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When a Chosen Tibetan Lama says 'no thanks'

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posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 12:00 PM
Time Magazine

Late last month, two Spanish media outlets confirmed that 24-year-old Tenzin Osel Rinpoche, one of the most renowned Buddhist "golden children" — toddlers determined through dreams, oracular riddles and their own "memories" to be tulkus, or reincarnations of high Tibetan Buddhist lamas — has abandoned his foretold identity. Instead of a Lama, he wants to be a filmmaker, and has reverted to his original Spanish name, Osel Hita Torres. ....

In 1989, with the approval of his Spanish convert parents, four-year-old Hita was tapped by FPMT monks as the reincarnation of the group's co-founder Thubten Yeshe. Their methods will be familiar to anyone who has seen Bernardo Bertolucci's Little Buddha or the current documentary Unmistaken Child: The monks reportedly heeded some dreams; the Dalai Lama consulted an oracle; and the capper was that young Hita "recalled" the color of the dead lama's car.

Last month, however, the magazine Babylon confirmed that the shaggy-haired Hita had long-ago dropped out of his Tibetan University, and that he no longer even considers himself a Buddhist. He was quoted more pointedly in the newspaper El Mundo as saying, "I was taken away from my family and put in a medieval situation in which I suffered a lot. It was like living a lie."

More information on this story at the link.

This is a rather significant happening for a large number of people.

The article goes on to say this interesting information about the process of picking a lama -

While signs and portents may play a role in monastic successions, he explains, so do more worldly considerations. Tulkus often inherit considerable wealth and influence, and powerful monks will jockey to place their own candidates. The political needs of their lineage also figure. And sometimes the consensus-based system doesn't yield a clear winner: Tibetan history crackles with bloody battles between rival claimants or their camps.

I'm a bit stuck by all this. I admit that as often as I've told people 'nothing is as it seems', I hadn't figured the lamas to behave in such a way as to earn the all-encompasing cynicism that I have developed. I honestly believed that they probably 'got it right' when they figured out who was reincarnated from past lamas and who had incarnated off the unending wheel ....


posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 12:05 PM
yeah, it happens in all religions, and all things under man's control...I'm a little confused as to why you thought buddhists were "untouchable", so to speak?

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 12:10 PM
I'm not going to be an apologist because first and foremost I don't think the world really needs more monks. And frankly I've always been disturbed by the 'royal' treatment those chosen receive.

How easy is it to be high and holy when you live with conveniences the people you serve do not?

So I don't find this particular story upsetting or discouraging. It shows what should already be realized that these are physical, material beings and therefore egoistic and prone to same foibles as the rest of us, regardless of their spiritual traditions (Which I personally still see as valuable).

If we follow the message that speaks to us rather than the mouth it emanates from, we can not be lost. This is just my personal philosophy where I see a world that needs 'average' people to truly make a difference in it.

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 12:54 PM

Originally posted by heyo
I'm a little confused as to why you thought buddhists were "untouchable", so to speak?

So am I. Honestly ... I just never pictured these guys as being this political or corrupted. I suppose I should have. I dont' know why my mind never included them in on being like the rest of humanity.

I'm disappointed. It's my own fault though.

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 01:01 PM
reply to post by FlyersFan

Yeah, it seems there's nowhere to turn except within.

i hope you don't lose heart tho. I'm trying to be patient along these lines as well.

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 02:41 PM
reply to post by FlyersFan
It's a bit of a sickener, but there isn't and hasn't been a religion that hasn't sought to control the population. Buddhism has admirable tenets of belief...all peace and love and selflessness. Christianity, Islam, Hinduism and anything else support peace, love and selflessness. I've studied all of them over the years for the same reasons anyone else does.

When the abstract concept of peace and understanding is delegated to a human agency, it all falls apart. We just can't help feathering our own nests if given the chance. Buddhism was a theocracy in Tibet. It wasn't the sole bastion of humanity's ideals put into practice. Seems to me that religion and democracy are fantastic ideas dreamt up by humans and consistently thwarted by human nature.

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 03:50 PM
This whole procedure of picking up a Lama is totally non-Buddhist.

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 03:57 PM
You peopel ahve also to remember taht the elites think they are the monks of the west, although probably not as well tuned, as the west has the obsession with money.

The geezer should do what he wants, would be interesting to see what his films are about, maybe they are using him to project something out there.

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 05:56 PM
reply to post by DangerDeath

I agree. Even if he reached enlightenment he could still very well decide all the old customs and rules were not to his liking and break them. Everything is illusion according to Buddhists anyway.

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 06:48 PM
The Buddha asked all his followers not to take his word as true, but rather to test the teachings for themselves. ln this way, each person decides for themselves and takes responsibility for their own actions and understanding.

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 06:54 PM
Well perhaps it was a meaningful way back when they started the practices of choosing their leader but as with everything the modern world and human nature has gotten to them now they are just getting as corrupted as anybody that is looking for power.

Obviously the "chosen one" wants to live his life in a more mundane way and so he made his choice.

posted on Jun, 7 2009 @ 07:32 PM
Just like all other religions, Buddhism as been watered down. All this cult-like nonsense, divination and idol-worship does not have much in common with what Buddha himself taught.

posted on Jun, 8 2009 @ 06:05 AM
reply to post by Skyfloating

I was surprised to read this - "Dalai Lama consulted an oracle". I figured that the Dali Lama didn't need to do that kind of thing. This article was a surprise for me. For some reason I didn't picture all this giong on.

Kind of a bummer reallly ...

So did the lama's get it wrong and this fella isn't a reincarnation of the previous lama ... or did this lama just chuck everything and say that he needs a vacation from being a lama for a while and decided to make films instead? We'll never know.

posted on Jun, 8 2009 @ 06:28 AM

Originally posted by DrDragonfly
The Buddha asked all his followers not to take his word as true, but rather to test the teachings for themselves. ln this way, each person decides for themselves and takes responsibility for their own actions and understanding.

Exactly. Buddha did not start a religion or political movement. However, his stance was very political since he insisted on personal responsibility, which is against all institutional distribution of responsibility.

The concept of Dalai Lama is totally ideological and has nothing to do with Buddhas teachings, as we know them.

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