911 How Could Al-Qaeda Have Known?

Impressme, you don't. Sanity, also please read.

You asked in the OP, HOw Al-qaeda could have known(about the exercise)?

My answer is that they did not care. Why would they? Take the time to read the commission report and it is all there. The intel failures, the training, and the entire timeline. HOwever, maybe they DID know.

If you looked into the timeline of 9/11, you would also know that the airliners did not immediately contact anyone. (FAA) (no intel there)

This means, that critical time was lost from the time of the report of the hijacking until NORAD knew anything. (NORAD)

VP Cheney was I am sure in meetings (UNless Zawahari had a secret meeting nothing to gain here)

The agencies you refer to, the FBI since the CIA would never operate on US soil were aware of the threats but did not stop the exercise because there were no reasons to (your agencies)

So, there is no need to infiltrate anyone because as a collective, they screwed up and 9/11 occurred without AQ needing any additional knowledge. However, please read on.

Now, as far as the 'little known terrorists', they were not and have never been. They are a highly funded organization with cells throughout the world. Please look up the name Ali Mohamed, or you can use this link. No bipartisan craziness in the article..good old wiki

en.wikipedia.org...

You see, they did not need to infiltrate because as you can read, they, AQ, have been infiltrating the militrayaround since 1998. This is the man that bought about all of the CIA is AQ rumors. So, to answer your question more directly....


they could have very well known....and had DARPA make them some flying carpets.

reply to post by esdad71

Impressme, you don't.

I wasn’t trying to, I think you are funny, to dream up all this BS. However, you actually believe it. LOL Nothing you have posted is true its all lies, opinions, and guess work.
You should try and stay away from disinformationist web site, I have never read that garbage in any web sit that you spew as facts.
In fact you know it is a lie because you refuse to post any sources, and if you do we will see it is coming from disinformationist propaganda web sits, like screw loose change.

If you looked into the timeline of 9/11, you would also know that the airliners did not immediately contact anyone. (FAA) (no intel there)

This is just not misinformation’s this is just a lie.

This means, that critical time was lost from the time of the report of the hijacking until NORAD knew anything. (NORAD)

And how much time was that?

VP Cheney was I am sure in meetings (UNless Zawahari had a secret meeting nothing to gain here)

VP Cheney was I am sure in meetings are you SURE?

The agencies you refer to, the FBI since the CIA would never operate on US soil

The CIA never operates on US soil! Are you kidding! What are you drinking?

Ali Mohamed, or you can use this link. No bipartisan craziness in the article..good old wiki

Oh you mean the Ali Mohamed that the CIA and military nearly killed by torturing him nearly to death, LOL Ali Mohamed, will admit he stole the Limburg baby. Anyone will agree to anything for a breath of air to live. There has been no proof what’s so ever that Ali Mohamed is even a terrorist. What we have been told is nothing but lies from the CIA and the FBI it’s all hearsay concocted by our government. In addition, as far as (wiki) I tend to stay away from web sites that are edited by anyone who choose to put disinformation for whatever political reason. Anyone can make changes to wiki.

You see, they did not need to infiltrate because as you can read, they, AQ, have been infiltrating the militrayaround since 1998.

So in a nut shell you are saying our military is a fool! And that AQ is smarter than our military and we spend billions of dollars in National security to keep us safe but it is useless against AQ. You are funny.

All I did was answer the question and even give you proof of our governments inadaqute intel and failures and still you think I am funny. What, Like a clown? Am I here to amuse you? No, just offer an opposite opinion.

As far as the CIA jibe, it was sarcasm... I am well aware of what they do and can do in the US.

You asked how they could have known and I told you. Since 98 their tendrils have been in the US military. It is easy for you to dismiss people because you feel a specific way what there is proof of Mohammed's involvement.

He is still in custody...or is he?

Originally posted by Sanity
Talk about fantasy worlds! I cant believe how much off topic, idiotic nonsense has been introduced into this thread.

...

If they didn't neded to infiltrate our military, how would they know where the Pentagon was?

Pentagon Address: *

Army Navy Dr & Fern St
Arlington, VA 22202

* Intersection of two streets at the entrance
to the Pentagon South Parking lot.
The Pentagon does not have a street address.

Pentagon mailing addresses are:

Pentagon, Washington, DC 20001 - Dept. of Defense
Pentagon, Washington, DC 20310 - Army
Pentagon, Washington, DC 20330 - Air Force
Pentagon, Washington, DC 20350 - Navy

Finding the Pentagon on Map Web Sites:

Google Maps - Copy into Search box

Army Navy Dr & Fern St 22202

Mapquest - Copy into these boxes

Address or Intersection: Army Navy Dr & Fern St
Zip Code: 22202

Yahoo Maps - Copy into Address box

Army Navy Dr & Fern St 22202

Source

That's how they knew where it is.

______________

Originally posted by esdad71
All I did was answer the question and even give you proof

Neither of them want an answer to the question. Three of us now have answered it, and the only response is "you didn't answer the question" and "you didn't show proof" followed by asinine ranting and raving about how we are off topic. That is why I walked away. I refuse to argue with children on the internet, I have better things to do with my time. The only reason I am posting this is because I can't believe someone would honestly think Al-Qaeda would need to infiltrate the military to find out where the pentagon is when all they need is MapQuest. Yet I'm the one with blinders on.



Impressme, if you think I've been off-topic with any of my posts I encourage you to click that little alert button on the posts you think are off-topic and let the mods decide.

Originally posted by Sanity
Are you so unaware of our intel capabilities? Why do you think all the satellites are orbiting the earth? It's not all about TV and weather! People talk about Al-Qeada gathering intel over years, thats lunacy! Intel is often only good for minutes at a time. This is 2009 not 1909 folks!

Sorry, you don't seem to know much about our intel, or how it's gathered.

Only good for minutes at a time? Really? Tell that to Isoroku Yamamoto when he was planning Pearl Harbor, or Eisenhower when they were planning D-Day. You think that was all just thrown together in a matter of minutes?

Satellites are great. They can read the license plate off a car miles in the air. It can tell if the vehicle has been running or not.

One thing was lacking back on 9/11. Google the term "humint" and get back to me.

Originally posted by Sanity
Impressme has it right, it wasn't Al Qeada. Truth is, Bin Laden's boys were probably tempted to fly their magic carpets to America just to laugh at those who believed 911 was done by them.

"Magic Carpets"? My, that's a trifle racist, isn't it?

The Pentagon? ~chortle~

Why the Pentagon is just East of a Citgo station and just North of the Doubletree hotel..

Please tell me this guy isn't serious.

Conspiracy Propagandists take note... THIS is how you can screw with peoples minds (in a really bad way)

And if anyone suspects my motives for posting it is because of things like this...NOT because I am a sheeple person or a shill, or some kind of sekrit agent, but because these kids deserve better.

reply to post by Jenna

Good. When you find the link to the evidence that lists every maneuver planned for the war games on 911 please post it. Remember, the link has to be well before 911 not something looking back.

This was my question to you on page one of this thread and you still have not answered it. You have posted three articles that were written YEARS later. The fourth article that was dated Sep 9 2001 was not a Press release of any war games period. Furthermore, there was not any mention of any war games being carried out in NYC, as the government has alledge they were doing.

You have not learned how to debate yet. If you want to learn, you can U2U me and I will be happy to help you. Esdad71, you certainly do not know how to debate.

Neither of them want an answer to the question.

What? I set up this thread, if I didn’t want answers to any of my question I wouldn’t had ask you all for any. You are playing games in here. Anyone reading your RANTS and OPINIONS with no sources to support your wild conspiracy theories can see that.

Three of us now have answered it,

Answered what? What is it you have answered?

by asinine ranting and raving about how we are off topic

The fact is you have been ranting and raving none stop and you came back in here to do some more and you have to have the last words like most children do.

That is why I walked away. I refuse to argue with children on the internet, I have better things to do with my time.

If we are children then why did you come back in here after you walk away? (I know to argue with the children!)

The only reason I am posting this is because I can't believe someone would honestly think Al-Qaeda would need to infiltrate the military to find out where the pentagon is when all they need is MapQuest. Yet I'm the one with blinders on.

Don’t you even know when someone is a joking with you? Come on you cant be serious?

reply to post by impressme



Impress me says...and I quote...

What? I set up this thread, if I didn’t want answers to any of my question I wouldn’t had ask you all for any. You are playing games in here. Anyone reading your RANTS and OPINIONS with no sources to support your wild conspiracy theories can see that.

and we have answered and even given you some leads as to how they could have known. Not know how to debate? Please, let us have a private debate set up by staff if you feel. No problem. Obviously you have never looked at any of the official debates here...man I was close. BUt then again, based on a few internet postings, you ascertain I cannot debate.

These are not rants and opinions but fact that we are posting. Wildconspiracy theories??? Now is that not what this site, and in particular, this forum, support? I have been booted from threads for NOT being conspiracy biased enough in my posts.


Your question was, HOW COULD AL-QAEDA HAVE KNOWN?

First, I told you that they could care less.

Second, I gave you a lead as to how the could have known.

Third, these fairy tales you claim I post are true. This was actually not the first time that they attempted to strike a large monument or landmark.

In December of 94 Islamic militants hijacked an Airbus 300 and threatened to strike the Eiffel tower. They were linked to AL-Qaeda. Linked to Bojinka.

I am not here to write a book but debate...no probs.

reply to post by esdad71

and we have answered and even given you some leads as to how they could have known.

No you did not, and you have never answered any of my question and you have not posted any sources to your information.

Please, let us have a private debate set up by staff if you feel.

I gladly accept your offer. I will enjoy debating the subject of this thread in a staff controlled environment. Have ATS staff notify me of date and time.

These are not rants and opinions but fact that we are posting.

If you think what you have posted is facts, then I am certainly going to enjoy debating you. For anyone who rambles, post opinions, and does not post any sources cannot call it facts. How dose one find that creditable?

Wildconspiracy theories??? Now is that not what this site, and in particular, this forum, support?

No, it is not a wild conspiracy; however, it may be to you. It was two scenarios that no one is willing to address. Furthermore, the wild conspiracy of 19 hijackers flying four commercial airplanes for an hour over highly restricted air space without a single military jet intervening, One would think that FAA and NORAD were behaving as if this occurrence was normal as if four commercial airliners do this all the time. However, these alledge airliners changed their courses rapidly and did not radio the Tower for permission. I know for a fact, the moment those planes changed their courses, and their flight altitude, and their heading without contacting Tower control; the FAA will immediately dispatch NORAD! Not wait for an hour, which is not part of their protocol. Now that is a wild conspiracy theory!

First, I told you that they could care less.

You keep saying they could care less, what is it they care less about?

Second, I gave you a lead as to how the could have known.

No you did not, try again.

Third, these fairy tales you claim I post are true.

Maybe in your mind but their not.

This was actually not the first time that they attempted to strike a large monument or landmark.

And what large monument, or landmark in the United States are you referring to?

I am not here to write a book but debate...no probs.

I am looking forward to this debate.

reply to post by Jenna

Originally posted by Jenna

Originally posted by Sanity

If they didn't neded[sic] to infiltrate our military, how would they know where the Pentagon was?

Neither of them want an answer to the question. Three of us now have answered it, and the only response is "you didn't answer the question" and "you didn't show proof" followed by asinine ranting and raving about how we are off topic. That is why I walked away. I refuse to argue with children on the internet, I have better things to do with my time. The only reason I am posting this is because I can't believe someone would honestly think Al-Qaeda would need to infiltrate the military to find out where the pentagon is when all they need is MapQuest. Yet I'm the one with blinders on.

Are you so intellectually challenged as to confuse obvious humor with fact? (Please note - this is a rhetorical question. Simply, that means don’t answer it. I normally would not have to explain this but since the line about the Pentagon flew right over your head, I thought I should not take any chances.)

The original topic of this thread was clear. Al-Qeada had to have a tremendous amount of significant intel to successfully hijack four airliners to begin with. Then how exactly do you think they managed to subdue the passengers and the crew and fly these huge commercial airliners in a manner only the most highly skilled AF pilots could? If they did not infiltrate our military, etc. then it would have to be the other way around. Again, logic dictates that only one of two things occurred on 911. Either NORAD and our military, etc. allowed Al Qeada the run of our skies, which I don’t for a second believe, or Al Qaeda had nothing to do with it.

You really have to be tired of following me around and bringing me up. Especially after you said you were walking away from this thread because you kept getting nailed for being off topic. If there is one thing I have learned from this experience, it’s this – if you don’t want Jenna breathing down your neck, then don’t let Jenna tail ya.



[edit on 6/21/2009 by Sanity]

reply to post by Taxi-Driver

Originally posted by Taxi-Driver
The Pentagon? ~chortle~

Why the Pentagon is just East of a Citgo station and just North of the Doubletree hotel..
Please tell me this guy isn't serious.

Conspiracy Propagandists take note... THIS is how you can screw with peoples minds (in a really bad way)

And if anyone suspects my motives for posting it is because of things like this...NOT because I am a sheeple person or a shill, or some kind of sekrit agent, but because these kids deserve better.

Taxi-Driver, tell me you’re not serious. It was meant as humor. I lived in the DC area for nearly forty years and I really don’t need you telling me where the Pentagon is. Also, I have my driver stay at the DTree when I visit friends in Potomac. So, until I feel you can guide me geographically, culturally, intellectually or otherwise, I will stick with the truth and not some feel better story you choose to cling to like a child holding a security blanket. All of your condescending remarks are signs of hurt and I can understand how let down you feel. If you open your eyes and your mind to some logical thinking, you may feel a little bit less like a sheeple.

reply to post by jerico65


WAKE UP! This is 2009 dude! You are the one who seems to be clueless about how intel is handled in the modern world. How in your right mind can you compare the Pearl Harbor era to the 21st century? Sorry, you are out of it.

Yeah, really…info is encrypted and re-encrypted thousands of times a second in some cases. I understand how it would take you longer to code/decode by hand but these days, smart folks, like me, use computers!

Oh, and the thing you said about satellites…

Satellites are great. They can read the license plate off a car miles in the air. It can tell if the vehicle has been running or not.

I appreciate the weird factoid dude but I don’t recall ever seeing a license plate or a car miles in the air. Oh, and it really wouldn’t do you much good to have a running car and a flying license plate. OK Studebaker, walk, don't run. Nope, never liked a car that ran. Nice car...


[edit on 6/21/2009 by Sanity]

The ball is in your court impress me for a debate...Pick a topic and tell a mod. YOu are the one who told me I cannot debate so if you wish to prove it, go for it. I think it will be alot of fun.

As far as this thread however, I have answered your questions. Multiple times. You want to call it all fiction but this is simply not true. It is verifiable fact if you choose to research it instead of simply telling me I am wrong. You asked an open ended question about how they could have known.

So, I gave you a reason they could have and also stated that it did not really matter. It is easy to find out when there will be operations, especially local.

If you know one or if someone on this site is, Ask an intel person what the best intel is? It is information you get yourself on the ground at that location not something second or third hand.. Have you ever been to a bar near a local AFB or other service location? There are always people talking. Always. If you wanted information you could find it without having to infiltrate anything. You just have to be creative.

The fact that some of you still think that AQ is not real is funny actually. Why don't you turn on Fox or CNN and take a look at Iran. Sure, the CIA is there but they are fighting Iran's AQ right now. Check out the story on the truck bomb. These are not a group of ragtag wanna be jihadis...they live in Miami.

Originally posted by truthtothemasses
reply to post by esdad71

 

Just the fact that any one can debate you with your distractingly silly avatar is a miracle of its self. This one is way more annoying than your previous cat jumping back and forth with head phones.

Why should that matter? I am simply answering the questions that were put forth. Words and actions define someone, not what they look like or give as an outward appearance.

Again, to the OP

If our global intelligence and national security is so great, how in the world did this little group of Arab terrorists know, in advance, that our military would be engaged in war games in the skies above NYC, and in these war games, one of the operations was to simulate planes crashing into skyscrapers?

Our global intel pre 9/11 was haphazard and engaged in pissing contests to see who was better and would withhold information. It is in numerous books I have read about our intel agencies since inception. This was a reason for DHS. In the 7 years following 9/11 we have not been hit again and numerous attacks in the US and worldwide have been prevented.

NEADS not NORAD was the first contacted after the first attack and this is where the "is this real or simulation" came into play. The exercise that occured that day was an annual event.

Originally posted by Sanity
WAKE UP! This is 2009 dude! You are the one who seems to be clueless about how intel is handled in the modern world. How in your right mind can you compare the Pearl Harbor era to the 21st century? Sorry, you are out of it.

Let me guess; from your answer, you still don't have any idea what "humint" is, right?

Yeah, you're right. Pearl Harbor is ancient history, right? When was that, sometime during the Dark Ages??

How come Special Forces are trained in something called, "special reconnaissance"? You know, since this is the "modern world" and your wonderful satellites can handle it all? SR goes hand in hand with humint, so when you're googling one, you can check the other one out, too.

Originally posted by Sanity
Yeah, really…info is encrypted and re-encrypted thousands of times a second in some cases. I understand how it would take you longer to code/decode by hand but these days, smart folks, like me, use computers!

Yep, you're smart, alright. You still don't have Clue One about intelligence gathering, tho.

Originally posted by Sanity
Oh, and the thing you said about satellites…

Satellites are great. They can read the license plate off a car miles in the air. It can tell if the vehicle has been running or not.

I appreciate the weird factoid dude but I don’t recall ever seeing a license plate or a car miles in the air. Oh, and it really wouldn’t do you much good to have a running car and a flying license plate. OK Studebaker, walk, don't run. Nope, never liked a car that ran. Nice car...

You funny!!! Well, I'm not going to waste time spelling it out for you, Ace, since you've already said about how smart you are.

Get back to me when you finally decide to find out what humint is. I doubt you'll check, tho.

IMpressme,

Look,y ou told me I could not debate. That is initiation of a challenge. I then accepted and said, sure, lets debate. Now, if you want to point fingers as to who should schedule or look into it that is just plain hysterical and I smell fear.

So back to the thread, Please, back up one of the reasons/points for your question and/or argument or else this is nothing more than a chat post. This site is about denying ignorance which, by definition, means becoming educated. You were asking how they could have known. Multiple people have attempted to give you some direction and you are unwilling to 'converse' and instead do little more than attempt to deflect and tell everyone who does not agree that they are ridiculous or should run home.

Your first post had NO links, evidence, video..nothing. Just a diatribe.
Your second post said, and I quote

Interesting. Over seven hours ago I posted a simple question. I have received S & F but not one single response. Where are all the OS supporters now?

This is asking for someone to come and assist you with a question...or is it you looking to pick a fight? Well, where are all the people who gave you the S&F's to back up your claims?

LAter in the posts you call OS supporters trolls. I mean, my god man you are calling on people in the second post to come and fight with you. So, where are the facts to back up your OP? Where?


[edit on 21-6-2009 by esdad71]