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Motivation - Illogical or Logical?

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posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 06:43 AM
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Hi ppl, my first thread, so please be nice!


Right, what I want to discuss is "motivation" in general. What is it? Where does it come from? How do we replicate it?

I have studied Wiki, Psychology books and so on, but to no avail. They all seem to state the same point, motivation is the inner desire behind an action toward a goal.

When I was around 17, I was very overweight, 38" waist and now im 32". For some reason, I decided to eat healthy, run everyday etc. Most would say this was a psychological process, I was fulfilling my heirarchy of needs, conforming to social norms, feeling good about myself, the list can go on... BUT when it comes to revision for academic exams for example, I find it hard to motivate myself to do what I know I should be doing, instead I procrastinate.

So, when it comes to the example above, how is it I could find the motivation to loose weight but not to secure my financial stability? Is motivation illogical?

Cheers!

Brad.




posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 06:49 AM
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reply to post by Toughiv
 


I don't really understand why it has to be a logical / illogical argument. It seems to me that your level of motivation depends on your level of desire for the outcome that you are after. I guess that sounds pretty redundant but that is what it is. You had a higher level of desire for that 32" waist than you do for financial security. Like it or not, the 32" waist is something tangible whereas the financial security is only a number on a piece of paper somewhere. It is much easier to get motivated for something that can gratify you in the short term than it is for something non tangible that doesn't pay off for years.

I am not sure if that is what you are looking for, but that is my $.02. Take it for what it is worth, which isn't much.



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 06:54 AM
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reply to post by Karlhungis
 


Thank you for your $.02
much appreciated.

I say Logical / Illogcial because it makes logical sense that I should care a lot about my financial security. Especially since I realise this conciously.

Your ideas about tangibility hit home. How then would you go about ensuring motivation for goals that arent as tangible, not necessarily financial security?

Cheers



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 06:58 AM
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reply to post by Toughiv
 


You are probably asking the wrong person. I am also a master procrastinator. I am typing this at work, so that should show you where my priorities are.....

I think it just takes a level of focus and discipline. You have to force yourself to prioritize things that you don't find particularly rewarding in the here and now. Either that or change your lifestyle so that you no longer have to worry about such things.

It isn't easy that is for sure. At least not for me.



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 07:04 AM
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reply to post by Karlhungis
 


HAHA, you and me both at work!



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 07:06 AM
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reply to post by Toughiv
 




When I was around 17, I was very overweight, 38" waist and now im 32". For some reason, I decided to eat healthy, run everyday etc. Most would say this was a psychological process, I was fulfilling my heirarchy of needs, conforming to social norms, feeling good about myself, the list can go on... BUT when it comes to revision for academic exams for example, I find it hard to motivate myself to do what I know I should be doing, instead I procrastinate.


You did not make the choice to exercise or loose weight overnight. You would have more than likely 'felt' annoyed at yourself, followed by 'apprehension' as to what weight you should be, followed by you manifesting, picturing or even 'feeling' what it was like to be healtier or fitter.

Weight loss is about exercise and eating healthly, which is earier said than done. But it also involves the will to achieve. You done this by the use of anchors, and by the sound of it, purely subconsciously.

When I have a little more time, I will pop in later and explain this a bit more I you wish.

Therefore, it is logical (that you choose a desired path), but also subconscious (in that you were not fully aware of how you came to making the decision of which path to take).

Where's that couch when I need it!!


Anyway, as for the procrastination - which is self-defeating, you have not viewed the outcome of the exam scores as preferential to your most basic needs. Such procrastination will pass when you start to become more aware of it and it's consequences, i.e. you see a job you need / want and therefore you need to do well educationally to get it!

I will try to clarify later.

Cheers.



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 07:50 AM
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reply to post by Breifne
 


Thank you for your response. Greatly appreicated. I would love to hear in more detail, the use of anchors and so on. I agree with you that there was a period of self-analysis, however when it comes to visualization, it must have been subconcious.

So, if motivation is logical, there is a way of forcing myself to be motivated about things that I know are good for me? I know that statement sounds ridiculous, but when it comes to study, i love to do anything but! I KNOW its good for me, in the future, i just cannot get that moment of self control to beat my procrastination. I feel like a slave to my desires. Highly infuriating.

Cheers

Brad



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 09:29 AM
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Originally posted by Toughiv
reply to post by Karlhungis
 


Thank you for your $.02
much appreciated.

I say Logical / Illogcial because it makes logical sense that I should care a lot about my financial security. Especially since I realise this conciously.

Your ideas about tangibility hit home. How then would you go about ensuring motivation for goals that arent as tangible, not necessarily financial security?

Cheers
The key word there is "should". You are telling and convincing yourself of something that doesn't come naturally. You naturally, in desire and motivation, wanted to lose the weight. Focusing on financial security isn't the same for you. You are 'making' yourself do something. And your true desires are at odds. Perhaps you should reconsider HOW you strive for that financial security. my 2 cents. If you get a lot of responses you may make some money...


[edit on 2-6-2009 by seagrass]



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 09:49 AM
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reply to post by seagrass
 


haha, i'll take as much $.02 i can get


Thank you for sharing, what you say makes a lot of sense, but if I limit it to what I naturally desire, I will procrastinate lol. Im sure it has a lot to do with how I am telling myself that I SHOULD revise?

Cheers

Brad



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 10:05 AM
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why would you procrastinate about a true desire? It is an impulse and requires no thought. If you tell yourself no, often... you aren't listening to yourself. If you are avoiding out of no desire or fear, it is usually because you really don't desire to do it. Procrastination is avoiding something because you would rather do something else. I believe you should do something else. But responsibility is a factor, and a belief that we CAN control things. Somehow that has to be adjusted and balanced. Some believe we do most of our 'work' by not doing. By being in a state of now and in trust. But believing that is difficult when we are taught, "to work for what we get". I believe our true 'work' doesn't feel like work. Desires need to be honored, and we all need to accept and not judge that that can take many forms.. Not just traditional ones.



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 10:13 AM
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I can spend hours and hours on ATS and my other forum. Reading and giving my 2 cents. u2uing people. I have my desk cluttered with food, coffee and cigarettes, papers and bills and whatever else.. You would think most people would see sitting here doing what I do as 'work'. If I was getting paid for this that would be wonderful... It isn't 'work'. I need a job like that. One that doesn't feel like "I want be doing something else instead" all the time. And "I cant wait for this to be over". Or "I really don't want to go in today". Those are all signs that we aren't following our desires. In a world where everyone was in their right work... would we need money anymore??? Wouldn't we do it for free because we love it?



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 10:32 AM
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reply to post by seagrass
 



Beautiful hippie philosophy. Most people don't understand that it is really possible to enter the "flow" and lose all that, guilt trip, societal programing
BS and not worry about the "goal."

But it takes work!!



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 10:40 AM
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reply to post by seagrass
 


I completely agree with what you have said, I constantly feel like i am having to force myself to study. The thing is, it is something I HAVE to do, otherwise my chances of success within this materialistic world drop by a high percentage. This is like a roundabout way to my actual desires, surely there is a way for my emotional side to see sense? I say emotional side because logically I know revision is good for me, but i procrastinate because i dont "feel" like doing it.

Cheers

Brad



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 10:40 AM
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Originally posted by whaaa
reply to post by seagrass
 



Beautiful hippie philosophy. Most people don't understand that it is really possible to enter the "flow" and lose all that, guilt trip, societal programing
BS and not worry about the "goal."

But it takes work!!
Well I WAS conceived on a SoCal beach in 65 after all!!
My mom had go go boots... Tom Jones... ahhh the good ol days.....What's new pussy cat? whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa.....



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 10:47 AM
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Originally posted by Toughiv
reply to post by seagrass
 


I completely agree with what you have said, I constantly feel like i am having to force myself to study. The thing is, it is something I HAVE to do, otherwise my chances of success within this materialistic world drop by a high percentage. This is like a roundabout way to my actual desires, surely there is a way for my emotional side to see sense? I say emotional side because logically I know revision is good for me, but i procrastinate because i dont "feel" like doing it.

Cheers

Brad
Have to? Chances of success that are dependent on one belief. You could go through all the rings of fire. Jump through all the designated hoops and still not be guaranteed materialistic success. There are no guarantees in the Have tos.
More likely your SELF will sabotage you if you aren't on your true desired path. Some magical thing will happen to F it up for you perfectly. Trust that my friend.



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 10:52 AM
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reply to post by seagrass
 


I fear my true desired path will lead me to being a bum on the street with not aspirations apart from to have an "easy life"


How is one to know what their true desired path is?

Thanks



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 10:57 AM
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Originally posted by Toughiv
reply to post by seagrass
 


How is one to know what their true desired path is?

Thanks


By walking a lot of paths and eventually finding one that doesn't lead to a destination.

and another profound piece of wisdom given to me by my Zen master "Rick"

"It's just as easy to love a rich woman as a poor one"

[edit on 2-6-2009 by whaaa]



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 11:09 AM
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reply to post by whaaa
 


See now this seems as if motivation is illogical. Something that is predetermined? What determines what path is for you? Is it a combination of all your experiences? Or what some people would argue "soul"?

I still personally believe you can motivate yourself to do things you dont like. If it is true that you are meant to follow a certain path, I guarantee there are a lot of people out there who dont, yet still manage to have happy lives.

Cheers

Brad



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 11:28 AM
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Originally posted by Toughiv
reply to post by seagrass
 


I fear my true desired path will lead me to being a bum on the street with not aspirations apart from to have an "easy life"


How is one to know what their true desired path is?

Thanks
fear and desire are directly related. Maybe an easy life is associated with doing nothing.. why does it have to be on a street? As a bum? Maybe "nothing" is something specific you could do. Something that really isn't nothing. Your true path will find you anyway, it's there next to all the holes you fall in, all the distractions you encounter, all the questions and fears you put up in front of it. It's there. But like me, it's difficult to find if you aren't listening to yourself. If you question it all the time. Put up shoulds and have tos and what will people thinks. I know, because I still do it all the time.



posted on Jun, 2 2009 @ 11:33 AM
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Originally posted by Toughiv
reply to post by whaaa
 


See now this seems as if motivation is illogical. Something that is predetermined? What determines what path is for you? Is it a combination of all your experiences? Or what some people would argue "soul"?

I still personally believe you can motivate yourself to do things you dont like. If it is true that you are meant to follow a certain path, I guarantee there are a lot of people out there who dont, yet still manage to have happy lives.

Cheers

Brad
I personally believe our "soul" higher self what ever you want to call it, does have a personality, a desire, a motivation. Predetermined at birth or whatever... That we desire because it is supposed to be there. To deny it is wrong on every level.
Our dislikes our likes, that golden light that shines on one thing but not another. The people who are in color, when others are in black and white. We have goals. We have interests, gifts, talents, miracles, and luck that help us. Don't question it. Just do it. Just follow it. Trust it. I know it's hard.. But being a bum on a street, might be a better life than studying a stupid uninteresting book. To allow yourself to experience a "judged" style of living, would be a hard thing if you believe you are a Bum if you do. What if a bum is happier than any millionaire on this planet.. is he really a bum then? Are tribal people unhappy because they don't have the latest and greatest? Only if they think so.



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