How we are Conditioned to act without Reason *Video* Must See*

Wow, it does give you something to think about.
Thanks for sharing!

Originally posted by Starseed32
Wow, it does give you something to think about.
Thanks for sharing!

No problem! I found this video very thought provoking and wanted to share it with others. Thanks for watching.

I haven't ever seen a video of it, but I've read about it. Not to do with governments, but in regards to company policy.

This has probably happened numerous times throughout human history.
I　Ｃan't think of any GOOD examples right now though! I'll keep thinking though, it's fun to think about.

Great video. I believe this can and does happen alot.

If the monkey gets hungry enough will it risk endangering its own safety for the reward of food?

Will the Fight instinct overrule the flight instinct if the animal is hungry enough? Or would it rather starve than risk bodily harm? Is it smart enough to know that without that banana for a food source it can die from starvation? The risk to GET the food would seem like a better chance than the risk to die of starvation.

Originally posted by audas

Originally posted by Ian McLean
I've searched and searched, but I can't find any sources that indicate this "experiment" is anything other than a fable.

Perhaps some monkey would wait until the others are asleep then grab the banana. Or the banana would rot and none of them would want it. Monkeys aren't stupid; the do self-assert and try creative things.

This video is junk pseudo-science, that attempts to dress up a perhaps-valid point as a basic law of behavioral psychology. In fact, the anecdote is the kind of disinformation it tries to exemplify - accepting authority opinion without validation.

Except for the fact that the video does not claim it is the truth, nor enforces it upon you - simply presents it as an anecdote as you have clearly indicated yet chosen to ignore as you chastise it for claims of scientific rigour - which the video never claims yet you attempt to discredit the video for making such claims which only you claim - ironic how your own post has clearly indicated demonstrated the validity of the videos arguments through your won attempts to discredit it - wow - cool.

The video does not make any explicit claims about it being based on any experiment but also does not state that it is anecdotal. The presentation is set up, however, like something you might see on Discovery Channel, in an authoritative style, which makes it misleading. Intentionally misleading.

The basic premise may or may not be true. I don't know. Someone needs to get 10 monkeys and find out for us.

At the end the video randomly shows an illustration of a police officer brutalizing a war protester. Of all the billions of possible scenarios they could use to illustrate their thesis they chose that one, one that doesn't actually illustrate anything but forces the viewer to quickly--thoughtlessly--force a psychological connection between the sheepish monkeys and current world conditions. Massive fallacy. But hey, who needs intellectual rigor these days amirite? So, I've concluded that this is straight-up leftist propaganda. Ian McLean's response did not in any way validate this video's premise, nor has mine. But perhaps YOUR response has, in a way...

Leftism is anti-reason, anti-reality, and always pragmatic about the "blurriness" of reality; nothing is concrete for the leftist mind. Too bad for them we live in one harshly concrete reality!

Originally posted by vat0r
What about the monkey who simply ignores the water, climbs the stairs and grabs the banana because he's really hungry?

What if one of the new monkeys is actually a ninja and beats up the other four?

Or one of the monkeys is more motivated, climbs the stairs while suffering the water, gets the banana just to show the weaker monkeys what is possible.

Mt. Everest for Monkeys.

Now we're getting more relevant to humans!

For those who feel as if there is not any proof, I would say the proof is all around you. Why do most people decorate a tree at Christmas? Why do we set off fireworks on the 4th of July? Why do we hide Easter Eggs? Why do we tap the brakes as soon as we see a cop regardless of the speed we're going (even those who have never received a ticket). Superstitions propose the same. Most things are done for the sake of "tradition" and most do not know or realize the beginning of said "tradition". Christmas does not seem like Christmas without a Christmas tree, I didn't find out until later in life that decorating the tree is believed to be pagan in origin. True enough fear is not what drives us toward these particular practices but the principle is the same. Most laws are obeyed through the fear of consequence not through the belief in it's practice to provide protection. Even our monetary system is proof. What true value does the dollar hold beyond our belief that it has value? We believe it has value because those before us believed it had value tied to gold. Since the dollar is no longer backed by gold it is only our belief that gives the dollar value. I believe these to be fair examples that show the video to be very accurate in it's depiction. You may disagree, but I find it to be all too true.

reply to post by impending_pyrrhic_victory


Great points, especially about the money thing.

But you are missing something very important.

Gold is not valuable either.

As a Metal, it is too soft for practical use.

As a conductor, it is too scarce to be usefull.

Sure, it's pretty.... but so is Pyrite

www.crystalradio.net...

So what makes Gold so valuable?


This inflated desire for gold goes back thousands of years.

Really.... of what value is gold, that cannot be applied to pyrite as well?


-Edrick

Haven't you heard of the method of catching a monkey by putting a banana in a pot that is just big enough for the monkey to get its hand in?

It grabs the banana & then can't get it's hand out again, but it won't let go of the banana (obviously the pot is tied to the ground so the monkey can't get away).

Anyway, concentrating on the monkeys is a red herring, it's just to show how people behave without using the faculties that they've been blessed with - ie thinking.

I've observed this a lot when you ask people what they think about some topic or another (some current affairs topic is a good one to use, since they'll have been watching it on tv).

People repeat the things they've heard & read, often almost word for word, and they actually believe that these are their own opinions that they've come to after careful consideration - they think that these are their own thoughts when they are just conditioned responses.

You should try it out.

Also, you might enjoy Pavlovs work on conditioned responses ie the salivation of dogs.

Originally posted by Power_Semi
Haven't you heard of the method of catching a monkey by putting a banana in a pot that is just big enough for the monkey to get its hand in?

It grabs the banana & then can't get it's hand out again, but it won't let go of the banana (obviously the pot is tied to the ground so the monkey can't get away).

Is this true? How long does the monkey hold on before it lets go? Do you have a souce?

This video is nice...and surely related to the real world

This is my first response here, and to a more than worthy topic. I hope that my response brings something of merit to the discussion.

This entire thread is an experiment in conditioning and free thought. Some people immediately jump in to discount, while others are led to believe the authoritative message of the video. Everyone has good points though, and even I was almost taken in by my impulse reactions. This video, right or wrong, is really about opening our eyes to the possibilities of conditioning, conditioning which happens in society today.

We're conditioned to flinch back from certain things. In older times, women were thought of as "inferior", and were discounted while men were dominant. And that was the "way things were done" until leaders with the minds to see beyond their societal shackles rose up to defend their right to vote.

Conditioning can be undone too. I try to think for myself, to consider my actions and the actions of those around me, but I'm sure that even I fall prey to the monkey at the stairs, fearing reprisal from his fellows. It's inescapable, human nature is to copy. Human see, human do.

True, and that is why nuclear weapons have been created. Our big monkeys are aware from previous history that it only takes a few to go up the stairs and the sequence begins all over again.

By dusting us with nuclear weapons they want to prove once and for all who are really the big monkeys.

reply to post by KOGDOG


I wondered what version of "The Way" you were referring to KOGDOG, as many religious sects claim to be of The Way but are not, as the original path had no deities, nor was any form of godmongering tolerated. The teachings of The Way were later twisted to a base purpose, and the rest is now history.

Thanks,
P

"ByThe Way, and by one way alone, the Earth's final message to man shall be known....."
The Son of the Widow

reply to post by Edrick



"So what makes Gold so valuable?"

Edrick, the thing that makes gold so valuable, is the idea that gold is valuable.
The reason that false beliefs are so attractive is that they use tthe idea of promised rewards for certain forms of behaviours. Such promised rewards cannot be substantiated, and cannot in fact be delivered, yet they remain attractive to our incessant need for security and reassurance of continued existence, even in the presence of lack of evidence of the existence of the imagined rewards.
It might be compared to having to pay off a loan on a very expensive car, without ever getting to see the car itself.
We continue to follow the idea of gaining something for effort expended, even if the goal is illusory and ever-moving, like a mirage. The frustration of not being able to succeed in attaining the goal, causes anxiety to build up in the mind of the individual, thus adding to the pre-existing sense of failure, even if the original carrot only existed as an idea that only originated in baseless and unfounded thought processes.

To compare men to monkeys is insulting.....to monkeys....as their capacity for reason is limited, and man has a higher potential for accuracy of mental projection in his strivings. However, he also has an even greater capacity for ignorance i.e. the ability to ignore, which he utilises at any given moment when the idea of being instantly gratified temporarily eases his sense of discomfort.
The human subconscious mind has no capacity for reason, as its primary function is to constantly protect and defend everyhing it considers important to the self, the ego, the primal unreasoning beast that exists in all living things. When the being's already limited capacity to reason has been castrated by false and contradictory indoctrinations, usually when young, and acccepted as factually real by the sunconscious mind, then the being operates on a hair-trigger response mechanism instead of a methodology of balanced thought.
Belief systems, and religions in particular, operate on the knowledge of these primal leanings, and they promote rote methodologies of compliance and unquestioning obedience, for which they promise rewards that are always just out of reach. People then become familiar with failure as an expected part of their lives, thus leaving them vulnerable to abuse by the most predatory of non-humans, who know how to twist the knife to elicit the required response.
We are truly a shameful species, and my recurring thought when I witness so much of this evil process, is not so much "How will we survive?" but "Do we deserve to survive?"

P




[edit on 15-6-2009 by Pentacular]

[edit on 15-6-2009 by Pentacular]

Ha great video, sums it right up. Kathy at conspiracy friend finder.

Why don't you need a lid on a bucket of crabs?

Because when one tries to crawl up and out, the others pull him back down.

'Nuff said.

[edit on 24-7-2009 by Skylonda]

Originally posted by Ian McLean
reply to post by audas

 

And that the fable seems a little too convenient, like it's contrived to show a point.

Humans probably act that way, however.

Because it was contrived to show a point. It was contrived to show a point about humans. Neat how your post is ironic yet again. You answer your own questions and then ask the same thing again. You clearly missed the point of the video and in your post, you are sooooo close. Oh well. Carry on.