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Holocaust Museum Suspect Was a 9/11 "Truther"

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posted on Jun, 11 2009 @ 10:23 PM
reply to post by LiquidMirage

I don't think anyone would ever think only "the muslims" carried out 911, as if only one group ever gets involved in any kind of terrorist action. That would be like saying when Palestinians were getting rocket bombed on the basis of Israel's cellphone service gps locater only Intel or the phone manufacturer was involved in the deed and Israel or the phone companies had nothing to do with each other.

They eventually got smart and switched to a swedish company as soon as fire from the sky became apparent.

All kinds of people attach themselves to all kinds of causes, just because some racist donates money to Ron Paul that doesn't mean that Paul endorses such a person, try they might to attach themselves to a person or cause such as finding out what might have gone wrong on 911, (and why would anyone not want to turn over every rock to find out some sort of relative truth?) just asking questions about any event or finding uncomfortable truths doesn't equate with anti-semitism or racism, maybe not as many people that were Jewish died in the gas chambers, why would anyone ever lie since everyone that believes in the story of the holocaust or global warming are perfect angels that have never ever done anything wrong nor misled or lied about anything ever in their lives, only people that understand science, biology and physics would ever believe such racist or anti semitic notions about evolution and sociobiology or those that understand buildings and explosives would also deliberately lie and claim the WTC7 just fell eventhough no plane hit it, of course anyone that thinks a plane didn't fly into WTC7 must be a racist or holocaust denier and deserves no "free speech".

The constitution has the first amendment to protect politically incorrect speech, I'd rather have a million holocaust deniers blabbing off at the mouth than one of them shooting up anything. If they feel silenced then violence ensues, I'd rather have racism which appears biologically inevitable than race wars which seem to occur when people don't call each other names or argue but just go for each others throats, without free speech you only end up with violence as the substitute, and usually the government tends to inflict that on those they can demonize in the government supporting media systems.

posted on Jun, 12 2009 @ 12:31 AM
reply to post by Blaine91555

Interesting post. Have you considered he may be a Sociopath thereby negating your entire theory about him. How sure are you he is not a Sociopath as so many of these pretend politically motivated butchers are? Can you blame a brain disorder on our system, or is it in reality, simply a unfortunate medical problem as we now know it is?

Can you tell me what constitutes a brain disorder? Which doctor has done a successful brain transplant operation in a human being? Which scientist has organically grown a fully functional human brain in a laboratory?

Psycho babble for the most part is all about convincing people there is something wrong with them if they just don’t compliantly fit into an otherwise insane world full of injustice and hypocritical absurdities.

I think there is a major problem with society.

I think we have a better shot at improving the quality of society sooner than we do mapping out the human brain to the point that we can absolutely correct birth defects and damages to it.

If you build it they will come. Provide the circumstances and situations to erode a person's ability to compliantly cope to a great enough degree and you will have people come unhinged.

There are a tremendous number of people right now who are one step away from being this man because of their frustrations with the current state of society and if people don't want episodes like this to become daily occurences then people need to start working on improving the overall indegrity of society and that does not include simply labelling everyone and anyone who can no longer tolerate it and acts out against it a terrorist and to impose even more restrictions and suspicions on people.

It means make the world a better place, and safer will follow right along with it.

I see where you are coming from, but I think you are using it to explain to much. If a person hates all Jews simply for being born Jews but pretends they only hate the Zionists how does that apply. I see people who fall into that category all the time. That is not a problem you can blame on history or society, it is either a psychological disorder or an evil person; and yes truly evil people do exist.

I dislike many of the things that Zionists do! Many Zionists thinks that mean I don’t like them as opposed to some of the things that they do. Some people don’t take criticism well even when it’s constructive. Amazing huh? Rather than consider when people are criticizing them that the person might have a valid point they just say "oh you don't like me because I am... or you just don't like ..."

Not exactly what I will call a path to higher learning and self improvement but I suppose some people feel that their standards and desires are the only one's that matter.

In this case it is even more heinous as it is likely he knew many of those there were neither Jewish or Zionists and he obviously did not care. That does in fact take him into the realm of a genuine Terrorist. In fact a sane person would abort their plans rather than risk killing an innocent person no matter who their prey was.

This is a man who spent six years in prison just so he could have one day in Court to talk about what’s wrong at the Federal Reserve, he didn’t use his trial to push his racial agenda.

This is a man who at 88 I am sure is looking to explain what his plans and motivations are once more in a Court of Law. I am sure he will want to get all on the record as far as what he intended on doing there.

He went armed with a pistol and a fake bomb to the Federal Reserve and did not shoot anyone. Until we see some security footage on TV or hear the Government’s case and the Defendants case inside a Courtroom then all either of us can do is speculate as to why he shot the man and what his goal was.

It is also a bit off to think we should all consider ourselves to blame for actions we play or played no part in. Even holding George Bush accountable for the actions of a Parent or Grandparent reveals that the hate is not rational unless a person knows for a fact the other family member holds the same beliefs and committed the same atrocities.

In considering President Bush's action, to be intellectually honest you would have to consider the facts independently of what his relative had done. To even think the opposite would be the same as saying Everyone related to Ted Bundy is a Psychopathic Monster.

I hear this a lot from people it's all part of the egocentric game of "I am ok, your ok, he's not ok" mentality.

If there is a problem it's always the other person's fault, and if it's a big problem that effects the whole world, just because you live in that world couldn't possibly mean the problem is in anyway related to your own interactions in it?

Yep, I am ok, your ok, he's not ok, keeps a lot of people lazy, stupid, ignorant, whiney and innefective.

As far as George the II...

Fact is he has a sizeable portion of that money in a trust account that was placed there for him when the frozen assets of Silesian Steel and Silesian Coal in occupied Poland, and USB Bank in New York were released in 1952 after being frozen in the Trading with the Enemies proceedings Congress had brought against his Grandfather.

He could have chosen to give the money to charity but he kept it.

I won’t accept a penny from a dead relative’s estate, let alone a penny from a dead relative’s estate that a sizable portion of what they left me came from the proceeds of Concentration Camp Slave Labor.

That apple sure didn’t fall far from the tree friend.

Part of what keeps this world and even small groups at each others throats is this nonsense of lumping entire groups of people or families into one nice little package. It is so intellectually dishonest as to be the product of an irrational brain.

Well your defending entire groups in one nice little package so you might want to toss out that ladle sometime soon, and the one where you have diagnosed this mans motives, intentions, biological and mental states while you are at it without being qualified medically or scientifically to do so and having conducted no study of the actual human subject in question through first hand scientific interaction!

I think irrational is kind of a harsh way to describe that, I refer to it simply as reactionary.

I could have kept this very short by saying it a different way I suppose. We are all responsible for our own actions no matter our environments. We are born knowing the difference between good and evil. When a person reaches the age of that man, he is directly responsible for his actions. I can understand an adolescent still in conflict and doing what they want when they want and to hell with society and their elders. It is partly hormonal after all. That is exactly why bad people and even Terrorists target Adolescents. I can not however justify blaming society for the actions of a very mature adult. It is incredibly disingenuous to do so.

I sure hope that this world full of poverty, famine, war, disease and insatiable selfishness and greed isn’t the pinnacle of humankind’s social achievements.

This country’s forefathers were labeled terrorists friend, to some that word might not carry the stigma that a government so intent on terrorizing us with the word itself implies that it has.

If we applied most people’s standards regarding terrorism we would still be England!

In case you missed the points I was stressing in each post, I don’t condone violence or racism, but I applaud people who will at least act on their convictions even if it is a misguided attempt or a bad one.

In case you missed the additional points in my posts I wasn’t attempting to excuse the man’s actions but to get people to better consider why the man acted as he did.

Further to contemplate the difference between reacting and responding in assessing the depth and breadth of a situation.

[edit on 12/6/09 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

posted on Jun, 13 2009 @ 01:10 AM
Just a very odd addition to this story...

From Carol Cratty

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- It is not possible for authorities to trace the rifle used in this week's shooting at the Holocaust Memorial Museum to the original purchaser, a law enforcement source said Friday.

The source, who was not authorized to speak publicly about the investigation, said the weapon is a Winchester Model 6, .22 caliber rifle -- a type of gun manufactured between 1908 and 1928 -- long before records were kept on gun purchases.

I hate to break it to people but a 22 long rifle bolt action rifle would not be anyone's weapon of choice for a 'close in' indoors combat situation.

A sniper might use a "Super X 22 Long Rifle 22" which weren't made in those days, that uses an even longer cartridge to add more gunpowder than a regular 22 would for a highly accurate recoiless head shot from a distance of up to a mile in the case of a world class marksman but a 22 is such a small calibre round it would not deliver a kill blow except by penetrating the center of the brain, heart or another vital organ.

The long barrel of the weapon makes it extremely disadvantages in a close quarters combat situation where a person with a 3 feet arm span would only have to make it to within 6 feet of the attacker to knock the 3 foor long barrel of the rifle off target and to grab it or take it away or knock it out of the assailants hands.

I doubt this guy was "Charlie Atlas" at 88 years of age.

Additionally a bolt action weapon in the hands of even a young man would require about 5 seconds between shots to manually eject the cartridge, load another one into the bore and chamber, and line up another shot since the whole cocking operation would disrupt the aiming point of the previous shot.

5 seconds in a close combat situation is an eternity.

Now lets also consider this...

James von Brunn, 88, has been charged with murder in the death of Johns, 39, a security officer who police say opened a museum door Wednesday for the reputed white supremacist. Law enforcement analyst talks about how this could have happened »

Von Brunn remains in critical condition at a hospital, Washington police said. He was shot by other security officers at the scene

Shot by other security officers at the scene?

The kids who shoot up high schools like Columbine and the College Campuses bring much more sophisticated and better suited weaponry to their attacks...

This was a man who served in Military intelligence?

Please...this reaks like no tomorrow.

There is something very, very odd about all of this.

I smell a setup.

I don't think that man went there with the intent to kill anyone, not with an old pea shooter like that.

We aren't being told the real story on this.

posted on Jun, 13 2009 @ 03:04 AM
a spurious correlation if i've ever seen one.

i don't care if the guy was Satan incarnate. It doesn't discredit the validity of his beliefs concerning 9-11 nor is it detrimental to the 9-11 truth movement

posted on Jun, 13 2009 @ 04:27 AM
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Good find PPT.

And good typing on that long discussion with Rapin. Stars on all of em.

Ignore HunkaHunka. He likes the knee jerk reactions

posted on Jun, 13 2009 @ 04:31 AM
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

I think it ought to be pointed out that when the pilgrims left England, they did not do so having disrupted the society they no longer wished to be a part of. They just left it. Totaly unlike terrorism , they did not leave destruction in thier wake , and thier names were not synonymous with murder death and anguish.
If they really had been terrorists, then they never would have been able to get out of England, simple reason being that the English would have strung up and gutted each and every one of them.

posted on Jun, 13 2009 @ 04:40 AM
reply to post by TrueBrit

Yes, but they did fight against England later on, you see.

posted on Jun, 13 2009 @ 05:04 AM
reply to post by xxpigxx

I stand by my conclusion however that in doing so they were not performing acts of terrorism. They fought a war, in a military fashion. They did not randomly detonate explosives with the intent to cause mayhem amongst non combatant targets , in a time of peace. They killed when at war for thier freedom. There is a big fat massive difference.

posted on Jun, 13 2009 @ 11:33 AM

Originally posted by TrueBrit
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

I think it ought to be pointed out that when the pilgrims left England, they did not do so having disrupted the society they no longer wished to be a part of. They just left it. Totaly unlike terrorism , they did not leave destruction in thier wake , and thier names were not synonymous with murder death and anguish.
If they really had been terrorists, then they never would have been able to get out of England, simple reason being that the English would have strung up and gutted each and every one of them.

I think it should be pointed out that the United States of America has long been other nations safety valve.

If the millions of Cuban Americans had not been allowed to flee Cuba for the United States, Castro would not be in power today.

As a small child growing up in a rural mountain community my elders cautioned me repeadetly "Any animal if cornered even a normally harmless one will choose to fight viciously for it's freedom and life".

The Cubans in America up until fairly recently led a fairly happy and decent life in the United States patiently 'waiting' for Fidel to die or someone else to have the courage to take the risk that most of them would have like to have had the courage to take such a risk themselves in ridding the world of Castro...hence the Bay of Pigs. (The failed attempt of Cuban Exiles to militarily invade the Island Nation and overthrow Fidel)

"Give us your Tired, Hungry and Poor" in many ways has been the one thing that has kept many European, Latin American, Middle Eastern and Asian nations from exploding internally in to violence.

Sadly, even tragically so, when the Masons of France commissioned the Statue of Liberty that bears that inscription to give to the Masons of America as a gift over to celebrate it's independence from not England's but the Holy Roman Empires tyranny they seem to have failed to have mentioned...

That the Statue of Liberty is nothing but the biggest most deceptive Military Recruiting sign in the entire world as the United States of America continued through part and parcel to not just be a part of the Holy Roman Empire but the Roman Empire itself and began it's function as the World's Army and the World's Policeman to keep that far flung Empire running smoothly and expanding.

During some of this Nation's conflicts immigrants found themselves stepping off the boats that carried them here in the morning, and found themselves immediately cast into uniform and conscripted before dinner that day. One could say at least they knew where their first and next meal was coming from here in America.

There are sadly no places left to run and hide, or run and lead a peaceful existence and Arlington Cemetary is lined with the graves of men as are Cemetaries all over the world that clearly denote the recently arrived immigrants to the United States did not find that peaceful existence here in the United States but feel merely for arguably one of the World's greatest deceptions.

If you know English and French and German history that whole period around the beginning of colonization of the Americas and it's inception as a semi independent nation of the Holy Roman Empire in the war of 1776 and the period leading afterwards up to World War I was rife with European political violence and upheaval...

So much so that the New World Order's (Rome's) army, the United States of America's military Caesar's own immortal 13th Legion itself (The 13 colonies, the 13 bars and stripes and stars, the 13 building blocks in the Pyramid, etc., etc.) has been called upon again and again to quelch it.

Terrorism is simply a word to describe how frustrated Institutionalized States, Principalities, City States, Common Wealths and Sovereignties view combatants against their corrupt powers and largesse when that combatant is acting in a human capacity and not a State, Principality, City State, Common Wealth or Sovereignties Official capacity in carrying out an act of violence with a political goal.

I believe it's as deceptive a Misnomer as the Statue of Liberty is and America's so called and highly touted Independence and Freedom which most Americans especially now under the Patriot Act, the FISA Act and all the other unconstitutional laws and actions that infringe and impinge upon our Constitutional freedoms between urinating in cups for our employers to see if biologically we are fit for employment in a highly militarized, highly monitored and tightly controlled police state.

It would seem you enjoy living in your Fascist Police State, I and many other Americans do not enjoy any longer living in ours.

posted on Jun, 13 2009 @ 11:44 AM

Originally posted by xxpigxx
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Good find PPT.

And good typing on that long discussion with Rapin. Stars on all of em.

Ignore HunkaHunka. He likes the knee jerk reactions

Thanks my friend...truth be told all the reactionary types truly believe they are doing and saying the right things based on their ability to percieve and annalyse things...

Tragically and sadly anyone's ability to percieve and annalyse things becomes vastly diminished when they succumb to emotions like anger and fear that create at times such a fog of confusion and boundless imagination and adrennalin that the haze becomes nearly impenatrable for them to see through.

Because their reactions 'morally' feel 'right' that by extension makes their reactionary intitial perceptions and annalyses 'right' in their mind, and once self assurred of their own 'correctness' and someone elses impropriety as being 'wrong' the validating and mind numbing 'absolution' most humans crave as been obtained and once released from any perception of culpability on their part, they go back to their zombified wanderings and meanderings after placing all further responsibility on a corrupt and innefective state to sort out and correct any problems that remain that they have now assured themselves they are not a part of and have no responsibility to lend a thought, eye, ear or hands to fixing.

Of course the State itself never does anything to correct the problems because the problems only help to insulate the State from having it's own corruption and malfeseance viewed at with more discerning and demanding eyes and minds.

The Powers that Be of course know how such purely 'emotional' and 'conditioned' thinking aids and abets them and are typically appreciative to the extent of then responding in a way that further denigrates the quality of all plebian and even some patrician quality of life.

The plebes mean well, they just are not terribly adept at doing well.

Thank you friend.

posted on Jun, 13 2009 @ 11:51 AM
Well this is indeed what that line of thinking leads to.

This isn't a generalization... The line of thought that states that power exists outside of you and it's up to you to seek the truth leads to these behaviors....

posted on Jun, 17 2009 @ 02:17 PM

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
There is something very, very odd about all of this.

I smell a setup.

I don't think that man went there with the intent to kill anyone, not with an old pea shooter like that.

We aren't being told the real story on this.

PPT you could be a forensics ballistics specialist for an investigation team

CNN transcript; Witness says one guard shot another at Holo Museum, not von Brunn

posted on Sep, 29 2009 @ 10:26 PM
Von Brunn has been sent to FEDERAL PRISON in another state despite not being convicted of anything--
James von Brunn, the elderly white supremacist charged with killing a security guard at the U.S. Holocaust Memorial Museum in June, has been transferred to a federal prison in North Carolina for an evaluation to determine whether he is competent to stand trial. He arrived at the Butner Federal Medical Center in Butner, N.C., on Friday... A judge ordered the evaluation, which was requested by von Brunn’s lawyer despite his client’s objections.

Ya just have to wonder, do they really need to send him hundreds of miles away just for a psych eval? And how did they transport him? By bus? That alone would have been enough to kill him. He is either going to die down there or he is going to come back with a full confession and a pre-arranged plea deal, no question asked.

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