Mohawk Warriors vow to storm border post

Respect that they are willing to stand up for their rights (unlike some americans nowadays...).

But I see this going horribly wrong if they do try to resolve it with force, they harm or even kill a Canadian border guard, they can expect swift military action from the Canadians and US agencies. Will be a lot of shootouts and deaths resulting, then lots of arrests and incarcerations, followed by some land grab by the Canadians or similar...

Many of us here in Ontario knows what it's about. Sorry to those who think it's a noble cause.

It's about vast amounts of money made by the Mohawks and their smuggling rackets.

Duty free cigarettes and booze bound for the US via Lake Ontario where they will be taxed, gets rerouted back to Canada to be resold at tremendous profits.

Don't know what's happening this year. The US and/or Canadian border getting tighter with the new security measures - ie passports have to be shown.

Biker Gangs and various Mafias moving in on their turf with other markets drying up?

They had a virtual monopoly for decades with the Canadian government looking the other way.

Tough times in the contraband business for the Mohawks.


Mike

these guys should be treated as a non-native person if they did it. sorry. how many nonnative people would everyone applaud if they stormed a border?
I appreciate what they're doing, but how come we don't as canadians (do they not call themselves canadians when they get their grants and stuff) see ourselves as deserving of the same thing? Because they were here first? that's not good enough. The government meddles in everyone's affairs, but i'm not storming any government building or whatever.

It just seems like such a double standard that everyone wants to embrace for some reason i don't get it.

reply to post by Phenomium


Not tribe. Nations. Nation implies sovereignty.

Sovereign nations do not beg to other country's legislatures. They negotiate, and when negotiation fails, they exercise sovereignty.

Native Americans comprise sovereign nations.

You would do the same if aliens invaded your town.

I don't understand why when I go onto the REZ to buy my cigarettes, they have a tax-stamp on each pack. I guess, just like this Mohawk thing, they don't really have the sovereignity they were promised.

I have a great T-shirt with a picture of Sitting Bull on the front.

SURE YOU CAN TRUST THE GOVERNMENT; ASK AN INDIAN!

[edit on 1-6-2009 by CreeWolf]

Originally posted by CreeWolf
I don't understand why when I go onto the REZ to buy my cigarettes, they have a tax-stamp on each pack. I guess, just like this Mohawk thing, they don't really have the sovereignity they were promised.

Reservations are watched pretty closely.

Black market cigarettes are more often sold at the back door of smaller stores and then 'under the counter' or by street vendors.

From the grapevine they may be printing counterfeit seals in some places.


Mike

Let me grab my tomahawk!
Go Mohawks! Im with ya!

I'm sorry but in Canada issues between the two sides are very heated. I don't dispute that the Canadian Gov't did terrible things in the past. I didn't do it, none of my family had anything to do with it as most taxpayers had no knowledge of what was going on. And generation after generation of taxpayers have invested 100's of Billions dollars into trying to fix the problems of the past only to see vast amounts of it squandered and then demanded that more be given. Well when is enough going to be enough. It was mentioned that Native Bands had to account for the money being spent to ensure that money allocated for rebuilding of reserves was in fact going to those causes. There was a huge uproar over that.

I don't mind as a taxpayer making things right, but the Native People have to take ownership of the fact that it is they who have squandered the opportunities given to them. I don't know what else we can do. I see soo many homeless people on the streets of Vancouver that are Native and it saddens me. Because I know that they have better chances given to them by their Community and the government than the non-native homeless and yet the numbers between the 2 are almost evenly split.

It's a border with a Sovereign Nation that is also paranoid about security. Homeland Security isn't going to let this go. Border Guards will be armed as part of the Integrated Border Security with the US. The Mohawks attacking the border outpost with force won't end well for the Mohawks or any other Band in Canada. It will only hurt the Native Cause.

Originally posted by DEEZNUTZ
I'm sorry but in Canada issues between the two sides are very heated. I don't dispute that the Canadian Gov't did terrible things in the past. I didn't do it, none of my family had anything to do with it as most taxpayers had no knowledge of what was going on. And generation after generation of taxpayers have invested 100's of Billions dollars into trying to fix the problems of the past only to see vast amounts of it squandered and then demanded that more be given. Well when is enough going to be enough. It was mentioned that Native Bands had to account for the money being spent to ensure that money allocated for rebuilding of reserves was in fact going to those causes. There was a huge uproar over that.

I don't mind as a taxpayer making things right, but the Native People have to take ownership of the fact that it is they who have squandered the opportunities given to them. I don't know what else we can do. I see soo many homeless people on the streets of Vancouver that are Native and it saddens me. Because I know that they have better chances given to them by their Community and the government than the non-native homeless and yet the numbers between the 2 are almost evenly split.

I have great respect for the indigenous Canadian culture and am fully aware of the injustices perpetrated in previous centuries. My father understood less. He came to Canada from a country where his community were persecuted and often slaughtered. He had no advantages and came at a time when there was no concept of governmental support.

He did the only thing he could do to survive. Worked hard, used his wits, and saved. He had no resentment for the native people here in Canada, but could not understand why they could not get over their collective trauma after hundreds of years and get on with their lives.

Mike

Govt better watch out. Native peoples throughout the Americas have never once unleashed bad medicine upon them for past transgressions. They don't want to start a war with the Mohawks.

as far as i can see, this stinks of terrorism!

who cares if Canada have armed their border guards, its their country, they can do what they want! they have probably armed them to deal with situations like this.

are American border guards on the mexican border not armed?

i see a few posts saying they support these "terrorists" 100%, would it be the same way if they were to attack your own countrymen at the mexican border? no, you would be crying out to hang them from the nearest lamppost.

sick way of thinking!

It begins:

OTTAWA — The border crossing on the Akwesasne reserve near Cornwall is closed in both directions Monday morning as Mohawks continue their protest over the arming of Canadian border guards.


Shortly before midnight, Canadian Border Services Agency guards left their posts in a First Nation that straddles the Ontario, Quebec, and New York borders for "their own safety," Mohawk leaders said early Monday morning.


After a night of negotiations with officials from the Mohawk Council of Akwesasne about the contentious plan to arm border guards, the post was abandoned, Grand Chief Tim Thompson said in a statement

www.ottawacitizen.com...

Canada has a Federal government right now which has little time for First Nations issues. For some insight on how things stand, please read:

www.ctv.ca...

www.cbc.ca...

On the smuggling, it certainly wasn't happening at the border crossing. A quick peek at a map will show that the area is a maze of islands and channels where the RCMP/OPP play a game of cat and mouse with smugglers in small, fast boats. I doubt ANY contraband is snuck through the border crossing itself.

The issue of the guns is not related to that, but (imo) more to the issue (of) armed federal officers on reservation land. At Oka, it was the Canadian Military that stepped in and that didn't work out so well for anyone either.

What needs to be understood throughout this is the fact that the Federal Conservatives under Prime Minister Harper are the same bunch that governed Ontario with the leadership of Premier Harris.

Bad blood.

[edit on 1/6/09 by masqua]

Go the Mohawks. People need to start learning the way of the Mohawks how to stand up for their rights and beliefs.

I hope this paves the way for other people to stand up against totalitarian policies.

"It's wrong for the current government to turn what is essentially a moral issue into partisan gamesmanship,'' Martin said last week.

Brian Mulroney, the former Conservative prime minister, also expressed support for the accord on the weekend.

"We've existed for 140 years and we have this shameful situation . . . and why?'' Mulroney said on the program The Next Great Prime Minister. "Very simple: we stole their land.''

Mulroney said he "absolutely'' supports the Kelowna agreement.

thanks for the update masqua

For those who wish to have an insider's look at the Oka crisis... Oka Crisis on Google Video

I am not sure how it works in Canada, but the theory in the United States is that native peoples living on Reservations (Concentration Camps) are people in their own sovereign nation.

I think both sides have forgotten this aspect. I don't think it was an accident either.

Originally posted by nethawk
They don't want to start a war with the Mohawks.

Actually, Oka was a pretty good start.

I'm all for a fair deal for the Indians...whatever it may be. There are a lot of problems, social and otherwise on both sides of the debate. Two points, though...
First, there is a fine tradition of smuggling across the St. Lawrence by the Mohawks. Call it an expression of aboriginal rights, call it organised crime, whatever...it's a fact.

Secondly, what are the 'rules of engagement' by the border agents...are they being armed to shoot out a Zodiac full of smokes or to defend themselves against bad guys coming through from the States?

That matters, too. I will allow that it's a pretty sticky issue and will likely have to be settled in the courts.

Originally posted by whatukno
I am not sure how it works in Canada, but the theory in the United States is that native peoples living on Reservations (Concentration Camps) are people in their own sovereign nation.

I think you need to be careful with the phrase 'concentration camps' when referring to reservations. Historically...maybe. Socially, as in preservation of personal treaty rights, maybe. Equatable with Nazi extermination camps...no.

[edit on 1-6-2009 by JohnnyCanuck]

Originally posted by star in a jar
Go Mohawks!

They are one of the original peoples of North America, and borders should mean nothing to these people. What gives the government the right to force them to accept the notion of borders, anyway?

Native American can move freely from the U.S. to Canada without much inspection, both governments aknowledge the treaties and their rights.

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck


Your right, I'm sorry Reservations came first, perhaps they should have called Auschwitz a reservation instead of a Concentration Camp. The extermination of the Jews would have been much more palatable.

So let's see, we will force march an indigenous people across the country off of their homeland, give them a pathetic spit of land, let them believe they are a sovereign nation on that land, and then when it is no longer convenient for the government they move in and do what they want anyway.

Oh but they smuggle cigarettes and duty free items. Is it smuggling if it is legal in a supposed sovereign nation? Or is it then free trade? Sorry, the pathetic spit of dirt the government decided to let these people have is their own land, they have the right to govern themselves as they see fit. Now a foreign occupying force is demanding a base on their soil to put armed soldiers on? To me that seems like an invasion.

I'm not sure how many people have actually crossed this bridge on the mohawk land, but the mohawks who live on the US side coming into canada, since it's to go to their own land anyway, they have their own lane. They have a native lane on the bridge they go through.

My friend lives in Masssena across the bridge on the US side, and she goes to school in Cornwall. Just talked to her, she said theres about 400 natives with the bridge shut down.

I wonder how long they will be there.
As a fellow native, although not mohawk, I support them as long as no one get's hurt.