Timewave Zero - Countdown to Transition, page 29
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reply posted on 11-7-2009 @ 10:08 AM by rocksolidbrain
reply to post by Evasius


Yes, you do have a point. The idea of transition to higher types of civilizations does not take into account the possibility of a singularity occurring during this process.

The whole idea is pre-singularitarian, as it is not possible to predict the events after singularity. And the fact that there is this prediction of type-1 going to type-2 and beyond shows that Kaku and others have not considered the singularity happening before that.

Whatever happens, it is a fairly accurate prediction, IMHO, at least for transition from type-0 to type-1. We can see the trends surely. Our planet is becoming one. Everything is merging, languages, culture differences, communication gaps are disappearing. Countries are dependent on each other for even the basic needs. People are realizing the limits of conventional energy. It is becoming one family.

I feel that the transition to a type-1 civilization is almost certain given the trends. I say almost, because there is a small chance that the violent and egoistic kinds among us will destroy everything and set us back to stone age before that transition happens. But chances are small and getting smaller, people are tired of dictators, pseudo-patriotism and wars. So I believe we will see type-1 in our lifetimes.

Now, if singularity occurs during these times, it is anyone's guess what we will do after the technical capability hits the ceiling and energy consumption exceeds beyond the capacity of earth. We may start exploring, or if we stumble upon parallel realities (it is just a theory now, but lets say) we may decide to leave the 3d universe undisturbed or as you say, we may realize that it is already a work of intelligent species those achieved singularities before us, and move on to something more interesting.

We may want to spread the seeds of life, where-ever we see fit in this universe or join the efforts of others in doing so, because any intelligent species will know the value of spreading life around or laying new eggs, in your words. And once we have served the purpose in this dimension we will leave, that is one possibility.

So we may not conquer the galaxies in a sense of capturing and exploiting them, but we may decide to do something noble for this universe with our super-technologies and knowledge. In this way the transition to higher civilization types can take place even with singularity occurring, although it might not be the kind exactly envisioned by Kaku or Kardashev and others.



reply posted on 11-7-2009 @ 02:40 PM by unknown known
reply to post by Evasius


Okay I just want to know the significance of the graph going up and the graph going down? How should we see that affect our day to day lives?


reply posted on 11-7-2009 @ 05:12 PM by misfitoy
reply to post by Evasius


The idea of reaching Technology Singularity is very fascinating, but also a little unnerving lol. You can't help but to think of movies like Terminator and The Matrix when considering the possible outcomes.

The thought of advancing to a more multidimensional existence upon reaching this singularity is something my brain is still trying to comprehend. The first time I've thought about something similar was when The Celestine Prophecy came out. (wiki). Although a fictional piece, it helped me to open my mind to the idea of us 'moving on' when the characters discovered the ninth insight and were able to move into another dimension at will.

This stuff can mess with your head, but it is fun to consider.
Thanks for the info Evasius.


reply posted on 11-7-2009 @ 09:57 PM by BlasteR
reply to post by starscape


The singularity is basically a scientific theory that computers will be smarter and faster than the human brain in another few years.

Technological Singularity

The technological singularity is the theoretical future point which takes place during a period of accelerating change sometime after the creation of a superintelligence.[1]

In 1965, I. J. Good first wrote of an "intelligence explosion", suggesting that if machines could even slightly surpass human intellect, they could improve their own designs in ways unforeseen by their designers, and thus recursively augment themselves into far greater intelligences. The first such improvements might be small, but as the machine became more intelligent it would become better at becoming more intelligent, which could lead to an exponential and quite sudden growth in intelligence.

In 1993, Vernor Vinge called this event "the Singularity" as an analogy between the breakdown of modern physics near a gravitational singularity and the drastic change in society he argues would occur following an intelligence explosion. (Vinge 1993) In the 1990s, Vinge popularized the concept in lectures, essays, and science fiction. More recently, some prominent technologists such as Bill Joy, founder of Sun Microsystems, voiced concern over the potential dangers of Vinge's singularity. (Joy 2000)

Robin Hanson proposes that multiple "singularities" have occurred throughout history, dramatically affecting the growth rate of the economy. Like the agricultural and industrial revolutions of the past, the technological singularity would increase economic growth between 60 and 250 times. An innovation that allowed for the replacement of virtually all human labor could trigger this event.[2]

Futurist Ray Kurzweil argues that the inevitability of a technological singularity is implied by a long-term pattern of accelerating change that generalizes Moore's Law to technologies predating the integrated circuit, and which he argues will continue to other technologies not yet invented.


Some scientists have theorized the year this will happen. Of coarse, noone really knows. Most of the dates I've seen discussed are far after the 2012 "Zero Point".

-ChriS


reply posted on 12-7-2009 @ 04:54 AM by segurelha
Dear Evasius,

I agree with you.
I guess by 2012, 2200 or whatever other date lurking into the future, humanity can ONLY transcend itself.

People here state that the physical universe being ruled by entropy.
I agree, but I should add something more.

The universe seems to be ruled by superior inteligences. Look at the ideas of Earth being a spirit, of higher selfs, souls, spirits, ghosts, alien interdimensional civilizations, channeling entities, devas, solar Logos, God, gods, Goddess, etc... There goes the merging, the seemingly opposite of entropy.

This flaws completely the idea of thinking in a threeshold to our civilization as becoming merely a physical one. From a T0 to a T1 civilization.
Like you, Evadius, I believe that the transition has to be one of merging the physical with the non-physical.

I even become amazed ho the Timewave dips are the same dates of astrological activations of the current big transits coming.

As I said the whole period 2008-2016 is a very intense one, accordingly to Astrology, only similar in intensity to the 1930s. Likewise periods reccur every 84 years (one Uranus cycle back, the planet of novelty and revolution) to 1840s, 1760s, 1680s, 1590s, 1510s, 1430s, 1350s... and also in other more complicate cycles.

The fact that you find the sudden increase in revolutions (riots, wars, uprisings, inventions, science advances, important personalities, utopian ideals, advance towards globalization) is a remark that to me this whole progressing process is one ruled by superior inteligence!

What happens is that the outer (generation ruling) planets find themselves in signs of cardinal energy (Aries, Cancer, Libra, Capricorn) and these are main initiatory energies. Like a big impulse, or an injection of novelty!

Circa 14-20 August and 15-21 September and 20 Oct-4 Nov 2009 (and into March and July 2010), the outer planetary energies are in perfect alignment and "activated" by inner planets (Sun, Mercury, Mars).

When this happens, I see much change in myself (even if I don't want it!!) and in the world. It is important to say, that events can be offside by one or two weeks, but they tend to always occur around these periods.

What is striking is these are also the SAME dips in the Timewave.
What may happen I do not know, but I guess this NK/Iran and swine flu may play one role. Maybe pushing us to shift from a physical focus to a more non-physical one.

In 2008, the same happened (Timewave and Astrology-wise): In mid June, in early August, in late September, in mid December. You see what happened.
In the world there was first a major oil crisis, then the war in Georgia, and the stock market fall, and in December the Madoff case and the Gaza war.

In my personal life, important events have also happened, usually connected to my life direction, professional and personal life, and a few days of more unrest or excitement, change and novelty.

Like you, I still dont know what will happen. The technology singularity could be the result that superior inteligences go hidden, to another dimension. A civilization like us, lacking ethics, has one big problem ahead. There are also many secrets to be disclosed like ET presence, the existence of souls and much more above, free energy, and the flaws of our current society.

For mankind, I dont know what to expect. In the long term, the direction seems to be the same direction of my personal life: a return to localism and nature, to community, and peace; mabe within a unified and global network world. I have dreams with this start happening in 2020, and evolving after 2080.

You said it all here, Evasius:


I'm glad you asked that question, I never really thought of sharing that information until now. Yes, I do indeed feel each major dip and peak, and I experience on varying levels - personally, as a member of the population, and in some cases physically. It's very difficult to describe what I feel during the 2-3 d


reply posted on 12-7-2009 @ 12:16 PM by Scaart
post deleted, as information incorrect

[edit on 12-7-2009 by Scaart]

Actually a different link now that says 21st december was his birthday

Birthday

i originally posted a link to wikopedia which has december the 18th so ive posted the new above link for december 21st

do you think this has any correlation?

[edit on 12-7-2009 by Scaart]


reply posted on 12-7-2009 @ 01:55 PM by tamaransd
reply to post by Evasius


Evasius, sorry if this is already somewhere in the thread but how is the last Webbot report and the TW graph correlating?



reply posted on 12-7-2009 @ 06:24 PM by Sirius20
I really like McKenna's theory of the singularity and how we'll come about it. I'll post the video of him talking about novelty theory and he goes into what happens and how the singularity is brought about. This interview was in 1991 I believe, before the internet became as popular as it is now. Just listening to him talk about the technological age back when he was giving this interview it was uncanny to hear him say that we're all going to be connected through the internet and that all ideas would soon be converging until we reach the singularity. IMO, I don't like the idea of a technological singularity where AI is created that soon surpasses human knowledge. It's possible that it may happen, but I like the idea better that our collective consciousness will be the singularity and every person on this planet will be a contributing member of a larger entity. Whether or not it happens is anybody's guess, but we'll just have to wait and see what happens. Thank you, Evasius for posting this information about TWZ. It's really interesting to read up more on this and you seem very well informed with his theory, although it would be so much nicer to have him here and contribute more to his theory and see how it changes as he gains more knowledge. I too feel some of the emotional aspects of novelty when they happen and very recently I've been feeling kind of depressed in a sense, but for no reason at all. This is definitely one of my favorite threads to follow on this website. Thanks again.

Here's the link to the youtube video where McKenna is talking about the singularity and talks about technology linking everyone together. Sorry if this has been posted by someone else. It's about 3:25 when he starts talking about it, although the rest of it is very interesting as well:




reply posted on 12-7-2009 @ 08:50 PM by Sirius20
reply to post by RazorX


I think that's actually worse than having AI surpass us on its own. Frankly, I don't want to be part man part machine. That takes away what makes us human. You can try to rationalize it as much as you want, but I personally would rather stay the way that I am and hopefully ascend consciously, not through creating technology that we can add to ourselves to help us become immortal and superhuman. I guess we'll have to see what happens, but I still would rather evolve in a more natural way. If becoming part man part machine appeals to you, then knock yourself out.


reply posted on 12-7-2009 @ 11:23 PM by adeeze
Originally posted by Sirius20
reply to post by RazorX


I think that's actually worse than having AI surpass us on its own. Frankly, I don't want to be part man part machine. That takes away what makes us human. You can try to rationalize it as much as you want, but I personally would rather stay the way that I am and hopefully ascend consciously, not through creating technology that we can add to ourselves to help us become immortal and superhuman. I guess we'll have to see what happens, but I still would rather evolve in a more natural way. If becoming part man part machine appeals to you, then knock yourself out.


The idea of a Bhuddist enlightenment has always appealed to me more than any other religion or philosophy for the matter. But the problem is that even though there are many wise monks searching for enlightenment, I have never seen anyone ever achieve it and the state of Nirvana, besides a few accounts that claim to be. To me, all religions and gods are a manisfestation of what we hope we could be or would like to reach. The power of technology, which is a NATURAL part of human evolution, can potentially allow us to be or do anything, and the possibility of a higher conciousness only seems possible through technology. What happens when a computer can out-process our own brains? Won't people want to use them to replace their own processing brain matter? It doesn't seem like it now, but you'll be sure to see it happen in the near future.
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