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911 Truth - Somebody Please Give It To Me!

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posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 01:36 PM
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But....But..you said:



Originally posted by Big Unit

3. Exercises never took place that day. No training took place that day.

Try again.


Now how am I going to take anything you say as truth? Silly person. If you tell the truth, you will not have to make up more lies later to cover up the complete fabrication you mentioned previously. (mom taught me that one)

Now go back under your bridge.




posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 01:46 PM
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Lets recap..Big Unit..

training that day..Proved wrong..

NIST's ignoring of reports and witnesses..Proved wrong

Refuses to answe why george sits there for 7 minutes and then lies about his where abouts after the fact..

Controlled demo can take place without a long series of bangs like stated..

shall we go on..

thats right the cameras..


By the way you dont have a Nepolian complex do you?



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 02:16 PM
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reply to post by Redpillblues
 


Arrgh! Had a beautius response, lost the internet connection!!
Response, 2.0:


I would love to see a over lay of the p56 area with the flight path of flight 77..



I don't have the computer skills to do overlays. I found better aeronautical charts, these ar 'visual' procedures, so they're to 'scale'

HERE you see a 'RIVER Visual' when the airport is landing to the South:

flightaware.com...

HERE is the MOUNT VERNON Visual, for North operations:

flightaware.com...

You can look at Google Maps for perspective. The Pentagon is in Virginia, West of the Potomac. Roughly on the DCA 3-mile arc, West of the Memorial Bridge (from the RIVER Visual plate)

The (disputed) path of AA77 keeps it mostly to the West, and South of the Pentagon before impact. SO, the Prohibited areas were not compromised. However, the "fly-over" theory is in doubt, because of P-56A and P-56B. An Eastbound (whatever) would have to turn immediately....and radius of turn is directly related to speed and angle of bank....



What would be the protocall of an eratic plane thats non responsive flying towards the pentagon?


Well....again, on that morning, the prevailing 'threat' was supposed to come from "outside" the US borders.

However, given that the AA77 transponder was 'off', it became more difficult to track, for the controllers. They would have had NO altitude info for the target. They could only guess at heading changes, since the RADAR upates only with each sweep...about six to ten seconds each. As the target passed from one facility's coverage are to another's, they'd have to telephone their colleagues to give them a "Heads Up"....it would have been very confusing. AND, they were likely unaware of the events that had just transpired in NYC!

Also...even though there were indications the airplane was heading towards DC...no way to tell its intentions. Talk has been that UA93 may have been destined for the Capital...sincew it's bigger and easier to see from the air than the WH...but, who knows??



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 02:17 PM
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Originally posted by grapesofraft
reply to post by Big Unit
 


Well do not take it personal. It just goes with the territory. I have been called a troll just for starting this thread. There are some people who would call you a troll for not just blindly believing whatever they seem to think is true.

I appreciate your comments as well as comments that disagree with yours. I think it is important to discuss it from all angles.


Is that a real picture of you and your wife?? Are you a reverend?? Clever if you are not. I am not here to confess to anyone.

Take some time and do your own research.

Why did WTC 7 (not hit by any plane) fall at free fall speed?????

Do realize that every support column would by necessity need to give way at the exact same moment for that to happen???? Every single column gives way at the exact same moment...what are the odds of that occurring???

Check out AE911truth.org! Read David Ray Griffin. Check out Dr Steven Jones work. It's easy just use Google.

I hope you will enlighten your flock!



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 02:19 PM
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Big Unit - it hasn't been fun but I'm enjoying ignoring you once again, until you change your name again, then I'll ignore you again then. You need help dude



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 02:26 PM
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What aspects of 9/11 am I still not certain about? 1) How exactly it was done ie. which planes hit the towers, what exactly happened at the Pentagon, what really happened to flight 93, how and when the towers were wired for demolition, who took all the gold stored under the towers that ended up missing and what really happened to the passengers of the allegedly hijacked planes? 2) Who were the top instigators? Was it Bush? Was Cheney running the whole OP or was he taking orders from someone else? Bottom line is this. You don't need to know exactly all the details in order to be sure that the Official Story is bogus. Just when I think I have it all figured out, I learn more new info that puts a new slant on it but which also reconfirms the contention that Bush lied about what happened. The lack of a consensus does NOT mean the official story is right.



You have already discovered and understand the most important and basic truth of 9/11 - It was a Criminal act, involving certain elements within the Bush Administration, US Military, Intelligence Agencies, the FBI and many others. The Saudis,, that may have been CIA Assets, like Bin Laden became when Russia invaded Afghanistan. You mentioned something important, that I should of covered actually, - The Mossad link could be and should be explored further.

The Constitution issue regarding The Patriot Act Congress is a huge problem, especially if things are left as they are for too long. I'm not up to speed with that at all, hopefully some congressmen are.

Regarding your questions, well, as you know it all comes down to the level of involvement of the FAA, which has been questioned as Highly suspicious.

I will give you my theory and see how if they can be improved on your behalf or not:

Planes Hitting the Towers: Some people, including me have a strong belief that the first plane had no identifiable markings of a commercial jet. If this is true, the "real" passenger jet could have taken off and unfortunately the passengers would be dead, either they were killed while in the air or when and if the plane landed because the amount of the officially "missing" passengers in all 4 planes that day were approx. 20-30% full? (I can't remember the exact figures), I remember it was way below average and those numbers of deaths would be very minimal/significant to the Criminals to the number in the target buildings.

We all know what happend to WTC 7 at this stage, I would hope.

This whole first scenario could have also been done for the second WTC tower attack, because the criminals behind this new by this stage it would be seen by many people on the ground and other buildings and LIVE on TV, so they could have used another unidentifiable plane, BUT this time with the EXACT, or very similar paint, markings and signature of the claimed hijacked plane.

My theory on the Pentagon is similar to the WTC 1 & 2, but this part of 9/11 will be the most difficult to piece together for a number of reasons, to name a few, a few, not to many - planted witnesses/disinformation/collaborators like Lloyd the Taxi Driver & his Magic Light Pole Story, Lloyds wpartner.

I believe the Pentagon was hit by a smaller aircraft or Drone in the disguise of a 757 (ie paintings,markings etc). It is still possible that it was a missile (painted and marked) on its own, or some type of experimental/current? explosive attached to the smaller plane or Drone that could penetrate the rings and leave that small exit hole we all saw.

The "Hijacked" Flight again could have taken off as planned, and passengers murdered in flight or if it landed. A "Ghost Plane" could have been the one flown over the Pentagon as witnesses did see a Passenger jet, and a C-130, I think there was even some reports of a third plane seen,but there is not enough evidence to support a third at this stage.

The first few minutes (15 minutes or so?) of live footage and the photographs available are crucial.



[edit on 12-6-2009 by Skyline666]



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 02:43 PM
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reply to post by grapesofraft
 


I'm not a truther although I think it is possible WTC7 was taken down purposefully to protect documents and records which would make sense to me.

I think something pertinent here is that pretty much all conspiracies are exercises in futility and are mainly perpetuated based on entertainment value rather than factual evidence. On rare occasion they do turn out to be based in fact however and real evidence comes forward.

Any honest or should I say intellectually honest person would admit the 9/11 theories are for the most part wild speculation based on an intrinsic hatred of government and authority and a sometimes unrealized desire that they be true. To understand that I suppose we would have to spend many years in deep study in the field of psychology.

I'm not implying Truthers are nuts in any way, even though you will surely find mentally ill involved in any wild conspiracy. I am saying that often people's hatred and mistrust runs so deep and they want something to be true so badly, it severely limits their ability to think objectively or critically. They want it to be so, so to them it is so.

The evidence that still has the most impact on me is that Bin Laden clearly confirmed it was in fact perpetrated by Terrorists as advertised. In fact it is such strong evidence since Bin Laden was not known for fabricating stories, that it nearly guarantee's they did it.

The second most compelling thing to me is that for many of these stories to be true, the number of people keeping this horrible secret would be quite large. Since hand picked staff's working for our Presidents can not even keep a secret, I find this highly unlikely.

Another issue that bothers me is that they would have had to kill all the original passengers and that they were able to find people willing to do that and have it kept secret in perpetuity. I can't buy that. That many Sociopaths at that level would hardly go unnoticed.

Yet another issue is the claim no plane hit the Pentagon because it is not possible a plane could have disintegrated so completely upon directly hitting a heavily reinforced structure. This even though there are many examples of planes doing just that in accidents.

Probably the hardest pill to swallow is that all the people who were eyewitnesses to the planes hitting the Towers were mistaken or were liars or government shills.

I personally watched the second plane hit on what I honestly believe was a live feed. That leads to explanations like holographic planes and such which is the point I start to wonder if the believer is sane.

To answer your question properly:

Terrorist under the leadership of Osama Bin Laden flew two hijacked commercial aircraft into the World Trade Centers. The resulting damage caused unforeseen structural damage that eventually caused the buildings to collapse.

WTC7 however was carefully cleared of people, double and triple checked to make sure it was empty and then destroyed using preset charges to protect sensitive documents and records important to the government or national security. (This is I think is the only conspiracy being hidden and it should just be admitted too to stop this nonsense)

As part of the same Terrorist attack, a third plane was flown directly into the Pentagon. Since the Pentagon is such a highly fortified structure the plane which struck it virtually disintegrated and since the wings were the weakest part only the central structure of the aircraft actually penetrated the walls. In penetrating the walls it was reduced to nearly unrecognizable rubble.

A fourth aircraft involved was stopped from flying into another DC Structure, possibly the White House, by the heroic efforts of the passengers resulting in the giving of their own lives. No amount of praise could express the thanks owed to these people by every citizen of this country. Anyone who would not heap praise upon them is not a person I would want to associate with or that I would give credibility.


[edit on 6/12/2009 by Blaine91555]



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 02:48 PM
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reply to post by Big Unit
 


Originally posted by Big Unit

Exercises never took place that day. No training took place that day




Powell's question—"Is this real-world or exercise?"—is heard nearly verbatim over and over on the tapes as troops funnel onto the ops floor and are briefed about the hijacking. Powell, like almost everyone in the room, first assumes the phone call is from the simulations team on hand to send "inputs"—simulated scenarios—into play for the day's training exercise.




"When they told me there was a hijack, my first reaction was 'Somebody started the exercise early,'" Nasypany later told me. The day's exercise was designed to run a range of scenarios, including a "traditional" simulated hijack in which politically motivated perpetrators commandeer an aircraft, land on a Cuba-like island, and seek asylum. "I actually said out loud, 'The hijack's not supposed to be for another hour,'" Nasypany recalled.


www.vanityfair.com...

originally posted by Big Unit

"try again"



Perhaps you should apply your own demand to yourself.


[edit on 12-6-2009 by FewWorldOrder]

[edit on 12-6-2009 by FewWorldOrder]



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 02:55 PM
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Thank you Weedwacker..Cleared up a misconception..

Allot of confusion went on that day..Almost as if it were planned..

I personally think anyone in the feild doing their job,was doing exacly that..That goes from the Controll tower guys with the radars to guys running the training exercises for the military..It was just a big chess game that got played to the T..

People in high places turned a blind eye to let things happen,and some dirty feild work done in the trade towers before hand..

Notice i didnt say president?..I dont think Bush had any offensive part in it....The look he had after he was told of it,was one of ''I cant #ing beleive they did it..I personally beleive that the prez is not the top of our food chain in washington..

Kinda reminds me of and old Cheech and Chong record I had when I was little..It was a skit and the punch line was ''if it looks like poop,smells like poop,taste like poop,its must be poop..

Its such a shame that some people come up with these crazy ideas of death beams,mini nukes,and whatnot..That is what kills the whole truth movement..No planes my arse..they hit the towers..

Flt.93..I feel as though it was shot down..
I understand the greeving of the familys and whatnot,but what better way to deflect wrong doing than over praising the ''heros'' of 93..I'm certainly glad they did praise them,as it hopefully made the familys feel somewhat better..But thats the feeling I got from all of the hype..

Who knows maybe it was the perfect crime? It certainly split the jury of america..
And yes,I dont buy the pic of the preecher either...


[edit on 12-6-2009 by Redpillblues]



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 02:57 PM
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I think there is sufficient evidence that Flight 77 was shot down, especially when you compare the crash site to nearly all other plane crash sites.

No one can prove who shot it down, but Donald R did make a serious slip up when he said that terrorists shot it down live on tv!

The radius of the debris rings alarm bells in any ones book.

The woman, I have forgotten her name accurately describes a Drone making impact very close to the claimed impact site of Flight 93.

This witness is very convincing when you see the interview. Her emotions speak a thousand words. Many other close witnesses stateed what they heard/saw and they do contradict the official story.

Many reasonable people believe it is scientifically impossible for the two 6t Titanium and steel engines to vapourize, or even nearly vapourize - including all passengers and other plane parts on impact.

Yes DNA was found, but where?, and how much? are the Real questions.

The DNA issue is very debatable at all 4 impact sites, when you measure against the total weight of the officially released number of passengers and the amount of DNA discovered/released.


How did they get the nano-thermite/super-thermite into the buildings?

It was most likely in the 9-12 months(or more) before 9/11. The workers had all kinds of access, including access to the core collumns. Marvin Bush was on the board of the Security Firm, until 2000. This Security Firm has to be investigated further, then more answers will come. A lot of debunkers always use the Marvin Bush thing against us. There are other people close to the Bush family, maybe not within the security firm, but WHERE?

For the Gold in the Building, Never thought to put it high on the list, but when was it last accounted for to be in the building?

George Bush and his whole family have strong ties to other powerful elite, mentioned in the New Worl Order threads and many other media. These 2 Presidents would have to be 2 of the most connected to PTB (Bilderberg and all known associates). Remember that the Bush Family was How Rich? before George and his dad became Presidents.

Dick Cheney and many others have and have had in the past, interests in certain companies that benefited from 9/11.
Also have alook at the information availble on the new Afghanistan President,, then you will see why he is President, I think the company is Unical? or Unacal?

I hope this can lead to some more answers



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:08 PM
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Originally posted by Blaine91555
WTC7 however was carefully cleared of people, double and triple checked to make sure it was empty and then destroyed using preset charges to protect sensitive documents and records important to the government or national security. (This is I think is the only conspiracy being hidden and it should just be admitted too to stop this nonsense)


Something to keep in mind is that the fires from the jet fuel and flammable objects in the main towers could only reach around 1100 degrees fahrenheit. This is based on chemistry and can be verified on the internet and physics/chemistry books.

It takes about 3000 degrees to cause steel to begin to soften.

you can "cook" chicken all day long at 25 degrees and it will NEVER cook.
you can burn a steel building at 1100 degrees all day long and it will never fall.
It takes more than jet fuel. There is evidence of explosives (high-tech, engineered, nano-thermite explosive) found in the wreckage of ALL THREE buildings.




[edit on 12-6-2009 by notreallyalive]



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:22 PM
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reply to post by Redpillblues
 


i BET YOU BELEIVE IN KARMA. But guess what. it's not real.



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:25 PM
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some could say God isnt real also?..So your point is????
Thats right you havent made any sensible ones yet..



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:25 PM
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post deleted

[edit on 12-6-2009 by _BoneZ_]



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by CreeWolf


What reason would our Government have for keeping the Pentagon videos hidden? File a request for them.

I'd like to see complete and unaltered images of certain places on the moon (where the tampering is blatantly obvious!) What could there be on the moon to hide?

government, you must be a whackjob!



There are no videos showing a perfeclty clear and beautiful picture of the airplane hiting the Pentagon. I still cant believe there are people out there that thinks a missle hit it, or it was some other plane.

What is it you dont understand?? The DNA of the nearly all the passengers was identified. Identified by people who do NOT work for the government. I suppose in bizarro world you think those people were paid off. Let me tell you. They weren't. Phone calls from passengers to loved ones were made from that plane.

This is mindboggling to say the least.

I'm not going to even touch what they are hiding on the moon.



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:29 PM
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reply to post by notreallyalive
 


Sorry for not being very present in my own thread. I will just jump in where we are at now.

We have all gotten a little side tracked by debating the government version vs the conspiracy version or whatever you want to call it.

By the way what do you all want to call the alternative version of events? Something that will not offend anyone.

Really what I would like to see is all of the people who believe 911 happened in a way that conflicts with the governments view of events to work together to make a court case for who, what, when, where, and why the events of 911 took place.

Being realistic, you may need to present several cases.

Ok as far as jet fuel weakening the steel, there are two things to be considered. There isnt just jet fuel burning, there are the other parts of the plane like plastic seating and office furniture, paper, construction materials burning. These things could raise the temp of the fire.

Also, I find it hard to believe that if you heat steel to 1100 degrees for an extended period of time that it would not weaken to some degree. I am not saying it would melt it, but that it could weaken it enough for failure at some points in the structure.



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:30 PM
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reply to post by network dude
 


Drills did not take place that day. I will admit there was a training course by a few folks on a computer. But I consider training being out on the field. Not sitting at a desk. And of course this "training" effected nothing on 9/11.


But...if you want to beleive the boys at Loose Change, or Dave VonKleist, or David Ray Griffin (lol), or Alex Jones and his concentration camp nonsense. Feel free. They are the ones blatantly lying to you. Not me.



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:33 PM
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Originally posted by Redpillblues
Lets recap..Big Unit..

training that day..Proved wrong..
They were no field training exercises that day.

NIST's ignoring of reports and witnesses..Proved wrong
No it wasn't.

Refuses to answe why george sits there for 7 minutes and then lies about his where abouts after the fact..
What's Bush supposed to do. Jump up and down and make a scene. This is such a stupid question to put in blountly.

Controlled demo can take place without a long series of bangs like stated..
No it can't. You are wrong.

shall we go on..

thats right the cameras..
The best video has been released of the airplane strike has been released.


By the way you dont have a Nepolian complex do you?
No.



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:36 PM
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reply to post by _BoneZ_
 


Ok as far as the plumes being compressed air, this is feasible. As the building collapses it is going to push air down the elevator shafts, compressing it and forcing it out the elevator doors. This could be what caused the expulsion of air through certain parts of the building.

Also, if it were a rigged explosion that brought it down, all of those explosions would have had to been timed perfectly for it to fall the way it did. This means they would have had to all been tied together more or less to blow in a timing pattern. So there would have to cord connecting all the explosives togehter.

Having said that it is hard to believe that someone could have rigged the core of the building with explosives and no one notice the connecting cords running everywhere, let alone the tons of explosives that would have had to been delivered at different points inside the building.

Also, when you implode a building you dont just use explosives. You use jackhammers and blowtorches to weaken parts of the structure so it will fall in the manner you wish. So all this banging and burning is going on and nobody notices it?



posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 03:39 PM
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reply to post by Big Unit
 


You beleive what you want..But I think any sane person presented with the facts would call you a waste of bandwith..

If my President is told and I will quote it again'' the country is under attack'' i would hope he would say kids I think its time for me to go..

7 minutes could mean 1000's of lives if the threat is unknown,in wich it wasnt at that time to him..Sorry but yes,make a scene,if not for the kids in the classrooms protection..

And who ever stated anything about feild exercises?.you really do like putting words together dont you..You havent the slightest clue...Your the kinda guy who bull#s there way through life i bet..

And you say NIST didnt ignore the thermal pics and eyewitness accounts of molten steel...There was video of a head engineer for NIST stating he doesnt know about them..hello,anyone home??

[edit on 12-6-2009 by Redpillblues]



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