Im from china, open to talk about politics, military, economics, human rights etc...

Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by rogue1

 

I do not own a flat screen, in fact that particular item will help me address your bewilderment as to what I have meant.

There is a nasty little gas that is required for the manufacture of flat screens...it is called nitrogen triflouride. Did you ever wonder rogue if it were possible that the rest of the world has looked upon China as a big factory where the pollution and the labor laws would not have to be dealt with?

In fact that is just one factor enriching China's bottom line. But almost every other none 1st world country is dealing with the same problems. China is doing what it deems necessary to keep people employed.
Of course the flip side of all this is teh West is mortgaginf it's future on China's ability to produce.
As you mention Labor Laws, when I first worked there they were neer enforced, now though they are starting to become enforced far more rigidly

Those electronic components that China polluted the environment to make are then shipped back to China in order to strip any precious metals from them thereby further polluting the environment.

And....who is making the lions share of money out this ? Western companies maybe you should start boycotting them. In fact did you boycot buying American made goods due to the illegal war in Iraq ?

In my mind China plays the part of the global village idiot that will do anything for attention.

Hmm well many people say the same of America during the 8 years of the Bush administration. I guess each to there own.

I can assume though from your comments you hvae never been to China and have a very limited grasp of what the country and its people are all about.

Originally posted by rogue1

And....who is making the lions share of money out this ? Western companies

maybe you should start boycotting them. In fact did you boycot buying American made goods due to the illegal war in Iraq ?


Hmm well many people say the same of America during the 8 years of the Bush administration. I guess each to there own.

I can assume though from your comments you hvae never been to China and have a very limited grasp of what the country and its people are all about.

See this is exactly why people have issues with China.
Never a straight answer always deflecting the issues while pointing out the faults of others.

Thats a sign of weakness.


[edit on 5-6-2009 by SLAYER69]

reply to post by rogue1


Chinese capitalist have turned their own country into a toilet for a buck.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
See this exactly why people have issues with China.
Never a straight answer always deflecting the issues while pointing out the faults of others.

Thats a sign of weakness.

Stating facts is a sign of weakness, this seems to be the problem in America, not accepting the truth. You cannot critisize China about it's pollution etc without bringing American corporations into it - they are the ones bankrolling all of this so they can increase their profit margin. I think you want to bury your head in the sand about this.

This is the problem when dealing with China is that they look at America as a corrupt country (which it is), so why should they listen to anything America tells them to do. "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone......."

reply to post by SLAYER69


I find it interesting that we are on an introduction thread authored by an individual who through censored news and cherry picked history insinuates that the members of ATS are lacking in their knowledge of China...coincidental also I'm sure that this thread coincides with the anniversary of Tienanmen Square.

reply to post by rogue1


They are big boys they can defend themselves. Talking about Chinese issues is not taboo like some people around here want us to believe . They are not above scrutiny. By the way We know all about Americas Issues we see them all day everyday.

So give that argument a rest.

Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

I find it interesting that we are on an introduction thread authored by an individual who through censored news and cherry picked history insinuates that the members of ATS are lacking in their knowledge of China...coincidental also I'm sure that this thread coincides with the anniversary of Tienanmen Square.

Well I'm not sure about the coincidence of Tian'namen, but the OP does appear to have a different sense of history than the more enlightened. One thing which really stood out to me was teh indoctrination of the children teaching them that Mao is an almost demigod and he never did any wrong. If you ask about the famines, cultural revolution or the Red Guards, they'll tell you with a straight face that Mao was oblivious to all of these atrocities and they were kept secret from him from other people.
Never say a bad thing about Mao to them, they get just a little upset.

Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

I find it interesting that we are on an introduction thread authored by an individual who through censored news and cherry picked history insinuates that the members of ATS are lacking in their knowledge of China...coincidental also I'm sure that this thread coincides with the anniversary of Tienanmen Square.

Actually you're right we saw a very similar thing right before the Olympics.
Kind of funny. Why is it when somebody asks hard hitting questions about China everybody gets all defensive.

If China wants to be a world player then they need to stop acting like some sort of psychotic introvert.


[edit on 5-6-2009 by SLAYER69]

Originally posted by rogue1

Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

I find it interesting that we are on an introduction thread authored by an individual who through censored news and cherry picked history insinuates that the members of ATS are lacking in their knowledge of China...coincidental also I'm sure that this thread coincides with the anniversary of Tienanmen Square.

Well I'm not sure about the coincidence of Tian'namen, but the OP does appear to have a different sense of history than the more enlightened. One thing which really stood out to me was teh indoctrination of the children teaching them that Mao is an almost demigod and he never did any wrong. If you ask about the famines, cultural revolution or the Red Guards, they'll tell you with a straight face that Mao was oblivious to all of these atrocities and they were kept secret from him from other people.
Never say a bad thing about Mao to them, they get just a little upset.

When u said "they get just a little upset", who are "they"? Don't confuse China with CCP, don't confuse people with govt in a dictatorship country.

As far as I know, most people here in China knews Mao was wrong, just like those university students knew corruption was wrong, but when they spoke out, there was the Tian'namen. Want to understand China? Understand DICTATORSHIP first.

China expexts that the whole world will just look the other way and mind their own business while china grows into a monster country with a monster population because the country knows dam well that the worlds global resources are charted and accounted for by and large and they cant fight for what they think is their fair share yet because America is still so strong.If China thinks they can wait until the babyboomer generation passes and America is at its weakest to make a move they are fooling themselves because like I said I am Canadian and the whole world sees what is happening and we wont let it ,you dont understand what team means ,everybody wants to play on Americas team and the very point that you dont get that is a reflection of your unwillingness or inability to view the world like the rest of us.

No you cant sit quietly and consume global resources to gain a long term advantage,we are not fools and you can be as patient as you want but your tactics wont work against the rest of the team,your country believes they can dominate the world through attrition and population and china has been implementing a MASSIVE global growth and control policy for a minimum of thirty years.

You need to contribute more than you can even imagine because you are so far behind the rest of the world as per your size.A fat quiet kid is still required to heave himself up and WORK ALONGSIDE THE REST OF US,and I mean fat in reference to the population.

China DOES NOT CONTRIBUTE TO THE GLOBAL FAMILY BECAUSE THEY HIDE BEHIND AN ANTIQUATED POLITICAL SYSTEM CALLED COMMUNISM THAT ALLOWS THEM TO REFUSE TO PARTICIAPTE IN THE MAJORITY OF WORLD AID AND PEACEKEEPING MISSIONS and pal I dont mean to hurt your feelings but when your dam elephant of a country sends 10000 troops I AND THE REST OF THE WORLD EXPECT YOU TO SEND 100000 AND WE EXPECT THEM TO DO WHAT OUR COLLECTIVE COMMAND TELLS THEM PERIOD.

You say that they are communist but they dont practice communism and you admit a thinly veiled attempt at a strategic move to as I said earlier not fully contributing by hiding behind an antiquated political belief.This is done so you CAN CONTINUE TO GROW AND NEVER GIVE BACK.
Yes my chineese friend You are being asked to give more than you recieve but you cant handle that because you are so fat population wise that you cant spare the resources.And we all know it and you cant hide it anymore you have reached a critical mass situation with population vs resources and are now forced to be patient and wait for the right moment to take the resorces you require and furthermore AS I SAID EARLIER YOUR MEDIAN AGE YOUNG MEN ARE GETTING RESTLESS BECAUSE THEY ARE MORE EDUCATED THAN EVER BEFORE ,AND WHAT YOUR GOVERNMENTS DONT GET BUT WHAT WE ALL SEE IS THAT YOUR YOUNG PEOPLE ARE BELIEVERS IN COMMUNISM SO THEY WILL FOLLOW IT NO MATTER WHAT AND WE ALL SEE THAT COMMUNISMS GROWTH MECHANSIM IS THROUGH WAR,NOW WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE FOOLING WITH YOUR WE ARE QUIET AND PATIENT SO LEAVE US ALONE BULL---.

You better pay attention to the word collective here because this is the way the world is going and it is obvious that there is some genereal misconception in china that they are free to do what they want,please get real.

I appreciate the passion with which the chineese poster is sharing with us but I am forced to maintain my stance that I see where China is going with their tactics of attrition but so does the whole world because the world has changed as fast as china has grown it is only CHINA SUFFERING GROWING PAINS THAT DOESNT SEE THE ROAD THROUGH THE FOG.

China needs our help BUT HAS TO GIVE FIRST AND THIS IS THE PROBLEM THEY DONT WANT TO GIVE UNCONDITIONALLY FIRsT.

Originally posted by CONTACT
When u said "they get just a little upset", who are "they"? Don't confuse China with CCP, don't confuse people with govt in a dictatorship country.

As far as I know, most people here in China knews Mao was wrong, just like those university students knew corruption was wrong, but when they spoke out, there was the Tian'namen. Want to understand China? Understand DICTATORSHIP first.

They are every student I spoke to in Beijing (Tsing Hua, BLCU), Shanghai (Fudan) and in Guangzhou (South China Normal). All expressed the same opinions. Also the young people I met whilst inspecting factories in the Pear River Delta, an area where Nomadtg should be familiar with.

[edit on 6-6-2009 by rogue1]

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Actually you're right we saw a very similar thing right before the Olympics.
Kind of funny. Why is it when somebody asks hard hitting questions about China everybody gets all defensive.

If China wants to be a world player then they need to stop acting like some sort of psychotic introvert.

You ahve to understand CHinese culture first, don't try and transpose Western values on CHina, it will never work and they don't want to be seen as a nother copy of America. China is a land of proud people, they don't get off on the self loathing which is common place in America. They'll be a far stronger country for it.

Chinese poeple put there country first, whilst in America it's all about me, me, me. This country has come along way from the days of Kennedy - "Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for it"

Originally posted by one4all
China DOES NOT CONTRIBUTE TO THE GLOBAL FAMILY BECAUSE THEY HIDE BEHIND AN ANTIQUATED POLITICAL SYSTEM CALLED COMMUNISM THAT ALLOWS THEM TO REFUSE TO PARTICIAPTE IN THE MAJORITY OF WORLD AID AND PEACEKEEPING MISSIONS and pal I dont mean to hurt your feelings but when your dam elephant of a country sends 10000 troops I AND THE REST OF THE WORLD EXPECT YOU TO SEND 100000 AND WE EXPECT THEM TO DO WHAT OUR COLLECTIVE COMMAND TELLS THEM PERIOD.

Then maybe the big players hsould lead by example, I don't see America doing what yu preach

You are being asked to give more than you recieve but you cant handle that because you are so fat population wise that you cant spare the resources.And we all know it and you cant hide it anymore you have reached a critical mass situation with population vs resources and are now forced to be patient and wait for the right moment to take the resorces you require

Well all western countries consume far more resources than they need, maybe we should practice some restraint when using the resources. The USA alone consumes 25% of the worlds resources whilst only having less than 5% of the global population. You work it out, kinda obvious isn't it ?

I can't reply to the rest of your post, it's dumbing me down/ One thing I have gleaned from your rants is you have very limited knowledge of geopolitics, absolutely no knowledge of China at all and extreme problems in articulating yourself.

BTW. Using caps all the time is getting very childish

Originally posted by SLAYER69
If China wants to be a world player then they need to stop acting like some sort of psychotic introvert.

Strong words, explain your thoughts behind this please.

Psycotic refers to the inability to comprehend their place in the reality the rest of the world is experiencing and introverted is how they are attempting to remain so they dont have to contribute,and furthermore you may do all the calculations you choose but until the Chineese people contribute as many dollers per person or as much resources per person as Canadians do you might want to consider yourself to stand corrected.

In reference to the % of resources the US consumes .in case you havent heard the champion eats first and best at the family table so until other countries can show an equal willingness and resolve to contribute to global well being they will eat second ,and just so you understand what I mean I MEAN YOUR PEOPLE WILL ETERNALLY HAVE TO MAKE DUE WITH LESS THAN THE PEOPLE FROM THE CHAMPIONS COUNTRY,and you dont even come in in the top ten at the champions or the USes side of the table.

Originally posted by rogue1
Chinese poeple put there country first, whilst in America it's all about me, me, me. This country has come along way from the days of Kennedy - "Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for it"

Tell that to their Government. While you may want to blame western companies for China's pollution problem. Who is it exactly that is allowing this to happen in their own country as they chase the pot of gold at the end of the smogbow?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e55410bab927.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/fcc73da299e7.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/8e46c812bb33.jpg[/atsimg]

China overtakes US as world's biggest CO2 emitter

China has overtaken the United States as the world's biggest producer of carbon dioxide, the chief greenhouse gas, figures released today show.

The surprising announcement will increase anxiety about China's growing role in driving man-made global warming and will pile pressure onto world politicians to agree a new global agreement on climate change that includes the booming Chinese economy. China's emissions had not been expected to overtake those from the US, formerly the world's biggest polluter, for several years, although some reports predicted it could happen as early as next year.

[edit on 6-6-2009 by SLAYER69]

reply to post by rogue1


China invited the industrial world into their back yard so that China could become a world power. Again as did Mao very little thinking was used as to the ills that could come about. In order to make a "Great Leap Forward" a momentum must be at least attempted. Again...shortcuts

Mao devastated his countries resources cutting every tree down to heat furnaces thereby stripping natural protection. The starvation came from farmers being turned into metallurgists. I believe Tibet was over run by Mao in order to poses her resources.

The land scape changes daily over there and not for the better.

The status of each country is hard earned....no shortcuts.

Originally posted by rogue1

Originally posted by CONTACT
When u said "they get just a little upset", who are "they"? Don't confuse China with CCP, don't confuse people with govt in a dictatorship country.

As far as I know, most people here in China knews Mao was wrong, just like those university students knew corruption was wrong, but when they spoke out, there was the Tian'namen. Want to understand China? Understand DICTATORSHIP first.

They are every student I spoke to in Beijing (Tsing Hua, BLCU), Shanghai (Fudan) and in Guangzhou (South China Normal). All expressed the same opinions. Also the young people I met whilst inspecting factories in the Pear River Delta, an area where Nomadtg should be familiar with.

[edit on 6-6-2009 by rogue1]

U still don't get it do u?
How could anyone inside China dare to say any bad thing about CCP to foreigner, when CCP having a gun pointing to their head!?
Do u know how many thousand students were killed in Tian'namen!? Do u know how many people lost their job just talking to foreign reporters!? Do u know how many scholar "suicided" because of saying "wrong" things to their students!? ...

Originally posted by CONTACT
U still don't get it do u?
How could anyone inside China dare to say any bad thing about CCP to foreigner, when CCP having a gun pointing to their head!?
Do u know how many thousand students were killed in Tian'namen!? Do u know how many people lost their job just talking to foreign reporters!? Do u know how many scholar "suicided" because of saying "wrong" things to their students!? ...

Hmm I seem to get it far more than you. I also have spoken to Chinese students in America and Australia who say the same things about Mao. It seems you don't get it, sorry about that.