Year of the hungry: 1,000,000,000 afflicted

The problem with food prices being "too low" is that if food prices were much higher, a large chunk of the population in the US and the rest of the developed world would have to quit their low paying jobs and be a subsistence farmer. After all food isn't so hard to make in 2009.

The powers that be are thus caught in the middle of two goals. They want high prices for food, but they don't want people to grow their own food. Crushing the little family farmer has been a world controller's dream going back to ancient times. They want massive operations under one control scheme.

Trying to make both of those goals work is spitting into a strong economic head wind. You can't make it work that way.

So it's post scarcity or bust.

reply to post by Blaine91555


Yes I suppose we do.

Yes we’re kind of stuck in a quagmire food costs are to cheap for farmers to profit, not to mention, gas, mechanical maintenance, etc. People are noticing increased prices at the stores.

Last month we saw falling oil and gasoline prices level off and food prices rose the most in a year. We can hope that we don’t see lower prices and lower wages that would cause deflation; although I expect inflation to rise steadily for the next few years.

In the United States, even the poorest households spend only 16 percent of their income on food. In Developing countries we see it at 75% or more but in parts of southern Asia and Africa, a 25 percent rise in food costs can lead to starvation, riots and political upheaval.

According to the World Bank, food prices have risen by 83 percent in just three years and will likely continue to rise. Governments have imposed tariffs and trade restrictions in an attempt to stabilize prices in these countries.

As reported in the Wall Street Journal, wholesale prices of key food items have risen dramatically .

Butter prices are up 31%

Cheddar cheese prices, up 65%

Nonfat dry milk prices, up 117%

Broiler chickens, up 17.5%

Beef, select, up 12.8%

Biofuels and trade are major reasons that demand is out doing the supply. Rising produce prices then trickle down the production line to other items.

The recent drought in Australia the worst in the country's History drastically reduced its rice production.

I’m glad to see how self sufficient you truly are! You learned well from your parents. I have a few laying hens and need to buy a milking goat if things get too out of control.

In theory, capitalist economics work. In reality, a billion people are starving.

I'm sure most you conspiracy buffs have seen the Zeitgeist: Addendum flick at one point or another. The resource based economic model the movie outlines is probably the only option if we want to solve the world's problems.

It is my belief that the only real way to solve any of these global problems is through Fascism. No one power has the resources to feed (in this case) all the underprivileged nations out there. More importantly, no one power has the authority to control the governments of all those underprivileged nations.

There needs to be a collective agreement among the developed nations on how the issue (world hunger) is to be addressed. It is difficult to find an unanimous decision that accomplishes the intended goal. This discrepancy is caused by democratic process and national sovereignty.

If on the other hand one entity was making the decisions, and held feeding the hungry of highest importance, then the goal would likely be accomplished. In Fascism there is really one set of goals that receive the nation's attention and resources.

Now would a Fascist USA or Europe realistically accomplish this goal? It is hard to believe that any one Fascist state would work for the betterment of another nation. No, the resources to accomplish the goal will be delivered by a cabal of developed nations, but the “wet work” will be done in the food impoverished nation itself. An army of revolutionary nature will need to be imported or home grown in the local nation.

This group would have to take control of the general governmental happenings, along with any agricultural infrastructure (to prevent sabotage). This would result in many deaths of both the current governmental forces and the revolutionary liberation army. It should be noted during this time you are more likely to see religious, ethnic, tribal, and similar identifiers being used as targeting features for bloody cleansing. Do not worry, the more people that die the less there are to feed.

Upon successful acquisition of the nation's authority, the installed government can finally start to feed whatever segment of the population that is left standing. There is always the possibility that the revolutionary forces will not feed the people and instead plunder the nation's resources at the people's expense. I ask you what are the chances of that happening though?

(Note that I don't think the above is a good idea)

To be honest everyone needs to learn that there will always be some suffering in the world.

Could every developed nation help out other countries with a bit of charity? - Sure.
Will all that charity really help solve the problem of world hunger? - Doubtful.

You got to think though, any of that charity would mean the world to you if you were one of those starving fellows.

“As the flight begins, all is well. Our would–be airman has been pushed off the edge of the cliff and is pedaling away, and the wings of his craft are flapping like crazy. He’s feeling wonderful, ecstatic. He’s experiencing the freedom of the air. What he doesn’t realize, however, is that this craft is aerodynamically incapable of flight. It simply isn’t in compliance with the laws that make flight possible—but he would laugh if you told him this, He’s never heard of such laws, knows nothing about them. He would point at those flapping wings and say, ‘See? Just like a bird!’ Nevertheless, whatever he thinks, he’s not in flight. He’s an unsupported object falling toward the center of the earth. He’s not in flight, he’s in free fall. Are you with me so far?”

“Yes.”

“Fortunately—or, rather, unfortunately for our airman—he chose a very high cliff to launch his craft from. His disillusionment is a long way off in time and space. There he is in free fall, feeling wonderful and congratulating himself on his triumph. He’s like the man in the joke who jumps out of a ninetieth–floor window on a bet. As he passes the tenth floor, he says to himself, ‘Well, so far so good!’

“There he is in free fall, experiencing the exhilaration of what he takes to be flight. From his great height he can see for miles around, and one thing he sees puzzles him: The floor of the valley is dotted with craft just like his—not crashed, simply abandoned. ‘Why,’ he wonders, ‘aren’t these craft in the air instead of sitting on the ground? What sort of fools would abandon their aircraft when they could be enjoying the freedom of the air?’ Ah well, the behavioral quirks of less talented, earthbound mortals are none of his concern. However, looking down into the valley has brought something else to his attention. He doesn’t seem to be maintaining his altitude. In fact, the earth seems to be rising up toward him. Well, he’s not very worried about that. After all, his flight has been a complete success up to now, and there’s no reason why it shouldn’t go on being a success. He just has to pedal a little harder, that’s all.

“So far so good. He thinks with amusement of those who predicted that his flight would end in disaster, broken bones, and death. Here he is, he’s come all this way, and he hasn’t even gotten a bruise, much less a broken bone. But then he looks down again, and what he sees really disturbs him. The law of gravity is catching up to him at the rate of thirty–two feet per second per second—at an accelerating rate. The ground is now rushing up toward him in an alarming way. He’s disturbed but far from desperate. ‘My craft has brought me this far in safety,’ he tells himself. ‘I just have to keep going.’ And so he starts pedaling with all his might. Which of course does him no good at all, because his craft simply isn’t in accord with the laws of aerodynamics. Even if he had the power of a thousand men in his legs—ten thousand, a million—that craft is not going to achieve flight. That craft is doomed—and so is he unless he abandons it.”

“Right. I see what you’re saying, but I don’t see the connection with what we’re talking about here.”

Ishmael nodded. “Here is the connection. Ten thousand years ago, the people of your culture embarked on a similar flight: a civilizational flight. Their craft wasn’t designed according to any theory at all. Like our imaginary airman, they were totally unaware that there is a law that must be complied with in order to achieve civilizational flight. They didn’t even wonder about it. They wanted the freedom of the air, and so they pushed off in the first contraption that came to hand: the Taker Thunderbolt.

“At first all was well. In fact, all was terrific. The Takers were pedaling away and the wings of their craft were flapping beautifully. They felt wonderful, exhilarated. They were experiencing the freedom of the air: freedom from restraints that bind and limit the rest of the biological community. And with that freedom came marvels—all the things you mentioned the other day: urbanization, technology, literacy, mathematics, science.

“Their flight could never end, it could only go on becoming more and more exciting. They couldn’t know, couldn’t even have guessed that, like our hapless airman, they were in the air but not in flight. They were in free fall, because their craft was simply not in compliance with the law that makes flight possible. But their disillusionment is far away in the future, and so they’re pedaling away and having a wonderful time. Like our airman, they see strange sights in the course of their fall. They see the remains of craft very like their own—not destroyed, merely abandoned—by the Maya, by the Hohokam, by the Anasazi, by the peoples of the Hopewell cult, to mention only a few
of those found here in the New World. ‘Why,’ they wonder, ‘are these craft on the ground instead of in the air? Why would any people prefer to be earthbound when they could have the freedom of the air, as we do?’ It’s beyond comprehension, an unfathomable mystery.

“Ah well, the vagaries of such foolish people are nothing to the Takers. They’re pedaling away and having a wonderful time. They’re not going to abandon their craft. They’re going to enjoy the freedom of the air forever. But alas, a law is catching up to them. They don’t know such a law even exists, but this ignorance affords them no protection from its effects. This is a law as unforgiving as the law of gravity, and it’s catching up to them in exactly the same way the law of gravity caught up to our airman: at an accelerating rate.

“Some gloomy nineteenth–century thinkers, like Robert Wallace and Thomas Robert Malthus, look down. A thousand years before, even five hundred years before, they would probably have noticed nothing. But now what they see alarms them. It’s as though the ground is rushing up to meet them—as though they are going to crash. They do some figuring and say, ‘If we go on this way, we’re going to be in big trouble in the not–too–distant future.’ The other Takers shrug their predictions off. ‘We’ve come all this enormous way and haven’t even received so much as a scratch. It’s true the ground seems to be rising up to meet us, but that just means we’ll have to pedal a little harder. Not to worry.’ Nevertheless, just as was predicted, famine soon becomes a routine condition of life in many parts of the Taker Thunderbolt—and the Takers have to pedal even harder and more efficiently than before. But oddly enough, the harder and more efficiently they pedal, the worse conditions become. Very strange. Peter Farb calls it a paradox: ‘Intensification of production to feed an increased population leads to a still greater increase in population.’ ‘Never mind,’ the Takers said. ‘We’ll just have to put some people pedaling away on a reliable method of birth control. Then the Taker Thunderbolt will fly forever.’

“But such simple answers aren’t enough to reassure the people of your culture nowadays. Everyone is looking down, and it’s obvious that the ground is rushing up toward you—and rushing up faster every year. Basic ecological and planetary systems are being impacted by the Taker Thunderbolt, and that impact increases in intensity every year. Basic, irreplaceable resources are being devoured every year—and they’re being devoured more greedily every year. Whole species are disappearing as a result of your encroachment—and they’re disappearing in greater numbers every year. Pessimists—or it may be that they’re realists—look down and say,.

www.scribd.com...
Could not quote more, 8000 characters maximum

[edit on 5-6-2009 by pai mei]

reply to post by SkitzoFrenic


How do you suppose we control the population? The fact is that it is already overpopulated.

Originally posted by baseball101
reply to post by wonderworld

 

those are truly saddening numbers ... how can people go and spend billions/trillions of dollars of people's money (that most don't want them to spend it on) and not give 2 sh**'s about the starving and undernourished of the countries far and wide, including their own?

let us not forget the millions/billions of dollars put into war profiteers pockets to fund never ending wars, that could be used to feed the starving.

truly saddening.

Wana know what's really scary? That's not the people's money. That is money borrowed at 30% adjusted for inflation. Our money has been pissed away already.

edit: for grammar

[edit on 3-6-2009 by baseball101]

reply to post by alienstrangler


Yes that is scary. We could easily see only 20%-25% annual inflation, that would result in Hyperinflation in 3 years. With interest rates going up it's a wait and see game.

People in out Countries have never experienced Hyperinflation. We would be better off with another Great Depression.

In a Depression your 100 bucks in the bank still buy 100 loaves of cheap bread. With Hyperinflation that same 100 bucks would buy 1 loaf.

reply to post by NettleTea


I think I like the capitalist mthod better than Fascism. I think we are headed ther in a hurry though!

[edit on 5-6-2009 by wonderworld]

Originally posted by VelmaLu
Do you know what is the real problem behind population control? It's RELIGION. . . particularly Catholicism and Christianity.

Peronsal self restraint is the issue. Something both Christiaity and Catholicism address.

Peace

The Global Food Crisis

Our beef comes from Iowa, fed by Nebraska corn. Our grapes come from Chile, our bananas from Honduras, our olive oil from Sicily, our apple juice—not from Washington State but all the way from China. Modern society has relieved us of the burden of growing, harvesting, even preparing our daily bread, in exchange for the burden of simply paying for it. Only when prices rise do we take notice. And the consequences of our inattention are profound...
Such agflation hits the poorest billion people on the planet the hardest, since they typically spend 50 to 70 percent of their income on food....
World meat consumption is expected to double by 2050.

ngm.nationalgeographic.com...
Thought I'd post this on here. Hi WW! Great thread!



[edit on 6-6-2009 by dodadoom]

reply to post by dodadoom


Hi and thanks for the National Geographic link. It make a person wonder when we are importing our apples from China, rather than Washigton and Oregon.

reply to post by wonderworld

Hey no prob. I know huh!
Isnt that crazy! I would gladly pay a little more to buy American!
If we dont support our own growers and keep them in business,
what happens when china decides they need food worse than we do?
Also theres this along the same lines. Good heads up...

Over the long-term, the rising global population will be a fundamental driver of the rising price of food. Last year, Ban Ki Moon, secretary general of the United Nations, predicted that world food production had to increase by half by 2030 to meet rising demand. Then there is global warming. Dry places are getting dryer and wet places are getting wetter and this is playing havoc with farming. (I see this happening firsthand)
South America has suffered from a protracted drought this year and many crops have failed. Changing weather patterns are likely to mean this will continue.

www.thestandard.com.hk...



[edit on 6-6-2009 by dodadoom]

reply to post by HIFIGUY

Personal self restraint is the issue. Something both Christianity and Catholicism address.

You have this part correct; although we all know the word Religion has many meanings and gets distorted. There are a few of us that differentiat our realationship to God with the word Religion. 2 very different things.

Christians, Catholics, Judaism, etc. most inspired by God try to help. We have no control where the food goes one it is shipped.

I didnt mean to turn this in to a religious topic but it does have merrit. We could also say Atheists also send or donate to the less fortunate.


I know your reply wasnt to me. just thought I would add a bit.
Thanks!

reply to post by dodadoom


Yes, Crazy I agree! I think it was also Austrialia that got hit with a Historic drought. Have you noticed the word Historic coming up almost on a daily basis?

No History books will be used for reference on this scenario. We've never been in a binde, such as now,

Thanks again for the link.

[edit on 7-6-2009 by wonderworld]

reply to post by soficrow


Teh developed world has been throwing all kinds of food AND money at this issue for decades w/o any change. Why isnt there any change? The corruption in the "starving" nations. It's also about ignorance. We shoudl stop trying to help them by giving them hand outs. They have told us loud and clear they do not want to be helped. They need to help themselves. They need to start managing their own natural resources properly. they need to kick out their corrupt governments and fix things. Feed the World is a scam. It's about time we in the west wake up and stop getting guilted into throwing away money.

reply to post by norman619


Youre right, we need to somehow change the corruption in the governments to allow the food to reach the people.

It's sad but it seems like it's all we can do is give. The leaders in those Countries will end up paying for the starving children. It makes you wonder if they want them all to die, more food and supplies for the rich!

reply to post by milesp


Capitalism is awesome.

It isnt the job of the haves to feed the have not's.

reply to post by SurvivalGearDepot



I must say I love your user name SurvivalGearDepot! Do you have any gas masks for sale? Any extra Survival tools? Joking. I already have all that stuff.

Food is what we should be stocking up on now to take care of our families. Those who havent been to the survival boards should head there in a hurry.

reply to post by wonderworld


I just launched the store last week, still adding inventory to it. No gas masks, but tons of other stuff including organic and heirloom seeds.

Thats one item I think most people tend to overlook when putting together their survival kits.

Thanks