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Originally posted by IgnoreTheFacts
Basset is a buffoon. I have heard him in some pretty extensive interviews and he is a negative influence on this subject. If you disagree, then seriously go out and listen to his interviews out there on some smaller podcasts. He and his organization is filled with children, and they need to be babysat by the rest of the community lest they keep setting the subject back like all the other "ufo investigators/groups" do.
This isn't going to get us anywhere. Until you finally understand that the problem here is not about our opinions of who is a laughing stock and who's not ... Soon as you realize that the problem here is the United States government, has been, still is, you're just going to continue to chase your tail round and round and round. Focus all of your concerns about legitimacy, focus all your concerns about image on your own government, and it's willingness to lie to you, manipulate you, ... [and] turn reality on its head.
Changing government policy is what counts. ... It's just keeping the pressure on the government. I will not chase my tail; and I will not play the governments game in this intellectual ghetto that they've created for us, where we're all tossed in here behind the ridicule walls and deprived of money and a lot of other things, and so we slowly decay and feast on ourselves like a pack of jackals. I'm not interested in that. You want to feast go ahead.
Originally posted by subject x
I listened to that episode when it was broadcast. That's the same episode in which Bassett stated that credibility is not an issue in the UFO field. That's the kind of soft thinking that gets all UFO researchers lumped into the same category of nuts and whack-os.
If not for credibility, what have you got in the area of UFOs? A lot of "suggestive" evidence that won't prove anything.
Bassett's just playing a numbers game, in which he believes that with enough people yelling for disclosure, the government will cave and "disclose" all. This, as we all know, ain't gonna happen. The government cares not one whit about what the public thinks, as has been demonstrated repeatedly for as long as I can remember. They care not about how many people scream for disclosure, they will just go about their business as usual.
Whether or not the government even has anything to disclose is, of course, an entirely different debate.
Originally posted by Majorion
When myself and others mock Bassett, Greer, and the similar types in the ufo community, we do it for good reason. Being that these people are nothing more than charlatans,
and their public attempts are doing anything but damage to the goal of some possible disclosure and this subject taken more seriously.
Originally posted by Majorion
They are a burden, they have their own cult, and most of us who have a real interest in this subject and want it taken seriously know that these types need to be fought, or else they'll make things even worse than they already are. This is the sad truth.
Time and time again we've heard charlatans like Greer, Bassett and the ilk make 'claims'. And their claims and promises have all been a lie, or at best, a complete and utter failure (see; Disclosure Project).
Personally, I feel a strong need to fight these types, I just hope you understand me.
Originally posted by Majorion
Not to generalize, and since we are specifically on the subject of Greer and Bassett, I dont think it matters whats in their minds, as their actions and words deem any other thing as irrelevant to the bigger picture. While we may have initially somewhat applauded Greer back in 2001 for bringing about a big number of witnesses and documenting them - even at 2001, we can still criticize strongly, as many people agree that he is the worst representative and that some of his witnesses were the wrong ones and this tainted the whole project.
Whats worse is that he not only tainted the Disclosure Project but also tainted any similar efforts that may come about in the future. Putting long lost failed goals aside, Greer is indeed a charlatan. I think this article here sums up this character very well. He is ufology's own worst enemy.
However to call these people liars, charlatans, and other nasty things is akin to me walking in to a church and telling the pastor and his followers, "Your belief is garbage. You're all stupid and nuts!"
No, I disagree. I think its akin to normal modest people of faith fighting the extremists who are causing all the problems to them and the world and tainting and generalizing the modest ones.
However so long as the person isn't caught actively lying or massively over-inflating the truth, they're another voice advocating our position. The trick is to convince these people to tone down the rhetoric.
I'm sorry, we cannot even risk giving questionable people the benefit of the doubt - not for a subject like ufos. This is the precise reason why ufology is not taken seriously.
Of prime importance is the fact that the better the quality of the sightings, the more likely to be an Unknown and the less likely to be listed as Insufficient Information. These results are precisely what one would expect if the Unknowns were fundamentally different from those reports in the astronomical, balloon, aircraft, or other categories and also completely contradict the oft made statement that “There are no interesting UFO sightings that are reliable and no reliable sightings that are interesting.”
... The first question to ask in attempting to determine the identity of the Unknowns is “Is there any difference between the characteristics of the Unknowns as described by witnesses and the characteristics of the Knowns?" The results consistently showed that the probability that the Unknowns were just missed knowns was less than 1%!
This is a paranormal subject
, there is an inherent giggle factor, people like Greer and Bassett are at the forefront of this giggle-factor - and the only thing one can do is to fight them, not allow them any opportunity or any support at all (no conditions). They are charlatans.
I and others who have had real experiences strongly believe in this principle, most people who've had genuine experiences know for a fact that these people are nothing but cult-growing money-grabbing sensationalistic trolls who never had any experience, theyre just nutbags honestly.
Did you read the latest Disclosure Project release? - 'claims' of briefing Obama and intelligence. That says it all.
And this type of behavior needs to be strongly condemned.
Ive seen the latest sensationalist release unsurprisingly get hyped on UFO blogs, and everyone (almost) are all duped so easily and naively by these types, and that frustrates myself and many others. There remains only one solution here for this problem.
While one may argue that Bassett may have been misinterpreted with his statements for example, its crystal clear what effect he and others have on the gullible. Look at the title of this thread; Disclosure Countdown - what does that tell you?
- it makes it clear the type of message and false hopes people like Bassett and Greer are sending out and promoting.
When really, all these claims and promotions are for themselves, for their own egos, for their own benefit. Theres no mistaking that this thread; 'Disclosure Countdown' is exactly the type of bad hype that Bassett and his ilk intended to bring about. And this is not a good thing at all.
Originally posted by Frith
I've never liked the tangential accusations and speculation surrounding this subject. Sure it makes for more material to discuss or profit from, but it takes us no further to the truth.
Not to mention that these tangential arguments create handy strawmen to wipe out whatever sliver of credibility exists on this conspiracy. Its like 9/11 no plane and space laser theorists, but worse.
All anybody should be focused on is whether or not ET and UFOs are real and getting information gathered from our governments on this subject. Not wondering aloud about ET technologies, reptilian shapeshifters, or space brothers.
It not only damages believability it serves no useful purpose in finding out exactly what the truth is to all the reported sightings and government documented cases that we know of.
Originally posted by Xtraeme
We shouldn't be focussing on the rubbish rather we should be focusing on what's compelling - the evidence.
The problem with UFOs is the word UFO. Uttering that simple acronym instantly discredits anything associated with it, be it Presidents, atmospheric physicists (ie/ the most qualified people to discuss the subject), astronauts or take your pick of notable individuals.
Why is it no one discusses Project Blue Book Special Report 14? To quote Friedman,
It's paranormal by declaration. Rather I submit UFOs represent the science of identifying the unidentified, particularly as it relates to things seen in the sky.
I also find ufowatchdog's take of Greer a bit eye-rolling.
This is why in my last reply I went through the "personal escalation of explanation loop." Why is your subjective experience any more credible than Bassett's or Greer's?
It tells me people need to be more thorough in their analysis of peoples speeches and stop buying in to sensationalism.