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UK: MP Expenses - Why No Prosecutions?

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posted on Jun, 5 2009 @ 09:37 AM
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Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984
Forgive me for saying but if you don't vote then you have absolutely no right to comment about all of this. If you spoiled your vote i would be fine with it, but to simply be to lazy to partake in democracy means you basically gave up your right to complain when things go wrong.


IR, shame on you
I will refrain from anger for saying I'm 'too lazy'.

Why on Earth would i vote or 'partake' in a system that is corrupt to the core?

I really believe the whole voting process is a façade. There was some awesome research done by Bev Harris, an housewife who exposed the software hacking they did for polling station machines in America. Overview video here. (Bev's site here).

I believe the same goes on in the UK. The numbers are all crunched before any election is even called. Besides, i also feel it's just a one-party system where policies and manifestos are flip-flopped depending on what orders are given to them from the higher up blood-lines.

You had millions protesting in London before they went to Iraq to rape and pillage the oil, yet the g'ment still went ahead and invaded. The Americans called it a 'shock and awe' campaign; how ridiculous to stomp your way around the globe with their military might give such campaigns names that sound like bullying, yet people are complicit because they feel they have voted and made a difference!

I have proposed an alternative voting solution in my post here. Calling me lazy for not voting does make my blood boil as MP's vote themselves into power, just like the un-elected Brown. So why on Earth you think your vote counts, amuses me.

However, you have a right to express your opinion and I value that opinion.

I would also like to add the BS they said about 50% tax for 'the rich'. As if that would really happen!!! They just said that to appease the populous but in reality they'd work out ways to fly below the financial radar, otherwise you'd have every Tom, Dick and Harry earning over £100k leaving the country.

Politics is a game, plain and simple. A play of words where they say whatever they think Joe Public wants to hear. I won't play their game and so i choose to abstain from voting. In a 'democracy' that is valid.




posted on Jun, 5 2009 @ 09:39 AM
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reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984
 


Positions of power make you immune to the laws of the land for the common man.



posted on Jun, 5 2009 @ 09:50 AM
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Just wanted to add that the only way things will change is with bricks!

This thread gives an indication of the way people power can change 'the system'.




posted on Jun, 5 2009 @ 09:51 AM
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Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
IR, shame on you
I will refrain from anger for saying I'm 'too lazy'.

Why on Earth would i vote or 'partake' in a system that is corrupt to the core?

I really believe the whole voting process is a façade. There was some awesome research done by Bev Harris, an housewife who exposed the software hacking they did for polling station machines in America. Overview video here. (Bev's site here).


I seem to have a quote by Stalin surfacing in my pathetic mind.

"I care not how people vote, as long as i contro lwho counts the votes".

That is grossly paraphrased as i cannot remember the full thing, stupid brain of mine. However let us be clear. In the UK we still use pen and paper and i will be damned if they ever try computer voting here in full i will grab a whellchair and be protesting in the street. I may even try a go slow campaign in the sheelchair and risk my life lol. That isn'ta joke either, i will do that.


Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
I believe the same goes on in the UK. The numbers are all crunched before any election is even called. Besides, i also feel it's just a one-party system where policies and manifestos are flip-flopped depending on what orders are given to them from the higher up blood-lines.


In the end the votes are counte by civilians like you and i. There are to many to control! If we voted we could upset this system you speak of. So yes, shame on you for not voting! I am not being mean, i'm sure you're very nice as a person i just think that not voting is very bad.


Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
You had millions protesting in London before they went to Iraq to rape and pillage the oil, yet the g'ment still went ahead and invaded. The Americans called it a 'shock and awe' campaign; how ridiculous to stomp your way around the globe with their military might give such campaigns names that sound like bullying, yet people are complicit because they feel they have voted and made a difference!


Millions? I'm not sure it was millions, can you quote the actual figure because i thought it was only a few thousand. This is one area i respect the French because politicalythey stand up for their beliefs. Did you know when France tried introducing clamps the French people completely wrecked it? They all went around putting superglue in the clamp locks and within a month or two the government gave up the practice outside small localised areas.



Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
Calling me lazy for not voting does make my blood boil as MP's vote themselves into power, just like the un-elected Brown. So why on Earth you think your vote counts, amuses me.


My vote does count, i can decide on the issues and vote for a party i think is correct. the way that Labour seems to be losing seats shows the system does work. Sadly people have been drawn to the conservatives. I must admit i find this slightly designed. People need to think for themselves, however again i state that we have th epower because we outnumber all political organisations.


Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
However, you have a right to express your opinion and I value that opinion.


And i value yours, honestly i do.


Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
I would also like to add the BS they said about 50% tax for 'the rich'. As if that would really happen!!! They just said that to appease the populous but in reality they'd work out ways to fly below the financial radar, otherwise you'd have every Tom, Dick and Harry earning over £100k leaving the country.


Firstly you will see many peopel leaving. In fact that has been going on for years. Secondly i don't support such a stupid tax. It's just to much, will drive good, qualified peopel out of this country and in the end will reduce us to nothing as many will see labouring jobs as better than educated ones.


Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
Politics is a game, plain and simple. A play of words where they say whatever they think Joe Public wants to hear. I won't play their game and so i choose to abstain from voting. In a 'democracy' that is valid.


It is a valid position to spoil your vote out of protest at the system, to not vote isn't a protest it is being lazy. If you spoiled your vote you are basically saying that the entire system has a problem, that there is no party to vote for. That has more impact because spoiled votes are actualy counted. They are literally counted.

Joe public? Look if yo and i vote then maybe when parties other than the main ones get more and more seats, joe public will start to listen, did you think of it that way?

If we don't vote then people like the BNP get in because the extremists and dissilusioned always vote



posted on Jun, 5 2009 @ 10:14 AM
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reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984
 


Thanks for the reply IR, some good points.

Voting with pen 'n paper doesn't really count for much as it must be passed on further up the food chain, where the data is collated. That is where i would question the anonymity of counting.

However, you have made me question my non-voting as it seems there is some validity to UK voting. I was pleasantly surprised to find that the BNP have secured their first county council seat in Burnley, Lancashire. Not because it's BNP, but because it's a radical party that have won votes.

Back on topic, i don't see any change to the expense scandal, nor any prosecutions. They have one of their own (Sir Christopher Kelly) investigating the claims, so it's business as usual.


Sir Christopher added: "This is not something which can be done with a quick fix; we want to do a thorough piece of work. Our firm intention is to publish our report towards the end of the year."

BBC



posted on Jun, 5 2009 @ 10:47 AM
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Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
Thanks for the reply IR, some good points.

Voting with pen 'n paper doesn't really count for much as it must be passed on further up the food chain, where the data is collated. That is where i would question the anonymity of counting.

However, you have made me question my non-voting as it seems there is some validity to UK voting. I was pleasantly surprised to find that the BNP have secured their first county council seat in Burnley, Lancashire. Not because it's BNP, but because it's a radical party that have won votes.


that kind of proves our system does work. I hate the BNP with a passion as do many people yet they got in because paper and pencil is hard to flasify. Stalin was right in that it is the people who count the votes that matter. However currently we have decent people counting. I don't know any current counters but i have known past counters and they were good people doing what they thought was their duty. They counted honestly.

Computer voting should be abolished right this second. I swear if it comes to the UK enmasse i WILL drive down a main road in my fathers little buggy on a go slow campaign to bring attention. I swear this now on ATS so if you see it happenign then it's me lol. Granted it only has a 14 mile range.


Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
Back on topic, i don't see any change to the expense scandal, nor any prosecutions. They have one of their own (Sir Christopher Kelly) investigating the claims, so it's business as usual.


The problem is that independant bodies aren't independant in such cases. The police aren't independant in such cases. I would say the police need to investigate with complete trasnparency. That way if they mess up the public will know and can have a field day.

I'm for transparency of government. Complete and utter transparency of spending. The only area this couldn't be achieved is defense for obvious reasons.



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