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Christians sue for right to burn gay teen novel

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posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 04:41 PM
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Originally posted by stereovoyaged
After reading all of this thread, I cannot believe the level of hate and intolerance here. I always thought ATS was above all this, but I guess the reality is there are still

How dare you subscribe to a website whose motto is "Deny Ignorance", when some of the things read here are clearly some of the most ignorant and intollerant ever. I hope if you have kids they turn out gay, just so your forced to see the truth, that they are people just like us who deserve the same respect, privacy and dignity as anyone else. Loved the comment about the gay agenda being stuffed down everyones throat, hypocrite much???




just so your forced to see the truth, that they are people just like us who deserve the same respect, privacy and dignity as anyone else.


Copy paste the quote please where I said you didn't deserve the same respect I have got in this thread or the privacy and we all know how dignified it is to march down the streets of Boston with the men wearing a dress or in drag. I never said anything about taking all that sort of dignity away from them. Copy paste the quote or with draw the accusation




ass backwards, paranoid, homophobic, backwoods, alpha male, hillbilly, uneducated, captin of the football team in highschool, good god fearing christians.


Yep, we have all those kinds of people at our church and we can always use a few more Jethro, so you're welcome to join us




posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 04:45 PM
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reply to post by UltraAgentGirl
 


There are two camps in this thread...the first are folks that are trying to defend another group of people (gay) that deserve the same consideration as any other human being...to not be discriminated against through the denial of employment, a place to live or the right to marry the person they love, and last but not least to be able to visit a library where fiction based upon familiar experiences and emotions can be checked out

The second are folks that look for every reason possible to discriminate, deny and bludgeon with the bible. I suspect you have never felt the affects of discrimination, if you had I doubt that your posts would have been as scathing and hateful as they have been.

I was at one point simply going to bow out of any further discussion but your comment about the abortion provider having "reaped what he sowed" has stayed with me. You also degraded the life of Matthew Sheppard... unfortunate on your part....I doubt that your God will let those two things slip by.

I was raised a christian and most everyone I know is christian and they are some of the most beautiful, compassionate and open minded folks I know.

I suppose there are ugly sides to everything.



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 04:52 PM
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This is NOT a christian planet, everyone is entitled to thier own beliefs and lifestyle. Where does one group get off trying to force its beliefs on anyone else. I guarantee there is a lot more harmfull words and ideas in the bible than what you would have found in this book they are trying to get burnt. How would you feel if atheist tried to have the bible banned and burned??



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 04:56 PM
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Originally posted by HunkaHunka


Yes you showed how in an era of intolerance of homosexuality that stigma causes perversion...


I did? How so? I don't think anyone can show you anything honka.



This is true with anything... anytime a natural process is deemed unnatural it causes conflict within the individual which leads to perversions you mention....


This the Kinsey study or are you just making things up as you go trying to sound like you know what you're talking about?



How about the number of deaths caused by prohibition? But once it was legalized and accepted those crime related deaths dropped like a hot rock!


Ever checked the fatalaty statistics of Drunk Drivers?



Have you seen the amount of Christians who do these same things?
How about all of those Catholic Priests who molested thousands of little boys? Should we assume that being a Catholic Clergy makes you a pedophile?


So you show me a statistic about the sicko gay pedophile homosexuals that use the Church and its access to small kids to prove what? I already know that homosexuals do this kind of thing. The fact they do it in Schools and Church's is a pretty good clue telling much more than what you thought YOU were trying to say.



Also what about the Homosexuals who have SAVED your butt? Like Alan Turing

And the Sistine Chapel? Painted by a homosexual....


Yeah I hear they make good interior decorators too, so whats your point honka.




Oh yeah... btw... the other stuff you were spouting about a court case being closed and decided and lost...

Well scroll back a page and you will see that you were wrong on that as well...



mmmm really show me ? I could have sworn I posted the official decision twice



But then again, for someone who believes in morality based on a fairy tale from an ancient tribe... I guess that's par for the course.


You ever consider charm school honka? You may wanna do that inlieu of cosmetology school first.



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:00 PM
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Originally posted by stereovoyaged
This is NOT a christian planet, everyone is entitled to thier own beliefs and lifestyle. Where does one group get off trying to force its beliefs on anyone else. I guarantee there is a lot more harmfull words and ideas in the bible than what you would have found in this book they are trying to get burnt. How would you feel if atheist tried to have the bible banned and burned??


When was the last time YOU had any christians waterboarding you into the faith? Quit exaggerating.




I guarantee there is a lot more harmfull words and ideas in the bible than what you would have found in this book they are trying to get burnt. How would you feel if atheist tried to have the bible banned and burned??


Probably the same way millions of Christians felt being killed in secular societys like Stalin and Mao in China when those Godless leaders and their atheist society killed more people and burned more bibles than all the Religious wars combined.

But whose counting



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:11 PM
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Probably the same way millions of Christians felt being killed in secular societys like Stalin and Mao in China when those Godless leaders and their atheist society killed more people and burned more bibles than all the Religious wars combined.

But whose counting


Got any hard numbers to back that up, cause I am not buying it. I'm thinking you god has been responsible for more deaths than any other thing ever.



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:12 PM
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Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by UltraAgentGirl
 


There are two camps in this thread...the first are folks that are trying to defend another group of people (gay) that deserve the same consideration as any other human being...to not be discriminated against through the denial of employment, a place to live or the right to marry the person they love, and last but not least to be able to visit a library where fiction based upon familiar experiences and emotions can be checked out

The second are folks that look for every reason possible to discriminate, deny and bludgeon with the bible. I suspect you have never felt the affects of discrimination, if you had I doubt that your posts would have been as scathing and hateful as they have been.

I was at one point simply going to bow out of any further discussion but your comment about the abortion provider having "reaped what he sowed" has stayed with me. You also degraded the life of Matthew Sheppard... unfortunate on your part....I doubt that your God will let those two things slip by.

I was raised a christian and most everyone I know is christian and they are some of the most beautiful, compassionate and open minded folks I know.

I suppose there are ugly sides to everything.


The truth is scathing to those that hate the truth but where was your righteous indignation when the first 30 minutes of posts after the OP sent out his mass u2u's to bump up his thread, all came in talkin smack about Christians mmmm? Remember I already tried alerting and denying their ignorance is all I have done with an average of 4-5 posters attacking me at a time.




I was raised a christian and most everyone I know is christian and they are some of the most beautiful, compassionate and open minded folks I know.


I agree, but so far you don't impress me as one but Ill give you the benefit of the doubt. As for mathew Sheppard?

What have i said about him that wasn't reported on ABC news and various news articles given by other classmates who bought meth and did sex with him? I can't help those truths bother you but like I said

Truth is hate to those that hate the truth

[edit on 6/16/2009 by UltraAgentGirl]



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:17 PM
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Originally posted by UltraAgentGirl

This thread exists NOT because the Bible does but because Christaphobic intolerant bibliobigots like the op and yourself are too impressed and too fond of your own ignorant opinions and if you think I said anything funny, at least you got a chuckle. All your post manifested in me is pity for you


Once again
your a barrel of laughs.

I'm intolorent and bigoted? Point to me where I discriminated against gays or religion in my post. I did state a opinion....hmmmm lets see what bigot means


A bigot is a person who is intolerant of or takes offense to the opinions, lifestyles or identities differing from his or her own, and bigotry is the corresponding attitude or mindset.


So you take offense to peoples opinions and lifestyles and then call them bigots. Your a little of base I think, if you can handle it put down the good book and enter reality. I can't help having the word hypocrite pop up in my head.

As for your pity.

Keep it as I am secure enough in my self to not need the good book to tell me how to live my life as you obviously are not.

Oh, and thanks for the chuckles, i'm sure you will provide a few more before this thread disappears into obscurity.


[edit on 16-6-2009 by FreeSpeaker]



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by stereovoyaged


Probably the same way millions of Christians felt being killed in secular societys like Stalin and Mao in China when those Godless leaders and their atheist society killed more people and burned more bibles than all the Religious wars combined.

But whose counting


Got any hard numbers to back that up, cause I am not buying it. I'm thinking you god has been responsible for more deaths than any other thing ever.


Life was given to you free of charge so God doesn't owe YOU a dime and as for thre history lesson

Read it and weap. I know many millions of Christians did



TYRANT DEATHS
Mao 40Million
Hitler 34M
Stalin 20M

Well, that certainly looks like Mao is our man, but wait. Mao's largest crime is the Great Leap Forward, a bungled attempt to restructure the economy of China which created a famine that killed some 30M. If we confine our indictment to deliberate killings, we get this:

TYRANT KILLINGS
Hitler 34M
Stalin 20M
Mao 10M

So it's Hitler, right? Except that most of the deaths on his head were caused by the Second World War. Sure, he started it, but our society does not blanketly condemn the starting of wars (after all, we reserve the right to do it ourselves in a just cause), and we certainly don't consider killing armed enemy soldiers in a fair fight to be a crime against humanity. If we therefore confine ourselves to the cold-blooded murder of unarmed non-combatants, our table rearranges itself again:

TYRANT MURDERS
Stalin 20M
Hitler 15M
Mao 10M

This brings Stalin floating to the top. So it look like once you reduce their crimes to the unjustifiably lowest common denominator, then Stalin is worst; however, you might want to argue that dead is dead so it really doesn't matter if you give your victims a chance to fight back. Fighting an unjust or reckless war is certainly a crime against humanity, so our numbers should go back to:

TYRANT KILLINGS
Hitler 34M
Stalin 20M
Mao 10M

... and these are just the problems we'll encounter if we accept my numbers without debate. If we want to use the estimates of other scholars, we can pin up to 50 million murders on Stalin, enough to push him to the top of the list regardless of definition. Or we can whittle him down to 10 million murders if we use the low end of the margin of error, and scrounge several more tens of millions for Mao, or away from him.

So, the answer to the question of "Who is roasting on the hottest fires in Hell?" is "Well, that depends..."


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Secondary Level of Mass Murderers:
Obviously, we're going to run into the same vagueries and uncertainties when we try to rank numbers 4 through 10 on the list of the 20th Century's worst killers, but at least we can nominate the candidates. A pretty good case could be made that each of the following rulers (listed alphabetically) were responsible for over a million unjust, unnecessary or unnatural deaths by initiating or intensifying war, famine, democide or resettlement, or by allowing people under their control to do so:

Chiang Kai-shek (China: 1928-49)
Enver Pasha (Turkey: 1913-18)
Hirohito (Japan: 1926-89)
Hirota Koki (Japan: 1936-37)
Ho Chi Minh (North Vietnam: 1945-69)
Kim Il Sung (North Korea: 1948-94)
Lenin (USSR: 1917-24)
Leopold II (Belgium: 1865-1909)
Nicholas II (Russia: 1894-1917)
Pol Pot (Cambodia: 1975-79)
Saddam Hussein (Iraq: 1969- )
Tojo Hideki (Japan: 1941-44)
Wilhelm II (Germany: 1888-1918)
Yahya Khan (Pakistan: 1969-71)
users.erols.com...



This one blows my mind how STUPID this so called secular, "science community" oriented public school system has become. You know the one that uses examples of monkey sex to justify the same behaviors for man. Is it any wonder violence and other animalistic barbaric behaviors are so prevalent in our State run Public schools teaching their religion of evolution as if it was some kind of Science.


Pacific Daily News -- June 9, 2009

A D.L. Perez Elementary School teacher arrested for allegedly touching and videotaping his students inappropriately is being held on $50,000 bail.


Frederick Emerson Fernsler, 55, appeared in the Superior Court on Saturday. He was charged with:


Second-degree criminal sexual conduct as a first-degree felony;
Child abuse as a misdemeanor;
and Official misconduct as a misdemeanor.


According to the magistrate's complaint against Fernsler, when an 11-year-old female student bent over in class, Fernsler allegedly "grabbed her hips from behind and started thrusting his pelvis against her buttocks."


The report makes no mention of cameras Fernsler allegedly hid in his classroom -- where students would change clothing. Police found the cameras May 21, according to a GPD news release issued last week.


Office of the Attorney General spokesman Eric Palacios said yesterday more charges may be filed against Fernsler. Mae Blas, public information officer for the U.S. Attorney's Office, said no federal charges had been filed against Fernsler, but she couldn't comment on pending cases.


How about this one

Victim endured a broom and hockey stick multiple times over two months while at school; Multiple witnessess never reported attacks


June 4, 2009


Hillsborough County -- Four teenage boys in Tampa, Florida, were charged as adults Wednesday on allegations of sexually assaulting a 13-year-old boy.


Charged with four counts each of sexual battery were Randall John Moye, 14; Raymond A. Price-Murray, 14; Lee Louis Myers, 14; and Diamante J. Roberts, 15. CNN is naming the defendants because they were charged as adults.


Hillsborough County prosecutors allege the four boys raped the 13-year-old victim multiple times over two months with a broomstick and hockey stick.


At a bond and arraignment hearing, the defendants appeared before Hillsborough County Judge Wayne Timmerman to hear the counts against them read in court.


Prosecutor Kimberly Hindman described to the court how two defendants held down the victim while the other two defendants violently sodomized him with the sticks. "The victim screamed and cried, telling them to stop," Hindman said.


The prosecutor said the victim's screams could be heard outside the boys' locker room at Walker Middle School, in southern Tampa, where the alleged assaults took place.


Multiple people witnessed the attacks, but no one reported the incidents, including the victim, Hindman said.


The school began an investigation after a fight that began on the football field and continued until a coach broke it up in the locker room, said the prosecutor. During the fight, the victim said, "I'm tired of them getting on me," Hindman said.


When school officials questioned the defendants, all four admitted in a written statement that they had sexually assaulted the victim.


The defendants "all implicated themselves in a sexual-battery incident," Hindman said.


The victim did not acknowledge the attacks until questioned. School officials contacted authorities, who initially charged the four as minors with sexual assault and false imprisonment.


Several students witnessed the incidents over the two months, said the prosecutor, who added that she could not understand why no one reported the attacks. www.cnn.com...




posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:24 PM
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reply to post by UltraAgentGirl
 


I did not say I was a christian, I said I was raised a christian. As for the folks that I know who still practice their beliefs of following the examples of Christ they are abhorred by the kind of conduct you exhibit in this thread.

The kind of fanatical thinking that you spew all over this thread reminds me of the fanaticism of those that still practice the honor killings of women all over the middle east. Hopefully your brand of religious fervor will be a thing of the past soon in this country.... I suspect you may feel right at home in a country that executes Gays and women.

I pity a mind that is so closed as to never see the disgrace of there own actions and words.



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:28 PM
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Originally posted by The All Seeing I

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker
I think publishers should start putting little Jesus Fish stamps on books that are reviewed and approved by some kind of religious group. Then the very conservative religious people can be free from the terror of none faith comforming books.


Actually you bring up a very valid and workable point, which i think we should seriously consider. We put warning labels on all potentially hazardous substances, why should those sources that have proven to be the most dangerous of all, be exempt from labeling?




I always loved that pic.


I do think its a workable idea though, they could create a "approved section" in a library for people of faith. Problem solved.



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:32 PM
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Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by UltraAgentGirl

This thread exists NOT because the Bible does but because Christaphobic intolerant bibliobigots like the op and yourself are too impressed and too fond of your own ignorant opinions and if you think I said anything funny, at least you got a chuckle. All your post manifested in me is pity for you


Once again
your a barrel of laughs.

I'm intolorent and bigoted? Point to me where I discriminated against gays or religion in my post. I did state a opinion....hmmmm lets see what bigot means


A bigot is a person who is intolerant of or takes offense to the opinions, lifestyles or identities differing from his or her own, and bigotry is the corresponding attitude or mindset.


So you take offense to peoples opinions and lifestyles and then call them bigots. Your a little of base I think, if you can handle it put down the good book and enter reality. I can't help having the word hypocrite pop up in my head.

As for your pity.

Keep it as I am secure enough in my self to not need the good book to tell me how to live my life as you obviously are not.

Oh, and thanks for the chuckles, i'm sure you will provide a few more before this thread disappears into obscurity.


[edit on 16-6-2009 by FreeSpeaker]


You guys keep talking about tolerance and you have been anything but then you have the unmitigated audacity to call anyone a hipocrite when I have already admitted I am just as much a sinner guilty as charged as anyone else.


That's ok and since you are so impressed with yourself Ill let ya have the last word, this is a waste of time jousting. Isn't like you all didn't act like I expected unsaved people to act.

Bye oh and

Jesus loves you



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:37 PM
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reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


I find it odd that ultraagent came onto this thread to defend Christians and then spews the most hateful garbage I have ever read in the name of Christianity.

This is one of those threads that I feel dirty while I'm there....kinda like the old side shows at carnivals where you know you should not look but you can not help it.



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:37 PM
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Originally posted by Witness2008
The kind of fanatical thinking that you spew all over this thread reminds me of the fanaticism of those that still practice the honor killings of women all over the middle east. Hopefully your brand of religious fervor will be a thing of the past soon in this country.... I suspect you may feel right at home in a country that executes Gays and women.



show me examples of all this "Fantaticism" where I endorsed ANYTHING like the aspersions you have cast on me CHRISTIAN!

Lets see the copy paste quote or withdraw the fanatic claims and exaggerations



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:40 PM
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Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


I find it odd that ultraagent came onto this thread to defend Christians and then spews the most hateful garbage I have ever read in the name of Christianity.

This is one of those threads that I feel dirty while I'm there....kinda like the old side shows at carnivals where you know you should not look but you can not help it.


Tell ya what "witness" you take the posts that were spit at me and replace each one with how YOU would have handled them and lets see how well you defend your Christianity. If that is what you really are.



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:44 PM
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Originally posted by Witness2008


I did not say I was a christian, I said I was raised a christian. .


aaah my mistake and wow now it all makes sense. No wonder you are just coming here just to make talking points and exaggerated ad-homs to the rest of your contribution as an example of tolerance and inclusivness


sheesh


Im outa here, have an ordinary day,

I just did



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:46 PM
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reply to post by UltraAgentGirl
 


I'm going to let you exhaust yourself with all the copying and pasting. I think I will simply continue to remind you of the utter frivolity of pushing your hatred on this particular thread.

Has it occurred to you that all of your time and effort here has gotten you no-where? Except maybe confirming for the rest of us how utterly ridiculous your notions are.



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 05:51 PM
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Originally posted by UltraAgentGirl
Isn't like you all didn't act like I expected unsaved people to act.

Bye oh and

Jesus loves you



Look, do you even understand how offensive this statement can be to a athiest. I know you mean it in good manner, but to someone who simply does not believe what you believe, and quite frankly never will, you are talking down too, insulting, and demeaning me, and poeple like me, by insinuating I need to be saved. I do not and never will tell you to give up your faith because you are misguided, despite my personal opinion that believes you are.

I have no problems with those of any faith including yourself, but why should I respect you when you are being insulting whether you know it or not. Let christians and gays do whatever they want, just don't expect me to take part in it or be forced into it.

Thats the part you of faith can't come to grips with. I have read your book and found it wanting. That is my right. So why this eternal battle to make us athiests believe in the lord. Notice I said lord and not god, there's a huge differnece. So stop thinking we are misguided lost souls and show us some respect for once as HUMANS who simply live our lives different than yours.



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 06:00 PM
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reply to post by watchtheashes
 


Watch, homosexuality being a sin makes no sense at all. Homosexuality is a physiological attribute as much as height or skin colour. It's something that between 5-10% of people are born with, and 30-40% of people are born with a varying degree of. By being anti-homosexuality, you aren't railing against behaviours or sins of people, what you are doing is demonising a cross-section of humanity for simply existing. If someone is racist towards black people, they hate black people for something that the black people didn't even get to choose. It's no different to anti-homosexuality. Sure you can tell gays to not have gay sex and get married to the opposite sex and force themselves to procreate with their partners, but that is like telling black people to get their skin bleached.

"Oh I'm just warning you." You say. We know that the book says. The fact that we aren't followers means something. We simply do not care what it has to say because we disagree.

[edit on 16-6-2009 by Welfhard]



posted on Jun, 16 2009 @ 06:22 PM
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Originally posted by rapinbatsisaltherage

The novel in question is Francesca Lia Block's Baby Be-Bop


I like that novel, it's pretty simple. Read it in middle school. Why on earth of all the books out there to burn would they choose this one? There's plenty of novels with young STRAIGHT teens doing all sorts of "un-godly" things.

If they want to cause a stir they should have sued to burn Harry Potter for witchcraft and the Twilight series for obvious reasons.
Would have given them way more attention, then again, maybe they were scared of Twilight tweens?


I think what has happened here is the media have a non story which they have blown out of proportion. It fullfills two purposes and they are to arouse anti -Christian sentiment and to push the gay agenda.




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