Im from china, open to talk about politics, military, economics, human rights etc...

I dont believe anyone was upset at anti-american remarks because we are all one family and for the faults the the US has and we havent been addressing them now ,the US knows its place in our family and it is acting according to the parameters of the lessons it learned based on its physical traits ,it is aware of its obligations to the family and adjusts its actions accordingly WITH REGARD FOR ALL.Its mistakes are made in the name of committment to the family and are overshadowed by its commitment to the family on many different fronts.

I didnt mean to develope an anti-china attitude but the more I think about how the country itself has behaved in the last hundred years the more I want to help them see how badly they are behaving.I dont want to trump up th US either because they are simply another family member and are prone to the same mistakes all are prone to,but sometimes family members need to look at each other in order to understand how to balance their actions to keep them in the position they need to be in according to family values.China needs to look at the US as simply a family member ,obviously china is the younger brother in terms of population these are new people and a new reality,the US isnt competition for china they are a little brother who happens to be a better leader right now by experience .Let the US lead, your best abilities and strengths come out when you are a good teammate and when you properly use your considerable size in support of the family,you are a trusted righthand man and need to see that,BUT YOU ARE WHO YOU ARE .

This is all coming from the third child canada and we exibit our greatest strengths when we negotiate and settle disputes by very wisely lending our reatively small contribution to whichever of our family members needs support in order TO MAINTAIN BALANCE in the family.We tip the scales if you will SO WE CAN QUICKLY AND ACCURATELY DIAGNOSE ANY IMBALANCE IN OUR FAMILY AND I JUST DID THAT FOR THE BENEFIT OF THOSE READING THIS POST. Are you listening brother China?

NomadTG,the reason China never dominated the world 500 yrs ago is the same reason they will NEVER DOMINATE THE WORLD,their place in our global family is dictated by their physical traits and they cannot ever change this their resonsibilitys and levels of contribution are also dictated by these traits.Your population has pigeonhoed you into a reality or position and you cannot gauge your future path by anything else you must adjust your perspectives to include the reality that you have responsibility to the world family and it supercedes your right to damaging self-growth through non-involvement in family affairs. 500 yrs ago it was no different population wise it was just a different time thats all.No domination then and no domination now and my friends no domination ever.

Originally posted by A Conscience
reply to post by CONTACT

 

Also, KMT was the main force to defense China from Japan for EIGHT YEARS in WWII! Do u think they don't have the support of major population? Well, they were not prefect of course, they had some corruption of course, but still, they were heros.

I thought I'll just budge in for a moment to put things in the proper perspective.

KMT under Chang Kai Shek was more interested in fighting the CCP than defending against the Japanese. He had to be kidnapped by his own generals in order to be persuaded to join forces with the CCP, in a united front against the Japanese.

KMT was corrupted to the core. The Japanese created friendly puppet governments to look after their interests and one of these was headed by KMT premier Wang Jingwei. That says so much for the KMT and their morals.

Digressing a bit here, but a portion of KMT who did not flee to Taiwan became drug lords in the Golden Triangle.

All in all, IMO China is better of with the CCP. At least it is a united China. A feat not to be scoffed at, considering the population, provinces, and vast land mass.

Chinese public opinion strongly criticized the leader of Manchuria, the "young marshal" Zhang Xueliang, for his nonresistance to the Japanese invasion, even though the Kuomintang central government was indirectly responsible for this policy.
On 12 December, 1936 a deeply disgruntled Zhang Xueliang decided to conspire with the CCP and kidnapped Chiang Kai-shek in Xi'an to force an end to the conflict between KMT and CCP. In order to secure the release of Chiang, the KMT was forced to agree to a temporary end to the Chinese Civil War and the forming of a United Front between the CCP and KMT against Japan on 24 December 1936.
en.wikipedia.org...

"kidnapping"? Promised "join force" but actually "let them die alone"? After Chiang released from the kidnap, KMT still fight Japan as the main force for 8 years?
Oh yeah! That really says so much for the CCP and their morals.

"China is better of with the CCP"!? Like I said before, a bigger school have more students but more resource, a smaller school have less students but less resource, its the administration that makes the different. Look at the GDP per person of Taiwan in the 60's to 90's, then compare to China; I would say USA could not be no.1 in the world if China was administrated by KMT. At least, without Taiwan & HK, I believe China has already bankrupted, just like USSR & North Korea (remember, they were exactly the same kind of admin with USSR & NK, why do u think USSR & NK end up like this but China did not).

NomadTG, great to have you on-board.

I have a few questions.

Just two weeks ago, one of my work Chinese associate mentioned a few points that surprises me. Can you confirm them.

1) Chinese Citizens do not pay personal income tax ?

2) A 25 US cents can get you a square meal of a bowl of rice, two veg, one meat and a bowl of soup.. even at a side lane in Beijing !! ?

If this is the case, then the so-called $1 per day to gauge poverty in China does not apply. Compare an avg American/Europe 40% tax and 20x(25cents) to get a McDonald burger. The PPP is too wide to compare.

Originally posted by one4all
I dont believe anyone was upset at anti-american remarks because we are all one family and for the faults the the US has and we havent been addressing them now ,the US knows its place in our family and it is acting according to the parameters of the lessons it learned based on its physical traits ,it is aware of its obligations to the family and adjusts its actions accordingly WITH REGARD FOR ALL.Its mistakes are made in the name of committment to the family and are overshadowed by its commitment to the family on many different fronts.

I didnt mean to develope an anti-china attitude but the more I think about how the country itself has behaved in the last hundred years the more I want to help them see how badly they are behaving.I dont want to trump up th US either because they are simply another family member and are prone to the same mistakes all are prone to,but sometimes family members need to look at each other in order to understand how to balance their actions to keep them in the position they need to be in according to family values.China needs to look at the US as simply a family member ,obviously china is the younger brother in terms of population these are new people and a new reality,the US isnt competition for china they are a little brother who happens to be a better leader right now by experience .Let the US lead, your best abilities and strengths come out when you are a good teammate and when you properly use your considerable size in support of the family,you are a trusted righthand man and need to see that,BUT YOU ARE WHO YOU ARE .

This is all coming from the third child canada and we exibit our greatest strengths when we negotiate and settle disputes by very wisely lending our reatively small contribution to whichever of our family members needs support in order TO MAINTAIN BALANCE in the family.We tip the scales if you will SO WE CAN QUICKLY AND ACCURATELY DIAGNOSE ANY IMBALANCE IN OUR FAMILY AND I JUST DID THAT FOR THE BENEFIT OF THOSE READING THIS POST. Are you listening brother China?

BUddy what the hell are you trying to say. You make no sense, please stop with the bizarro metaphors and write normally.

reply to post by one4all


I dont know if there listening but im willing to bet there scratching there heads.What Kinda convoluted mess was that?

Its pretty simple ,its time for china to grow up and start to contribute to the global family or the "world" if the term global family is confusing.Hiding behind Communism and refusing to lend a hand proportionate to your size because you claim a belief system the entire world knows is dying while you make a historicly unprecedented growth spurt is WRONG.

China needs to stop committing crimes against humanity and refusing to let go of communism.

China needs to accept that its role is defined by its size not its political beliefs.Do you understand that basic concept??Have you ever been on a team in your life,any kind of team at all?For the love of god herself we all know that you dont put the 80lb weakling at the anchor position when you have a tug of war,that is simplistic and shouldnt need to be explained any further.

This type of ignorance is tactical in nature it is called playing possum.

I have been on many teams and I'll tell you this much ,while I try to be as fair as I can when debating this thread in my mind I always come back to the same place,there are leaders and there are followers and America is the world leader and China is a follower,an oversized undercontributing follower.

The reason China is a follower is because of its size and its inability to adjust and move and therefore be as effective or learn the lessons needed to be a leader.An entity as big as China is and can only be worried about being able to sustain its tremendous needs.

So my smart alec friends either we help get China back into the scene and help them fulfill their global role and responsibility so they understand what is expected OR THEY WILL GROW THEMSELVES INTO THE NEXT WORLD WAR and people like this who "just cant seem to understand what this means????"wont get a second chance to pay attention.

P.s wherever you all are,I for one as a Canadian dont plan os sharing any of my water with a resource hog who doesnt feel an obligation to play by the rules of the world or the global family.And I hope I dont have to explain that comment again,because we are all the same when the gloves are off and we cant communicate anymore.There is a superpower next door to me who says this is so.

So for anyone who cant understand what I am saying its this STEP UP TO THE TABLE OR STEP BLOODY BACK AND DONT COME LOOKING FOR PITY AND EXPLANATIONS THERE WILL BE NO ADVANTAGE GIVEN TO THE IGNORANT.

And I cant believe its a canadian that has to say this.

When is the last time you or anyone else felt good about hearing that China was sending troops somewhere??Do you get it ,because the whole world sure does,so please snap to attention and look around you at our global family and use your noggin to give responsibility to those prepared to handle it ,THEN COME BACK AND TELL ME THIS POST IS A MESS.


I dont care what country you are from we all see the same things in the world today,or would you rather ask Rwanda to send some aid to Beijing??

This kind of attitude surrounding global responsibility and accountability is sickening and no country on this planet will be able to avoid these things soon and I will thank God on that day because ,there are to many fence sitters on all sides of this discussion and our global familys growth and health are the only things that are paramount.

And there is no metaphore its your reality BUDDY we are living in the same world but you think that you are living in a country that gives you a right to abbrogate your global accountability,you may be today but not for long because you are sitting on a fence that someone else built,and are soon to be asked to hop down and build your own wether you "like it" or not,the world is rapidly changing and they are positive changes.

Step up or stand back there are a lot of people in a lot of countries willing to take your place.

reply to post by rogue1


Actually he is making some rather good points.

Apparently unpopular ones but good none the less. As an American I see and hear criticism of the US all day every day. If the situation calls for it I become one of the largest and loudest "Critic" of my own country.

WHY?

Because I can, also I feel an obligation to chime in as a citizen. Actually it's my responsibility to do so. It is becoming very apparent that China wants to hold the rest of the world at arms length when it comes to being criticized.

Why is that?

For an upcoming world power they sure do seem to be very thin skinned when people start asking hard hitting questions. You would think that a culture that is as old as it is often bragged about would by now know how to handle criticism.

reply to post by one4all


I agree with all that you have posted. For me I see China repeating the same mistakes of Mao Zedong. He mimicked the industrialized west taking serious shortcuts as to infrastructure and knowledge there by plunging his country into a devastating period. I see that China has not learned from her former leader.

Chinas economy is built on the export of cheap products and the worlds taste for those products plummet...I believe due to the dangerous shortcuts that once again are being taken by that country and also the treatment of Tibetans...I think China has another lesson on the way.

Originally posted by one4all
Its pretty simple ,its time for china to grow up and start to contribute to the global family or the "world" if the term global family is confusing.Hiding behind Communism and refusing to lend a hand proportionate to your size because you claim a belief system the entire world knows is dying while you make a historicly unprecedented growth spurt is WRONG.

China needs to stop committing crimes against humanity and refusing to let go of communism.

China needs to accept that its role is defined by its size not its political beliefs.Do you understand that basic concept??Have you ever been on a team in your life,any kind of team at all?For the love of god herself we all know that you dont put the 80lb weakling at the anchor position when you have a tug of war,that is simplistic and shouldnt need to be explained any further.

So what are you saying ? What do you want China to do? These incredibly vague posts of your are very confusing. Should they help by unilaterally invading other #ries, bomb a few countries ? You know help like America has.

BTW, China is communist in name only - communism has been relinquished for a long time in China.

I have been on many teams and I'll tell you this much ,while I try to be as fair as I can when debating this thread in my mind I always come back to the same place,there are leaders and there are followers and America is the world leader and China is a follower,an oversized undercontributing follower.

Well America might be a leader but very few people are listening these days. Who does China follow ? They seem to be damned good at going there own way and following no one.

The reason China is a follower is because of its size and its inability to adjust and move and therefore be as effective or learn the lessons needed to be a leader.An entity as big as China is and can only be worried about being able to sustain its tremendous needs.

Not making sense. What is a leader a country which bullies others around ? China doesn't need to do that, they look very long term.

So my smart alec friends either we help get China back into the scene and help them fulfill their global role and responsibility so they understand what is expected OR THEY WILL GROW THEMSELVES INTO THE NEXT WORLD WAR and people like this who "just cant seem to understand what this means????"wont get a second chance to pay attention.

I don't think you understand what you mean. How are they going to cause a war ? Have you ever been to China, do you know anything about the peple and culture. I suggest you hold back on your judgements until you have actually lived there.

P.s wherever you all are,I for one as a Canadian dont plan os sharing any of my water with a resource hog who doesnt feel an obligation to play by the rules of the world or the global family.

Are you talking about America now ?

So for anyone who cant understand what I am saying its this STEP UP TO THE TABLE OR STEP BLOODY BACK AND DONT COME LOOKING FOR PITY AND EXPLANATIONS THERE WILL BE NO ADVANTAGE GIVEN TO THE IGNORANT.

STEP UP TO THE TABLE AND DO WHAT. You waffle alot bu there is no substance to what you are saying. It's like do something and when pressed you say " I don't know what they should do."

When is the last time you or anyone else felt good about hearing that China was sending troops somewhere??Do you get it ,because the whole world sure does,so please snap to attention and look around you at our global family and use your noggin to give responsibility to those prepared to handle it ,THEN COME BACK AND TELL ME THIS POST IS A MESS.

China has deployed thousands of UN peacekeepers over the years - what is your point ? You know how to use google right ?

I dont care what country you are from we all see the same things in the world today,or would you rather ask Rwanda to send some aid to Beijing??

Actually China sends billions of dollars in aid to Africa - what is your point again ?

BTW - Western countries should be giving much more aid we can afford it look at PPP to get an idea of how wealthy western countries are and then compare it to China's.

[edit on 5-6-2009 by rogue1]

Originally posted by Witness2008
I agree with all that you have posted. For me I see China repeating the same mistakes of Mao Zedong. He mimicked the industrialized west taking serious shortcuts as to infrastructure and knowledge there by plunging his country into a devastating period. I see that China has not learned from her former leader.

What has China not learned ?

Chinas economy is built on the export of cheap products and the worlds taste for those products plummet...I believe due to the dangerous shortcuts that once again are being taken by that country and also the treatment of Tibetans...I think China has another lesson on the way.

Cheaps goods, you mean like the computer you're using or the flat screen TV you are watching. China is gradually making more and more high tech goods - they are gaining the knowledge to do this extremely quickly, couple that with the amount of scientists and engineers graduating every year and China will leap forward.

Originally posted by rogue1
Well America might be a leader but very few people are listening these days.

Pretty much everybody Here is part 1 of 6 of the entire speech.
Follow the link for the rest

Originally posted by rogue1
Who does China follow ? They seem to be damned good at going there own way and following no one.

Well here is an example of a "Company" Getting its way with of all places China.

It seems Beijing will listen and do what its told from a company rather than listen to other governments or the UN. I thought this was very interesting

CEO Lee Scott has made it clear that Wal-Mart's China suppliers have to go green or else they will have to just go, period

Wal-Mart's New Sustainability Mandate in China

I just attended the Wal-Mart Sustainability Summit in Beijing. There are times you know you're watching something special. The point of the meeting was to bring Wal-Mart's Chinese suppliers (some 900 of them) together to hear Wal-Mart's sustainability agenda and the specific goals for the company's biggest supply partner. To put the relationship in context, if Wal-Mart were a country, it would be China's sixth or seventh largest trading partner (clearly the scale of both China and Wal-Mart is shocking).

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Because I can, also I feel an obligation to chime in as a citizen. Actually it's my responsibility to do so. It is becoming very apparent that China wants to hold the rest of the world at arms length when it comes to being criticized.

That's understandable considering the suffering they have endured at the hands of western powers in the past. They feel they should never have to answer to the west again.

For an upcoming world power they sure do seem to be very thin skinned when people start asking hard hitting questions. You would think that a culture that is as old as it is often bragged about would by now know how to handle criticism.

As above. Then again there are many thinned skinned people in this country as well.

Originally posted by rogue1

As above. Then again there are many thinned skinned people in this country as well.

You don't see this one side stepping the issues and laying blame on others now do you?

Originally posted by SLAYER69
You don't see this one side stepping the issues and laying blame on others now do you?

All countries try and pass the buck onto others even America.

reply to post by rogue1


Yes but the way you make it sound is as if China should not be looked at.PERIOD.

Why is that?

This isn't the China of 300 or 100 or even 50 years ago this is the present day China. One that wants to be a world player while it also seems wants to hide behind the great wall and stay above scrutiny?


Come on they will have to be open to world opinion and get used to it.

reply to post by rogue1


I do not use Chinese products, you'd be surprised at how many other countries produce quality electronics. I have not purchased a product made in China since the "Free Tibet Campaign" was launched.

Given the gullibility (only IMO) of China to jump on every technology that would come their way (IBM) without understanding the scientific and labor infrastructure makes me think the big fall is now in the making. The U.S could be a friend...I doubt it. Propaganda is not solely a Chinese skill.

China has not earned their way into the global family. Just imagine if half of the U.S population were to cease buying Chinese products. China exports Melamine in animal feed and baby formula...how long do you think it will take the rest of the world to stop buying?

Mao turned China into a communal metal works....a furnace in every back yard...starving the population in the end. China now pollutes every back yard with the industrial run off from producing cheap products.

Originally posted by Witness2008
I do not use Chinese products, you'd be surprised at how many other countries produce quality electronics. I have not purchased a product made in China since the "Free Tibet Campaign" was launched.

If you have a flat screen TV it was made in China.

Given the gullibility (only IMO) of China to jump on every technology that would come their way (IBM) without understanding the scientific and labor infrastructure makes me think the big fall is now in the making. The U.S could be a friend...I doubt it.

Oh but they do understand the technologies and what it takes to prodice them.

China has not earned their way into the global family. Just imagine if half of the U.S population were to cease buying Chinese products. China exports Melamine in animal feed and baby formula...how long do you think it will take the rest of the world to stop buying?

Well teh US population isn't going to do that and the EU in fact does more trade with China. As for tainted products that is the fault of the American corporations for not having decent quality control. The US companies I have worked for in China have a whole divisions devoted to inspecting factories and goods being produced in China. Blaiming the Chinese solely for tainted products is just American corporations trying to cover up their sheer laziness when it comes to QC and that isn't just my opinion but senior people I was working for in China in charge of well known corporations - Wal-Mart and Payless Shoes Source being 2 of them.

Mao turned China into a communal metal works....a furnace in every back yard...starving the population in the end. China now pollutes every back yard with the industrial run off from producing cheap products.

Well if the US had 1.3 billion people it would quickly become a sewer. SO you know a tiny bit of Chinese history, you brought up that point why ? How s this relevant to today ?

reply to post by rogue1


I do not own a flat screen, in fact that particular item will help me address your bewilderment as to what I have meant.

There is a nasty little gas that is required for the manufacture of flat screens...it is called nitrogen triflouride. Did you ever wonder rogue if it were possible that the rest of the world has looked upon China as a big factory where the pollution and the labor laws would not have to be dealt with?

Those electronic components that China polluted the environment to make are then shipped back to China in order to strip any precious metals from them thereby further polluting the environment.

In my mind China plays the part of the global village idiot that will do anything for attention.