.

A test I took much later while in I scored- once again- REAL high. Oddly enough, the results of that test disappeared into a black hole, never to be seen again. I asked around, I tried to find out what happened to my results- and no one knew. This kept me from a job so amazing, technical, and everything else- that it has kept me eternally suspicious of what happened with the results.....