Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by nh_ee


Muslims worship a different God then the Christians. Christians worship a trinity God, which would be evil according to the Muslims. Muslims do not worship or see the divinity of Christ or the Holy Spirit.

Different Gods. (or should I say - different gods (small g?)

I'm sorry but this is wildly inaccurate. First, the concept of the Trinity is predominantly a Catholic Doctrine. Talk to a protestant on the issue and you'll get wild variation from the trinity is a bastardized concept that has no legitimacy to something resembling the Roman Catholic Line and everything in between.

Secondly, the Qur'an does recognize most of the Christian prophets, including Jesus (Isse, I believe in the Qur'an) believing Judaism and Christianity has either perversions of God's word or they simply got it wrong. Essentially, the Abrahamic traditions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam) basically worship the same "God." Just very very different interpretations.

Back to the original point. Quite honestly, all this hoopla about his Muslim roots shows a great deal of bigotry and ignorance, as well as contradition within the community. Either he is a Muslim terrorist sleeper cell or he's part of the Bilderberg NWO or he's secretly Black National Terrorist. Make up your minds.

Lastly, to the people who argue that this War on Terrorism is a declaration of War against Radical Islam... have you really sat down an read al-Qaida's rhetoric and bs? It's an oddball blend of Marxist-Leninism and Islam and in between all of that is this:

Bin Laden is a separatist-nationalist who wants his own sovereign in what currently is Saudi Arabia. There's no question he's anti-Western. But this is his method of Civil War. So long as Saudi Arabia is protected by the U.S., he cannot and will not win a straight up war. This was his best strategy to achieve his goals. Given our oil interests, you can imagine why the war on terror was declared.

Bin Laden is evil and brilliant, much like Hitler was. He used religion as an alignment tool to recruit of a radical fringe element, which (by the way HELLO WAKE UP) exists in every group.

See the Provisional IRA, Christian Identity, any and all groups who bomb abortion clinics, and even Buddhists (Aum Shinrikyo, sarin gas attacks, yes Shoko Asahara incorporated the three major schools of Buddhism into his doctrine and freaking launched a Sarin Gas attack!).

This war isn't against Islam as a whole, just a radical fringe element. The Christian History is just as bloody (Crusades, Pope Urban II, Montsegur).

As for the statement that Islam needs to get out of the middle ages... I fidn that comment probably the most ignorant and stupid. Religion is a glorified mechanism to perpetuate certain cultural traditions that have existed prior to its creation (seriously, the system of patriarchy predates the 3 major religious traditions), Islam is no different. Muslims in the US live incredibly differently from those in much of the middle east. Sadly, while most people here claim to see the truth. You all still take your talking points from the same sources that deliberately focus on radical fringe elements and begin to characterize the region as a whole.

As for Old versus New Testament. I don't know, "lots" of Catholics, Protestants, and Baptists would love to go back to the old testament for punishments? Are they evil? Are they the enemy? No? Again, contradiction that you people need to resolve.

Hate Obama and think he's lied? Great, don't vote for him and given what I read on this website daily, why bother voting at all? Our votes don't matter as the the NWO will force whatever they want. The only way for change is to take up arms and start a revolution. That isn't happening in our life time.

[edit on 8-6-2009 by NeverendingWars]

[edit on 8-6-2009 by NeverendingWars]

[edit on 8-6-2009 by NeverendingWars]

When I read the post from people that say they don't care what religion Obama is, or what faith any president is, I can't help but be reminded how much Bush was Bashed for being a Christian fundy.

Especially fundy, they loved using that word.

see ya

Originally posted by Southern Guardian

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
You are missing the whole point,

He lied, he is a liar.

Lied about what? Religion is a choice, he said his christian, it didnt matter whether he turned around tomorrow and said he was a hindu, we have freedom of religion here. If you think his a "liar because he went to muslim countries so that must make him a muslim" thats your own personal issue.

First we were racist to shut us up.

Not racist, religious. The way you folks have been going on about islam in general posting fear mongering threads, this goes little beyond the mindset of the religious fringe.

Get off it, in this country your free to follow what religion you want. You have no standing dictating anything.

Not in this country SG - Oh I forgot you and I are not real Americans...

BooHOOO!!!

I must be a Muslim too

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
When I read the post from people that say they don't care what religion Obama is, or what faith any president is, I can't help but be reminded how much Bush was Bashed for being a Christian fundy.

Especially fundy, they loved using that word.

see ya

Yeah it just sounds cute that way they were not bashing his religion i guess? Truth is if Obamma is Muslim he has lied to get in the senate he lied to become president and went to great lengths to cover this up.In fact attended a church who's religion he didn't even believe, Major character issue. Aside from that this just shows calculation way beyond lying. I voted for the democrats not him wanted Hillary i admit it. But this gives me great pause in the future that if this is true then also the DMC lied as well because they were the ones supposed to make sure there candidate qualified.I really sincerely hope this birth certificate thing is false but id have to say it looks like it isn't judging from the way hes been handling this!

Originally posted by neformore

Originally posted by Bombeni
And here we are, reduced to having to elect a prewsident w/ a muslim father and muslim name to even attempt to gain favor with the middle east now....oh what a tangled web we have woven.

"Reduced"???

I thought you lived in the land of the free, where everyone was equal?

Peace, liberty and justice for all?

You know, all that stuff that America is supposed to be? Not bitter recrimination and bigotry.

Sheesh. Sometimes it seems I'm more American than some of you lot.

Sometimes... It seems the lack of interaction breeds this concept, no different then
biological disease or vermin. In my generation in my city cultural and racial
interaction is common which my or may not be the same for you know who above.
As a result I could care one red cent about a persons looks, ethnicity, orientation or religion. This is to be expected for another 60 70 years until diversity is all living humans
know, never forget racist or bigoted grandpa can leave his mark long past his lifetime.

What is obvious is that those who speak of liberty and equality are usually those who
believe there is a particular frame work or criteria for such concepts. However both WORDS/IDEAS at the core do not ascribe to particulars; they are FREE to be reinvented and expressed...

Funniest thing is W could spread FREEDOM and LIBERTY to IRAQ -

But the question begs to asked, can *ISLAMS practice or embody such ideals??? ( *just speaking "real American")

I do believe you sound true blue myself -

Eventually such attitudes will die and fade just as everything conservative in practice does

despots
monarchies
burnings
slavery
terrorisms
etc...

Freedumb




[edit on 8-6-2009 by mental modulator]

[edit on 8-6-2009 by mental modulator]

I'll just go ahead and say what most sane individuals are probably thinking. There is nothing wrong with being a Muslim! Sure there will be a few Islamophobes who wish to stir up some trouble on this issue, but this happens against most major religions in all threads.

The key issue at heart here for most people is that Obama seems to have mislead the world about his upbringing and religious allegiance. If true, this is a significant problem because as we all know, people lie for three main reasons:

1) To ensure something unpopular among the general public will be accepted by those who have the power to make things happen
2) To cover-up something so as to ensure this specific element is not highlighted or examined
3) To get a kick out of tricking and deceiving somebody (pathological liars?)

I doubt it's number 3. Perhaps number 1, almost definitely number 2 I would say in this case.

Notice that past Presidents' lies have been to save themselves, friends or colleagues from persecution, or maintain respect among their own families. Still unacceptable and wrong, but nothing really to do with their upbringing and religious allegiance.

This is what makes Obama somewhat unique. Why is there so much controversy over where he was born, his change of name and his religious allegiance? Why the slip ups in interviews? Why did he not cover his heart for the Pledge of Allegiance in the first few instances (until he was informed that this was considered strange)?




[edit on 8/6/2009 by Dark Ghost]

Ermm I dont understand...under US constituion all races are treated eqally so what if he is Muslim, Hindu, Sikh, Jew? The religion does not change the person that he/she is. TBH one should judge a person by his deeds not by his religion. We are living in 2009 and even now the views such as of OP surprises me. That is just 'wow'

I am from India, my Prime minister Mr. Man Mohan Singh is Sikh and ex President Mr. Abdul Kalam is Muslim. But they both do/did a wonderfull job in running the country so I dont understand what's the fuss over religion. That's he point of democracy all people are/should be treated equally.

Thank you Dark Ghort, you summed it up EXACTLY. No one cares that Obama is a Muslim for religious reasons, so you disinfo artists knock that off. Obama LIED, and is STILL hiding it. Which means what else is he willing to hide and lie about? The rules state you must be born in the US or you can't be president, it has nothing to do with religion really. He's not qualified by law that's all.

Thank you Dark Ghost, you summed it up EXACTLY. No one cares that Obama is a Muslim for any religious reasons, so you disinfo artists knock that off. Obama LIED, and is STILL hiding it. Which means what else is he willing to hide and lie about? The rules state you must be born in the US or you can't be president, it has nothing to do with religion really. He's not qualified by law that's all and it proves how corrupt our government is since they not only knew this, but are in fact helping him with it.

Originally posted by December_Rain
Ermm I dont understand...under US constituion all races are treated eqally so what if he is Muslim, Hindu, Sikh, Jew? The religion does not change the person that he/she is. TBH one should judge a person by his deeds not by his religion. We are living in 2009 and even now the views such as of OP surprises me. That is just 'wow'

I am from India, my Prime minister Mr. Man Mohan Singh is Sikh and ex President Mr. Abdul Kalam is Muslim. But they both do/did a wonderfull job in running the country so I dont understand what's the fuss over religion. That's he point of democracy all people are/should be treated equally.

After 16 pages of replies, another one that just doesn't get it. If you won't read the rest of the thread, at least read the reply by genus (above).

It's not the religion, it's the lies about it and what that says about the man.

Many of these same posters hated Bush because they feel (not think) he lied about WMD's in iraq. But then they turn around and defend a man that many think (not feel) has lied about his religion and worse, whether he is even qualified under U.S. law to be president.

Then we have all the members posting here that apparently have no problem with being lied to by their elected and appointed officials. And what does that say about them?

[edit on 6/8/2009 by centurion1211]

You guys (I'm Canadian) put up with 8 years of Bush, and now when there is someone ten times more qualified to be the president and so far has done a terrific job, want him expelled because of his "hidden faith".

This article is absolutely ridiculous, and so is anyone who believes it.

Bush Stealing 2 elections> Obama faking his religion(if its even true)

[edit on 8-6-2009 by Rigel 3]

[edit on 8-6-2009 by Rigel 3]

Originally posted by neformore

Originally posted by Bombeni
And here we are, reduced to having to elect a prewsident w/ a muslim father and muslim name to even attempt to gain favor with the middle east now....oh what a tangled web we have woven.

"Reduced"???

I thought you lived in the land of the free, where everyone was equal?

Peace, liberty and justice for all?

You know, all that stuff that America is supposed to be? Not bitter recrimination and bigotry.

Sheesh. Sometimes it seems I'm more American than some of you lot.

I think you misunderstood me. What I meant was, our former president has lowered our credibility so much in the middle east, that we pretty much require a president now with a muslim background to make any headway with the people in the middle east.

now i ask?.. so if he is muslim? is there something wrong with that?..
so he lied about his faith to win an election, do you think politicians don't lie to win elections?

i don't care if he is a muslim, i don't care if he is a christian as long as he is a good leader... (i am not saying he is)

you americans have some serious issues.. FIX THEM!, for the sake of the world

[edit on 8-6-2009 by Next_Heap_With]

[edit on 8-6-2009 by Next_Heap_With]

Glad someone else is using their brain. This whole subject bothers me only for that very reason. I have to now constantly think about what other dark deals Obamb is willing to make (or maybe has already made) under the table. Unfortunately you could threaten impeachment if he didn't disclose the records, but if he was willing to go this far with it AND have the U.S. government support, you can pretty much guarantee a doctered paper. So what can we really do is a good question as well.

He obviousy cannot be a true Muslim as they are NOT allowed to participate in other religious practices and he went to that crazy black nationalist christian church for many years.

Honestly I don't care what his faith is, it's the illegality of his presidency and having the U.S. government of it that bothers me... bad times indeed

First of all, Obama being raised Muslim does not make him dangerous, evil or even suspicious, it is a religion and a culture just like Judeo-Christian tradition. If anything, having a black from a Muslim background gives the US an edge up on the world stage since he actually understands the cultural nuances of a huge portion of the world's people, critical when you are in a position to play politics. Face it folks, the rest of the world is sick to death of being under the heel of overprivileged white American politicians who have done nothing but exploit the rest of the world for their own gain. Maybe his background is why he is a negotiator and not a destructive warmonger? Just food for thought.....

Also, saying someone is raised Muslim doesn't make them observant, just as there are millions of nonpracticing Jews, Christians, Buddhists and others of stated family religious tradition, many of whom are even atheists. This is the same argument that derailed Mitt Romney from the candidacy and he was by far the most competent and qualified of any candidate in the last 20 years. God forbid an observant Mormon with an excellent business and political record get in, they may actually, gasp, do the job well......

I am all for them being forced to declare his actual birth status and release his personal records like any other person but give the guy a chance, he is trying to undo a mess that was decades in the making. You won't even begin to cure this mess in four years.