A Warning To All ATS Members

Correction to my own post:

Maybe I'll need a gun after all. When the supermarkets run out of food, I can go to Central Park and bag me some tasty squirrels and pigeons.

Originally posted by diabolique
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

This economic crash was a long time coming, and frankly, it's a corrective for all the corruption and excess over the past 20 years. People's eyes are finally being opened. The money we THOUGHT we had was all an illusion. The easy availability of CREDIT and artificially inflated stock and real estate prices just masked what was really going on. Now that credit isn't so easy to obtain, people are finally realizing that their wealth was illusory. Now it's time to get back to basics. Real jobs. Real money. Government that actually WORKS for US!

So true. Another point I did not make was to take a stroll down Madison Ave between 50th and 80th. Count how many closed up and vacant commercial storefronts are available.

This is a real 'correction' and a necessary one. I think once it is all over, things will be better for our country. Sure, I don't have a bunker in Central Park either but I do have a pantry full of dry food and a couple friends left in the city (the ones that did not have to move out of state due to being laid off). Hopefully it will not last long, but I do think another dip downward will be warranted before we can start building up again.

Face it folks, business in the US got bloated and we have been floating on the bloat for several years / decades. The excess we once had due to our grand industrialization is gone, and technology could not float us quite as far. Once this [R/D]epression is over, we will be more efficient and relevant to global trade again. Consumerism is dead and innovation must be resurrected.

I am ever hopeful, but also alert and prepared.

People have the POWER!
Campaign finance reform is key. No corporate money in elections!
This is a very simple solution to our problems.
We need to take back our government. Remember the US can feed itself, has abundant natural resources and a lot of smart people! Not to mention the MOST dangerous military on the planet.

That last part will give TPTB pause before they throw us into the junk heap of history. We need to start our manufacturing again by repealing unfair trade agreements. It is obvious they are chasing cheap labor around the world to maximize profits and have convinced our population that the labor movement and rights for workers are an anathema to capitalism.

We have sent 2 strong messages to DC in the past 2 elections. The next message should be to vote them all out and support only candidates that support campaign finance reform and fair trade agreements along with energy independence!

Easy to say hard to accomplish being that TPTB control the Propaganda Ministry known as the MSM.

We are strong and we can do justice to our founding fathers and all the fallen veterans and union organizers that have died to advance our liberties.

Here's your green sharts..I mean shoots...

Lagging indicator you say? Think again..and this is only through May..AND using fallacious Labor numbers...

Unemployment Rate State By State

[edit on 19-6-2009 by RolandBrichter]

Originally posted by Doc Velocity
I beg to disagree with the OP. The only areas of the economy that are failing are those in which the central government has interfered in the past, a solid indication that our increasingly socialist government has no idea of what it's doing when it comes to free market capitalism.

The USA is a capitalist nation, built its superpower status on capitalism. That nation cannot survive with socialists interfering to micromanage and regulate the markets.

There are areas of business that remain untouched by this socialist-wrought "recession" — the pharmaceutical industry, for example, and its associated industries are enjoying some rather bullish returns, and the graph is still tracking upward for the foreseeable future.

I mean, damn, my wife contracts for the pharmaceutical industry and she's getting a 35% bonus this year — that's 35% of her yearly income, in one check, as a bonus. We haven't felt the so-called recession at all.

It's true, President Hussein's tax-and-spend socialist administration is killing capitalism and chasing business out of the USA, but I have faith that American socialism will go the way of all socialism — into the fossil bin of failed politics. Freedom will prevail, even if a few heads have to roll.

In the meantime, everybody needs a bottle of aspirin or a Valium nightcap. Follow the prescription drug market and you won't go far wrong. My wife thanks you and I thank you for your unswerving patronage.

— Doc Velocity




[edit on 6/18/2009 by Doc Velocity]

Is that what happened to sweeden? Funny, last time I checked there were doing just fine.

-rrr

reply to post by Tentickles


Not fully true about fall. I made a post about something similar. It was about U.S bonds and other stuff. Basicly other countries buying US debt. By june 25th we will be broke. This dosen't mean we can't afford anything it means epxenses will rise even more. This means that our country can't afford to run on it's own. It relies on loans from other countries and debt being bought The loans are in many forms some are bonds. by june 25th we will not be able to to pay back these loans. Once other countries figure this out we will then be a broke country. We will continue doing a ponzi scheme. Meaning we will get loans to pay off loans. This means we will lie to countries and make them think we have the money and we are a good investment. If the other countries finds out about the facts that we are broke and are getting free money from other countries. They will stop giving us loans causing us to not be able to pay back loans which is halt the U.S economy and the value of the U.S dollar.

So your post i right but I don't think by fall we will be broke. This depends on the situations and on other countries on how smart they are and how well the U.S gov can lie to other countries.

so by june 25th we will be walking on a bridge that has a road that is cracked and could give way at any moment.

So it depends on the situation. We will be entering a soon faulty dangerous economy starting june 25th.

In SEP the US ficial year ends and starts a new ficial cycle. So fall can be a possible collapse of the economy. I just want to say that it's not a for sure but you can't say that for sure.

It depends on how fast these other countries will know we can't pay back loans at all.

before we were able to pay back loans or half the loans. We soon will not be able to pay back loans at all.

This was engineered by builder burge. They needed our economy to fail to make us all pennyless so we have no power. Money = power. So since they will have most of the money they will make laws and rules to make us all running on a tread mill.

That means we will work and work and work thinking we will get promotions and get higher up but in reality you will never progress. This is modern day slavery.

Definition of slaver: A persons that is control in many aspects. This means you will never progress.

abraham lincoln said: " Democracy is where I am not a slave nor a master".

That says it all. Democracy is supposed to be where you not controlled nor you can control others. It means freedom. As long you don't infringe on others rights.

Currently the rich are our masters. I mean try suing GM and win a case I bet you will never win a case unless you have a friend that is a lawyer or you are rich yourself.

If your a middle class person and hire a random laywer you looked up in a book or online for local lawyers. They first try to figure out how much your making so they can figure out how to deal with the case in other words to milk you for your money.

To make this short we are controlled by wealthy people. The economy crisise was a game plan to help put in place the North American Union.

If you think of it this way. The terrorist stuff 9/11 stuff was to get the Security and control laws in place. They then done this economy stuff to make Americans weak in power. They will be like cattle. Property and owned. Once Americans are not rich enough to fight against the government or builder burge. Then they are no threat.

Brainwashing is one powerful tool that builder burge uses.

Thanks for the warning.

Originally posted by redoubt

Originally posted by Tentickles
This is a warning for everyone who reads ATS.

I can say the next comment without worry I will be wrong at all. I know this to be true

The economy is going to crash. Starting the fall of 2009. The signs will be hard to see at first to the normal man or woman but it will start.

[edit on 6/18/2009 by Tentickles]

You may be right, I may be crazy. But even though you 'know' all of this... I am not quite ready to run and hide in the root cellar just yet. And even if the economy crashes, burns and goes to heck in a pic-a-nic basket (eh, boo boo?)... it just seems pointless to curl up into a fetal position and chew my toenails.

It would seem a far nobler endeavor to tell people that they can survive even in the worst of situations with a little work (gardens, wells, etc.).

Best wishes regardless

Now that you mention being able to survive. Why do you think the blogs and forums for survival preparation are growing exponentially?? Many regular everyday people don't need to be told we have a train wreck coming. Common sense has already told them that. And if you haven't already got a good jump on preparation, your're just about screwed. Times a wasting.

reply to post by mrpotatohead


Low income people don't pay taxes? Well explain to me why FICA and all those other deductions come outta my paycheck? I guess if we get rid of all the low income people the world would be a better place.

Don't make the mistake thinking that just because one part of the business world is doing ok, or this sector, or that sector is ok, when the FED gets ready to pull the switch, it's going to affect evedrybody. When you have total control, you can do things like that. the idiots in Congress have done this. They will for ever be remembered for this time in history.
Always look at the big picture, some of the news events are a smoke screen for what is really going on. Watch what's going on behind the scenes. The FED gets more powerfull as each day goes by. They nearly control everything now.
As mentioned in some other posts, watch for the progress on the FED selling our national debt. The world already has our number. They have us by our family jewels, and they know it. Ask yourself, why did the Chinease laugh at Tim Guentner when he told them how safe and secure the US dollar was.?? They aren't stupid, they already own half the United States now. The Chinease are getting ready to cash their chips in, and walk out the door of the casino. Ask yourself, why wasn't the US invited to attend the BRIC conference recently held by Brazil, Russia, India, China???? They are getting ready to put the squeeze play on the US now, and there's nothing we can do about it.
Folks, it doesn't take a PHD in economics to figure this stuff out. When I recently visited my financial adviser to ask some questions about my finances, I mentioned the possibility of a banking holiday in the fall, and told him I thought the stock market was going to take a dive later this year. He simply refused to believe that either of them could happen. His problem is he can't see the forrest for the trees.

I will make sure that I remind him of what I told him when it happens. And it will happen, it's only a matter of time.

I’m an economist. I will go through and address some things said in this thread as well as try to answer any direct questions.

Originally posted by mapsurfer_
Sad but true... My economic indicator is the price tag or value of something. How much does it cost me to fill up my gas tank, or eat dinner. It is outrageous the price of food these days. Just spent $100 getting a few items for a dinner... I get like 2-3 bags that are consumed in nothing flat (like 1 meal). The global economy evolved into a no-barter system so people and resellers cannot get a good deal anymore. The value comes from peoples ability to sell something and still make a profit. When the big dogs get greedy, and cut out the middleman, everyone suffers.

Most of what is said in this post is not accurate. What you are referring to is the nominal price of something; this alone is a useless economic indicator. What is important is to adjust for inflation, then to determine what the real price is. Inflation/Deflation happens, so the prices change, but what matters is whether or not you can afford the same amount of goods given that incomes also change. Having money is what essentially eliminated the barter system which would rely on a coincidence of wants. This is a very good thing. This does not mean that it eliminates the ability to haggle on prices—instead it eliminates huge inconveniences. If you produce pots for a living you would have to be able to find people who not only produce food, but have a need for and are willing to trade food for pots. Value does not come from people’s ability to sell something and make a profit. Value (or price) is largely determined by what people are willing to pay. It’s basic supply and demand in normal cases.

Originally posted by marg6043

In that thread is plenty of information and analysis from all kind of sources.

America is facing the biggest job market crash in history and all the government is doing is sugar coating the results of their data.

Without a job source is not taxable income to support the government spending, borrowing and deficits become unsustainable (as per Obama own words) and a nation path to collapse becomes imminent.

But in America the nation of consumers and big spenders is hard for regular people to see this, but as the credit card crunch and the job lost keeps getting to everybody near you, soon you will also feel the urgency.

In six months Obama has pledge 1.8 trillion dollars to fix the economy but all you see so far is the fixing of the markets so they can survive.

Nothing else is been done as money is needed for anything else, money that America doesn't produce but rather prints in the treasury department.

The bond market is not healthy China is lowering the amount of bonds it used to buy due to the dollar falling.

The way the deficit is growing and the faster is grows will render bonds worthless.

This is not the biggest job market crash in history. There was this thing called the great depression where unemployment was almost 25%. Unemployment was also very high during the recession in the early 80s.

The deficit is already huge prior to this. The actual makeup of the deficit is a common misconception. The current wars have hardly even impacted the size of the deficit. Debt can be sustainable if the rate of the debt’s growth is equal to the growth rate of nominal GDP. Also given the large amount of foreign cash inflow, Americans don’t have to save as much.

The fixing of the markets is extraordinarily important. If the financial markets are not functioning properly, the effectiveness of other stimulus will be greatly decreased.

All money is printed in the treasury market. You can’t legally produce money.

Bonds can be purchased to be adjusted against inflation. It’s no biggie.

WWIII could save the economy. The governments would rather risk nuclear winter rather than have the economy crash.

In definite agreement with the OP.

I've been watching the global financial situation and have noticed the two-sided presentations being offered. One is the close to reality truth of a looming Depression worse than the 1930's, while the other is the "It's okay so keep investing/spending" mantra of those who seek even more profits.

The figures are always unreal, and I can say this as my ex worked for Peat Marwick and told me, "The figures are always altered to reflect the needs of those paying the bill." I've never believed the rubbish figures all governments pull out to show everything is okay.

What "they" do not want is for you to take your investments or money from the banks/institutions. That's what people did last time, creating a run on the banks that do not have the money. They want you to keep putting more in to make sure it appears to be staying afloat, which also allows for more profit taking in another three months.. that is your money being taken up the syphon to the top elite's coffers while you suffer.

I advised people last christmas to start feeding themselves and finding a clean source of water, stock up on necessary medications and first aid supplies, etc, so that they can at least be self-reliant when this crunch does bottom out. I still stand by that advice.

The fortunate people are those who have nothing! For they are the ones with nothing to lose. All the rest of you who have worked hard to chase the Lifestyle Dream will be the ones to suffer the most as your dreams and desires fall apart all around you. So therefore take time now to become fully Independant for your needs.

As is often quoted, "Being forewarned is to be forearmed."

lets just see if the 134.5 billion in bonds is counterfeit. that will tell a lot

link

if these bond are real,the end is near.
i'll bet a million bucks,they claim they're false. either thator this will be a crisis the government won't pass up.

this could be the biggest scam in the history of the world.

ps only 4 other countries own this much in bonds,and only countries possess these bomds.

if a country is dumping their dollars, WE ARE SCREWED,BLUED AND TATTOOED

I believe this has everything to do with your subject please please pass this around. get something called Audicity linked here: audacity.sourceforge.net...
(get the MP3 plugin, I got um all)
and you can just record it and burn it to cd with other stuff if you like and PASS IT OUT!!! EASY, FREE!!!




DK

reply to post by getreadyalready


it is not about buying up the grocery stores, it is about starting to grow our OWN stores..

I have most of mine in containers, and a camper if need be....on outside appearnaces, I still own a home, and have a huge yard etc.....but you never know, so have seeds and things growing that I let some go to seed etc too, and things growing to eat, etc, etc, etc......

the best way to be prepared is to be as self sufficeint as possible BEFORE any crash..

What most people don"t know won"t hurt them.Its best to hide the truth until the very end.Can't worry people to death like that.

Originally posted by venividivici
reply to post by Tentickles

 

Shoudn't this be in the prophesy forum so we can later laugh at the claim.

The fact is that foreign countries ARE buying US Treasuries and there is no evidence other than Gerald Celente and the Webbot fear mongering to back up a statement that the economy will crash.

Of course - everything is going to be all right, don't prepare, drink that beer, turn on the TV.

There are no figures anywhere that tell me the US economy is going to suddenly recover, or even slowly recover.

All the crucial figures are still plunging in the wrong direction. Banks are not using their cash to stimulate manufacturing - or small business, or anything worth while.

OK - lets say myself and the OP are wrong - and you go buy some gold and silver, and you stockpile a bit of food - grow some more food, put in a rain water tank - what do you lose? Maybe you look a bit of a fool?

What do you lose if your not prepared and things really do get a lot worse? Well, its going to be worse than a little embarrassment.

Hope for peace, and prepare for war.

I like reading all "the things to watch out for" to determine when the crash is coming. It seems the overall picture is missed in these though. You miss the forest for the trees. The overall picture is down. When you add in the fact that the bailouts will have to be payed for in the near future and China and the Middles East have already said they aren't going to buy very many of our T'bills and there's going to be a big shortfall in what's coming in and all that's going out. Also there's a delay of a few to several months in the results from all the money they've printed. And September is the end of the current budget. So it looks like September - December as far as a time line.

Don't look at the drug industry or the stock market. One guy was saying the drug industry is basically doing fine, but in reality they've laid off thousands of people. Yeah those who are still left might be doing fine, but the overall picture is bad in their industry too. And thankfully it's going to be really bad eventually. The only thing they'll be selling is vaccines. And then when that toxic garbage kills of even more and does nothing to stop disease, even that market will be gone too! Yippee!!!!

So don't think about just food and tents. What about staying healthy? What are you going to do when the Swine flu mutates, probably this winter?

There are many simple things you can do that will create an environment where disease can't survive. Remember the key to good health is is simple, it's just removing toxins and supplying good nutrition. I'm going to have to upload all my survival books and topics soon and give the links. It's just too much to talk about when it's about 100 gigs.

Bottom line is get ready cuze it's coming in the 4th quarter probably. Get food stashed, get your heirloom seeds ready, get heat and shelter ready for the long term, because it's going to last for years. Get out of the cities and suburbs. Know where all the springs, streams and caves are in your area. If you're in a nuke area, be ready to go underground for a while. Get a generator that will work in any place like a bicycle generator that will supply enough energy to run a couple of things and it's small enough to easily move. I'm even storing how-to information like every issue of Mother Earth News and Backwoodsman magazines, probably 400 books for Dummies. And things I just like reading like every issue of National Geographic magazine since 1888. And all the songs I like. Probably 100 books on health. Books on wild edibles. And then just plain entertainment like movies and cartoons just to have something to laugh at or engage the mind in. And have some kind of faraday cages for all your electronics and yourself, because they'll be jamming everything.

reply to post by SoulHunter



Thank you, we are totally on the same page....

It makes me happy realizing so many of us will survive, because I am Suzie social and I LOVE people, so I want enough around that have clear heads on their shoulders to meet up once we are thriving more again in a different direction.